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Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361144]

Sat, 26 December 2020 12:42

hertfordnc

Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC

Karma: 0

Senior Member

I am still researching all my generator options. I can fit an Emerald that i already have. I am on the hunt for an original 4K and i am also looking at the inverter generators that are not Honda.

Used to be you didn't go to Harborfreight for anything with moving parts. At least that was my impression. But i am seeing RV people including the sagely wise people in this group, bragging on the Predator series generators.

I have a 76 Birch. it is my understanding that the early years did not have good cab AC to begin with.

I live in the South. i camp mostly in July and August and my coach has a black roof.

So, My typical trip might have the roof air running for several days. Are we getting that sort or reliability from the sub-$600 inverter generators?

Dave & Ellen Silva Hertford, NC 76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021 It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.

[Updated on: Mon, 28 December 2020 10:58]

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Re: [GMCnet] Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361146 is a reply to message #361144]

Sat, 26 December 2020 15:07

Ken Henderson

Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA

Karma: 9

Senior Member

After my experience with the expensive Generac 36G, I won't consider
another inverter generator from anyone! I replaced that Generac (which
lasted about 75 hours after the 4k Onan), I installed a 6.5kW TroyBilt.
It's LOUD, but it's run perfectly for several hundred hours with NO
problems.

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g3781-generac-impact-36g-plus-ii-installation.html
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g5330-troybilt-generator-installation.html

Ken H.

On Sat, Dec 26, 2020 at 1:43 PM dave silva via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:

> I am still researching all my generator options. I can fit an Emerald
> that i already have. I am on the hunt for an original 4K and i am also
> looking
> at the inverter generators that are not Honda.
>
> Used to be you didn't got to Harborfreight for anything with moving parts.
> At least that was my impression. But i amseeing RV people including the
> sagely wide people in this group bragging on the Predator series
> generators.
>
> I have a 74 Birch. it is my understanding that the early years did not
> have good cab AC to begin.
>
> I live in the South. i camp mostly in July and August and my coach has a
> black roof.
>
> So, My typical trip might have the roof air running for several days. Are
> we getting that sort or reliability from the sub-$600 inverter generators?
>
>
>
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
> Hertford, NC
>
> 74 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361150 is a reply to message #361144]

Sat, 26 December 2020 18:27

lqqkatjon

Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN

Karma: 5

Senior Member

There are so many different “cheap” generator out there. Some have proven to work well. Others have not.

It is also about care and use. Sitting for long period of time seem to take out cheap motors at my work. Honda motors seem to just need new gas.

Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361151 is a reply to message #361150]

Sat, 26 December 2020 18:29

lqqkatjon

Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN

Karma: 5

Senior Member

Dave-

I would feel confident in a champion(preferred). Or a preditor 3000 watt generator.

I think a person really needs 3000 watt minimum. You can function on less, but really not well. A 3000 watt generator running a single ac is not really labored.

Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361152 is a reply to message #361144]

Sat, 26 December 2020 18:47

Matt Colie

Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan

Karma: 7

Senior Member

hertfordnc wrote on Sat, 26 December 2020 13:42

I am still researching all my generator options. I can fit an Emerald that i already have. I am on the hunt for an original 4K and i am also looking at the inverter generators that are not Honda.
Used to be you didn't go to Harborfreight for anything with moving parts. At least that was my impression. But i am seeing RV people including the sagely wise people in this group, bragging on the Predator series generators.
I have a 74 Birch. it is my understanding that the early years did not have good cab AC to begin with.
I live in the South. i camp mostly in July and August and my coach has a black roof.
So, My typical trip might have the roof air running for several days. Are we getting that sort or reliability from the sub-$600 inverter generators?

Dave,

First non-answer, I suggest you check you TZE number because it is my understanding that there were no transmodes shipped before the 75my. That really doesn't make a great deal of difference as the cab A/C sucked until the 77my for all builds.

Now, about other brand longevity. Ken's Generac was bad because it was built around a junk engine. Junk engines are easy to build. All they have to do is not buy the better parts and materials and the cost can be drastically reduced. What I can't answer is just how bad the CCP engines really are. We know that they make a good virus, and the machine tools for export are massively mediocre as far as working life. They have learned a lot in recent years with the theft of intellectual properties and trade secrets. I have to allow that they not alone at building inferior engines. Good old American Briggs and Stratton has a produced a line of small engines that are so inexpensive that service parts are not available as it is more cost effective to toss that one overboard and replace it as a unit at the end of 50~100 hours.

The electric end is pretty easy actually. It has windings and a bearing and really not much more. Ken's was an inverter unit and I don't know if that was his problem or not. By the time I got to talk to Ken at any length, that machine was gone.

So, I really can't answer your question, but maybe one of the small engine groups on line can.

Matt

Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361156 is a reply to message #361144]

Sat, 26 December 2020 22:16

Richard RV

Messages: 631
Registered: July 2012
Location: Full-timer for 12 years, ...

Karma: -17

Senior Member

Dave,
I'm pretty sure that Coachmen first offered the Birchaven for the 1976 model year. Here's a handy dandy TZE decoder ring that will tell you what model year you have:
https://www.gmcmotorhome.com/faq/vin.html

Richard

'77 Birchaven TZE...777; '76 Palm Beach under construction; ‘76 Edgemont waiting its turn

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361165 is a reply to message #361144]

Sun, 27 December 2020 11:28

Ernest Dankert

Messages: 133
Registered: May 2007
Location: Ogden, New York

Karma: 1

Senior Member

I inherited a Champion generator, 6500 watts from my brother. It had been used very little. The automagic choke vacuum hose had decayed and it had stale fuel. Tuned it up and changed the oil. I suspect it had the first fill of oil and it was pretty clear so I could see the metallic bits. Put it to work on a contractor air compressor for nailing. It worked for about 30 minutes and voltage went to ~half.

No slip rings, the stator volts are induced and one diode had shorted. Replacement diode was available and restored to original operating condition. It holds voltage and frequency real well and starts easily. Running the air compressor might be considered a torture test; 0 to 60% to 0 load as the pressure switch cycled.

I have 3 Generac red chassis generators which Generac no longer supports; red chassis business was sold to Briggs & Stratton; Generac is now orangeish. Two I inherited, one just a tune up and the other was stored outside and had water in the cylinder. Opened up and cleaned cylinder with scotch brite; runs well. I tune the Generac to 60 Hz at half resistance load.

Personally I will keep the Onan going as long as I can support it. Cast iron cylinder, 1800 rpm. Yeah the others are OHV, but 3600 rpm and aluminum block.

1977 Eleganza II
Ogden NY

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361171 is a reply to message #361156]

Sun, 27 December 2020 15:12

hertfordnc

Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC

Karma: 0

Senior Member

Richard RV wrote on Sat, 26 December 2020 22:16

Dave,
I'm pretty sure that Coachmen first offered the Birchaven for the 1976 model year. Here's a handy dandy TZE decoder ring that will tell you what model year you have:
https://www.gmcmotorhome.com/faq/vin.html

Richard

You are correct- it's a 76.

Dave & Ellen Silva Hertford, NC 76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021 It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361184 is a reply to message #361144]

Sun, 27 December 2020 20:18

6cuda6

Messages: 975
Registered: June 2019

Karma: -6

Senior Member

Are we talking running A/C for several days with no shore power? If so i would get something name brand....if only an hour here or there off shore power then probably anything would last long enough.

JMHO from a guy who spent a few hours putting in a 6500 watt Honda generator and didnt use it once this past season....lol.

Rich Mondor, Brockville, ON 77 Hughes 2600

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361185 is a reply to message #361184]

Sun, 27 December 2020 20:27

hertfordnc

Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC

Karma: 0

Senior Member

6cuda6 wrote on Sun, 27 December 2020 20:18

Are we talking running A/C for several days with no shore power? If so i would get something name brand....if only an hour here or there off shore power then probably anything would last long enough.

JMHO from a guy who spent a few hours putting in a 6500 watt Honda generator and didnt use it once this past season....lol.

THat's what i'm attempting to work out.

Yes, the generator may be on for extended periods. Can i expect the dash air to keep the coach cool at 90F ?

I'm gonna service it with Duracool

SO i'm either adapting the Emerald or finding a 4K or buying a Predator form harbor freight.

Dave & Ellen Silva Hertford, NC 76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021 It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361186 is a reply to message #361185]

Sun, 27 December 2020 21:29

lqqkatjon

Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN

Karma: 5

Senior Member

Dash air in a 77 or 78. 23’ coach should keep cool. It is all about keeping/staying cool. Window coverings, insulation also are a big deciding factor.

Dash air will not keep a 26’ coach cool in my opinion and experience.

Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361201 is a reply to message #361144]

Mon, 28 December 2020 08:23

jhbridges

Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga

Karma: -74

Senior Member

I don't believe KenH's genset was an inverter set. I think it was, like the one I had, a multispeed multiwinding set which switched windings in and out based on load which also determined engine speed. Which is why they nore 55 Hz to 65 HZ.

--johnny

Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons. Braselton, Ga. I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell

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Re: Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361205 is a reply to message #361144]

Mon, 28 December 2020 09:50

lqqkatjon

Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN

Karma: 5

Senior Member

other things to consider for generator:

weight and size.

I have access to honda 3000 watt inverters. I have used them plenty and I believe those to be by far the quietest and best generator money can buy. they sip gas, they are whisper quiet, and just fantastic units. but the suckers are big and heavy. just big enough I can lift it, probably doing a little damage to my back. Not good. I almost always try to get help, and need to be careful when I don't. I think they are 130 pounds.
one of those will run my roof air over a weekend on a tank of gas. part of that, is they have a 3.5 gallon tank. added weight.

the Honda also takes up space. I almost always haul it on a trailer when I took one with, but if not, it would suck up the entire doorway and you would have issues getting in and out of my coach.

I would believe the predator 3500 from harbor freight would be the same as it looks like a clone of the honda. site says 100 pounds.

running smaller generators at closer to max loads, also really effects fuel consumption. Not that you are going to go broke buying gas, but a honda 2000 running full kilt will be out of gas in 4 hours. vs. 8 to 10 on 1/4 load. so refueling is a hassle on some vs others.

security is also a concern, and also running one in the rain.

I had that champion 3100 watt generator. was louder then the honda 3000 by far, but probably equal to the honda 2000. also has enough gas capacity it would not need to be constantly fueled up. It weighed I think 100 pounds. not light, but it was manageable.

I have seen both the honda 3000 watt generator installed in a gmc, as well as a champion. The champion is nice because it also has a wireless start/stop keyfob. but both of those I think they modified the compartment.

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member-galleries/p57206-honda-3000-generator.html

Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

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Re: [GMCnet] Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361210 is a reply to message #361205]

Mon, 28 December 2020 10:10

jimk

Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA

Karma: 9

Senior Member

John,
I will need to find out from our Onan Cummens rep.

On Mon, Dec 28, 2020 at 7:51 AM Jon Roche via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:

> other things to consider for generator:
>
> weight and size.
>
> I have access to honda 3000 watt inverters. I have used them plenty and
> I believe those to be by far the quietest and best generator money can buy.
> they sip gas, they are whisper quiet, and just fantastic units. but the
> suckers are big and heavy. just big enough I can lift it, probably doing
> a little damage to my back. Not good. I almost always try to get help,
> and need to be careful when I don't. I think they are 130 pounds.
> one of those will run my roof air over a weekend on a tank of gas. part
> of that, is they have a 3.5 gallon tank. added weight.
>
> the Honda also takes up space. I almost always haul it on a trailer when
> I took one with, but if not, it would suck up the entire doorway and you
> would have issues getting in and out of my coach.
>
> I would believe the predator 3500 from harbor freight would be the same as
> it looks like a clone of the honda. site says 100 pounds.
>
>
> running smaller generators at closer to max loads, also really effects
> fuel consumption. Not that you are going to go broke buying gas, but a
> honda
> 2000 running full kilt will be out of gas in 4 hours. vs. 8 to 10 on 1/4
> load. so refueling is a hassle on some vs others.
>
> security is also a concern, and also running one in the rain.
>
> I had that champion 3100 watt generator. was louder then the honda 3000
> by far, but probably equal to the honda 2000. also has enough gas
> capacity it would not need to be constantly fueled up. It weighed I
> think 100 pounds. not light, but it was manageable.
>
> I have seen both the honda 3000 watt generator installed in a gmc, as well
> as a champion. The champion is nice because it also has a wireless
> start/stop keyfob. but both of those I think they modified the
> compartment.
>
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member-galleries/p57206-honda-3000-generator.html
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Roche
> 75 palm beach
> EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
> St. Cloud, MN
> http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>

--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.gmcrvparts.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502

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Re: [GMCnet] Cheap generators - real world longevity? [message #361269 is a reply to message #361205]

Wed, 30 December 2020 11:16

GMC.LES

Messages: 505
Registered: April 2014

Karma: -2

Senior Member

I have a Yamaha 3000w inverter genset and they are reputed as having the cleanest AC signal of all the portable inverter gensets. These units are equal to the Honda 3000w inverter with regards to size, noise, and efficiency. They have been produced for over 10yrs with no changes, so parts are readily available both used and new.

The HF predator units are appealing due to price, but I’d be worried about parts availability when traveling. I can’t afford to wait extended periods for parts while on the road. Yamaha and Honda will likely be able to supply any parts you need within a few days. Same for skilled repair service.

Les Burt
Montreal
'75 Eleganza 26'

> On Dec 28, 2020, at 10:51 AM, Jon Roche via Gmclist wrote:
>
> other things to consider for generator:
>
> weight and size.
>
> I have access to honda 3000 watt inverters. I have used them plenty and I believe those to be by far the quietest and best generator money can buy.
> they sip gas, they are whisper quiet, and just fantastic units. but the suckers are big and heavy. just big enough I can lift it, probably doing
> a little damage to my back. Not good. I almost always try to get help, and need to be careful when I don't. I think they are 130 pounds.
> one of those will run my roof air over a weekend on a tank of gas. part of that, is they have a 3.5 gallon tank. added weight.
>
> the Honda also takes up space. I almost always haul it on a trailer when I took one with, but if not, it would suck up the entire doorway and you
> would have issues getting in and out of my coach.
>
> I would believe the predator 3500 from harbor freight would be the same as it looks like a clone of the honda. site says 100 pounds.
>
>
> running smaller generators at closer to max loads, also really effects fuel consumption. Not that you are going to go broke buying gas, but a honda
> 2000 running full kilt will be out of gas in 4 hours. vs. 8 to 10 on 1/4 load. so refueling is a hassle on some vs others.
>
> security is also a concern, and also running one in the rain.
>
> I had that champion 3100 watt generator. was louder then the honda 3000 by far, but probably equal to the honda 2000. also has enough gas
> capacity it would not need to be constantly fueled up. It weighed I think 100 pounds. not light, but it was manageable.
>
> I have seen both the honda 3000 watt generator installed in a gmc, as well as a champion. The champion is nice because it also has a wireless
> start/stop keyfob. but both of those I think they modified the compartment.
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member-galleries/p57206-honda-3000-generator.html
>
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Roche
> 75 palm beach
> EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
> St. Cloud, MN
> http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

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