| Intellipower upgrade? [message #280881] |
Sat, 27 June 2015 20:35  |
Darryl
Messages: 144
Registered: December 2011
Location: Northern California
Karma: 0
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The first upgrade I made on my coach when I bought it three years ago was to replace the original "buzzbox" with an Intellipower PD9130 converter. It works great but I've been frustrated sometimes trying to keep the batteries up with the generator while dry camping. I know that solar and more batteries are the ultimate solution but I'm considering replacing the PD9130 with a PD9160. After reading Jerry Work's comments about his experience with a high amperage converter/charger (70-80 amps?) I'm concerned about pushing 60 amps through what I believe is the original cable from the utility closet to my two 6v golf cart batteries in the generator compartment.
Will I need to upgrade the cable or is it adequate?
Anyone else using the 9160? Does it charge the batteries substantially faster (ideally twice as fast) as the 9130?
Darryl Meyers
1978 Eleganza II
El Dorado Hills, CA
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280892 is a reply to message #280881] |
Sat, 27 June 2015 23:15  |
Darryl
Messages: 144
Registered: December 2011
Location: Northern California
Karma: 0
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Thanks, John
I have the "Charge Wizard" pendant with the 9130 I currently have so I don't need the 9245/60. However, since I intend to give my 9130 to my son for use with the 75 Airstream TT I gave him when I bought the coach I suppose I should also give him the pendant which means I either need another pendant to go with the 9145/60 or should buy the 9245/60 with the built-in "Charge Wizard".
Darryl Meyers
1978 Eleganza II
El Dorado Hills, CA
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280893 is a reply to message #280892] |
Sat, 27 June 2015 23:34 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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The larger converter has the capacity to supply more current but that does not mean that the batteries will take that current. So what you really need to determine is whether you are maxed out with your current converter. Most batteries will take an initial high current and then taper off quickly to slower and slower rates. The only way to increase the rate of charge is to increase the voltage of the charging device. When you do this, everything in the coach will see the higher voltage and if not closely monitored for gassing and temperature the batteries will over charge and boil.
A normal charge voltage should be 13.8 to 14.2 volts. So I suggest that you install an amp meter and see if you are exceeding the capacity of you current converter whiel charging at 14.0 volts. Most intelligent one today run at 14.0 volts and you can not increase the voltage and accordingly the rate that the batteries will take a charge.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280900 is a reply to message #280881] |
Sun, 28 June 2015 09:25 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Darryl,
I suggest that you go over to the Progressive Dynamics http://progressivedyn.com/ and dig through a lot of the technical articles that are there. Battery charging while the bank is in use is a delicate issue. If you use a charging voltage that is greater than the mid 14s, there are two immediate problems. First is that you risk frying every voltage sensitive thing (like all the incandescent bulbs). Second is that you will cause the batteries in the bank to heat and out gas so that water will have to be replaced.
To this end, all the "intelligent" chargers use a limited charging voltage. That is another compromise. It looses charm in that the limited charging voltage greatly increases the time to full density. This is a good thing if you don't want to be replacing things a lot. It does, however, mean that while you can still get the bank back to 80% pretty fast (a couple of hours) from a 50% discharge, getting that last 20% can take another five or more hours. There is just no way arround this with lead acid batteries that are still in the active bank. If you are willing to put up with the increased cost and maintenance, you could always put the buzz-box back in and plan to replace the banks and lots of lightbulds on a very regular basis. Actually, if all the bulbs were replaced with regulated LEDs (the kind that say 8~30VDC), you could get by only replacing the house bank and cables about every other season. Why the cables? because the outgassing carries some to the sulphuric acid with it - always.
And finally, a 9260 will not recharge the bank twice as fast as a 9230 because the bank can and will only accept the amount of charge current it wants with the given conditions. A big problem with the coaches is the wire size between the charging systems and the house bank. running the size cable that should be there is somewhat expensive, but finding the place to put it is another big issue.
Matt
Darryl wrote on Sat, 27 June 2015 21:35The first upgrade I made on my coach when I bought it three years ago was to replace the original "buzzbox" with an Intellipower PD9130 converter. It works great but I've been frustrated sometimes trying to keep the batteries up with the generator while dry camping. I know that solar and more batteries are the ultimate solution but I'm considering replacing the PD9130 with a PD9160. After reading Jerry Work's comments about his experience with a high amperage converter/charger (70-80 amps?) I'm concerned about pushing 60 amps through what I believe is the original cable from the utility closet to my two 6v golf cart batteries in the generator compartment.
Will I need to upgrade the cable or is it adequate?
Anyone else using the 9160? Does it charge the batteries substantially faster (ideally twice as fast) as the 9130?
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280950 is a reply to message #280881] |
Sun, 28 June 2015 19:58 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Daryl,
I would guess your Eleganza has a very similar cable setup to my Palm Beach. The cable from the house batteries to the front boost solenoid is a battery cable , probably #2 wire and will easily handle the charging amps from your converter/charger to your battery bank' I would suggest upgrading the cable from the converter to the electrical terminal (in the rear of your electrical compartment) to at least a #6 or #8. The original #10 wire in my coach heated up enough to melt the corrugated conduit it was in. I have a PD 9245 and, after running my house batteries down by accident one night, I saw almost a 45 amps charge going into them (through my Trimetric meter) for quite a while before it started to settle down.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
[Updated on: Sun, 28 June 2015 21:44] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280960 is a reply to message #280881] |
Sun, 28 June 2015 20:52 |
Darryl
Messages: 144
Registered: December 2011
Location: Northern California
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Thanks, Carl, that's the information I was looking for.
I should go back and find Jerry's post but as I now recall his concern started because he had substantially depleted his AGM batteries and when he recharged them they pulled the full amperage of his high-amp (75-80 amp?) charger, creating a lot of heat.
I think I will go ahead with the 9160 (or 9260). I'll upgrade the cable from the converter to the electrical terminal in the utility closet and keep and eye (and maybe an occasional hand) on the other cables when recharging from a deep discharge.
"I would guess your Eleganza has a very similar cable setup to my Palm Beach. The cable from the house batteries to the front boost solenoid is a battery cable , probably #2 wire and will easily handle the charging amps from your converter/charger to your battery bank' I would suggest upgrading the cable from the converter to the electrical terminal (in the rear of your electrical compartment) to at least a #6 or #8. The original #10 wire in my coach heated up enough to melt the corrugated conduit it was in. I have a PD 9245 and, after running my house batteries down by accident one night, I saw almost an 45 amps charge going into them (through my Trimetric meter) for quite a while before it started to settle down."
Darryl Meyers
1978 Eleganza II
El Dorado Hills, CA
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| Re: Intellipower upgrade? [message #280974 is a reply to message #280920] |
Mon, 29 June 2015 07:03 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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It primarily depends on the state of the battery that you are attempting to charge. A very low battery will initially take a lot of current and then as it warms up and starts to take a charge, the current will taper off. Somewhere around 75% to 80% of charge the current will taper off to a few amps.
You put around 14.0 volts from the alternator or the converter across the battery terminals and the battery determines what it will accept as charging current. It is continuously changing as the reverse EMF (level of charge) raises.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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