| Ignition Key Switch [message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 15:27  |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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Something went wrong when I turned the key to start up my coach this morning. The cylinder where the key goes into the steering column, felt a slight 'snap'. Now I can't start the coach (at least not using the key).
How do I remove the ignition switch cylinder? Do I need to take off the steering wheel?
If so, do I need a special tool to do so?
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264516 is a reply to message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 17:59  |
mrgmc3
Messages: 210
Registered: September 2013
Location: W Washington
Karma: 2
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MangoMushroom wrote on Sun, 19 October 2014 15:27Something went wrong when I turned the key to start up my coach this morning. The cylinder where the key goes into the steering column, felt a slight 'snap'. Now I can't start the coach (at least not using the key).
If the lock cyl is in one piece but does not engage the switch, your "rack" may have snapped. GM tilt columns have a little zinc die cast rack that is moved by the key cylinder and it pushes on the rod that engages the actual ignition switch at the base of the column. The die casting can break which breaks the link between the key cylinder and the switch. It's a bit of a pain to replace as it requires pulling the steering wheel and some additional disassembly below the wheel as well. The service manual is kinda vague, so take lots of digital pictures as you go.
I replaced one on a similar vintage GM car 3 or 4 years ago and can post about a hundred pictures if this is the problem and you get stuck.
Chris Geils - Twin Cities / W Wa
1978 26' Kingsley w/ very few mods; PD9040, aux trans cooler, one repaint in stock colors, R134a, Al rad, Alcoas, 54k mi
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264518 is a reply to message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 18:39 |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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Well, I replaced the lock cylinder and it did not solve the problem. The issue is somewhere further on down the line. The lock cylinder makes other parts move. What could be the next step? Any help is greatly appreciated, as i am stranded!
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264528 is a reply to message #264519] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 20:27 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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MangoMushroom wrote on Sun, 19 October 2014 16:57I'm thinking the ignition switch actuator rod somehow uncoupled?
"Uncoupled" may be what Chris referred to when he said the rack may have snapped. There is a little pot metal gear the key acts on and it breaks. It can be replaced, however I took the easy way out. I apologize to the purists who will shake their head sadly, because they thought I was a classy guy.
I offer this solution as a deterrent to theft. I say that because when I had my coach at JimK's they had to ask me how to start it.
I offer this solution as a 20 minute fix that has worked for over three years.
I offer this solution as a reminder of my farming experience when you shut a tractor down by pulling on a lever that shut off the injector pump. (I admit I have to push to shut my coach down.
One downside is if you push tooo far you can end up in AUX rather than off. You have to look at the dash lights.
The gun cleaning rod goes down to the switch and has a bend in it much like the bend GM put in the rod that comes from the ignition key/rack system to the switch. When you take the key out, the steering still locks. (You do have to put the key in if you want to steer, even if you can start the engine. Ask me how I know!)
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
[Updated on: Sun, 19 October 2014 20:32] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264529 is a reply to message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 20:34 |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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I cannot feel a rod move when I turn the cylinder. I think the rod disconnected from the rod actuator (the part with teeth that moves when the cylinder rotates)
Need to take more of the steering assembly apart to see if that's the case.
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264531 is a reply to message #264528] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 20:36 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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George Beckman wrote on Sun, 19 October 2014 18:27MangoMushroom wrote on Sun, 19 October 2014 16:57I'm thinking the ignition switch actuator rod somehow uncoupled?
For e-mail folks, I fixed the link.
The gun cleaning rod goes down to the switch and has a bend in it much like the bend GM put in the rod that comes from the ignition key/rack system to the switch. When you take the key out, the steering still locks. (You do have to put the key in if you want to steer, even if you can start the engine. Ask me how I know!)
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264542 is a reply to message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 21:50 |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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I would do the tap, but don't have the parts and I am stranded. I am now taking apart the tilt portion of the steering column. Seems like I'll need to go further in order to access where the ignition rod couples with the actuator.
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264545 is a reply to message #264507] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 22:09 |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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Looks like I hit a road block anyway... Need a pivot pin remover to get to the next step. Auto parts store is closed. Looks like I get to enjoy the "house" part of my coach for the night! Thx for your continued feedback everyone
Once I get the tilt off, will I be able to access the part of the ignition actuator that couples with the ignition rod?
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264548 is a reply to message #264545] |
Sun, 19 October 2014 22:53 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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Senior Member |
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MangoMushroom wrote on Sun, 19 October 2014 20:09Looks like I hit a road block anyway... Need a pivot pin remover to get to the next step. Auto parts store is closed. Looks like I get to enjoy the "house" part of my coach for the night! Thx for your continued feedback everyone
Once I get the tilt off, will I be able to access the part of the ignition actuator that couples with the ignition rod?
The lever is not pulling the switch down by the brake pedal. I was at a dump station when it happened. I started it with two pair of pliers, standing on my head, pulling the rod up.
I know it is not elegant, but before I put the gun cleaning rod in I started it with a bent coat hanger suck down the column. The switch, if I remember, has a little cover. Pull it off. Toss the rod aside. Shove a coat hanger down beside the column. Bend the end to stick in the slot in the switch down by the brake pedal. Put the cover on. It will at least get you home.
I know some are saying use a starter switch, which will indeed run the starter. If the rod is not pulling the ignition switch the "key" is off. The engine will not start unless the ignition switch (down by the brake pedal) is in the "run" position.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264555 is a reply to message #264546] |
Mon, 20 October 2014 04:58 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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If you do not have a gun cleaning rod handy, get an antenna shaft off of a Ford Tarus in the junk yard. Get the slick ones, not the ones with the spiral down the shaft. I think it takes one 10 mm wrench. I go down the Ford row and get them 10 at a time. The junk yard is full of Fords. I pay $1.00 each for them. Bend and cut it to what you need. Beside using them for antennas (they are stainless), I use them for push and pull rods on all kinds of things.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264568 is a reply to message #264507] |
Mon, 20 October 2014 09:13 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Can you take the trim panel off, take the 2 column nuts off and drop it down to manually actuation the switch? Put the top side back together to get you hone? Just a thought.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: Ignition Key Switch [message #264585 is a reply to message #264507] |
Mon, 20 October 2014 14:47 |
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MangoMushroom
Messages: 67
Registered: August 2008
Location: Emeryville, CA
Karma: 0
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Found the problem! The rack broke in half (the part with teeth that engages with the cylinder rod)
I wonder if they have a replacement at the auto parts store
****MangoMushroom
`76 GMC Birchaven named "Harvey"
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