Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Firearms: Australia and Canada (Looking for information)
| Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 15:20  |
djeffers
Messages: 219
Registered: June 2004
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
We would like comments from all sides.
Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet, particularly regarding Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand information, we raise the question here.
If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at
<don dot jeffers at frontier dot com>.
If you write to me please copy Susan at:
<susan at read hyphen the hyphen bible dot org>.
Thanks,
Don and Susan Jeffers
78 Eleganza II
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295753 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 16:05  |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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As long as it doesn't degenerate into flag wavin' and "Rights spouting" I'd be interested. I've heard so much about each country's actual laws and practices, much of it contradictory, I'd like to hear from residents of each. While I'm unlikely to visit Australia, I might well head beck through Canada again.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295759 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 16:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Don,
Below you will find a boiler plate email I've prepared because I constantly get asked questions regarding gun ownership in
Australia.
Guns in Australia:
First of all it's important to know that Australians don't have a constitutional right to own firearms. The gun laws here are
similar to those in the United Kingdom. I'm not going to get into the discussion of whether that is right or wrong but I do believe
in the 2nd amendment.
Please take the time to read this article as it will help you understand why Australia changed the gun laws:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
Next here's an article that discusses gun laws in Australia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Australia
Finally here's an article that discusses an email that floats around the internet:
http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp
If you don't feel like reading all of the above here it is in a nutshell:
1) You can own a shotgun (double barrel or bolt action)
2) You can own a rifle (bolt action)
3) You can own a handgun if:
a. Your job requires it
b. You are a member of a pistol club
You have to have a license to own any of the above and the weapons have to be registered with the government.
When I lived here in the 1980's I was a member of the Qantas Pistol Club and had:
1) S&W Model 29 - .44 Magnum with a 8 3/8" barrel ala Dirty Harry
2) S&W Model 19 - .357 Magnum with a 6" barrel
3) S&W Model 659 - 9mm Stainless Steel 14 shot automatic pistol
4) Ruger Old Army - .40 black powder pistol
5) H&K Target Pistol - .22 caliber
They had to be stored in a safe that was bolted to the floor.
When I retired here in 2002 I decided it was too much trouble to be a member of a pistol club so I sold them all before I left the
USA.
One more thing, if someone has a pistol and shoots someone that invades his home HE IS IN BIG TROUBLE unless he can prove that the
intruder was going to kill him!
I reiterate I believe in the 2nd amendment and if I lived in the USA and Helen or I heard someone in our home; I would tell Helen to
call 911, I would get up, put on my glasses, go lock the bedroom door, grab the double barreled shotgun from under my bed, sit back
down on the bed and wait for the police to arrive or wait until the interloper was trying to break into the bedroom. The first bang
on the bedroom door would result with one of the barrels loaded with double 00 buck to make a big hole through the door and the
intruder. I reckon if there were more than one that would send them running!
Oh yeah, this is what I carry in the GMC in the USA:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurus_Judge
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Don Jeffers
Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2016 8:20 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
We would like comments from all sides.
Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet,
particularly regarding
Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand information,
we raise the
question here.
If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at
.
If you write to me please copy Susan at:
.
Thanks,
Don and Susan Jeffers
78 Eleganza II
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295762 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 16:20 |
Dave Mumert
Messages: 272
Registered: February 2004
Location: Olds, AB, Canada
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Hi
There is nothing political about it, it is what it is. If it actually accomplishes anything may be debatable but is not relevant.
Here is the RCMP site with firearms info
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/owner-proprietaire-eng.htm
the more details lawyer version is here
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/F-11.6/index.html
Here is the Australian act
www.legislation.act.gov.au/a/1996-74/current/pdf/1996-74.pdf
It looks like they are more restrictive then Canada where there is no need to justify having a firearms license.
Dave
> Subject: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
>
> Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
>
> We would like comments from all sides.
>
> Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet,
particularly
> regarding Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand
> information, we raise the question here.
>
> If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
>
> If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at .
> If you write to me please copy Susan at:
> .
>
> Thanks,
>
> Don and Susan Jeffers
> 78 Eleganza II
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295763 is a reply to message #295759] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 16:22 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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And I believe that the "Judge" is declared illegal in California.
In any event, I have no intention to go to California!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ Since 30 November '53 ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ Member GMCMI and Classics ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
~~ k2gkk + hotmail dot com ~~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
______________
|[ ]~~~[][ ][]\
"--OO--[]---O-"
> From: robmueller@iinet.net.au
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2016 09:15:01 +1100
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
>
> Don,
>
> Below you will find a boiler plate email I've prepared because I constantly get asked questions regarding gun ownership in
> Australia.
>
> Guns in Australia:
>
> First of all it's important to know that Australians don't have a constitutional right to own firearms. The gun laws here are
> similar to those in the United Kingdom. I'm not going to get into the discussion of whether that is right or wrong but I do believe
> in the 2nd amendment.
>
> Please take the time to read this article as it will help you understand why Australia changed the gun laws:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
>
> Next here's an article that discusses gun laws in Australia
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Australia
>
> Finally here's an article that discusses an email that floats around the internet:
>
> http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp
>
> If you don't feel like reading all of the above here it is in a nutshell:
>
> 1) You can own a shotgun (double barrel or bolt action)
> 2) You can own a rifle (bolt action)
> 3) You can own a handgun if:
> a. Your job requires it
> b. You are a member of a pistol club
>
> You have to have a license to own any of the above and the weapons have to be registered with the government.
>
> When I lived here in the 1980's I was a member of the Qantas Pistol Club and had:
> 1) S&W Model 29 - .44 Magnum with a 8 3/8" barrel ala Dirty Harry
> 2) S&W Model 19 - .357 Magnum with a 6" barrel
> 3) S&W Model 659 - 9mm Stainless Steel 14 shot automatic pistol
> 4) Ruger Old Army - .40 black powder pistol
> 5) H&K Target Pistol - .22 caliber
>
> They had to be stored in a safe that was bolted to the floor.
>
> When I retired here in 2002 I decided it was too much trouble to be a member of a pistol club so I sold them all before I left the
> USA.
>
> One more thing, if someone has a pistol and shoots someone that invades his home HE IS IN BIG TROUBLE unless he can prove that the
> intruder was going to kill him!
>
> I reiterate I believe in the 2nd amendment and if I lived in the USA and Helen or I heard someone in our home; I would tell Helen to
> call 911, I would get up, put on my glasses, go lock the bedroom door, grab the double barreled shotgun from under my bed, sit back
> down on the bed and wait for the police to arrive or wait until the interloper was trying to break into the bedroom. The first bang
> on the bedroom door would result with one of the barrels loaded with double 00 buck to make a big hole through the door and the
> intruder. I reckon if there were more than one that would send them running!
>
> Oh yeah, this is what I carry in the GMC in the USA:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurus_Judge
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> The Pedantic Mechanic
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Don Jeffers
> Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2016 8:20 AM
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
>
> Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
>
> We would like comments from all sides.
>
> Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet,
> particularly regarding
> Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand information,
> we raise the
> question here.
>
> If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
>
> If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at
> .
> If you write to me please copy Susan at:
> .
>
> Thanks,
>
> Don and Susan Jeffers
> 78 Eleganza II
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295768 is a reply to message #295759] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 17:33 |
Emery Stora
Messages: 959
Registered: January 2011
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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Hi Rob
My son in the Phoenix area owns over 100 guns ranging from a Derringer to a machine gun.
I once asked him about the Judge and said it looked like a good defensive gun and he explained to me that I should instead buy a S & W Governor.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smith_%26_Wesson_Governor
It has six shots instead of 5 and the ability to fire not only the 45 Colt and a 410 shotshell but also 45 ACP cartridges which are a whole lot cheaper than 45 Colt rounds.
So, that is what I bought.
I carry it in the GMC along with my Walther P38 in 9mm.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick, CO
> On Feb 19, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Robert Mueller wrote:
>
> Don,
>
> Below you will find a boiler plate email I've prepared because I constantly get asked questions regarding gun ownership in
> Australia.
>
> Guns in Australia:
>
> First of all it's important to know that Australians don't have a constitutional right to own firearms. The gun laws here are
> similar to those in the United Kingdom. I'm not going to get into the discussion of whether that is right or wrong but I do believe
> in the 2nd amendment.
>
> Please take the time to read this article as it will help you understand why Australia changed the gun laws:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
>
> Next here's an article that discusses gun laws in Australia
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Australia
>
> Finally here's an article that discusses an email that floats around the internet:
>
> http://www.snopes.com/crime/statistics/ausguns.asp
>
> If you don't feel like reading all of the above here it is in a nutshell:
>
> 1) You can own a shotgun (double barrel or bolt action)
> 2) You can own a rifle (bolt action)
> 3) You can own a handgun if:
> a. Your job requires it
> b. You are a member of a pistol club
>
> You have to have a license to own any of the above and the weapons have to be registered with the government.
>
> When I lived here in the 1980's I was a member of the Qantas Pistol Club and had:
> 1) S&W Model 29 - .44 Magnum with a 8 3/8" barrel ala Dirty Harry
> 2) S&W Model 19 - .357 Magnum with a 6" barrel
> 3) S&W Model 659 - 9mm Stainless Steel 14 shot automatic pistol
> 4) Ruger Old Army - .40 black powder pistol
> 5) H&K Target Pistol - .22 caliber
>
> They had to be stored in a safe that was bolted to the floor.
>
> When I retired here in 2002 I decided it was too much trouble to be a member of a pistol club so I sold them all before I left the
> USA.
>
> One more thing, if someone has a pistol and shoots someone that invades his home HE IS IN BIG TROUBLE unless he can prove that the
> intruder was going to kill him!
>
> I reiterate I believe in the 2nd amendment and if I lived in the USA and Helen or I heard someone in our home; I would tell Helen to
> call 911, I would get up, put on my glasses, go lock the bedroom door, grab the double barreled shotgun from under my bed, sit back
> down on the bed and wait for the police to arrive or wait until the interloper was trying to break into the bedroom. The first bang
> on the bedroom door would result with one of the barrels loaded with double 00 buck to make a big hole through the door and the
> intruder. I reckon if there were more than one that would send them running!
>
> Oh yeah, this is what I carry in the GMC in the USA:
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurus_Judge
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> The Pedantic Mechanic
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Don Jeffers
> Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2016 8:20 AM
> To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
> Subject: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
>
> Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
>
> We would like comments from all sides.
>
> Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet,
> particularly regarding
> Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand information,
> we raise the
> question here.
>
> If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
>
> If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at
> .
> If you write to me please copy Susan at:
> .
>
> Thanks,
>
> Don and Susan Jeffers
> 78 Eleganza II
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295777 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 18:22 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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The Georgia Attorney General's office told me a long gun is by definition not concealable. I carried first a Winchester Model 12 and later a Remington Wingmaster along on night visits to transmitter sites - both of which I gather are verboten in Australia. I hold a concealed carry permit purely for political reasons, I can't hit anything with a handgun. Both my Birmingspam and Ben Hill sites were in very bad sections of town, getting out of the truck with the shotgun in hand served to get the Urban Outdoorsmen moving away from the gate, which was the idea... never fired one of them at anyone while working. I have taken out a rat or two at sites with them. There's usually a long gun traveling in the GMC.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295786 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 19:47 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Judge, Governor, or my Saiga, shot load order should be 8,2,00 IMO. But, mostly, make a bunch of noise chambering.
I don't think I'd better put my Saiga in the coach.
https://s3.amazonaws.com/mgm-content/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2010/12/01/73128_02_saiga_410_w_pistol_grip_conver_640.jpg
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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| Re: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295791 is a reply to message #295762] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 20:10 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
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Senior Member |
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I read the Canadian site. If I'm traveling from say the Pacific NW into Alaska and want to bring a weapon (mostly because of wildlife danger), is there a permit or license I'm missing?
Dolph Santorine
DE N8JPC
Wheeling, West Virginia
1977 ex-Palm Beach TZE167V100820
1-ton, Sullybuilt Bags, Reaction Arms, 3.70 LSD, Manny Transmission, EV-6010,
> On Feb 19, 2016, at 5:20 PM, Dave Mumert wrote:
>
> Hi
>
> There is nothing political about it, it is what it is. If it actually accomplishes anything may be debatable but is not relevant.
>
> Here is the RCMP site with firearms info
> http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/owner-proprietaire-eng.htm
> the more details lawyer version is here
> http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/F-11.6/index.html
>
> Here is the Australian act
> www.legislation.act.gov.au/a/1996-74/current/pdf/1996-74.pdf
>
> It looks like they are more restrictive then Canada where there is no need to justify having a firearms license.
>
> Dave
>
>> Subject: [GMCnet] Firearms: Australia and Canada
>>
>> Would anyone be willing to discuss the firearms possession and ownership situations in Australia and Canada?
>>
>> We would like comments from all sides.
>>
>> Susan and I have been trying to research the issues online and have been getting conflicting information off the Internet,
> particularly
>> regarding Australia, and since this is the most likely place we have, to contact those that might actually have some first hand
>> information, we raise the question here.
>>
>> If we can discuss this on the forum, great.
>>
>> If not and this is political and should be handled off the GMCforum I can be reached at .
>> If you write to me please copy Susan at:
>> .
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Don and Susan Jeffers
>> 78 Eleganza II
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295794 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 20:51 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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I do not claim to know about the Australian gun laws. Rob will probably be your best resource on this net.
In 1998 when I was out running around northern Queensland on the Cape York Peninsula north and west of Cairns, I ran in to a guy in a high off road vehicle complete with Ru guard, gas cans, etc. The truck was was covered least a years worth of dirt from running around in the bush. He was carrying what looked like a .44 in an exposed holster. I quizzed him about it and he said that he had to belong to a registered pistol club and had to store it at a certified site when not in use. He was not allowed to have it in his home. I do not knwo if the rules vary by state in Australia.
As far as Canada goes the rules are slightly different for residents and non-residents. As a non-resident we use to have to have a Canadian PAL license just like a resident. That requirement is gone. As a non-resident do not even think of trying to possess or import (even temporarily) a restricted or prohibited weapon. As a non-resident you can bring in, temporarily, a permitted weapon (most long guns) and ammunition by claiming them at the border, filling out a form, and paying a $25.00 fee.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295795 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 21:00 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Dolph, Ken Burton answered above and I've found a previous post where he gave some links
> You can carry a long gun or multiple long guns to and through Canada if you fill out CAFC form 909 and pay a $25.00 CDN fee when you enter Canada. (They have always taken my credit card.) Check the block on the form that it is for "wildlife protection". One form is good for multiple entries (and multiple guns) so you do not have to do it again on your return trip. I have done this many times.
>
> A. You are not allowed to have a magazine larger than 5 rounds. B. You can have multiple 5 round magazines.
> C. There is an exception for tube fed .22 rifles which can be more than 5 rounds.
> D. You are allowed up to 200 rounds of ammunition to match the long gun(s) you are claiming.
> E. No .25 or .32 caliber weapons or ammunition.
>
> Here is the Canadian site with the CAFC 909 form you need to fill out and turn in at the border.
> http://www.cfc-cafc.gc.ca/form-formulaire/indiv_forms/909_e.asp
>
> You might also want to look at their FAQ page:
> http://www.cfc-cafc.gc.ca/info_for-renseignement/non-residents/default_e.asp
source: http://list.gmcnet.org/pipermail/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org/2009-February/016973.html
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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| Re: Firearms: Australia and Canada [message #295801 is a reply to message #295747] |
Fri, 19 February 2016 22:35 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Nope, perfectly legal. Not a handgun. Listed as AOW under the National Firearms Act
1- Pick the model of your choice from the store. The Serbu Super Shorty is one of the more popular ones.
2- Pay for the weapon.
3- Fill out an ATF Form 4, and submit your application to register an AOW in your name along with the tax stamp fee of $5.
4- Wait 6-10 weeks for the ATF to send you back your tax stamp and certificate, and then take your new AOW home.
http://www.offthegridnews.com/self-defense/guns-ammo/the-incredible-aow-any-other-weapon/
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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