| Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36692] |
Fri, 27 February 2009 16:16  |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Someone said they had heard of some problems with two stage (clear coat) being used on the roof. I sort of like the clear coat idea as I am no longer a fan of wax on- wax off days.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
|
|
|
|
| Re: Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36695 is a reply to message #36692] |
Fri, 27 February 2009 16:44  |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
""Someone said they had heard of some problems with two stage (clear coat) being used on the roof. I sort of like the clear coat idea as I am no longer a fan of wax on- wax off days. ""
George, I'm not sure where you live, but in some of these intense climates it is very common to see the clear coat delaminate from the color coat. I'm not making any judgement regarding how good those paint jobs were, but most of them are on cars (both domestic and foreign) which were painted in controlled conditions. You can still have a nice gloss without clearcoat, even without frequent polishing. I think in many cases, clearcoat is overplayed.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
|
|
|
|
| Re: Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36700 is a reply to message #36695] |
Fri, 27 February 2009 18:39 |
Ron
Messages: 250
Registered: February 2004
Location: Conifer, Colorado
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Guy's..
Most of the clear coat issues I have had experience with were caused by the change over to Water Borne paints.. They just didn't work too wel.. Modern first line clear coats should work OK if applied properly..
I agree with Bob a single stage poly paint should have a decent low maintenance shine..
Maybe do the roof in a single stage and sides in a base clear coat.. Nothing will shine like that..
Ron..
now a P.O.
Conifer, CO
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36721 is a reply to message #36715] |
Sat, 28 February 2009 05:51 |
Carleton Douglas[1]
Messages: 174
Registered: March 2006
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
George, I thought that all clear coat was polyurethane. I know you see
some GM vehicles with the clear separating from the color coat. What
brand of paint did they use that separated from the color?
There is a proper procedures that must to be followed for a lasting paint job.
On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 11:49 PM, Terrance Boyd <newtent@gmail.com> wrote:
> 5 years ago my coach was painted with two stage that was not water base. 2
> 1/2 years later the clear coat was peeling. I had the repainted with
> polyurethane, so far so good.
>
> On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 2:16 PM, George Beckman <gbeckman@pggp.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Someone said they had heard of some problems with two stage (clear coat)
>> being used on the roof. I sort of like the clear coat idea as I am no
>> longer a fan of wax on- wax off days.
>> --
>> Best Wishes,
>>
>> George
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Carleton Douglas
73 custom, by myself
Prescott, AZ
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36796 is a reply to message #36721] |
Sun, 01 March 2009 09:28 |
Luvn737s
Messages: 1106
Registered: June 2007
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Unless you are doing a metallic paint job, there's no real advantage in a basecoat/clearcoat paint job. That being said, if you do BC/CC you need to clear while the base is still wet and you need to use the same paint system for both base and clear. I can imagine a one-man show trying to paint something as large as a motorhome might allow too much time to pass between base and clear and run into adhesion problems.
Spraying clear on an old paint job is a lousy idea. Imron (or whatever PPG's equivalent is) is probably the best paint for coaches that spend most of their time outdoors.
https://corporateportal.ppg.com/NA/Refinish/PPGRefinish/2-0-Products/EN
Randy
1973 26' Painted Desert
Ahwatukee (Phoenix) AZ
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36803 is a reply to message #36796] |
Sun, 01 March 2009 10:05 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| Luvn737s wrote on Sun, 01 March 2009 09:28 |
Unless you are doing a metallic paint job, there's no real advantage in a basecoat/clearcoat paint job. That being said, if you do BC/CC you need to clear while the base is still wet and you need to use the same paint system for both base and clear. I can imagine a one-man show trying to paint something as large as a motorhome might allow too much time to pass between base and clear and run into adhesion problems.
Spraying clear on an old paint job is a lousy idea. Imron (or whatever PPG's equivalent is) is probably the best paint for coaches that spend most of their time outdoors.
https://corporateportal.ppg.com/NA/Refinish/PPGRefinish/2-0-Products/EN
|
i can see a problem there of shooting the roof while still wet.
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #36822 is a reply to message #36796] |
Sun, 01 March 2009 13:22 |
Keith V
Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| Luvn737s wrote on Sun, 01 March 2009 09:28 |
Unless you are doing a metallic paint job, there's no real advantage in a basecoat/clearcoat paint job. That being said, if you do BC/CC you need to clear while the base is still wet and you need to use the same paint system for both base and clear. I can imagine a one-man show trying to paint something as large as a motorhome might allow too much time to pass between base and clear and run into adhesion problems.
Spraying clear on an old paint job is a lousy idea. Imron (or whatever PPG's equivalent is) is probably the best paint for coaches that spend most of their time outdoors.
https://corporateportal.ppg.com/NA/Refinish/PPGRefinish/2-0-Products/EN
|
Wow one of us is completely wrong. I just painted my Vette base coat / clear coat. There are MANY advantages to the system.
The clear does NOT go on wet base coat, you let it dry and you have many days before you have to clear it. (according to the manufacurer)
If you want to clear after a long time you do need to clean and scuff, with like 1000 grit, but you can do it.
The best part of using clear is that good clears contain UV inhibitors. more than they could put in the color coat. This protects the color better.
BTW, clear coat finishes still need to be waxed. They are not a wax free system 
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96190 is a reply to message #36822] |
Tue, 17 August 2010 09:48 |
Ken Coit
Messages: 151
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
OK, I just have to weigh in here.
My '98 Olds Aurora had what GM, the dealer, a few paint shops, and the
insurance company all agreed was a manufacturer's defect in the paint. It
started peeling clear coat in about 7 years. I suspect it spent a lot of
time in Florida, but none of my Arizona cars ever did this, even the used
ones. I tried to get hail damage coverage after it was hit by hail and the
clear just popped off, but they kept telling me it wasn't hail damage.
Someone in an expensive body shop with a great reputation finally said the
words "manufacturer's defect." Neither GM, the dealer nor the insurance
company would use those words.
As I understand it, GM's paint supplier failed to include one ingredient. I
suppose it was in the spec. It took awhile to find. I think there might have
even been a recall.
Anyway, there are many ways to screw up a paint job. Following the
directions might get you there.
--
Ken Coit, ND7N
Raleigh, NC
Parfait Royale
1978 Royale Rear Bath, 403, 3.07
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96193 is a reply to message #96190] |
Tue, 17 August 2010 09:58 |
LarryInSanDiego
Messages: 336
Registered: September 2006
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
And whatever you do, never apply any of those aftermarket "poly" or whatever treatments, like the kind on infomercials and what dealers like to add on for extra profit. They ALL go fail mode in a few years. They are easy to spot, not to mention really ghetto looking.
Add edit: If you're lazy like me, stay away from metallic and dark colors, especially reds. White is one color that can oxidize and still look somewhat acceptable from 20' away.
Larry Engelbrecht
San Diego, CA
'73 26' ex-Glacier
TZE063V100319 03/07/73
[Updated on: Tue, 17 August 2010 10:00] Report message to a moderator |
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96286 is a reply to message #96193] |
Wed, 18 August 2010 05:33 |
Dr. Detroit
Messages: 158
Registered: April 2010
Location: Novi, MI.
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
In my 20 years of dealing with coatings I've found Base-Clear to be a very durable system when properly applied. Left outside 24/7 the typical factory finish on a car should last around 10 years before the clear is worn away by sun, acid rain, and other environmental factors. As far as peeling goes that's typically a material or application failure. A properly bonded base-clear paintjob does not peel.
That said, I never could figure out why we'd paint our roofs with a nice paint and then walk on them so I'm going a different route....
I'm going to use a product by SEM that's a bedliner material. It's tintable to any color and I'm getting it in white. In it's natural state (no rubber filler chunks) it's not a rough texture like Herculiner and other systems. It could even be layed down smooth depending how the painter puts it on. For my coach I'll give it a very light sand like stipple to make the roof walkable when wet. My goal is something like the deck of a boat. Enough to keep you from skidding off yet not so much that leaves and junk stay up there forever.
http://semproducts.com/Catalog.asp?prod=315
Ken W.
1973 GMC 23'
All Birch and Maple Interior Cabinetry. TZE033V100221
"The Honeycomb Hideout"
[Updated on: Wed, 18 August 2010 05:39] Report message to a moderator |
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96290 is a reply to message #96286] |
Wed, 18 August 2010 07:22 |
gmcrv1
Messages: 839
Registered: August 2007
Location: Memphis
Karma: -1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Ken,
I couldn't agree with you more. A PO used white aerosol spray paint to
paint the first 6" of the roof. I don't think it was prepped at all. After
I bought the Glacier last fall I went to my local Porter Paint store and
took one of the original mirror brackets and had them mix up a gallon of
their single stage urethane enamel - Glptex is the paint line. High
gloss - used for trim, machinery and metal. I use it in the sign business.
It is very durable and it flows out nicely. My roof was a mess - no shine
whatsoever and places where the paint was completely worn off.
I read a few articles from the hot rod guys about painting your car with a
roller. The process is long and tedious. You will wear your arms out with
all the sanding - which I didn't do. After all, I wasn't looking for a 20
cost hand-rubbed lacquer finish. I wanted clean and serviceable
.
I washed the roof and then let it dry overnight. Next day I used Dupont
Prep-Sol 3919S to remove wax (ha!) and other foreign matter on the paint
surface. Then I used Dupont enamel reducer 3612S with the two rag system.
First apply with a wet rag and dry with a clean rag - don't let the ER dry
on the surface. It could leave contaminants behind. Next lightly sand with
320 finishing paper. Repeat the ER 3812S process. I edged around all the
roof fixtures vents etc. I used the finest foam roller I could find - the
porosity they leave after painting varies greatly. Look for a roller for
fine finishing.
The entire process took two days - after the wash. I did overlapping areas
starting on the center line and working to the gutters.
I only did one coat and as time permits, I may do a light sanding with a DA
and repeat the process. Very happy with the results. Looks good, clean and
is serviceable. Just what I was looking for - cost for paint, Prep-Sol and
enamel reducer was about $65. But there is a lot of Prep-Sol and enamel
reducer left. And about about half of the paint.
Side note - When I brought the mirror bracket to the paint store, one of the
guys said it looked like his 1974 Pinto. I said no, but you're close.
If I could figure out how to upload pictures I would
JWID
Tom Eckert N2VWN
73 Glacier
Oakland, TN
On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 5:33 AM, Ken Wolkens <kwolkens@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> I never could figure out why we'd paint our roofs with a nice paint and
> then walk on them so I'm going a different route....
>
> I'm going to use a product by SEM that's a bedliner material. It's
> tintable to any color and I'm getting it in white. In it's natural state
> (no rubber filler chunks) it's not a rough texture like Herculiner and other
> systems. It could even be layed down smooth depending how the painter puts
> it on. For my coach I'll give it a very light sand like stipple to make the
> roof walkable when wet. My goal is something like the deck of a boat.
> Enough to keep you from skidding off yet not so much that leaves and junk
> stay up there forever.
>
> http://semproducts.com/Catalog.asp?prod=315
>
> Ken W.
> --
> 1973 GMC 23'
> All Birch and Maple Interior Cabinetry. TZE033V100221
> "The Honeycomb Hideout"
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96417 is a reply to message #36692] |
Thu, 19 August 2010 11:26 |
Larry C
Messages: 1168
Registered: July 2004
Location: NE Illinois by the Illino...
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I sort of like the clear coat idea as I am no longer a fan of wax on- wax off days
________________________________________
There are two products out now, one a tv commercial and the other at the store that you apply when you wash the car. Then you gently spray rinse the body with clear water.
The water gradually rolls off the body, more importantly, it helps keep the dirt off and will come off easier.
So there you go, RainX for the windows and this product for the body...
The PRODUCT I have been trying is SIMONIZ Self Drying. It is in a clear bottle and the liquid is golden color.
If it is a hot day, when I did the car ( a black one ), the metal gets so hot the water will dry faster then the water can travel off the hood so I use a micro fibre cloth to wipe it down. It looks like glass when dry.
Just a suggestion.
I am not affiliated with the Simonize company and am only sharing my results to this point. I receive no benefit from said company for bringing this to your attention.
Gatsbys' CRUISER  08-18-04
74 GLACIER X, 260/455-APC-4 Bagg'r
Remflex Manifold gaskets
CampGrounds needed, Add yours to "PLACES" />
http://www.gmceast.com/travel
_
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Clear Coat on the Roof [message #96910 is a reply to message #96741] |
Mon, 23 August 2010 10:16 |
Dr. Detroit
Messages: 158
Registered: April 2010
Location: Novi, MI.
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Without a doubt Imron is the best due to it's high urethane solids content. FWIW I think I read that it was used on the later coaches from the factory. I want to say that the change over was 1975. I'll try to find where I saw this info.
Ken W.
1973 GMC 23'
All Birch and Maple Interior Cabinetry. TZE033V100221
"The Honeycomb Hideout"
|
|
|
|
GMCforum
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
