Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » New MSD EFI (Any thoughts)
| New MSD EFI [message #329775] |
Wed, 07 March 2018 10:20  |
77Royale
Messages: 461
Registered: June 2014
Location: Mid Michigan
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Just seeing of anyone has run this system, or if there are any thoughts from the braintrust here. It looks as if the MSD system is similar to Fitech. Same principle anyway. 1300 bucks or so with a fuel pump.
I noted that the MSD does not require a return fuel line. No fuel command center unit. Just run a high pressure fuel pump and its supposed to be good to go.
https://www.msdperformance.com/products/fuel_systems/atomic_efi/atomic_efi_tbi/parts/2910
Same/similar arguments with timing control.
Just wondering if anyone on this board is running this system or not. I dont do facebook but understand there may be some discussion on it. MSD has been around a while so Im wondering what the thoughts are on the system.
Thanks in advance.
77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
Mid Michigan
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329779 is a reply to message #329775] |
Wed, 07 March 2018 11:08  |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I don't have any personal experience, but I know Miguel Mendez has installed quite a few of them and is a big fan. You might give him a call.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] New MSD EFI [message #329806 is a reply to message #329787] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 00:34 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Miguel and I use the return line as it helps to keep the unit cooler ad
maintains better pressure control.
We hae sold quite a lot as they are approved for California Air Resources
Board (CARB)
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:38 AM, Billy Massey wrote:
> Miguel has quit installing FiTech and recommends the MSD very highly.
> http://mgmgmc.net/
>
> bdub
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:20 AM, Wayne Rogewski wrote:
>
>> Just seeing of anyone has run this system, or if there are any thoughts
>> from the braintrust here. It looks as if the MSD system is similar to
>> Fitech. Same principle anyway. 1300 bucks or so with a fuel pump.
>>
>> I noted that the MSD does not require a return fuel line. No fuel
>> command center unit. Just run a high pressure fuel pump and its supposed
>> to be
>> good to go.
>>
>> https://www.msdperformance.com/products/fuel_systems/
>> atomic_efi/atomic_efi_tbi/parts/2910
>>
>>
>> Same/similar arguments with timing control.
>>
>> Just wondering if anyone on this board is running this system or not. I
>> dont do facebook but understand there may be some discussion on it.
> MSD
>> has been around a while so Im wondering what the thoughts are on the
>> system.
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] New MSD EFI [message #329807 is a reply to message #329787] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 00:36 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Like the Fitec, MSD does not give you better economy like the Howel based
unit with the EBL .
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:34 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
> Miguel and I use the return line as it helps to keep the unit cooler ad
> maintains better pressure control.
> We hae sold quite a lot as they are approved for California Air Resources
> Board (CARB)
>
> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:38 AM, Billy Massey wrote:
>
>> Miguel has quit installing FiTech and recommends the MSD very highly.
>> http://mgmgmc.net/
>>
>> bdub
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 10:20 AM, Wayne Rogewski
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Just seeing of anyone has run this system, or if there are any thoughts
>>> from the braintrust here. It looks as if the MSD system is similar to
>>> Fitech. Same principle anyway. 1300 bucks or so with a fuel pump.
>>>
>>> I noted that the MSD does not require a return fuel line. No fuel
>>> command center unit. Just run a high pressure fuel pump and its
>> supposed
>>> to be
>>> good to go.
>>>
>>> https://www.msdperformance.com/products/fuel_systems/
>>> atomic_efi/atomic_efi_tbi/parts/2910
>>>
>>>
>>> Same/similar arguments with timing control.
>>>
>>> Just wondering if anyone on this board is running this system or not. I
>>> dont do facebook but understand there may be some discussion on it.
>> MSD
>>> has been around a while so Im wondering what the thoughts are on the
>>> system.
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329815 is a reply to message #329775] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 08:30 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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I've an MSD installed by Miguel on my coach. It has an outboard pressure regulator and return line which is plumbed into the filler neck. Positive points so far, Walks over elevations without histrionics... keeps the mixture stochiometric or close regardless of altitude; cranks up instanter, even after sittingand a weak battery (I left the 12V supply unplugged.) Not quite so good points - which I don't think are MSD specific - The engine's noisier because there's just a plastic bonnet over the throttle body which hasn't a lot of soundproofing; I don't get decent mileage. As I say, these aren't MSD specific, more soundproofing and some time playing with the system tuner should help both.
Given that the system has some high pressure fule lines, I consider a foam extinguisher essential. I've a FireFight bolted to the bak of the hatch opening. The lines are new and good, but who knows what might make one leak.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329820 is a reply to message #329775] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 11:16 |
Scott Nutter
Messages: 782
Registered: January 2015
Location: Houston/San Diego
Karma: 4
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After reading the MSD manual and reviews on the web,
A big plus for the MSD is that you can make real time adjustments on the handheld controller while driving. I believe with the Fitech you have to pull over, turn off the ignition, wait a few seconds, restart, enter the new adjustment, then drive. And only one adjustment at a time.
As with all the throttle body EFI's(except the Howell EBL), I don't think they are designed to give any better MPG, unless you have a badly tuned carburetor. Just better performance.
The complaints seem to be less with the MSD from the reviews I've read.
Scott.
Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329822 is a reply to message #329775] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 12:14 |
Scott Nutter
Messages: 782
Registered: January 2015
Location: Houston/San Diego
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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And to add more confusion, Just got off the phone with Summit racing customer service. They swear by the Fitech, but sell the MSD also..........
I guess it's the old apples to oranges comparison. But the MSD is California compliant. Fitech will soon be.
Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329823 is a reply to message #329822] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 13:36 |
77Royale
Messages: 461
Registered: June 2014
Location: Mid Michigan
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Appreciate the comments thus far. It may be worth adding the thought process behind this possible switch. Each owner may want different things and have different expectations.
The concerns or things Im looking to mitigate in no particular order: potential for Vapor Lock, Exhaust Smell, reliability overall, warm up times.
I currently have a low mile Patterson rebuilt carb and distributor. The system works very well, and Dick was nice enough to help adjust the carb and give a once over in Elkhart. Im not sure its going to get better than where it is currently.
My concerns with the current system are that the coach takes a while to warm up and the exhaust is pretty stinky. Having the rebuilt carb tuned has helped with the exhaust smell a lot, but not all the way. I dont have any expectations that the GMC will ever smell like a new car when running, but anything helps. Perhaps EFI will help some more.
Warm up times are not an issue when Im home. We mostly camp at normal campgrounds, and I try to be a good neighbor and as considerate as possible. Warming up the coach for 5 mins or longer on a cold morning, coupled with the smell and actual noise of the running engine I think has gotten to some of our camping neighbors. (no we are not at a high brow campground, Yes, I have two working new mufflers that are not race style and dont leak) No its not as loud as the 25 super diesels that are also there camping, but I dont want to be "that guy". No I dont expect to leave a campsite in total silence either. But if I can start the engine and roll sooner, then that's great. Perhaps EFI will help some more. (I also dont expect to turn they key and floor the gas to tear out of any place).
Ive never experienced vapor lock, but truth be told, when we are underway, I rarely shut the engine down until Im there. In reading about the EFI experiences of several GMCers. Running a return line, and keeping as much fuel line away from anything producing heat seems like its both reasonable and effective at better controlling or eliminating this condition. Having the fuel lines run behind the engine from the tanks to feed the EFI seems like a better set up temperature wise, than the OEM steel line running in front of everything, then through the mechanical pump, then up to the front of the Carb. As I understand it, EFI should help with this condition.
Fuel Pumps. Ive probably read every horror story and success story on pumps on this forum. Some pumps seem better, some worse, all will fail at some point, just be prepared for it. I have a new, proper mechanical carter pump installed, and also a new spare in the coach just in case. Im not so much worried about one going out, but more that the diaphragm lets go and dumps fuel in the crank case. I had that happen on an engine once. Didn't do too much damage overall, but properly disposing of 10+ quarts of gassy oil was a pain, plus flushing the engine. I cant imagine doing that on the side of the road in the GMC. Seems like changing a bad electric fuel pump mounted outside the tank would be a bit easier than on the side of a hot engine. Perhaps the EFI high pressure pump would be "better" from a change out perspective but not necessarily more reliable. At least expect for it to fail, hope it doesnt, and carry a spare and move on with life.
Also in the reliability area is if something tanks, or gives up. The reality is if the carb fouls up, and you cant fix it, it could be some time before replacement carbs, someone that knows what they are actually doing, or replacement parts can be found and shipped to your location, and again if you dont know what your doing, finding someone who does close by. So your off the road for a while waiting. If the EFI tanks, and you know its not the pump, just assume its the entire unit. Same thing, your off the road, however you will find a new replacement unit faster, and in some cases shipped to you probably the same day. Unplug the electrical connections, and fuel lines, pull, drop new one in, plug in and go. So if I had to pick between a carb going south or EFI I may prefer the EFI route for the time involved to replace. Im not suggesting that 900 to 1000 bucks is a throw away unit, but correctly rebuilt carbs are several hundred as well, or more if your current carb cant be used as a core.
I suppose thats where my thinking is. and I know Ive missed other valid concerns.
The MPG as has been mentioned is not that big of a deal. Im not expecting or looking for any gains. As it stands we do not drive a ton of miles to really appreciate a few extra gallons of gas here and there. Our time off, and time with the family is the most valuable part of every minute in the coach. I found driving as if there is an egg covering the gas pedal helps, keeping it under 65mph and having empty holding tanks (grey, black, and fresh) are pretty helpful.
Perhaps there is more discussion on the merits/de merits of this system, or maybe I just further talked my self into this, but I appreciate the knowledge on this forum.
77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
Mid Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] New MSD EFI [message #329826 is a reply to message #329823] |
Thu, 08 March 2018 16:12 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Wayne,
If the choke is set correctly, there is no need to warm up the engine.
By driving it slowly for the first mile or two will heat the engine rapidly
and is easier on the engine wear.
In my book warming up a endine by idleing is a por practise
On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 11:36 AM, Wayne Rogewski wrote:
> Appreciate the comments thus far. It may be worth adding the thought
> process behind this possible switch. Each owner may want different things
> and
> have different expectations.
>
> The concerns or things Im looking to mitigate in no particular order:
> potential for Vapor Lock, Exhaust Smell, reliability overall, warm up
> times.
>
> I currently have a low mile Patterson rebuilt carb and distributor. The
> system works very well, and Dick was nice enough to help adjust the carb and
> give a once over in Elkhart. Im not sure its going to get better than
> where it is currently.
>
> My concerns with the current system are that the coach takes a while to
> warm up and the exhaust is pretty stinky. Having the rebuilt carb tuned
> has
> helped with the exhaust smell a lot, but not all the way. I dont have any
> expectations that the GMC will ever smell like a new car when running, but
> anything helps. Perhaps EFI will help some more.
>
> Warm up times are not an issue when Im home. We mostly camp at normal
> campgrounds, and I try to be a good neighbor and as considerate as possible.
> Warming up the coach for 5 mins or longer on a cold morning, coupled with
> the smell and actual noise of the running engine I think has gotten to some
> of our camping neighbors. (no we are not at a high brow campground, Yes,
> I have two working new mufflers that are not race style and dont leak) No
> its not as loud as the 25 super diesels that are also there camping, but I
> dont want to be "that guy". No I dont expect to leave a campsite in total
> silence either. But if I can start the engine and roll sooner, then
> that's great. Perhaps EFI will help some more. (I also dont expect to
> turn
> they key and floor the gas to tear out of any place).
>
> Ive never experienced vapor lock, but truth be told, when we are underway,
> I rarely shut the engine down until Im there. In reading about the EFI
> experiences of several GMCers. Running a return line, and keeping as much
> fuel line away from anything producing heat seems like its both reasonable
> and effective at better controlling or eliminating this condition.
> Having the fuel lines run behind the engine from the tanks to feed the EFI
> seems
> like a better set up temperature wise, than the OEM steel line running in
> front of everything, then through the mechanical pump, then up to the front
> of the Carb. As I understand it, EFI should help with this condition.
>
> Fuel Pumps. Ive probably read every horror story and success story on
> pumps on this forum. Some pumps seem better, some worse, all will fail at
> some
> point, just be prepared for it. I have a new, proper mechanical carter
> pump installed, and also a new spare in the coach just in case. Im not so
> much worried about one going out, but more that the diaphragm lets go and
> dumps fuel in the crank case. I had that happen on an engine once. Didn't
> do too much damage overall, but properly disposing of 10+ quarts of gassy
> oil was a pain, plus flushing the engine. I cant imagine doing that on the
> side of the road in the GMC. Seems like changing a bad electric fuel pump
> mounted outside the tank would be a bit easier than on the side of a hot
> engine. Perhaps the EFI high pressure pump would be "better" from a
> change out perspective but not necessarily more reliable. At least expect
> for it
> to fail, hope it doesnt, and carry a spare and move on with life.
>
> Also in the reliability area is if something tanks, or gives up. The
> reality is if the carb fouls up, and you cant fix it, it could be some time
> before replacement carbs, someone that knows what they are actually doing,
> or replacement parts can be found and shipped to your location, and again
> if you dont know what your doing, finding someone who does close by. So
> your off the road for a while waiting. If the EFI tanks, and you know its
> not the pump, just assume its the entire unit. Same thing, your off the
> road, however you will find a new replacement unit faster, and in some cases
> shipped to you probably the same day. Unplug the electrical connections,
> and fuel lines, pull, drop new one in, plug in and go. So if I had to
> pick between a carb going south or EFI I may prefer the EFI route for the
> time involved to replace. Im not suggesting that 900 to 1000 bucks is a
> throw away unit, but correctly rebuilt carbs are several hundred as well,
> or more if your current carb cant be used as a core.
>
> I suppose thats where my thinking is. and I know Ive missed other valid
> concerns.
>
> The MPG as has been mentioned is not that big of a deal. Im not
> expecting or looking for any gains. As it stands we do not drive a ton of
> miles to
> really appreciate a few extra gallons of gas here and there. Our time off,
> and time with the family is the most valuable part of every minute in the
> coach. I found driving as if there is an egg covering the gas pedal
> helps, keeping it under 65mph and having empty holding tanks (grey, black,
> and
> fresh) are pretty helpful.
>
> Perhaps there is more discussion on the merits/de merits of this system,
> or maybe I just further talked my self into this, but I appreciate the
> knowledge on this forum.
>
>
>
>
> --
> 77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson
> carb and dizzy.
> Mid Michigan
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] New MSD EFI [message #329838 is a reply to message #329828] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 06:53 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I can tell youb that when I take a coach to pass smog, if it smells , I
know it will not pass.
Sometimes a lean at idle will not pass as there will not be enough gas
molicules for the spark to ignite the mixture.
On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 4:13 PM, Matt Colie wrote:
> Warren,
>
> I completely agree with JimK. If you can't make the engine pull the coach
> after about 30 seconds, your choke calibration is wrong. The fact that the
> exhaust stinks would also indicate this. Nothing good happens to an
> idling engine. These days I am kind of busy, but when I get through my
> current
> big tasks (or if parts don't come in) I could show up there and give a
> hand getting the cold calibration right.
>
> Matt
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie - '73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
> Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan
> OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329841 is a reply to message #329775] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 09:31 |
Scott Nutter
Messages: 782
Registered: January 2015
Location: Houston/San Diego
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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Warren,
I think you are absolutely correct on your train of thought for the EFI. It seems to be a cleaner and potentially better system all together. And I think modern fuels are designed with fuel injection in mind.
I'm going that route, 90% sure it will be Fitech. With no distributor control and no fuel command module. Just a easy to get to fuel pump.
Scott.
Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329843 is a reply to message #329841] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 10:30 |
77Royale
Messages: 461
Registered: June 2014
Location: Mid Michigan
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Thats one of the things I was looking for, If anyone has switched to EFI, did that make a difference with the exhaust smell? This would make the co pilots very happy.
As for the choke settings and Choke. I switched to an electric with the Patterson rebuild, and Mr. Patterson personally adjusted it while the engine was cold. He also made some adjustments to the mixture screws while running and with a vacuum gauge attached. and verified the correct vacuum hoses were connected where they were supposed to be. Super nice guy to meet and chat with in person.
Im a bit hesitant to undo or modify the adjustments he made.
My main reason for the engine to warm up as long as I do is to make sure the ATF has a chance to get to where it needs to before asking the trans to do some work. Perhaps that's not good practice? The other thing I do while the engine is warming up is a full walk around. All the lights on and working, is the LP tank off, is the shore power cord unplugged and stowed. Do the turn signals work, is there anything at all leaking, dripping or pouring out from under the coach, including holding tanks. Are there any new puddles where there shouldn't be. Is the awning secured, Is the campfire out, have I left the campsite cleaner than when I found it. Are bikes secured, Do I hear any new noises that need to be looked at right now. etc.
77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
Mid Michigan
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329844 is a reply to message #329841] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 10:45 |
Larry
Messages: 2875
Registered: January 2004
Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Scott Nutter wrote on Fri, 09 March 2018 09:31Warren,
I think you are absolutely correct on your train of thought for the EFI. It seems to be a cleaner and potentially better system all together. And I think modern fuels are designed with fuel injection in mind.
I'm going that route, 90% sure it will be Fitech. With no distributor control and no fuel command module. Just a easy to get to fuel pump.
Scott.
Scott,
I have a Fitech on my Cad 500 and really like the way it handles fuel demands. There are some things that the FiTech "Set Up" and "Quick Start Guide" do not cover. So I went on line to some of the forums that address Fitech issues, for answers. One of the themes that I have seen is problems with the Fuel Command Center. One of the solutions to those problems has been , instead of using the FCC, the mounting on the frame of a high pressure pump as low as possible and as close as possible to the fuel tanks. Some who have done this have experienced a LOT of noise coming from the pump. I experienced this when running a port injection EBL system. The warmer it got outside the louder the "screaming" coming from the pump. I finally took the pump out and replaced the system with high pressure pumps in the tanks and fuel pressure regulator on the frame next to the forward tank with return directly to the Aux tank. Noise gone, and now have a backup pump (in the second tank) in case one goes bad. Just for what it is worth, look closely at pumps in the tanks instead of frame mounted. JMHO
On a side note, FiTech (the company) will be doing a session at the spring GMCMI convention in Tucson. Might be a good time to talk personally with them about your situation.
Larry 
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329845 is a reply to message #329775] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 10:50 |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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I'm a bit biased to the EBL because I have had it for 7 years. However hfom reading manuals and reviews on the newer systems out there now, I would go EBL again.
EBL is a modern electronics Flash-based Engine Control Module (ECM) that replaces a GM stock ECM found on the Howell EFI system and others. You can add it to a Howell system, or roll your own using a TBI and sensors from the Men's Mall. There are a couple good write-ups from Club tech pages.
One thing I'd like to point out first is that EBL is self learning. On top of that there is a community of GMCer's who have already setup the EBL, so all you need is to request a file and dump it into your EBL and you are set to go!.
Some pros of the EBL:
-Uses a GM or Holley Throttle body so injectors and sensors are readily available at any Auto Parts stores.
-Many of these new bolt-on systems are wholly designed in house. They use their own sensors, injectors etc. If something fails you might be sitting there while you send it back to the manufacturer and wait for it to come back or buy a whole new unit.
-You can optionally add a Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS). This will give you fuel saving features such as:
-Lean Cruise (leans the mixture to about 16:1 when cruising and the engine is under light load)
-Deceleration Fuel Cut Off (DFCO, cuts the fuel to the engine when you take your foot off the gas, coasting down a hill etc)
-Spark Control using a standard GM ESC distributor, so readily available parts. ESC is what really wakes your engine up. Spark advance is controlled by a number of parameters with knock sensor feed-back. In lean-cruise mode, additional spark advance is added to compensate for the slow burn of a lean mixture.
-Multiple fueling/spark setups (Bin files).
-The EBL can handle upto 8 different operational settings, selectable on the go. So you can have one setup optimized for power for climbing mountains, or economy in the flat-lands.
-Electronics are housed inside the cabin.
-Sure there are electronic components that are rated for higher operating temperatures than there was 20 years ago. But I can tell you after 45 years in the electronics field that heat reduces the life of electronic components. The higher the temperature rating of the component, the higher its cost. Military and Aerospace can require and justify the cost for high spec components, but I don't think a $700 EFI system can justify a $300 microprocessor.
-When you are running down the road, the airflow through the TBI will cool its housing. Pull in to fuel-up after a long run on the hyway with the engine heat-soak and headers cooling, no airflow and sitting on top of the engine what do you think the temperature will rise to? The components dissipate heat as well so they are running hotter than the temperature of the TBI.
Just my 2 cents,
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: New MSD EFI [message #329846 is a reply to message #329775] |
Fri, 09 March 2018 11:12 |
Scott Nutter
Messages: 782
Registered: January 2015
Location: Houston/San Diego
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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Larry, thanks and I completely agree that the in tank pumps would be the ultimate setup.
I just don't want to get into the tank project at this time. But if the EFI system works out, I could see installing the tank pumps in the next 18 months or so. Probably right before I put in the new carpet. So I can put in a couple of access ports in the floor for easy replacement of the tank pumps if needed in the future.
Scott.
Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas
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