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Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279290] Sun, 07 June 2015 18:12 Go to next message
budworks521 is currently offline  budworks521   United States
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Registered: October 2013
Location: Grand Rapids MI 1974 Pain...
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Gentlemen, since I am not a very great mechanic I took to heart many great ideas on solving my riddle(s). I rented a vacuum pump, got a small container of gas, and some gumout and tried different methods of analysis. First I tried adding air or vacuum with the pump to see if my vacuum was the problem of stalling and it didn't help. I had a steady 17 inches or so from two ports front and back of carb. Secondly, I decided to add a few squirts of gas tear drop style when it started to bog down and viola the engine wanted to run again. I already changed the module with no difference in running better. Hence, this is what I noticed. First, my float bowl is empty upon starting. No squirts when a cold throttle takes place. It is either draining out of the bowl or something else. My carb no longer floods either. Secondly, Once it starts running it will idle for some time until the carb rids itself of gas or ???. Maybe by me pumping the gas to get it to idle fills the bowl enough and then the gas eventually runs out? My fuel line before the mechanical pump used to twitch quite abit and now you can hardly feel the gas pulsating through the line. So I pretty much know that my problem is lack of gas to engine. The carb has been looked at and rebuilt three times, no idea what my fuel pressure is, and whether or not my float needle is hanging up or stuck. I wonder how long can an engine run with with gas initially in the bowl and then not refilling properly??? Thanks for all the insight.

1974 Painted Desert 455 upper half rebuild constant project inexperienced mechanic Grand Rapids Mi Always trying to learn
Re: Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279292 is a reply to message #279290] Sun, 07 June 2015 18:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
John  Sharpe is currently offline  John Sharpe   United States
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I would think that with a full bowl the engine would idle for more than 30 seconds. It would start faltering before it eventually dies.

John Sharpe
Porter, TX
78 Eleganza II, TBI
40 Ford Panel, TPI
Re: Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279299 is a reply to message #279290] Sun, 07 June 2015 19:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
George Beckman is currently offline  George Beckman   United States
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budworks521 wrote on Sun, 07 June 2015 16:12
So I pretty much know that my problem is lack of gas to engine. The carb has been looked at and rebuilt three times, no idea what my fuel pressure is, and whether or not my float needle is hanging up or stuck. I wonder how long can an engine run with with gas initially in the bowl and then not refilling properly??? Thanks for all the insight.


You are doing well. Homing on the problem.

Hard to tell how long it will run on the fuel in the bowl because we don't know if it is getting completely filled.

I have fuel injection so I don't have a stock fuel pump. However, if it is starting to fail we want to make sure that no gas is leaking into the engine oil. THere is a diaphragm in the pump and if it fails it can leak gas into the engine. Shouldn't happen but look at your oil. Make sure it isn't rising. Smell it. It might also seem thin as the gas will dilute it. THis is not a big chance, I don't think, but it would be a shame to ruin an engine because of something overlooked.



'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
Re: Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279300 is a reply to message #279299] Sun, 07 June 2015 19:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
A Hamilto is currently offline  A Hamilto   United States
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George Beckman wrote on Sun, 07 June 2015 19:27
You are doing well. Homing on the problem.
Hard to tell how long it will run on the fuel in the bowl because we don't know if it is getting completely filled.

I have fuel injection so I don't have a stock fuel pump. However, if it is starting to fail we want to make sure that no gas is leaking into the engine oil. THere is a diaphragm in the pump and if it fails it can leak gas into the engine. Shouldn't happen but look at your oil. Make sure it isn't rising. Smell it. It might also seem thin as the gas will dilute it. THis is not a big chance, I don't think, but it would be a shame to ruin an engine because of something overlooked.
I was under the impression that the mechanical fuel pump was bypassed and an electric one was installed.

At any rate, when I don't know if it is a sticky float or a plumbing/pump problem, I figger out how to gravity feed the carb. If it runs, the problem is the pump or the plumbing. If it doesn't run, its the carb. Make sure the in-place pump can't pump before gravity feeding the engine on something like an outboard motor tank.
Re: Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279320 is a reply to message #279300] Sun, 07 June 2015 22:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ken Burton is currently offline  Ken Burton   United States
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Or take a 5 gallon can and fill it with gasoline. Strap it to the front bumper and run a hose to the intake side of the fuel mechanical pump. If it runs this way you have proven that he fuel pump, and carb are not the problem. It only takes a few minutes to hook this up. You will need something less than 6 feet of gas line (3/8" hose).

Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
Re: Testing of gas versus spark versus vacuum [message #279452 is a reply to message #279290] Tue, 09 June 2015 19:22 Go to previous message
budworks521 is currently offline  budworks521   United States
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Registered: October 2013
Location: Grand Rapids MI 1974 Pain...
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thanks for the input. I have already been aware of fuel dumping into the crank and have watched my oil dipstick very carefully. I was flooding out and not having proper ignition before and I believe fuel got in that time and drained the oil and refilled with new last year. Thanks gain guys

1974 Painted Desert 455 upper half rebuild constant project inexperienced mechanic Grand Rapids Mi Always trying to learn
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