Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG ((*and other great FWD motorhomes))
| Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 10:26  |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
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In the course of parting out the GMC I was asked about, and gave some consideration to keeping it intact. I think keeping as many on the road as possible is good for everyone.
There were even fewer Revcons made and far fewer still on the road. It is in our interest to keep as many of both of these fine machines out of the scrap yard.
But the world still needs a properly engineered, efficient, safe motorhome under 30 feet. The Eurovan-based Winnie ain't it.
Right now there are several drivable GMC's and one Revcon on Craigslist, east of the missisppi for around $5K - Will some new person seek one out and lovingly restore it?
In some cases the sellers do not appear to appreciate what they have. They are probably not members of this group.
Does this group or any other group do anything to activly promote the coach to a new audience?
What could be done?
How about a national caravan? Circumnavigate the country and have people join in wherever they can. Hold rallies in some different places, with the goal of interacting with the rest of the RV crowd.
Here's a nutty idea- what if we went to a trade show?
Obviously no one could afford the fees but perhaps if we offer trade show organizers a collection of vintage RV's that they could promote to draw people in- in exchange for a discount on space. We collect product info and a small contribution from the various GMC vendors to join forces.
We could promote it on the regular RV boards and maybe get some press.
People are afraid to take on something older than they are. Afraid of relying on a scatered band of net aquaintances for guidance and support.
But when I browse the Class A forums on RV.net and see how much time and money conventional people spend fixing leaks, reinforcing structure, overcoming bad design, and getting screwed by the manufacturers, i think- what I'm doing is a lot more fun.
I hope this inspires some conversation.
-- About the parted out 74. All the good stuff you can see in the pictures is gone, including the interior. Remaining is the drive train less hubs and knuckles.
Ultimately, it was not as nice as it looked. Mostly original stuff held together by paint. The engine and trans are fresh and it seems to run good. A test drive is forthcoming.
Dave
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60815 is a reply to message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 11:59  |
Jim Bounds
Messages: 842
Registered: January 2004
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Dave,
You are a man after my own heart-- don;t take that weird! Promoting the GMC to the4 new audience, not just the "choir" is what my business & I are all about. These coaches are dropping because of their age. Sitting around is killer for any machine and this is now taking it's toll on our GMC population. This is a main mission statement of my business-- as the coaches get older they need more rehab work and thats what we do.
I try and expose the GMC to the general RV community, it does less good telling you guys how cool a GMC can be-- if you don;t know that by now there's something wrong with you. The general young public can easily see how efficient and cost effective it is to reinvent a GMC to their needs. Much less than purchasing a new class A motorhome, I GMC can be outfitted with all the goodies for less than plunking down what the RV industry charges for something nice.
You guys in the GMC community are spoiled-- I have folks call me every day asking how they can get into a GMC. One criticism I do have of the GMC community is they just do not appreciate how much value there is in a GMC and how much htey should be worth to someone interested in having a machine of it's type. Take away the pinche we put on our classic machine, put it on a P&L list and you will see how cost effective they really are. It sort of erks me when someone in this listing gets wild about someone spending over $50,000 to renovate a GMC. You will spend @ $100,000 to buy something new that will do what a renovated GMC will! This means our GMC is a really cost effective machine. This one point is what drives our business and what keeps us busy. Some of you say I am too expensive to work on your coach and do as much as you can yourselves-- hey, thats fine but still understand that for that new GMC owner who does not have experience in
their corner we are here to help them and we are a great help to most. Keeping the GMC "original" is not what I'm talking about. So like that and thats all well and good but the value is in updating, adding new technologies, colors, ideas is what we bring to the GMC and this is what the young, new community is looking for.
Yes, we want to save if we can every GMC but some are just not worth saving. I mean it would just cost too much to bring them back. I ran into one of those this weekend. A 73 had a plexi plate screwed over the back window, another window taped over, the termites left because there was nothing left to eat on the interior! The motor had a car intake on it with a holley carb, tranny is bad, exh. is bad, air bags bad, tires bad, windshields bad, ext. had shaker can residue. This thing was a dump, there are just too many nicer machines to work with. A coach like this will either need a stripping to the insulation or needs to be harvested for parts. My beloved dog "Bridgette" had to be put down, she could have kept living but her quality of life was gone-- a machine like this one really needs too much and there are too many nicer ones to deal with all of this. As parts it has a value.
Keep the enthusiasm up on GMC exposure, it does help us all, find places to show off your coach, work with others to show how cost effective they can be. Don't just stay in the choir, turn around and go to the audience and show the general public why they need to look at a GMC-- all of that will help us all. I'm trying my best, I started a business to do that and I gotta tell ya it's a blast!
Jim Bounds
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----- Original Message ----
From: dave silva <gmc@davesilva.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Tue, October 20, 2009 11:26:47 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG
In the course of parting out the GMC I was asked about, and gave some consideration to keeping it intact. I think keeping as many on the road as possible is good for everyone.
There were even fewer Revcons made and far fewer still on the road. It is in our interest to keep as many of both of these fine machines out of the scrap yard.
But the world still needs a properly engineered, efficient, safe motorhome under 30 feet. The Eurovan-based Winnie ain't it.
Right now there are several drivable GMC's and one Revcon on Craigslist, east of the missisppi for around $5K - Will some new person seek one out and lovingly restore it?
In some cases the sellers do not appear to appreciate what they have. They are probably not members of this group.
Does this group or any other group do anything to activly promote the coach to a new audience?
What could be done?
How about a national caravan? Circumnavigate the country and have people join in wherever they can. Hold rallies in some different places, with the goal of interacting with the rest of the RV crowd.
Here's a nutty idea- what if we went to a trade show?
Obviously no one could afford the fees but perhaps if we offer trade show organizers a collection of vintage RV's that they could promote to draw people in- in exchange for a discount on space. We collect product info and a small contribution from the various GMC vendors to join forces.
We could promote it on the regular RV boards and maybe get some press.
People are afraid to take on something older than they are. Afraid of relying on a scatered band of net aquaintances for guidance and support.
But when I browse the Class A forums on RV.net and see how much time and money conventional people spend fixing leaks, reinforcing structure, overcoming bad design, and getting screwed by the manufacturers, i think- what I'm doing is a lot more fun.
I hope this inspires some conversation.
-- About the parted out 74. All the good stuff you can see in the pictures is gone, including the interior. Remaining is the drive train less hubs and knuckles.
Ultimately, it was not as nice as it looked. Mostly original stuff held together by paint. The engine and trans are fresh and it seems to run good. A test drive is forthcoming.
Dave
--
1972 Revcon 250- the other front wheel drive motorhome. http://www.davesilva.com/revcon
Parting out 1974 GMC 26- http://www.davesilva.com/gmc
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60819 is a reply to message #60815] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 12:17 |
Fin Beven
Messages: 101
Registered: September 2005
Karma: 0
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I've only had my GMC for 4 years, but absolutely have the GMC passion.
I do think that our local clubs are really "missing the boat" if they fail
to sell the wonder of GMC beyond their own insular rallies.
I think that each GMC club should make it a point to incorporate at least
one FMCA rally and possibly one Good Sam rally into their annual schedule.
What could be easier ? What could offer better exposure ?
What better way could there be to attract more members into our family ?
Fin Beven
Pasadena, CA
1976 ex-Edgemonte.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Bounds" <gmccoop@yahoo.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG
Dave,
I try and expose the GMC to the general RV community, it does less good
telling you guys how cool a GMC can be-- if you don;t know that by now
there's something wrong with you. The general young public can easily see
how efficient and cost effective it is to reinvent a GMC to their needs.
Much less than purchasing a new class A motorhome, I GMC can be outfitted
with all the goodies for less than plunking down what the RV industry
charges for something nice.
Keep the enthusiasm up on GMC exposure, it does help us all, find places to
show off your coach, work with others to show how cost effective they can
be. Don't just stay in the choir, turn around and go to the audience and
show the general public why they need to look at a GMC-- all of that will
help us all. I'm trying my best, I started a business to do that and I gotta
tell ya it's a blast!
Jim Bounds
--------------------------------
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60830 is a reply to message #60819] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 14:21 |
armandminnie
Messages: 864
Registered: May 2009
Location: Marana, AZ
Karma: 2
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We have had our GMC for 3 years now and both of us really love it and have each wanted one since we first saw them in the 70's. We belong to GMCMI, GMCWS and just joined the Saguaro Jetsetters.
We have been receiving the FMCA magazine for the 2 years we have belonged to it (as a requirement of the GMC clubs) and each time I look for GMC rallies and never see them and have never understood why - still don't. It seems as though we don't really want to be a part of FMCA - is that correct?
Seems as though at least advertising our rallies in the FMCA magazine might generate some interest. There have been articles in that magazine about GMCs and they have generated responses from people so there might be some interest in our rallies?
Why don't we advertise/list our rallies?
Armand Minnie
Marana, AZ
'76 Eleganza II TZE166V103202
visit my gmc blog
click here to visit gmcws.org
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| Re: Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60831 is a reply to message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 14:23 |
WayneB
Messages: 233
Registered: July 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Personally I am not sure anything can really be done beyond what has already taken place.
Before I bought mine, I never visited this forum (which is hard to find), my only real place of regular visits was to Buddy Bethunes site to check out what nice looking rigs were for sale.
As one of the younger, newer owners of a GMC Motorhome (50 years old), 1 year owner ,my main attraction towards them is purely from an iconic styling/design aesthetic and nothing to do with the Oldsmobile FWD setup, air suspension etc. that is talked about endlessly on here at times, alot of which is either lost on the younger generation(many who were not even born when the GMC's were in production) or serves to scare them off into thinking our motorhomes are prone to one sort of catostrophic failure or another(highlighting percieved unrelyability?).
To put it into perspective, my brother (38 years old) bought a new Class C Ford based motorhome at the same time I bought my GMC,he is interested in warranties,new technology and looking trendy over my preference for classic good design and a need to be fiddling with a motorhome to fend off boredom, in other words he is looking at the motorhome as an appliance, not an ifatuation/hobby to imerse himself into as most of us have done.
Wayne
1976 23' GMCII By Explorer
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| Re: Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60832 is a reply to message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 14:47 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Every young kid (teenager of driving age) and adult says "that thing is cool." and my coach isn't exactly a shimmering example of GMC Greatness. My next door neighbor thought I was using it as a storage unit when it was in my driveway.
Everyone wants one, Nobody wants to refurb one, that is the issue.The nickel and dime kills it for most.
I think there is a market following the "GMCII" model, but two words come to mind that need to make that model a success today:
DRIVE TRAIN.
I think people would spend $80-90K on a Frame-off unit with a new (brand new) Modern Motor at the very least, and a new Trans too. I don't know how tough a TH325 can be made to be, but the later years had an overdrive. I read somewhere that warranty killed the GMCII project, but their model was fundamentally right as they did it in volume (100 units IIRC) but only rebuilt the motor/trans when it came to the powertrain.
Let's face it, a Carbureted 455 and 3 Speed Automatic is out dated and will prevent this type of model from working. The best solution may be to put a rebuilt and outfitted GMC body on a FWD Workhorse chassis like Jim has already done, but Gas or Diesel as options. If the market wakes up from it's four-slide-granite-counter-marble-floor-big-square-box mentality, a new breed of modern GMC-type coaches could really start a new market.
The perfect Motorhome would (in my opinion)be 2 feet longer than my 26' GMC and 6 inches wider with a bit less curvature at the top, and using today's sealing technologies, be water tight at the seams, and use car-like roll-down windows, which is what I see as one of the big misses in the GMC. Why GM didn't use any automotive style roll down windows is lost on me.
Today's RV's are built with cheap parts to control cost/profit and give the customer more and more of the look nice-gotta have stuff, but the reality is that they get just more of the same cheap crap beneath.
The next one needs to be built like one of today's cars.
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60836 is a reply to message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 15:04 |
Rick Denney
Messages: 430
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 0
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dave silva writes...
> Does this group or any other group do anything to activly promote the coach to a new audience?
> What could be done?
In my ever-so-humble opinion, there are a zillion good ideas for
promoting the GMC. What those ideas often lack are champions willing
and able to make them happen.
We did put a web page up, and Walt Taylor sells decals we can put in
our windows to promot it--www.GMCers.org. That web page provides an
entry point for people who just curious about the vehicle, and leads
to them to more depth if they want to pursue it. We have talked about
brochures that owners can have to hand out to those who express
curiosity. I have calling cards that someone made up that points to
GMCers.org. Those things give owners some tools for answering the
questions that come their way.
Those are things that could be done with little effort. New ideas will
require more effort, and that requires a time commitment not all can
afford.
I'm so overburdened by commitments that I can't even do what I already
promised to do in the GMC community, and I don't think I'm all that
unusual.
By the way, I don't agree that Winnie's Mercedes/Sprinter-based
motorhome is an ineffective product. It's not a GMC, of course, but it
seems to be a well-made small motorhome with lots of features and good
design. I have a friend who owns one, and he's owned it long enough
for evil things to emerge. They haven't.
In the end, evangelism for GMCs is something we each do, one person at
a time. The best way to do that is to have good-running and
good-looking coaches, and that's where most of us spend most of our
GMC time. Providing a good example is the starting point.
Rick "still failing in that attempt" Denney
'73 230 Ex-Glacier "Jaws"
Northern Virginia
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'73 Glacier 230 "Jaws"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60837 is a reply to message #60836] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 15:14 |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
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| Rick Denney wrote on Tue, 20 October 2009 15:04 |
By the way, I don't agree that Winnie's Mercedes/Sprinter-based
motorhome is an ineffective product. It's not a GMC, of course, but it
seems to be a well-made small motorhome with lots of features and good
design. I have a friend who owns one, and he's owned it long enough
for evil things to emerge. They haven't.
|
Not the Sprinter. I think those are pretty cool- still too tall, but a good pedagree.
I was refering to the VW Eurovan based Winnie that replaced the Le Sharo.
dave
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
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| Re: Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60849 is a reply to message #60797] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 17:31 |
Dave Wilson
Messages: 94
Registered: September 2009
Location: Livonia, MI
Karma: 0
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We try and promote our GMC when and where we can. My borther in law brought our #3 to the GM Employee Car Show out in Milford, MI this year, and I brought her to the Ford Employee Car Show in Dearborn,MI in July. Alot of people expressed a great interest in the vehicle and some overstayed their welcome, but we all tried our best to be positive and encouraging in our words.
Bottom line, with some work and maintenence, these vehicles are alot of fun (sometimes even fun during catastrophies!). As owners, we should show our joy and be open to strangers whenever we take these beauties out!
Dave Wilson
'77 Eleganza II
Photos @ http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member.php?uid=2183&protype=1
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60851 is a reply to message #60832] |
Tue, 20 October 2009 17:42 |
Jim Bounds
Messages: 842
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 0
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The machine you describe will cost over $200K to produce-- I know I have tried! A new drive train is not an option, too expensive. The Workhorse chassis off the truck is $65,000-- do the modes to put it under a MC and there you are! No, if you want a machine to beat an entry level new coach you can do it with an original drive train. At that I reject the idea that a carb and HEI dist is no good. Heck, anyone can fix it! I mean anyone including you. No computer crap needed, no anything-- you have, fuel, you have fire you go! What is the end goal-- to go, I rest my case. You will not get better economy pulling 12,000 pounds, more maintenance maybe but not more power or more mileage. I have climbed that mountain and can tell you the truth on that.
No, for the next 10 years, the GMC with it's original drive train can be a viable platform to build up a reliable vehicle for general use-- I am convinced of that, heck I do that every day!
Just depends on what you want to do and how far you want to go,
Jim Bounds
---------------------
----- Original Message ----
From: Chris Choffat <cchoffataz@yahoo.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Tue, October 20, 2009 3:47:37 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG
Every young kid (teenager of driving age) and adult says "that thing is cool." and my coach isn't exactly a shimmering example of GMC Greatness. My next door neighbor thought I was using it as a storage unit when it was in my driveway.
Everyone wants one, Nobody wants to refurb one, that is the issue.The nickel and dime kills it for most.
I think there is a market following the "GMCII" model, but two words come to mind that need to make that model a success today:
DRIVE TRAIN.
I think people would spend $80-90K on a Frame-off unit with a new (brand new) Modern Motor at the very least, and a new Trans too. I don't know how tough a TH325 can be made to be, but the later years had an overdrive. I read somewhere that warranty killed the GMCII project, but their model was fundamentally right as they did it in volume (100 units IIRC) but only rebuilt the motor/trans when it came to the powertrain.
Let's face it, a Carbureted 455 and 3 Speed Automatic is out dated and will prevent this type of model from working. The best solution may be to put a rebuilt and outfitted GMC body on a FWD Workhorse chassis like Jim has already done, but Gas or Diesel as options. If the market wakes up from it's four-slide-granite-counter-marble-floor-big-square-box mentality, a new breed of modern GMC-type coaches could really start a new market.
The perfect Motorhome would (in my opinion)be 2 feet longer than my 26' GMC and 6 inches wider with a bit less curvature at the top, and using today's sealing technologies, be water tight at the seams, and use car-like roll-down windows, which is what I see as one of the big misses in the GMC. Why GM didn't use any automotive style roll down windows is lost on me.
Today's RV's are built with cheap parts to control cost/profit and give the customer more and more of the look nice-gotta have stuff, but the reality is that they get just more of the same cheap crap beneath.
The next one needs to be built like one of today's cars.
--
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
77 Ex-Kingsley 455: The Engineer's Motorhome
Scottsdale, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60917 is a reply to message #60866] |
Wed, 21 October 2009 07:46 |
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Interesting. I've looked through the magazine about how to notify them of a
rally and not found instructions. I've also searched the website of FMCA.
Same deal - nothing. So, do you know a secret I don't know? I'm ready to
send information.
Byron
Bob Moss wrote:
>
>
> I think the idea of publishing the rally's that the many GMC chapters have is
> a great first start. Family Motorcoach offers the opportunity to put them in
> their magazine which is published every month. Just let the secretary of your
> club know it can be done and have him/her contact FMCA at www.fmca.com for
> instructions on how to do it. We too get many compliments on our coach at the
> many football games we attend. And it runs and drives beautifully. But you
> must remember, we are like the folks who love old cars. Ours is one better
> though because it's an old motor home. So you not only have to like old cars
> but you also have to like the RV lifestyle.
> Bob Moss
> 77 Eleganza II
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60949 is a reply to message #60797] |
Wed, 21 October 2009 12:00 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Guys, There is nothing wrong with the 455, Qjet, HEI, and the TH425...for us.
I was talking about for the folks who don't have these things as a hobby. My GMC replaced my 1966 Chevy II Nova Hardtop as my hobby car.
I was talking about folks who want basically what the Sprinter Van Class B's are: an appliance. They are nice, but you shower in the aisle...
So that chassis is $65K? I was thinking closer to $40K. Volume will surely play a part in that as well as the build, and not every person in a MFG company makes $80K+ per year. Volume and Mass manufacturing is key.
Well, there is that mob in Indiana that makes some Ford Front drive chassis as well.
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60983 is a reply to message #60974] |
Wed, 21 October 2009 15:35 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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On Oct 21, 2009, at 1:52 PM, Jim Galbavy wrote:
>
>
> emory, [EMERY]
>
> The Recording Secretary sends in the schedule during the course of
> the year. If you don't notify FMCA of your rallies, how do you
> receive liability insurace coverage from FMCA? Each rally has it's
> own individual policy. FMCA has never charged the Crabs for a rally
> listing that I know of.
>
> Byron, unless you are the secretary of your club, you don't send the
> rally schedule in, otherwise you just screw things up. FMCA sends a
> package to each club officer with a list of duties for that position.
>
> jim galbavy
> '73 X-CL (ANNIE)
> Chesterfield, Va
Notifying the magazine about future rallies and obtaining insurance
for an event are two different things.
There is a special form that has to be filled out prior to a rally (or
convention) and that goes to an entirely different person at FMCA.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Santa Fe, NM
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| Re: [GMCnet] Promoting the GMC*- What can we do? - LONG [message #60984 is a reply to message #60983] |
Wed, 21 October 2009 15:47 |
Jim White[1]
Messages: 144
Registered: September 2008
Karma: 0
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Emery-
Thanks for clarifying that issue. Does that imply that each local club
needs to complete a form well before holding a monthly rally for example?
Thanks-
Jim "Doc" White
Emery Stora wrote:
> On Oct 21, 2009, at 1:52 PM, Jim Galbavy wrote:
>
>
>> emory, [EMERY]
>>
>> The Recording Secretary sends in the schedule during the course of
>> the year. If you don't notify FMCA of your rallies, how do you
>> receive liability insurace coverage from FMCA? Each rally has it's
>> own individual policy. FMCA has never charged the Crabs for a rally
>> listing that I know of.
>>
>> Byron, unless you are the secretary of your club, you don't send the
>> rally schedule in, otherwise you just screw things up. FMCA sends a
>> package to each club officer with a list of duties for that position.
>>
>> jim galbavy
>> '73 X-CL (ANNIE)
>> Chesterfield, Va
>>
>
>
> Notifying the magazine about future rallies and obtaining insurance
> for an event are two different things.
> There is a special form that has to be filled out prior to a rally (or
> convention) and that goes to an entirely different person at FMCA.
>
> Emery Stora
> 77 Kingsley
> Santa Fe, NM
>
>
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