| What Glue for Black Tank [message #257455] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 15:16  |
Steve
Messages: 506
Registered: September 2013
Location: East Greenville, Pa
Karma: 1
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I am trying to get my new black tank in this weekend. What is the proper cement or glue to use to go from the tank to ABS pipe?
I was planning to use a rubber coupling to go from the tank to pipe so there would be a flexible joint vs. a rigid joint, but I can't find a rubber coupling that will go over the tank outlet, so I am going to cement a short piece of ABS to the tank, and then do my rubber coupling flexible joint.
Any advice would be appreciated.
1978 GMC Royal
Eastern Pennslyvania
1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
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| Re: [GMCnet] What Glue for Black Tank [message #257458 is a reply to message #257455] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 15:20  |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
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If your new tank is abs you want to use abs cement. What is your tank made out of?
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Aug 1, 2014, at 1:17 PM, Steve Adams wrote:
>
> I am trying to get my new black tank in this weekend. What is the proper cement or glue to use to go from the tank to ABS pipe?
>
> I was planning to use a rubber coupling to go from the tank to pipe so there would be a flexible joint vs. a rigid joint, but I can't find a rubber
> coupling that will go over the tank outlet, so I am going to cement a short piece of ABS to the tank, and then do my rubber coupling flexible joint.
>
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
> --
> 1978 GMC Royal
> Eastern Pennslyvania
> 1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
> 1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
> 1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
> 1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257471 is a reply to message #257455] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 17:24 |
Steve
Messages: 506
Registered: September 2013
Location: East Greenville, Pa
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Todd, Joe, and Mr.Fisher, Thanks for your reply's. I should have been more specific.
I have a new tank from Applied GMC. I am not sure what it is made of. The inside diameter of the outlet is about 3.4 inches, and a 3 inch ABS pipe fits very snugly inside of it. The outside diameter is an odd size and has a little taper to it. I went to three pluming supply houses looking for a rubber fitting that would tighten down it but everything was either too tight or too loose. So it seems like my best option would be to cement a short 3 inch pipe into the tank.
I called Applied GMC and they said they use ABS pipe and ABS cement, and a 4 inch stainless steel hose clamp around the joint. I will likely take that route unless I can find a rubber fitting. I would prefer to have an easy disconnect there.
1978 GMC Royal
Eastern Pennslyvania
1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257480 is a reply to message #257455] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 19:26 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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When you "Glue" ABS to ABS, or PVC to PVC, you are really solvent welding. The tank is HDPE (Polyethylene). You cannot Weld ABS to the tank. Doing what they told you is basically press fitting the pipe and sealing it with the glue. It will work for a while, but then that glue will dry out and crack. Silicone will be even worse. The clamp may help, as the PE is soft. You're best bet is to have a piece of PE pipe that has a matching OD to the ABS welded to it at a plastic welding shop (Just look up plastic welding or fabrication), and then use the rubber coupling.
If you have a Ryan Herco in your town, you could also buy a +GF+ brand coupling that uses heat to weld itself. There is a wire wrapped around it and electrical current heats and welds the stuff together. They may also loan or rent you the tool or do it at the counter for you.
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257489 is a reply to message #257480] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 20:20 |
Steve
Messages: 506
Registered: September 2013
Location: East Greenville, Pa
Karma: 1
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Chr$ wrote on Fri, 01 August 2014 20:26When you "Glue" ABS to ABS, or PVC to PVC, you are really solvent welding. The tank is HDPE (Polyethylene). You cannot Weld ABS to the tank. Doing what they told you is basically press fitting the pipe and sealing it with the glue. It will work for a while, but then that glue will dry out and crack. Silicone will be even worse. The clamp may help, as the PE is soft. You're best bet is to have a piece of PE pipe that has a matching OD to the ABS welded to it at a plastic welding shop (Just look up plastic welding or fabrication), and then use the rubber coupling.
If you have a Ryan Herco in your town, you could also buy a +GF+ brand coupling that uses heat to weld itself. There is a wire wrapped around it and electrical current heats and welds the stuff together. They may also loan or rent you the tool or do it at the counter for you.
Chris, thanks for the reply. It makes sense. I am going to try to stretch the rubber coupling one more time. I also have a call into Jim K to confirm their procedure. I have been trying to glue/cement/weld two pieces of the tank together and I can't get anything to stick to it or to solvent weld it. I cut out holes for the toilet and vent pipe and I am using those pieces to test different pluming cements. The ABS cement does not do it. I suspect that you are correct in that it is really just helping to seal a fairly tight compression fit.
1978 GMC Royal
Eastern Pennslyvania
1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257490 is a reply to message #257489] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 20:41 |
midlf
Messages: 2212
Registered: July 2007
Location: SE Wisc. (Palmyra)
Karma: 1
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Steve Adams wrote on Fri, 01 August 2014 20:20
I am going to try to stretch the rubber coupling one more time.
You could boil the rubber coupling to soften it before trying to install it.
Not sure if this would work but it is easy and the coupling is replaceable if damaged.
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257491 is a reply to message #257489] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 20:42 |
midlf
Messages: 2212
Registered: July 2007
Location: SE Wisc. (Palmyra)
Karma: 1
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Steve Adams wrote on Fri, 01 August 2014 20:20
I am going to try to stretch the rubber coupling one more time.
You could boil the rubber coupling to soften it before trying to install it.
Not sure if this would work but it is easy and the coupling is replaceable if damaged.
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257492 is a reply to message #257478] |
Fri, 01 August 2014 21:00 |
Steve
Messages: 506
Registered: September 2013
Location: East Greenville, Pa
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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lqqkatjon wrote on Fri, 01 August 2014 20:08Look at my pictures. Not sure if you are dealing with the same tank.
http://www.lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
specifically:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5PN9l1L7b5w/U2PEDPCsQAI/AAAAAAAATMQ/k6L5UsKquAw/s1600/photo+16.JPG
it took a small bit of stretching of that rubber coupling, and a little tiny bit of wd-40. But I got that rubber 3" coupling to work out just fine.
I liked the idea of not being permanent mount to my brand new tank on that fitting.
otherwise they make plumbing pipe glue that is "all purpose" I do not think you are ever sure what truely the plastic tank is made of unless it is marked on the tank or you hear it from the manufacturer direct.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_23541-138-30821L_4294607598__?productId=4750817&Ns=p_product_qty_sales_dollar|1&pl=1¤tURL=%3FNs%3Dp_product_ qty_sales_dollar|1&facetInfo=
Jon, Many thanks for the advice. I did not think the 3 inch Fernco Coupling would go on, but after seeing your pictures I gave it another try. This time I had my son to help, as well as a little lubrication and a motorcycle tire iron for a little extra persuasion. We got it on and clamped down. I really feel better about that than trying to glue a pipe in. I prefer the flexible joint that can come apart as opposed to a rigid joint that does not come apart.
I also liked the idea of boiling to warm the part up. I have done that with nylon and other plastic parts that need press fitting.
1978 GMC Royal
Eastern Pennslyvania
1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
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| Re: [GMCnet] What Glue for Black Tank [message #257504 is a reply to message #257492] |
Sat, 02 August 2014 00:23 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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What our friend, the late Duane Simmons taught us to do was to rough sand
the inside neck of the tank and the spigot on the new valve and coat it
with RTV, then back it up with a hose clamp.
We have been doing this for the past several years, and seem to hold up.
On Fri, Aug 1, 2014 at 7:00 PM, Steve Adams wrote:
> lqqkatjon wrote on Fri, 01 August 2014 20:08
>> Look at my pictures. Not sure if you are dealing with the same tank.
>>
>> http://www.lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
>>
>> specifically:
>>
>>
> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5PN9l1L7b5w/U2PEDPCsQAI/AAAAAAAATMQ/k6L5UsKquAw/s1600/photo+16.JPG
>>
>> it took a small bit of stretching of that rubber coupling, and a little
> tiny bit of wd-40. But I got that rubber 3" coupling to work out just
>> fine.
>>
>> I liked the idea of not being permanent mount to my brand new tank on
> that fitting.
>>
>> otherwise they make plumbing pipe glue that is "all purpose" I do not
> think you are ever sure what truely the plastic tank is made of unless it
>> is marked on the tank or you hear it from the manufacturer direct.
>>
>>
> http://www.lowes.com/pd_23541-138-30821L_4294607598__?productId=4750817&Ns=p_product_qty_sales_dollar|1&pl=1¤tURL=%3FNs%3Dp_product_
>> qty_sales_dollar|1&facetInfo=
>
>
> Jon, Many thanks for the advice. I did not think the 3 inch Fernco
> Coupling would go on, but after seeing your pictures I gave it another try.
> This
> time I had my son to help, as well as a little lubrication and a
> motorcycle tire iron for a little extra persuasion. We got it on and
> clamped down.
> I really feel better about that than trying to glue a pipe in. I prefer
> the flexible joint that can come apart as opposed to a rigid joint that does
> not come apart.
>
> I also liked the idea of boiling to warm the part up. I have done that
> with nylon and other plastic parts that need press fitting.
>
> --
> 1978 GMC Royal
> Eastern Pennslyvania
> 1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
> 1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
> 1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
> 1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: What Glue for Black Tank [message #257509 is a reply to message #257455] |
Sat, 02 August 2014 06:55 |
Steve
Messages: 506
Registered: September 2013
Location: East Greenville, Pa
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Jim K, thanks for your response.
1978 GMC Royal
Eastern Pennslyvania
1968 Chevrolet C20 396 Camper Special
1969 Chevrolet C20 Camper Special
1985 Buick Electra Park Avenue
1992 Camaro 25th Anniversary Heretage Edition Black
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