Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness?
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314105 is a reply to message #314104] |
Sun, 05 March 2017 11:24   |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Bob, that has been 30 years ago. My personal experience with steel wheels
is as follows: My longtime friend, Bob Campbell, who owns Bob's O.K.Tire &
Wheel in Salem, Or. rounded up 20 16" used steel wheels for me. Different
sources. I mounted them on his wheel balancing machine without tires, and
spun them both slow pattern and fast pattern. I managed to find 7 out of
the 20+ wheels that were true and straight enough that I would use them.
Some were bad enough that you didn't need eyes to tell they were bad.
Balance was not a criterion, just tramp and wobble. Based on my experience
with G.M. Steel wheels from that era, I would say the G.M. specifications
were quite loose. Nothing like a fully machined alloy wheel for sure. I
have Eagles on my coach with B.F. Goodrich T/A load range E radials on
them. Dishes no longer rattle in my cupboards, and doors and drawers do not
vibrate open either. When all was said and done with my steel wheel
project, I do not think there was enough cost savings to justify all the
work involved. It included media blasting, powder coating, tire stems,
wheel spacers on the front, along with grinding the calipers, disassembly
of the front hubs, replacing the short wheel studs with longer ones at
$3.50 a pop for 16 studs, etc. All for an inferior ride. I have made
several sets of wheel spacers for fellow GMCERS who insisted upon using the
16" steel wheels in spite of my best efforts to convince them otherwise. I
presently am unwilling to make any more spacers. Life is too short to spend
any of what I have left on fools errands. Your experiences will vary.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Mar 5, 2017 8:55 AM, "Bob Dunahugh" wrote:
I noticed that when I got my America Eagles from Jim at Applied. The ride
improve as to being smoother. This was in comparison to the fairly new
tires on steel rims I took off. As to factory stock steel rims. GM has to
have a go, no go limits. So anyone know those limits? Is it .010, .020,
.030, or what? Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314106 is a reply to message #314104] |
Sun, 05 March 2017 12:13 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
|
Senior Member |
|
|
A shop that works on rechroming restoring steel wheels said they get them to .030 or better. Most tires have that much tramp. If really bad try to mount them 180 off to neutralize the errors. I don't think you will detect .030 at 65 MPH with balance to all zeros (1/2 oz tollerance for balancing error) but might at say 100 MPH and above.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314115 is a reply to message #314109] |
Sun, 05 March 2017 14:02 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I have been told by the tire dealers that the new tires are considerably
better in the last ten years so were finding the Runout to be acceptable.
I know Jim Bounds has had great results Trueing tires for his customers.
There are not many dealers who have them now, as I mentioned the tire
quality has improved.
You'll notice majority of new cars run Alloy wheels
On Sun, Mar 5, 2017 at 11:14 AM, James Hupy wrote:
> That is why they make tire shavers. Most high quality tires when mounted do
> not require shaving. We always ran our tires for a few miles to settle them
> down before we shaved them. The old bias plies would morning thump no
> matter what you you did to them.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, Or
> 78 GMC ROYALE 403
>
> On Mar 5, 2017 10:14 AM, "John R. Lebetski"
> wrote:
>
>> A shop that works on rechroming restoring steel wheels said they get them
>> to .030 or better. Most tires have that much tramp. If really bad try to
>> mount them 180 off to neutralize the errors. I don't think you will
> detect
>> .030 at 65 MPH with balance to all zeros (1/2 oz tollerance for balancing
>> error) but might at say 100 MPH and above.
>> --
>> John Lebetski
>> Woodstock, IL
>> 77 Eleganza II
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314264 is a reply to message #314104] |
Wed, 08 March 2017 08:38 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I have had a heathen 240v spin balancer for about 15 years. Just couldn't stand taking cars in to have the air gun taken to them (off and on) any longer. The hardest thing is getting the wheel to sit true on the spindle cone. Very easy to get false data by not having it "homed" correctly. Once I've got all zeros the machine saying it's good, I loosen the hold down and reseat the wheel at 180 deg and check for all zeros again. If good then I spin it 90 and check the work one final time. These final steps are super easy and add less than 2 mins to the process and double checking your work is always good. Some wheels are harder to home than others due to dirt or the way they are machined in the area where the cone seats. Even if you hand spin the wheel while clamping down, similar to step one in setting a wheel bearing, some can need multiple redos before they are really home. This is what they don't do at the tire stores due to time constrains, causing come backs complaints, and more shop time. Penny wise and dollar foolish as the time soaker is getting the car in, jacked, wheel removed, reinstalled and cleared from the stall and paperwork done. Even a single step recheck is less than 60 seconds or 4 min max per car. Of course at a tire store they don't even do a follow up road test, which you would do to comfirm work at all speed ranges.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314266 is a reply to message #314104] |
Wed, 08 March 2017 08:48 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
|
Senior Member |
|
|
PS they all have visible runout and tramp. Some wheels look great but the tires wobble or tramp, or the wheel has movement but overall is canceled by tire error (lucky) or really noticable and additive (bad). But if you don't exceed 80 MPH I think .030 is pretty undetectable if balance is correct. Most tires also have a dip point probably due to structure in manufacturing.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314267 is a reply to message #314264] |
Wed, 08 March 2017 08:44 |
Keith V
Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
After multiple attempts to get my daily driver tires balanced, I am seriously considering getting a Harbor freight tire change and just using balancing beads. How much worse could it be?
Has anyone used one of those things? the Utube vids look pretty simple
________________________________
From: Gmclist on behalf of John R.Lebetski
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 8:38:42 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness?
I have had a heathen 240v spin balancer for about 15 years. Just couldn't stand taking cars in to have the air gun taken to them (off and on) any
longer. The hardest thing is getting the wheel to sit true on the spindle cone. Very easy to get false data by not having it "homed" correctly. Once
I've got all zeros the machine saying it's good, I loosen the hold down and reseat the wheel at 180 deg and check for all zeros again. If good then I
spin it 90 and check the work one final time. These final steps are super easy and add less than 2 mins to the process and double checking your work
is always good. Some wheels are harder to home than others due to dirt or the way they are machined in the area where the cone seats. Even if you hand
spin the wheel while clamping down, similar to step one in setting a wheel bearing, some can need multiple redos before they are really home. This is
what they don't do at the tire stores due to time constrains, causing come backs complaints, and more shop time. Penny wise and dollar foolish as the
time soaker is getting the car in, jacked, wheel removed, reinstalled and cleared from the stall and paperwork done. Even a single step recheck is
less than 60 seconds or 4 min max per car. Of course at a tire store they don't even do a follow up road test, which you would do to comfirm work at
all speed ranges.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314273 is a reply to message #314264] |
Wed, 08 March 2017 09:29 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
|
Senior Member |
|
|
It is almost impossible to balance an Alcoa aluminum wheel using a cone. I had a wheel balanced by a Discount Tire shop some years ago. They then rotated the wheel on their machine and it showed very much off balance. They balanced it again and rotated it and it was again off balance. They then sent me to another shop that had an adapter that fit through the stud holes and it balanced properly.
I now ask any tire shop if they have that adapter before I have a wheel balanced.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO
> On Mar 8, 2017, at 7:38 AM, John R. Lebetski wrote:
>
> I have had a heathen 240v spin balancer for about 15 years. Just couldn't stand taking cars in to have the air gun taken to them (off and on) any
> longer. The hardest thing is getting the wheel to sit true on the spindle cone. Very easy to get false data by not having it "homed" correctly. Once
> I've got all zeros the machine saying it's good, I loosen the hold down and reseat the wheel at 180 deg and check for all zeros again. If good then I
> spin it 90 and check the work one final time. These final steps are super easy and add less than 2 mins to the process and double checking your work
> is always good. Some wheels are harder to home than others due to dirt or the way they are machined in the area where the cone seats. Even if you hand
> spin the wheel while clamping down, similar to step one in setting a wheel bearing, some can need multiple redos before they are really home. This is
> what they don't do at the tire stores due to time constrains, causing come backs complaints, and more shop time. Penny wise and dollar foolish as the
> time soaker is getting the car in, jacked, wheel removed, reinstalled and cleared from the stall and paperwork done. Even a single step recheck is
> less than 60 seconds or 4 min max per car. Of course at a tire store they don't even do a follow up road test, which you would do to comfirm work at
> all speed ranges.
> --
> John Lebetski
> Woodstock, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's concidered passable as to rim out of roundness? [message #314274 is a reply to message #314258] |
Wed, 08 March 2017 10:01 |
BobDunahugh
Messages: 2465
Registered: October 2010
Location: Cedar Rapids, IA
Karma: 11
|
Senior Member |
|
|
That's interesting Matt. So it seems I may have had a tire that needed more weights then what would be considered normal. Thus that larger weight may have come off. Be interesting to check more rims at some time. But time is something I'm generally short of. Bob Dunahugh
________________________________
This is why I asked. When I bought one of my Yenkos back in 2001. It came with a set of genuine 13" magnesium Mini Lites rims. I had some new Z rated computation tires mounted. And balanced for speeds to 155MPH. At about 135 MPH I got a vibration starting. So I just ran up to the vibration. Then backed off a little. I had only brought 8 new tires for the two day event. And each set of four only last for a day. About 140 miles at best. Came home, and put that set aside, thinking I had a rim problem. So last weekend I decided that I'd pull the tires off. Then check the rims for run out. I put a dial indicator on for all 4 rims. Ran from .016" to .040". Seems strange for an alloy machined rim. And there not hub centered. Could this not being hub centered be my problem? And what about this on our 16" GMC rims. As some rims that aren't hub centered. Sure am glad I got a set of hub centered Eagle rims from Jim K at Applied for my GMC. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Iowa
________________________________
I noticed that when I got my America Eagles from Jim at Applied. The ride improve as to being smoother. This was in comparison to the fairly new tires on steel rims I took off. As to factory stock steel rims. GM has to have a go, no go limits. So anyone know those limits? Jim K's at Applied are hub centered. Is it .010, .020, .030, or what? Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Sat Sep 21 00:28:23 CDT 2024
Total time taken to generate the page: 0.00967 seconds
|
GMCforum
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
