Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Airbag health
| [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279534] |
Wed, 10 June 2015 16:17  |
kelvin
Messages: 608
Registered: February 2004
Location: Eugene, OR
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A question for the Collective.
I have a OEM airbags on my coach. They have probably been replaced at
some point before I bought the coach in 2002 but they were perfect then
and I've kept them looking perfect since. Not a single check in the
rubber cover. They hold air just fine.
Someone suggested that I was running on borrowed time. Giant rubber
time bombs just waiting to go off and damage my coach. They're at least
13 years old - should I be replacing them soon? I've never seen this
opinion expressed on the GMCNet since I got here 13+ years ago.
Just wondering what ya'll might think?
Kelvin
'73 23' with old, perfect airbags.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279540 is a reply to message #279534] |
Wed, 10 June 2015 18:16  |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
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Kelvin
A few years ago I removed an original airbag from my 73. Still held air, worked fine, but was chafed and I had better appearing bags for use.
So, my opinion, your airbags are fine.
Dennis
Kelvin Dietz wrote on Wed, 10 June 2015 16:17A question for the Collective.
I have a OEM airbags on my coach. They have probably been replaced at
some point before I bought the coach in 2002 but they were perfect then
and I've kept them looking perfect since. Not a single check in the
rubber cover. They hold air just fine.
Someone suggested that I was running on borrowed time. Giant rubber
time bombs just waiting to go off and damage my coach. They're at least
13 years old - should I be replacing them soon? I've never seen this
opinion expressed on the GMCNet since I got here 13+ years ago.
Just wondering what ya'll might think?
Kelvin
'73 23' with old, perfect airbags.
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Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279606 is a reply to message #279587] |
Thu, 11 June 2015 09:44 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
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thesmith wrote on Thu, 11 June 2015 08:53Why would tires age out and the bags not do likewise? And can one really examine them and say they are definitely good?
With the originals so expensive and the possible consequences if they fail at the wrong time in the wrong place......if I had the time and money I'd swap out to a Sully system and remove both problems for good. Cheaper and easier to get replacements and don't fully collapse so not left stranded or worse.
Its what I'm going to do on my coach unless it already has a Sully or 4 bag solution already installed by a kind and generous PO!.............
Pete
Pete,
All rubber parts age out, but things that are solid rubber are less prone to age failures.
Our tires are many layers of cord, filler, thread and sealing layers. Many of these layers are actually bonded with yet a different layer of adhesive. The adhesive is the primary cause of the failure. It will age out. The only time I saw an airspring as a literally exploded view, it was rubber only. That doesn't mean it won't age out, but as layers aren't likely to part company, it is less of a risk.
I'm with you on the Sully setup.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279610 is a reply to message #279606] |
Thu, 11 June 2015 09:57 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
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Matt's analysis is probably spot on. The air bags are simply rubber whereas tires are an extremely complex mixture of many products. What I have read is that the reason tires age out before wearing out is that somewhat constant or regular use actually keeps the bonds between the separate products more secure and integrated in the tire structure.
Additionally, I suspect the T-skirts greatly minimize exposure to sunlight's UV rays would extend the life of the bags.
As always, my opinions are likely to be worth no more than what you have paid for them!
I was one the first owners to go with the Sully bags; installed at Shawnee convention. Using XD Rock Star Chrome Wheels and BFG tires.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ Member GMCMI and Classics ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
~~ k2gkk + hotmail dot com ~~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
______________
|[ ]~~~[][ ][]\
"--OO--[]---O-"
> Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2015 08:44:04 -0600
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: matt7323tze@gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health
>
> thesmith wrote on Thu, 11 June 2015 08:53
>> Why would tires age out and the bags not do likewise? And can one really examine them and say they are definitely good?
>>
>> With the originals so expensive and the possible consequences if they fail at the wrong time in the wrong place......if I had the time and money
>> I'd swap out to a Sully system and remove both problems for good. Cheaper and easier to get replacements and don't fully collapse so not left
>> stranded or worse.
>> Its what I'm going to do on my coach unless it already has a Sully or 4 bag solution already installed by a kind and generous PO!.............
>>
>> Pete
>
> Pete,
>
> All rubber parts age out, but things that are solid rubber are less prone to age failures.
> Our tires are many layers of cord, filler, thread and sealing layers. Many of these layers are actually bonded with yet a different layer of
> adhesive. The adhesive is the primary cause of the failure. It will age out. The only time I saw an airspring as a literally exploded view, it was
> rubber only. That doesn't mean it won't age out, but as layers aren't likely to part company, it is less of a risk.
>
> I'm with you on the Sully setup.
>
> Matt
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCES
> '73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279620 is a reply to message #279534] |
Thu, 11 June 2015 11:35 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Kelvin,
I spoke to Jim Bounds about this some time back and he told me that, if the air bags are not exposed to direct sunlight (ie. stored inside or even under the T-skirts) they should be good for 25 + years easily. Mine are from about '06 and '08 and still look good in spite of being on a coach that is stored outdoors in the Arizona sun. I do plan to upgrade to the Quadbag system at some point in the near future, but it hasn't been a high priority since my bags are in such good condition and based on what Jim told me. I wouldn't worry about yours at all. Maybe the Bob Sternfels bag protector would be a good idea though as Rob suggested.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279621 is a reply to message #279534] |
Thu, 11 June 2015 11:50 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Airbag life has been the subject on various threads found on the archives.
Mostly anecdotal ..
This from Mark, the original developer of the Sullybilt system.
On commercial trucks we inspect the truck every 20,000 miles. That works out to about every month and a half. The bags usually start to leak long before they blow out completly. If you take a look at them and find cracks it is time to replace them. once water gets to the cords they will not last long. You will probably find that the biggest problem is UV cracking. Some bags last in excess of 10 years, some less then a year. Sitting still with little or no use seems to kill them quick.
Mark
And this from Emery
I don't think you can compare tire life to airbag life. Many people
are still running over 30 years on their original Firestone airbags.
Mine lasted 33 years before one failed. I replaced the other one last
year too.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Dennis
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279642 is a reply to message #279610] |
Thu, 11 June 2015 14:54 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Actually the original Air Springs (bags) used on the GMC Classic coach are slightly more complex than a simple rubber bag. The Air Spring ( bag) is rubber impregnated canvas that is vulcanized the same way a tire is. The outer rubber coating is primarily to protect the inner from the road condition that they encounter. I changed out the original bags on our 1977 EleganzaII in 2004 (27 years) in service) when I did a complete brake job which included all new brake hardware, new shoes (carbon metallic) and new steel brake lines. The main line from the combo valve to the rear brakes had failed. The exterior rubber coating had failed in a few spots and you could see the canvas inner bags. I replace the old with new during the rebuild because I had the replacements. The old bags were use by several people as an emergency spare when they need to get back on the road for several more years. One other bit of information is that Firestone who made the bags over the years had only one of the bag dies in which the bags are vulcanized in and it was almost worn out the the cost of a new die was too expensive, so they one run a few years back of approximately 400 bags. Jim K got some and a few other GMC suppliers got some, but Cinnabar bought the majority. They want to corner the market, but there are a number of very good replacement system that are actually less expensive than using the stock bags.
J.R. Wright
GMC Great Laker MHC
GMC Great Laker Tech Editor
Newsletter Editor/Publisher
GMC Eastern States
GMCMHI
78 GMC Buskirk 30’ Stretch
75 GMC Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
> On Jun 11, 2015, at 10:57 AM, D C _Mac_ Macdonald wrote:
>
> Matt's analysis is probably spot on. The air bags are simply rubber whereas tires are an extremely complex mixture of many products. What I have read is that the reason tires age out before wearing out is that somewhat constant or regular use actually keeps the bonds between the separate products more secure and integrated in the tire structure.
>
> Additionally, I suspect the T-skirts greatly minimize exposure to sunlight's UV rays would extend the life of the bags.
>
> As always, my opinions are likely to be worth no more than what you have paid for them!
>
> I was one the first owners to go with the Sully bags; installed at Shawnee convention. Using XD Rock Star Chrome Wheels and BFG tires.
>
> ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
> ~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
> ~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
> ~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
> ~ Member GMCMI and Classics ~
> ~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
> ~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
> ~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
> ~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
> ~~ k2gkk + hotmail dot com ~~
> ~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
> ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
> ______________
> |[ ]~~~[][ ][]\
> "--OO--[]---O-"
>
>
>
>> Date: Thu, 11 Jun 2015 08:44:04 -0600
>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>> From: matt7323tze@gmail.com
>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health
>>
>> thesmith wrote on Thu, 11 June 2015 08:53
>>> Why would tires age out and the bags not do likewise? And can one really examine them and say they are definitely good?
>>>
>>> With the originals so expensive and the possible consequences if they fail at the wrong time in the wrong place......if I had the time and money
>>> I'd swap out to a Sully system and remove both problems for good. Cheaper and easier to get replacements and don't fully collapse so not left
>>> stranded or worse.
>>> Its what I'm going to do on my coach unless it already has a Sully or 4 bag solution already installed by a kind and generous PO!.............
>>>
>>> Pete
>>
>> Pete,
>>
>> All rubber parts age out, but things that are solid rubber are less prone to age failures.
>> Our tires are many layers of cord, filler, thread and sealing layers. Many of these layers are actually bonded with yet a different layer of
>> adhesive. The adhesive is the primary cause of the failure. It will age out. The only time I saw an airspring as a literally exploded view, it was
>> rubber only. That doesn't mean it won't age out, but as layers aren't likely to part company, it is less of a risk.
>>
>> I'm with you on the Sully setup.
>>
>> Matt
>> --
>> Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCES
>> '73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
>> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279693 is a reply to message #279642] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 01:56 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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JR,
The "story" I heard was that Firestone distributed the last lot of 400 bags to their customers in proportion to the numbers of bags
they had purchased over the years which is why Cinnabar got the bulk. Seems like a fair way to do it to me.
Also Cinnabar has commissioned the manufacture of a replacement bag at $400 a pop which ain't cheap but it suits people like me that
want to keep the system as it was designed by suspension engineers at GMC.
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: John Wright
Actually the original Air Springs (bags) used on the GMC Classic coach are slightly more complex than a simple rubber bag. The Air
Spring ( bag) is rubber impregnated canvas that is vulcanized the same way a tire is. The outer rubber coating is primarily to
protect the inner from the road condition that they encounter. I changed out the original bags on our 1977 EleganzaII in 2004 (27
years) in service) when I did a complete brake job which included all new brake hardware, new shoes (carbon metallic) and new steel
brake lines. The main line from the combo valve to the rear brakes had failed. The exterior rubber coating had failed in a few
spots and you could see the canvas inner bags. I replace the old with new during the rebuild because I had the replacements. The
old bags were use by several people as an emergency spare when they need to get back on the road for several more years. One other
bit of information is that Firestone who made the bags over the years had only one of the bag dies in which the bags are vulcanized
in and it was almost worn out the the cost of a new die was too expensive, so they one run a few years back of approximately 400
bags. Jim K got some and a few other GMC suppliers got some, but Cinnabar bought the majority. They want to corner the market, but
there are a number of very good replacement system that are actually less expensive than using the stock bags.
J.R.
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279701 is a reply to message #279693] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 07:17 |
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thesmith
Messages: 589
Registered: February 2015
Location: Cary, NC
Karma: 6
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Hmmm, in an earlier life I had a couple of years in the 80s working in Boca Raton......and I bought something designed by GM engineers....a Chevy Citation....ownership
of which left me with an enduring suspicion of anything from the company, only partly cured by my 1996 Z28 15 years later......that 5.7L V8 made up for a lot of poor design choices
and cost cutting (yes I know, don't blame the engineers for what the bean counters do.....)
Pete
USAussie wrote on Fri, 12 June 2015 02:56JR,
but it suits people like me thatwant to keep the system as it was designed by suspension engineers at GMC.
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: John Wright
Actually the original Air Springs (bags) used on the GMC Classic coach are slightly more complex than a simple rubber bag. The Air
Spring ( bag) is rubber impregnated canvas that is vulcanized the same way a tire is. The outer rubber coating is primarily to
protect the inner from the road condition that they encounter. I changed out the original bags on our 1977 EleganzaII in 2004 (27
years) in service) when I did a complete brake job which included all new brake hardware, new shoes (carbon metallic) and new steel
brake lines. The main line from the combo valve to the rear brakes had failed. The exterior rubber coating had failed in a few
spots and you could see the canvas inner bags. I replace the old with new during the rebuild because I had the replacements. The
old bags were use by several people as an emergency spare when they need to get back on the road for several more years. One other
bit of information is that Firestone who made the bags over the years had only one of the bag dies in which the bags are vulcanized
in and it was almost worn out the the cost of a new die was too expensive, so they one run a few years back of approximately 400
bags. Jim K got some and a few other GMC suppliers got some, but Cinnabar bought the majority. They want to corner the market, but
there are a number of very good replacement system that are actually less expensive than using the stock bags.
J.R.
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1978 Center Kitchen Royale.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279704 is a reply to message #279621] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 07:42 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Dennis S wrote on Thu, 11 June 2015 10:50Airbag life has been the subject on various threads found on the archives.
Mostly anecdotal ..
This from Mark, the original developer of the Sullybilt system.
On commercial trucks we inspect the truck every 20,000 miles. That works out to about every month and a half. The bags usually start to leak long before they blow out completly. If you take a look at them and find cracks it is time to replace them. once water gets to the cords they will not last long. You will probably find that the biggest problem is UV cracking. Some bags last in excess of 10 years, some less then a year. Sitting still with little or no use seems to kill them quick.
Mark
And this from Emery
I don't think you can compare tire life to airbag life. Many people
are still running over 30 years on their original Firestone airbags.
Mine lasted 33 years before one failed. I replaced the other one last
year too.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Dennis
I had one blow about 8 years ago and was shocked how bad the inboard side of the bag looked--the part you can't see unless you rotate the bag. Don't get too comfortable based just on appearance. When they blow, they can do a lot of damage--mine ripped open the inner wheelhouse panel.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279716 is a reply to message #279706] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 09:31 |
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thesmith
Messages: 589
Registered: February 2015
Location: Cary, NC
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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USAussie wrote on Fri, 12 June 2015 09:18Hmmm,
LOL, hope springs eternal.....sorry if I sounded negative, my only point was that just because the GM folks did something one way in the 1970s does
not mean it was even the best way or even close to it, even then, as there are lots of pressures on design engineers (thats what I do for a living)other than simply doing it the best
way there is.
BTW did you ever have a Citation?  If there was a bright shining center of the GM galaxy, The Citation was likely close to the point furthest from it......
Pete
I notice you don't have a GMC listed under your signature and I've noted in a number of your emails that you don't have one.
Taking into considering your experience with the Citation are you sure you really want another product designed by GM engineers?
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Pete Smith
Hmmm, in an earlier life I had a couple of years in the 80s working in Boca Raton......and I bought something designed by GM
engineers....a Chevy Citation....ownership of which left me with an enduring suspicion of anything from the company, only partly
cured by my 1996 Z28 15 years later......that 5.7L V8 made up for a lot of poor design choices
and cost cutting (yes I know, don't blame the engineers for what the bean counters do.....)
Pete
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1978 Center Kitchen Royale.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279725 is a reply to message #279693] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 11:12 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Rob,
Yes, they are and Jim K sell them too along with Cinnabar! Unsure of the quality as the originals had a long service life, these newer units have no service life history as of yet and I have never seen or touched one. Again if you want original style then the stuff is available, but you can also step up to newer systems that work as good or better than the originals. Overall cost is less to convert, but then the replacement Air Springs (bags) are also considerably less running in the $120 to $140 range for the single bag system and as low a just under $100 for a Quadra bag system single bag if you every need a replacement and are available at most truck suppliers across the US and Canada. I run a highly the modified Buskirk 4 bag patterned after the Leigh Harrison 4 bag system on the stretch. The bags are slightly bigger than the bags used on the Quadra bag system. There were only 7 of the systems build by Buskirk and they were used on the 7 1/2 coaches that were build
at the Buskirk shop. They are NOT available today before anyone ask! Coach #1 of the Buskirk stretch coach used air bag extenders and original bags.
http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/1430
JR Wright
78 Buskirk Stretch
Buskirk Stretch Historian
75 Avion
Michigan
> On Jun 12, 2015, at 2:56 AM, Robert Mueller wrote:
>
> JR,
>
> The "story" I heard was that Firestone distributed the last lot of 400 bags to their customers in proportion to the numbers of bags
> they had purchased over the years which is why Cinnabar got the bulk. Seems like a fair way to do it to me.
>
> Also Cinnabar has commissioned the manufacture of a replacement bag at $400 a pop which ain't cheap but it suits people like me that
> want to keep the system as it was designed by suspension engineers at GMC.
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> The Pedantic Mechanic
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Wright
>
> Actually the original Air Springs (bags) used on the GMC Classic coach are slightly more complex than a simple rubber bag. The Air
> Spring ( bag) is rubber impregnated canvas that is vulcanized the same way a tire is. The outer rubber coating is primarily to
> protect the inner from the road condition that they encounter. I changed out the original bags on our 1977 EleganzaII in 2004 (27
> years) in service) when I did a complete brake job which included all new brake hardware, new shoes (carbon metallic) and new steel
> brake lines. The main line from the combo valve to the rear brakes had failed. The exterior rubber coating had failed in a few
> spots and you could see the canvas inner bags. I replace the old with new during the rebuild because I had the replacements. The
> old bags were use by several people as an emergency spare when they need to get back on the road for several more years. One other
> bit of information is that Firestone who made the bags over the years had only one of the bag dies in which the bags are vulcanized
> in and it was almost worn out the the cost of a new die was too expensive, so they one run a few years back of approximately 400
> bags. Jim K got some and a few other GMC suppliers got some, but Cinnabar bought the majority. They want to corner the market, but
> there are a number of very good replacement system that are actually less expensive than using the stock bags.
>
> J.R.
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279756 is a reply to message #279716] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 19:27 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Pete,
Glad you took my comment in the spirit I meant it. Nope I've never had a Citation actually the only other GM product I owned was a
1971 454 convertible Corvette, it went like crazy but left a bit to be desired when it came to turning and stopping IIRC.
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: Pete Smith
USAussie wrote on Fri, 12 June 2015 09:18
Hmmm,
LOL, hope springs eternal.....sorry if I sounded negative, my only point was that just because the GM folks did something one way in
the 1970s does not mean it was even the best way or even close to it, even then, as there are lots of pressures on design engineers
(thats what I do for a living)other than simply doing it the best way there is.
BTW did you ever have a Citation? :) If there was a bright shining center of the GM galaxy, The Citation was likely close to the
point furthest from it......
Pete
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279757 is a reply to message #279725] |
Fri, 12 June 2015 19:39 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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JR,
I reckon Cinnabar would have found a company that could assure the quality of the bags, especially when one considers the damage
they can cause to a coach when they blow or possible injury to someone that was near the bag if it was to explode.
I clicked on the link in your email below and noted those bags look pretty good on the outside; however, as I know absolutely
nothing about the manufacturing process I am not going to comment as you can't judge a book by its cover.
Here's a link to a photo of the end of an OEM air bag that I cut off just to see how it was made.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/oem-firestone-air-bag/p47718-oem-firestone-air-bag-end-4.html
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: John Wright
Rob,
Yes, they are and Jim K sell them too along with Cinnabar! Unsure of the quality as the originals had a long service life, these
newer units have no service life history as of yet and I have never seen or touched one. Again if you want original style then the
stuff is available, but you can also step up to newer systems that work as good or better than the originals. Overall cost is less
to convert, but then the replacement Air Springs (bags) are also considerably less running in the $120 to $140 range for the single
bag system and as low a just under $100 for a Quadra bag system single bag if you every need a replacement and are available at most
truck suppliers across the US and Canada. I run a highly the modified Buskirk 4 bag patterned after the Leigh Harrison 4 bag system
on the stretch. The bags are slightly bigger than the bags used on the Quadra bag system. There were only 7 of the systems build
by Buskirk and they were used on the 7 1/2 coaches that were build at the Buskirk shop. They are NOT available today before
anyone ask! Coach #1 of the Buskirk stretch coach used air bag extenders and original bags.
http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/1430
JR
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279833 is a reply to message #279534] |
Sat, 13 June 2015 20:17 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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The Citation was a love it /hate it econobox. Maybe you should have sprung for the X11.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279881 is a reply to message #279756] |
Sun, 14 June 2015 13:46 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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My '81 Citation X-11 had ~ 140,000 miles on it when it was destroyed by tornado in '99.
Mac Macdonald in OKC
'76 ex P.B.
Sent from my iPad
> On Jun 12, 2015, at 19:26, Robert Mueller wrote:
>
> Pete,
>
> Glad you took my comment in the spirit I meant it. Nope I've never had a Citation actually the only other GM product I owned was a
> 1971 454 convertible Corvette, it went like crazy but left a bit to be desired when it came to turning and stopping IIRC.
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pete Smith
>
> USAussie wrote on Fri, 12 June 2015 09:18
> Hmmm,
>
> LOL, hope springs eternal.....sorry if I sounded negative, my only point was that just because the GM folks did something one way in
> the 1970s does not mean it was even the best way or even close to it, even then, as there are lots of pressures on design engineers
> (thats what I do for a living)other than simply doing it the best way there is.
>
> BTW did you ever have a Citation? :) If there was a bright shining center of the GM galaxy, The Citation was likely close to the
> point furthest from it......
>
> Pete
>
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Airbag health [message #279882 is a reply to message #279881] |
Sun, 14 June 2015 13:49 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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Mac, do you have a Tornado Magnet attached to your place? Didn't your GMC
get damaged In two different tornados?
Jim Hupy
On Jun 14, 2015 11:46 AM, "D C _Mac_ Macdonald" wrote:
> My '81 Citation X-11 had ~ 140,000 miles on it when it was destroyed by
> tornado in '99.
>
> Mac Macdonald in OKC
> '76 ex P.B.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>> On Jun 12, 2015, at 19:26, Robert Mueller
> wrote:
>>
>> Pete,
>>
>> Glad you took my comment in the spirit I meant it. Nope I've never had a
> Citation actually the only other GM product I owned was a
>> 1971 454 convertible Corvette, it went like crazy but left a bit to be
> desired when it came to turning and stopping IIRC.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Rob M.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Pete Smith
>>
>> USAussie wrote on Fri, 12 June 2015 09:18
>> Hmmm,
>>
>> LOL, hope springs eternal.....sorry if I sounded negative, my only point
> was that just because the GM folks did something one way in
>> the 1970s does not mean it was even the best way or even close to it,
> even then, as there are lots of pressures on design engineers
>> (thats what I do for a living)other than simply doing it the best way
> there is.
>>
>> BTW did you ever have a Citation? :) If there was a bright shining
> center of the GM galaxy, The Citation was likely close to the
>> point furthest from it......
>>
>> Pete
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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