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Frozen axle nut [message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:04 Go to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
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Location: Southern California
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Hi good fellows.

I have been taking things apart in preparation for an "out the top" engine swap. I took off the headers, intake manifold, water pump and fan, alternator,heads,fuel pump, distributor and power steering unit. Believe it or not those came off without incident. So, following the guide, I took off the right front wheel (front jacked up from the center with a 12 ton jack, 2 6 ton jack stands placed).

The axle nut won't budge. Have used 3/4 drive breaker bar with a pipe for leverage, an impact gun, various penetrating oils and propane heat.

I have an engine(a 403)all rebuilt with all the necessaries as I've read about, but if I can't get the right axle out....I can't remove the old engine.

I keep looking at it to see if it's reverse thread, but I don't think so.

Anyone have a suggestion?

I sure would be grateful
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285603 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JohnL455 is currently offline  JohnL455   United States
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Location: Woodstock, IL
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Just wondering with no heads and therefore no intake, where will you attach pick points?? Head bolt holes? I have never tryed to loosten that so don't know LH or RH.

John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285604 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
A Hamilto is currently offline  A Hamilto   United States
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Francois wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 15:04
Hi good fellows.
I have been taking things apart in preparation for an "out the top" engine swap. I took off the headers, intake manifold, water pump and fan, alternator,heads,fuel pump, distributor and power steering unit. Believe it or not those came off without incident. So, following the guide, I took off the right front wheel (front jacked up from the center with a 12 ton jack, 2 6 ton jack stands placed).

The axle nut won't budge. Have used 3/4 drive breaker bar with a pipe for leverage, an impact gun, various penetrating oils and propane heat.

I have an engine(a 403)all rebuilt with all the necessaries as I've read about, but if I can't get the right axle out....I can't remove the old engine.

I keep looking at it to see if it's reverse thread, but I don't think so.

Anyone have a suggestion?

I sure would be grateful
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/greasing-front-bearings-with-zerk-fittings/p19268.html
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285607 is a reply to message #285604] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tphipps is currently offline  tphipps   United States
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Location: Spanish Fort, AL
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We used a 3/4" drive on a breaker bar with a 10' length of steel fence post for "additional leverage.". Did work. Tapping on the nut, while it is under tension also helps.
Tom, MS II


2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552 KA4CSG
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285608 is a reply to message #285603] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
powerjon is currently offline  powerjon   United States
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Registered: January 2004
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Standard thread, righty tight, lefty loosey!

J.R. Wright
GMC Great Laker MHC
Newsletter Editor/Publisher
GMC Eastern States
GMCMHI
78 GMC Buskirk 30’ Stretch
75 GMC Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan

> On Aug 22, 2015, at 4:24 PM, John R. Lebetski wrote:
>
> Just wondering with no heads and therefore no intake, where will you attach pick points?? Head bolt holes? I have never tryed to loosten that so don't
> know LH or RH.
> --
> John Lebetski
> Woodstock, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
> Source America First
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285609 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 15:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
powerjon is currently offline  powerjon   United States
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Sigmund,
The axle may have been tighten to 200 or more FT/LBS of torque. You will need at least a 3/4 in or 1 inch breaker bar at least 18 to 24 inches long and get yourself a 6 or 8 Ft piece of heavy pipe and use that as a lever. They can be tough to loosen. The impact needs to be at least a 3/4 in drive and good to 350 FT/LBS, the 1/2 inch drive won’t cut it. We have had 2 people on the end of a 6 foot pipe to break them loose.

J.R. Wright
GMC Great Laker MHC
Newsletter Editor/Publisher
GMC Eastern States
GMCMHI
78 GMC Buskirk 30’ Stretch
75 GMC Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan

> On Aug 22, 2015, at 4:04 PM, Sigmund Frankenfelter wrote:
>
> Hi good fellows.
>
> I have been taking things apart in preparation for an "out the top" engine swap. I took off the headers, intake manifold, water pump and fan,
> alternator,heads,fuel pump, distributor and power steering unit. Believe it or not those came off without incident. So, following the guide, I took
> off the right front wheel (front jacked up from the center with a 12 ton jack, 2 6 ton jack stands placed).
>
> The axle nut won't budge. Have used 3/4 drive breaker bar with a pipe for leverage, an impact gun, various penetrating oils and propane heat.
>
> I have an engine(a 403)all rebuilt with all the necessaries as I've read about, but if I can't get the right axle out....I can't remove the old
> engine.
>
> I keep looking at it to see if it's reverse thread, but I don't think so.
>
> Anyone have a suggestion?
>
> I sure would be grateful
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org


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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285614 is a reply to message #285603] Sat, 22 August 2015 16:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
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Location: Southern California
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JohnL455 wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 13:24
Just wondering with no heads and therefore no intake, where will you attach pick points?? Head bolt holes? I have never tryed to loosten that so don't know LH or RH.


Yes, head bolt holes. I need it lighter because I am making the beam for the trolley out of 2x8s, also requiring me to get it high. Head bolts are grade 8 .
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285615 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 16:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
Messages: 161
Registered: October 2012
Location: Southern California
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Senior Member
I will try the local zoo and see if I can rent a gorilla
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285616 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 16:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JohnL455 is currently offline  JohnL455   United States
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Location: Woodstock, IL
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Why does that nut have to be so tight. Doesn't it just keep the splined shaft in place?

John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285619 is a reply to message #285607] Sat, 22 August 2015 17:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
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Registered: October 2012
Location: Southern California
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Senior Member
tphipps wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 13:38
We used a 3/4" drive on a breaker bar with a 10' length of steel fence post for "additional leverage.". Did work. Tapping on the nut, while it is under tension also helps.
Tom, MS II


So I used heavier pipe. I am working alone so I pressed down and hooked the pipe under the lower door hinge. Tied it off there.I tapped the socket with a hammer. So far no, but am leaving it under ténsion.
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285620 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 17:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
C Boyd is currently offline  C Boyd   United States
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Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member
Sir, if you are taking engine out the top, the axles can stay in. Just remove the 2 bolts in the bearing bracket. When installing have helper keep the bolt holes up, it can be a bear to turn installed. I have a 1" impact and axle nuts are no problem.



. Francois wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 16:04
Hi good fellows.

I have been taking things apart in preparation for an "out the top" engine swap. I took off the headers, intake manifold, water pump and fan, alternator,heads,fuel pump, distributor and power steering unit. Believe it or not those came off without incident. So, following the guide, I took off the right front wheel (front jacked up from the center with a 12 ton jack, 2 6 ton jack stands placed).

The axle nut won't budge. Have used 3/4 drive breaker bar with a pipe for leverage, an impact gun, various penetrating oils and propane heat.

I have an engine(a 403)all rebuilt with all the necessaries as I've read about, but if I can't get the right axle out....I can't remove the old engine.

I keep looking at it to see if it's reverse thread, but I don't think so.

Anyone have a suggestion?

I sure would be grateful



C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285621 is a reply to message #285616] Sat, 22 August 2015 18:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bruce Hart is currently offline  Bruce Hart   United States
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Registered: October 2011
Location: La Grange, Wyoming
Karma: 5
Senior Member
John,
You have two taper bearings with a pre-load spacer between them. To get
the bearings set up right you have to torque the wheel nut to insure the
bearings are pre-loaded correctly.

On Sat, Aug 22, 2015 at 3:47 PM, John R. Lebetski
wrote:

> Why does that nut have to be so tight. Doesn't it just keep the splined
> shaft in place?
> --
> John Lebetski
> Woodstock, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
> Source America First
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>



--
Bruce Hart
1976 Palm Beach
Milliken, Co
GMC=Got More Class
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Bruce Hart 1976 Palm Beach 1977 28' Kingsley La Grange, Wyoming
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285623 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 18:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
USAussie is currently offline  USAussie   United States
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Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
Senior Member
G'day Ziggy,

Haven't seen that nickname since I was a kid growing up in Hoboken!

To solve this problem I bought two of these (one for Houston and one for Sydney) on sale for $85.00 awhile back:
http://www.harborfreight.com/1-in-pistol-grip-air-impact-wrench-62355.html

I'm a tool junkie!

If you review the specs below you will see that it produces 1500 ft. lb. torque @ 90 psi

Name 1 in. Pistol Grip Air Impact Wrench
SKU 62355
Brand Central Pneumatic
Average air consumption 11 CFM @ 90 psi
Housing material Die cast aluminum
Maximum speed (rpm) 3800 RPM
Maximum Torque (ft. - lbs.) 1500 ft. lb.
Working pressure (psi) 90 PSI
Air inlet size 3/8 in.
Drive size (in.) 1 in.
Product Height 10 in.

I would suggest you Google "1 pneumatic impact wrench rental - Los Angeles."

While your emails don't have a signature that provides the model of GMC you have or where you are I went to your profile and read a
couple of messages one of which stated you went to Miguel Mendez's shop but it was gone so I figgered you were in the LA area.

Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426


-----Original Message-----
From: Sigmund Frankenfelter

Hi good fellows.

I have been taking things apart in preparation for an "out the top" engine swap. I took off the headers, intake manifold, water pump
and fan, alternator,heads,fuel pump, distributor and power steering unit. Believe it or not those came off without incident. So,
following the guide, I took off the right front wheel (front jacked up from the center with a 12 ton jack, 2 6 ton jack stands
placed).

The axle nut won't budge. Have used 3/4 drive breaker bar with a pipe for leverage, an impact gun, various penetrating oils and
propane heat.

I have an engine(a 403)all rebuilt with all the necessaries as I've read about, but if I can't get the right axle out....I can't
remove the old
engine.

I keep looking at it to see if it's reverse thread, but I don't think so.

Anyone have a suggestion?

I sure would be grateful



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Regards, Rob M. (USAussie) The Pedantic Mechanic Sydney, Australia '75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428 '75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285626 is a reply to message #285623] Sat, 22 August 2015 19:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Carl S. is currently offline  Carl S.   United States
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Location: Tucson, AZ.
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Senior Member

The good news is that the next time you do this you'll only need a 4' pipe on the breaker bar. Rolling Eyes

Carl Stouffer '75 ex Palm Beach Tucson, AZ. Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285628 is a reply to message #285601] Sat, 22 August 2015 19:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
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Location: Southern California
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I am pretty nervous about the HF breaker bar I bought just yesterday. Chinese steel. I have pipe out ten feet.
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285630 is a reply to message #285620] Sat, 22 August 2015 19:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Francois is currently offline  Francois   United States
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Registered: October 2012
Location: Southern California
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Senior Member

[/quote]
C Boyd wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 15:45
Sir, if you are taking engine out the top, the axles can stay in. Just remove the 2 bolts in the bearing bracket. When installing have helper keep the bolt holes up, it can be a bear to turn installed. I have a 1" impact and axle nuts are no problem.



It looks like the engine has to move forward to come out. I assume that is because the transmission torque converter has to be accessed. The axle is to the front of the engine oil pan reservoir. Is that incorrect??
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285631 is a reply to message #285630] Sat, 22 August 2015 19:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
C Boyd is currently offline  C Boyd   United States
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Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member
Yes, but not much. Remove starter then turn engine with big screwdriver against ring gear to remove the 3 torque converter bolts and push torque converter back in tranny bout an inch. Remove the long bracket bolt and nut on the diff. 2 front mount nuts. Floor jack under diff and jack up as you lift engine. When front mount studs are clear of mount, shake it or pry forward. Stop jacking diff when it separates. I would suggest removing a coolant drain plug on each side to drain block. Big mess on the ground is better than inside the coach.



Francois wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 20:30


C Boyd wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 15:45
Sir, if you are taking engine out the top, the axles can stay in. Just remove the 2 bolts in the bearing bracket. When installing have helper keep the bolt holes up, it can be a bear to turn installed. I have a 1" impact and axle nuts are no problem.



It looks like the engine has to move forward to come out. I assume that is because the transmission torque converter has to be accessed. The axle is to the front of the engine oil pan reservoir. Is that incorrect??[/quote]


C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285632 is a reply to message #285631] Sat, 22 August 2015 19:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
C Boyd is currently offline  C Boyd   United States
Messages: 2629
Registered: April 2006
Karma: 18
Senior Member
Easier to remove the tin dust cover also. Remove the 2 bolts you can see then drop it down and slide toward pass side. Bolt hole on drinkers side is slotted end hole and cover will slide out without removing. Install tame way..



C Boyd wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 20:40
Yes, but not much. Remove starter then turn engine with big screwdriver against ring gear to remove the 3 torque converter bolts and push torque converter back in tranny bout an inch. Remove the long bracket bolt and nut on the diff. 2 front mount nuts. Floor jack under diff and jack up as you lift engine. When front mount studs are clear of mount, shake it or pry forward. Stop jacking diff when it separates. I would suggest removing a coolant drain plug on each side to drain block. Big mess on the ground is better than inside the coach.



Francois wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 20:30


C Boyd wrote on Sat, 22 August 2015 15:45
Sir, if you are taking engine out the top, the axles can stay in. Just remove the 2 bolts in the bearing bracket. When installing have helper keep the bolt holes up, it can be a bear to turn installed. I have a 1" impact and axle nuts are no problem.



It looks like the engine has to move forward to come out. I assume that is because the transmission torque converter has to be accessed. The axle is to the front of the engine oil pan reservoir. Is that incorrect??

[/quote]


C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
Re: [GMCnet] Frozen axle nut [message #285637 is a reply to message #285609] Sat, 22 August 2015 21:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BobDunahugh is currently offline  BobDunahugh   United States
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Senior Member
I've run into this on 3 GMC's. Mine was the worst one. We had to put a 6 ft pipe on a 3/4 breaker bar. Then with 2 of us standing on the bar. To keep the axle from rotating. I put a bar in the rotor fins. It's stupidity that's the problem by who ever put the nut on the last time. It's a big nut. So the gorilla's attack. I think the torque is to be about 175 ft lbs. Have to look that up to know for sure. Then move to the nut to the next closes axle hole for the cotter key. That nut just doesn't have a huge load.Bob Dunahugh78 Royale
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Re: Frozen axle nut [message #285638 is a reply to message #285632] Sat, 22 August 2015 21:43 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Bullitthead is currently offline  Bullitthead   United States
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On the axle nut and any other stuck screw-type fastener...Lube it with ATF and carb cleaner mixture and then TIGHTEN it just enough to crack the threads loose, then loosen it to remove it.

Terry Kelpien ASE Master Technician 73 Glacier 260 Smithfield, Va.
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