Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps
LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps [message #365310] |
Fri, 09 July 2021 18:37 |
Tom Katzenberger
Messages: 399 Registered: June 2019 Location: Kingsville, MD
Karma: 4
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Guys,
I was all in on LiFePo4 Batteries until I discovered they can not be charged below 32F. Those who have time with the Lithium batteries please let me know your thought? Thanks.
Tom K.
Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
Kingsville, Maryland,
1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D., Micro Level, Howell EBL-EFI Spark Control, Macerator, York Air Compressor, 6 Wheel Disc, Quadra Bag, Onan W/Bovee Ignition
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[GMCnet] Re: LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps [message #365312 is a reply to message #365310] |
Fri, 09 July 2021 19:09 |
stu@97381.com, Emery
Messages: 232 Registered: June 2020
Karma: 2
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I believe they can still be charged if you reduce the charging rate. How do they charge electric autos at low temps?
There are also new lithium batteries that automatically heat the batteries at low ambient temps.
Emery Stora
> On Jul 9, 2021, at 5:37 PM, tomkatz3@comcast.net wrote:
>
> Guys,
>
> I was all in on LiFePo4 Batteries until I discovered they can not be charged below 32F. Those who have time with the Lithium batteries please let me
> know your thought? Thanks.
>
> Tom K.
> --
> Tom & Oki Katzenberger,
> Kingsville, Maryland,
> 1977 23' Birchaven, 455 C.I.D.
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> GMCnet mailing list
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Re: [GMCnet] Re: LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps [message #365313 is a reply to message #365312] |
Fri, 09 July 2021 19:39 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186 Registered: January 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Yes, there are LiFePo4 batteries with heaters.
I have been looking at them as well and I'm wondering why there are batteries with the same basic specs all over E-bay and Amazon that are half the price of the brand name ones (Battle Born, Briter, etc.)?
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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Re: LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps [message #365316 is a reply to message #365310] |
Fri, 09 July 2021 20:40 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447 Registered: October 2006 Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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I’d be more worried about charging during the hot weather we experience more often than cold. Remember all the 787 Dreamliner fires? That’s bad.
Cooling them would be harder than simply adding resistance heat in cold weather. No expert here, just looking at raising the obvious questions.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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Re: LiFePo4 Below Freezing Temps [message #365331 is a reply to message #365326] |
Sat, 10 July 2021 10:14 |
rjw
Messages: 697 Registered: September 2005
Karma: 4
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RF_Burns wrote on Sat, 10 July 2021 09:12The Battery Management System (BMS) within the LiFePO4 (LFP) battery should be designed to prevent charging below freezing. Some batteries have a built-in heater that uses the available charging current to warm the battery before switching that current to charge the battery. LPF batteries don't off-gas so you can install them inside. One 100Ahr LPF battery (smaller than a group 27 and weighing less than 30lbs) is roughly equivalent to two golf-cart LA batteries and will outlast them by many years.
You can discharge the battery down to -20C. Some say they operate up to +60C, but most say avoid operation above +40C
There are a number of Lithium battery chemistries. The higher charge concentration chemistries as used in Tesla's are much more unstable and susceptible to catching than LPF. LPF is a very stable battery chemistry. You can find videos on YouTube where they are dropped, shorted, over-charged etc and not much happens compared to Lead-Acid (LA) and other lithium chemistries.
There seems to be a handful of companies in China that make virtually all of the LPF cells. There are a number of companies that assemble these cells into batteries. They will custom build and private label the batteries for you. If you look at the various US lithium battery companies, they say "designed in USA" or "Designed and assembled" not "Made in USA".
You can also buy the cells and the BMS and assemble your own battery to your own specs. There is lots of info on-line about how to do this and the pit-falls. Google Will Prowse for some good info.
I just installed two 100Ahr batteries in my coach and so far I really like them. They charge much faster than LA batteries and have a very flat voltage discharge curve. The Murray sleeps in a heated shop all winter so I'm not much worried about freezing temps.
I am intrigued by the concept of getting rid of LA house batteries. My GMC also spends the winter in its own heated/air conditioned garage. Can you share with us approximate cost of your battery upgrade? I know my "new" converter/charger etc. would need to be replaced.
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com
Roller Cam 455, TBI+EBL, 3.42 FD, 4 Bag, Macerator, Lenzi (brakes, vacuum system, front end stuff), Manny Tranny, vacuum step, Tankless + OEM water heaters.
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