Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Generator alternatives (Was Birchaven with 3000W Honda thread)
| Generator alternatives [message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 11:53  |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Kind of a rehash of some previous discussion but the other thread has me thinking about generators. My Onan gave me some trouble on the recent trip. We tried to start it during lunch and it sounded like crap. We came on home and I looked into it last week. Turns out that the exhaust pipe had come off the muffler and the 'crap' we were hearing was just an unmuffled two cylinder. It runs fine now but does put out a bit of blue smoke.
I was looking at a Honda EV6010 but haven't found one yet.
And then I got to thinking about OUR generator needs. We don't dry camp. Our generator needs would be the occasional use during a lunch or rest stop and the hopefully unlikely event of a roadside 'event'.
A Honda EV4010 or 6010 is the obvious state of the art but it's not really necessary. Plus they are pretty expensive. Even the Honda 3000's aren't exactly chump change and 3000W isn't quite 'enough'.
A few years ago a tornado took out a bunch of high tension towers and the entire area was without power for about 10 days. Fortunately the weather was good. During that process, I purchased, to supplement my other two generators, a 8250W electric start offshore generator. Works great, a little loud but not that bad. It's made in China. Mine is made by EQT
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200313480_200313480
Looks identical to this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/8750-peak7000-running-watts-13-hp-420cc-generator-epa-iii-68530.html
I've checked and it will fit in the 26' box barely but will fit easily if the battery is moved to the front.
No fuel pump but Ken Henderson and others have solved that problem with the flutter valve pumps.
It's a bit too much capacity than I really need but its the smallest electric start that HF offers. At 600 bucks it's about the same price as the new Onan control board and Bovee ignition I purchased, and the new muffler system I need to buy. And my Onan will still smoke after all that.
I believe that with a bit of fabrication, the HF unit will do the trick.
- Fuel Pump
- Re-routing exhaust
- Dealing with the 220 output (may not be an issue as it has three 20A 120V outlets??)
- Possible a bit more noise
- Possible needing a fan to provide more fresh air for cooling.
Yeah, it's not a Honda. It probably won't last as long and certainly is louder. Offset that by the price and availability of replacements at the corner Harbor Freight and it seems to make a good bit of sense for MY needs. There may be smaller units with electric start but the appealing thing to me about the HF unit is that if it were to fail, I could probably drive a couple hours, pick up a replacement, and install it in a few hours. If I was planning on dry camping a lot, I'd choose a different solution.
When I get a chance, I'll download the sound pressure level meter app for my Android phone and measure the DBA of the Onan and the Chinese unit. I know it sounds 'different', but I'm not sure it's really that much louder.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271811 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 12:00  |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
There's a thread here with Chinese gensets. I believe we have more than a few 26' with the Far East power option, though maybe not your model.
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271812 is a reply to message #271811] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 12:04 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Other than Onan, (and I'm not sure about that anymore), are there ANY us made gensets that will remotely fit in the box?
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271813 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 12:09 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
|
Senior Member |
|
|
And I swear the next time I have to haul the Junkerac out of my 23' there will be one more with something made by the heathen chinee. I use the genset so infrequently, a yank starter isn't a real drawback, though I notice many of the manual starts have a mounting pad for an electric self-commencer. I suspect adding it wouldn't be too onerous a job.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271814 is a reply to message #271812] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 12:13 |
jknezek
Messages: 1057
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 5
|
Senior Member |
|
|
kerry pinkerton wrote on Thu, 12 February 2015 13:04Other than Onan, (and I'm not sure about that anymore), are there ANY us made gensets that will remotely fit in the box?
No one makes RV generators anymore. The Hondas aren't designed for the purpose. Cummins/Onan and Generac are it for commercial RV generator producers. Not even sure Generac is still in the business as far as enclosed mobile spaces go. Other than that, you need to get creative.
Thanks,
Jeremy Knezek
1976 Glenbrook
Birmingham, AL
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271821 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 13:34 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Jeremy - I believe Junkerac threw in the towel on their RV product line a few years ago. Cummins/Onan is about 'it' for purpose built RV gensets. Onan used to build their single engine 3600RPM sets up to 4KW, I don't know if they still do or not - Ask JimK.
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271822 is a reply to message #271821] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 14:00 |
jknezek
Messages: 1057
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 5
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Johnny Bridges wrote on Thu, 12 February 2015 14:34Jeremy - I believe Junkerac threw in the towel on their RV product line a few years ago. Cummins/Onan is about 'it' for purpose built RV gensets. Onan used to build their single engine 3600RPM sets up to 4KW, I don't know if they still do or not - Ask JimK.
That's what I thought. Since I wasn't sure I decided to hedge my bets.
Thanks,
Jeremy Knezek
1976 Glenbrook
Birmingham, AL
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Generator alternatives [message #271823 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 14:01 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
|
Senior Member |
|
|
In case there's anyone interested and doesn't know about it, I put a
Troy-Bilt 5kW in my 23' five years ago:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g5330-troybilt-generator-installation.html
In reviewing the album, I see that I never updated it from that initial
installation. I later replaced the 100# slides with the much heavier duty
ones from the old Onan.
The wiring diagram needs revision to show that the electric fuel pump now
operates only while the starter is powered. That change was necessitated
because the lowest pressure fuel pump and the lowest range regulator I
could find still overpowered the carb on the Troy-Bilt. Since it was
intended to run on gravity feed from a shallow tank right over the unit, it
require only about 0.084 psi of fuel pressure. That's now supplied by a
pump operating from crankcase pressure fluctuations. I'd expected to
install a solenoid to operate the choke during remote starting. Instead, I
just let the electric pump enrichen the mixture during starting. Not
elegant, but it's always worked.
Not shown in the album is the Generac exhaust resonator I added to the
outlet of the Onan starter. It does help, but the thing is still as loud
as an Onan and perhaps more annoying because it runs at 3600 rpm.
I've had only one problem during the five years. It starts almost
immediately, barely notices load changes, and has had to run all day at
times. The one problem occurred last year while dry camping at Sun-n-Fun
in Lakeland, FL. For a while I had the toad parked between the generator
and the row of campers behind us. After I moved it, one of those folks
came over and said, "Would you mind putting your car back between us and
your generator -- it makes it MUCH quieter for us!" :-) Methinks I should
probably add a vertical exhaust stack for such locations.
This has been a MUCH cheaper and more satisfactory solution that was its
predecessor, a Generac 36G.
Ken H.
On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 12:53 PM, Kerry Pinkerton
wrote:
> Kind of a rehash of some previous discussion but the other thread has me
> thinking about generators.
...
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271825 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 14:21 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Atwood offers a 2000 watt compatible A/C unit.:
http://www.rvsupplywarehouse.com/atwood-air-command-rv-air-conditioners-complete-unit
http://www.atwoodmobile.com/air-conditioners/air-conditioners-brochure.aspNGSBlU7I8ReDsLK2PuRb7jkfwpV3A&sig2=CmZHSsDGdy2mW9sXCVDnSQ&bvm=bv.857 61416,d.eXY
the 13,500BTU atwood says right in the literature it runs off 2000 watt generator.
I have an email from someone from a SOB forum, that he claims his larger atwood Air command the 15,500 BTU unit will run off his honda 2000i. I have not seen that with my own eyes, but if you look at the specs, it is right at that mark. I am planning on buying that large atwood unit for my GMC this spring.
having the onan or other generator on board, is nice. And being able to run it while driving down the road is a plus, But when I boondock, I borrow a honda 3000i, because it is quiet, but more because I can have it a distance away from my coach running, and no vibration at all is felt. I am hoping with the new A/C unit, I can borrow a lighter generator for boondocking. I am not sure at what point I will ever want to give up the 6000 watt onan, that can run a couple 1500 watt heaters.
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Generator alternatives [message #271826 is a reply to message #271825] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 15:19 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Go to propane
-60 amps out
- fits the space
- no carbon
- runs forever
- no alki fuel
- ready for your new diesel
http://gmcmotorhome.info/generator.html#dual
Erf
On Thursday, February 12, 2015, Jon Roche wrote:
> Atwood offers a 2000 watt compatible A/C unit.:
>
>
> http://www.rvsupplywarehouse.com/atwood-air-command-rv-air-conditioners-complete-unit
>
>
> http://www.atwoodmobile.com/air-conditioners/air-conditioners-brochure.aspNGSBlU7I8ReDsLK2PuRb7jkfwpV3A&sig2=CmZHSsDGdy2mW9sXCVDnSQ&bvm=bv.857 61416,d.eXY
>
> the 13,500BTU atwood says right in the literature it runs off 2000 watt
> generator.
>
> I have an email from someone from a SOB forum, that he claims his larger
> atwood Air command the 15,500 BTU unit will run off his honda 2000i. I
> have
> not seen that with my own eyes, but if you look at the specs, it is right
> at that mark. I am planning on buying that large atwood unit for my GMC
> this spring.
>
> having the onan or other generator on board, is nice. And being able to
> run it while driving down the road is a plus, But when I boondock, I borrow
> a honda 3000i, because it is quiet, but more because I can have it a
> distance away from my coach running, and no vibration at all is felt. I am
> hoping with the new A/C unit, I can borrow a lighter generator for
> boondocking. I am not sure at what point I will ever want to give up the
> 6000 watt
> onan, that can run a couple 1500 watt heaters.
>
>
> --
> Jon Roche
> 75 palm beach
> St. Cloud, MN
> http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271833 is a reply to message #271810] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 18:05 |
zhagrieb
Messages: 676
Registered: August 2009
Location: Portland Oregon
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I have an Onan Microlite 2800. Fits nicely in the compartment, runs a 13500 AC and microwave at the same time. More than enough amps for my needs.
Glenn Giere, Portland OR, K7GAG
'73 "Moby the Motorhome" 26'
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Generator alternatives [message #271843 is a reply to message #271826] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 15:31 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
|
Senior Member |
|
|
How about 500 AH of Li-On cells?
Like this -
http://www.technomadia.com/2015/02/living-the-lithium-lifestyle-3-5-year-lithium-rv-battery-update/
If you use his 370AH number, and assume 80% inverter efficiency, you could run one rooftop AC for 18 hours or so.
No oil changes, and no linguistic gymnastics to express your displeasure with the barbarian, or the Junkerac.
For the record, I have a EV-6010
But I’m really thinking that Li-On and a 4kW Honda Inverter might be the hot setup.
Dolph Santorine
dolph@dolphsantorine.com
134 Falls Road
Wheeling, WV 26003
Phone: 304-219-3100
FAX: 304-232-3075
> On Feb 12, 2015, at 4:19 PM, gene Fisher wrote:
>
> Go to propane
> -60 amps out
> - fits the space
> - no carbon
> - runs forever
> - no alki fuel
> - ready for your new diesel
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/generator.html#dual
> Erf
>
> On Thursday, February 12, 2015, Jon Roche wrote:
>
>> Atwood offers a 2000 watt compatible A/C unit.:
>>
>>
>> http://www.rvsupplywarehouse.com/atwood-air-command-rv-air-conditioners-complete-unit
>>
>>
>> http://www.atwoodmobile.com/air-conditioners/air-conditioners-brochure.aspNGSBlU7I8ReDsLK2PuRb7jkfwpV3A&sig2=CmZHSsDGdy2mW9sXCVDnSQ&bvm=bv.857 61416,d.eXY
>>
>> the 13,500BTU atwood says right in the literature it runs off 2000 watt
>> generator.
>>
>> I have an email from someone from a SOB forum, that he claims his larger
>> atwood Air command the 15,500 BTU unit will run off his honda 2000i. I
>> have
>> not seen that with my own eyes, but if you look at the specs, it is right
>> at that mark. I am planning on buying that large atwood unit for my GMC
>> this spring.
>>
>> having the onan or other generator on board, is nice. And being able to
>> run it while driving down the road is a plus, But when I boondock, I borrow
>> a honda 3000i, because it is quiet, but more because I can have it a
>> distance away from my coach running, and no vibration at all is felt. I am
>> hoping with the new A/C unit, I can borrow a lighter generator for
>> boondocking. I am not sure at what point I will ever want to give up the
>> 6000 watt
>> onan, that can run a couple 1500 watt heaters.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jon Roche
>> 75 palm beach
>> St. Cloud, MN
>> http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
> --
> Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
> “Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
> -------
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/
> Alternator Protection Cable
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Generator alternatives [message #271847 is a reply to message #271843] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 20:49 |
 |
ljdavick
Messages: 3548
Registered: March 2007
Location: Fremont, CA
Karma: -3
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Dolph,
That’s an interesting one - but 500 Ah seems so weak and it’s more than $3k for that… Why not buy a used Nissan Leaf with whatever remains of the 24 KW battery for, what $10k? It should have enough to power everything for a few days before being recharged. And with enough solar you’d only need to plug in to make up for air-conditioning and microwave loads every few days. Heck - let it regenerate while you’re towing (can you say 6 MPG?)
Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, CA
> On Feb 12, 2015, at 1:31 PM, Dolph Santorine wrote:
>
> How about 500 AH of Li-On cells?
>
> Like this -
>
> http://www.technomadia.com/2015/02/living-the-lithium-lifestyle-3-5-year-lithium-rv-battery-update/
>
> If you use his 370AH number, and assume 80% inverter efficiency, you could run one rooftop AC for 18 hours or so.
>
> No oil changes, and no linguistic gymnastics to express your displeasure with the barbarian, or the Junkerac.
>
> For the record, I have a EV-6010
>
> But I’m really thinking that Li-On and a 4kW Honda Inverter might be the hot setup.
>
>
> Dolph Santorine
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, Ca
Howell EFI + EBL + Electronic Dizzy
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Generator alternatives [message #271855 is a reply to message #271847] |
Thu, 12 February 2015 23:12 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Nissan Leaf - in these parts, they run on coal!
I wonder if they will be as popular at the junkyard as Prius’ after the second battery!
Dolph
DE N8JPC
Wheeling, West Virginia
1977 GMC 26' Palm Beach
TZE167V100820
1976 GMC 26' Donor Coach
TZE166V101610
> On Feb 12, 2015, at 9:49 PM, Larry Davick wrote:
>
> Dolph,
>
> That’s an interesting one - but 500 Ah seems so weak and it’s more than $3k for that… Why not buy a used Nissan Leaf with whatever remains of the 24 KW battery for, what $10k? It should have enough to power everything for a few days before being recharged. And with enough solar you’d only need to plug in to make up for air-conditioning and microwave loads every few days. Heck - let it regenerate while you’re towing (can you say 6 MPG?)
>
> Larry Davick
> A Mystery Machine
> 1976(ish) Palm Beach
> Fremont, CA
>
>
>> On Feb 12, 2015, at 1:31 PM, Dolph Santorine wrote:
>>
>> How about 500 AH of Li-On cells?
>>
>> Like this -
>>
>> http://www.technomadia.com/2015/02/living-the-lithium-lifestyle-3-5-year-lithium-rv-battery-update/
>>
>> If you use his 370AH number, and assume 80% inverter efficiency, you could run one rooftop AC for 18 hours or so.
>>
>> No oil changes, and no linguistic gymnastics to express your displeasure with the barbarian, or the Junkerac.
>>
>> For the record, I have a EV-6010
>>
>> But I’m really thinking that Li-On and a 4kW Honda Inverter might be the hot setup.
>>
>>
>> Dolph Santorine
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271868 is a reply to message #271810] |
Fri, 13 February 2015 07:26 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I believe member hertfordnc has purchased Honda hybrid battery packs for around $600. I know he's had my craigslist scanner tuned for them in the past.
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
|
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271869 is a reply to message #271868] |
Fri, 13 February 2015 07:57 |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Did i hear my name mentioned?
I've read that article about lithium batteries, it's good stuff and he's a very smart guy.
I have learned a bit about hybrid batteries in owning the Civic for 100,000 miles.
My understanding is that of the dozens of cells in the battery pack, only a few have to fail to croak the battery, so the average bad battery in the junkyard has more than a few good cells.
If you wanted to build a Lithium battery for your coach i think it could be done cheaply-
Search ebay to figure out which packs have the lowest resale, (early honda low, late Lexus high) Ebay sellers will also tell you the composition of the battery packs and there are many individual cells for sale.
Lithium batteries have 2-3 times the energy density of lead acid so a massive bettery instead of a genset could work for a lot of folks.
Gather a few packs from junkyards, seperate the good cells, assemple into a 14.4 volts pack, figure out a very precise charging system and you could probbly do it for the price of generator or eight golf cart batteries.
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
[Updated on: Fri, 13 February 2015 08:01] Report message to a moderator |
|
|
|
| Re: Generator alternatives [message #271870 is a reply to message #271810] |
Fri, 13 February 2015 08:22 |
 |
SeanKidd
Messages: 747
Registered: June 2012
Location: Northern Neck Virginia
Karma: 4
|
Senior Member |
|
|
http://www.extremetech.com/tag/lithium-ion
Wait another year, LiOn batteries are currently experiencing a quantum leap in advancement, give production some time. The batteries you may buy this year will be "old tech" in 2016... Sort of like solar panels, you gam now buy a 100 Watt panel for less than $150, this is old tech, new panels of the same dimensions are 435 watts each....
Commercially, we at building MegaWatt hour battery arrays to compensate grid imbalance caused by wind and solar farms. Think of a generation plant churning out 100MW goes off line on a hot summer day...that's what happens when an afternoon thunderstorm suddenly shades a solar farm. Infrastructure cannot handle any more solar without batteries. Lastly, solar farms generate at unity...power factor of 1. Same thing happens to power quality in the neighborhood of any solar generation. Pole mounted dynamic reactors are replacing static devices installed for years to compensate for power factor correction. Smart grid is a necessity. Sorry to rant off topic.
Sean and Stephanie
73 Ex-CanyonLands 26' #317 "Oliver"
Hubler 1-Ton, Quad-Bags, Rear Disc, Reaction Arms, P.Huber TBs, 3.70:1 LSD Honda 6500 inverter gen.
Colonial Travelers
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Fri Oct 04 06:30:42 CDT 2024
Total time taken to generate the page: 0.01076 seconds
|
GMCforum
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
