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Measurement needed [message #255797] Fri, 18 July 2014 13:44 Go to next message
Hal StClair   United States
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Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM
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Would anyone have the dimensions for the CV flange to flange width of our final drives? I'd like to get the dimensions pretty close, better than I can manage from under the coach. If someone had one on a bench that would be great. I'm trying to work out the axle lengths needed on the diesel swap and which IFS to use. Any help would certainly be appreciated.
Thanks again,Hal


"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM
Re: Measurement needed [message #255812 is a reply to message #255797] Fri, 18 July 2014 18:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bwevers is currently offline  bwevers   United States
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Location: San Jose
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Hal,
Your project sounds interesting. Are you planning on using the transmission and
transfer case from a C2500 4x4 truck? That sounds like a lot of work.
I don't know of anyone who has attempted that. You would probably have
to raise the floor in the interior. And then you might have to raise the chassis up.

I've heard of people using the standard TH425 transmission with an adapter plate to connect
to a diesel engine. That would seem easier than making new axles and transmission mounts.
And then the diesel engine gets it's power at a lower RPM, so it might need a gear/torque converter change.

Here is a link to photos of a diesel conversion:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/restoration-and-diesel-conversion/p4230.html

Regards,
Bill


Bill Wevers GMC49ers, GMC Western States 1975 Glenbrook - Manny Powerdrive, OneTon 455 F Block, G heads San Jose
Re: Measurement needed [message #255817 is a reply to message #255812] Fri, 18 July 2014 19:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hal StClair   United States
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Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM
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Senior Member
It seems I've been collecting parts more than getting much accomplished. I recently purchased a H1 Hummer complete 6.5 TD with 4l80e with only 12,500 miles on the clock. I've been trying to source all the electric connectors to keep things 'OEM' looking and make trouble shooting easier down the road. I've shifted my intent on going with the early mechanical pump to keeping the late electronic one and all the electronic controls such as throttle,cruise and transmission. I found a B/W Morse transfer case built for a Revcon that's only 12"x21"x5" and only needs a simple 3/4" adapter to work. I also sourced the Dana 70 from the Revcon but am having a real challenge adapting the 1 ton chevy outboard CV's to a simple u joint. I may have to use the AAM 9.25" IFS chevy axle I have. I know the Dana is stronger but I'm at a stand still right now.
I've been looking for a supplier for a 8.5", 3/16 frame to give me a 2.5" body lift. Found someone that can do it in 1/4" but I don't think I need that much meat here, after all it's only 1/8" stock.
I've also found a couple of companies that sell a modified valve body and computer to turn the 4l80e into a 5 or 6 speed. You really need to change the 1st/second gears to take advantage of the extra gears but I don't think an extra $3000 for the modification would be worth it.
Thanks for the interest Bill, I'll try to document the build with pictures as I go.
Hal


"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM
Re: Measurement needed [message #255818 is a reply to message #255817] Fri, 18 July 2014 19:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lotsofspareparts is currently offline  lotsofspareparts   United States
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Registered: May 2014
Location: Arlington, WA
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Senior Member
Hal StClair wrote on Fri, 18 July 2014 17:45
It seems I've been collecting parts more than getting much accomplished. I recently purchased a H1 Hummer complete 6.5 TD with 4l80e with only 12,500 miles on the clock. I've been trying to source all the electric connectors to keep things 'OEM' looking and make trouble shooting easier down the road. I've shifted my intent on going with the early mechanical pump to keeping the late electronic one and all the electronic controls such as throttle,cruise and transmission. I found a B/W Morse transfer case built for a Revcon that's only 12"x21"x5" and only needs a simple 3/4" adapter to work. I also sourced the Dana 70 from the Revcon but am having a real challenge adapting the 1 ton chevy outboard CV's to a simple u joint. I may have to use the AAM 9.25" IFS chevy axle I have. I know the Dana is stronger but I'm at a stand still right now.
I've been looking for a supplier for a 8.5", 3/16 frame to give me a 2.5" body lift. Found someone that can do it in 1/4" but I don't think I need that much meat here, after all it's only 1/8" stock.
I've also found a couple of companies that sell a modified valve body and computer to turn the 4l80e into a 5 or 6 speed. You really need to change the 1st/second gears to take advantage of the extra gears but I don't think an extra $3000 for the modification would be worth it.
Thanks for the interest Bill, I'll try to document the build with pictures as I go.
Hal



I make $18 per hour and am struggling, I wish I had your kind of money.

Jared


Jared & Tina Lazaron + 14yr old Daughter..... 77 Eleganza II "Recherché"..... 73 Canyon Lands 230 "Elephant"
Re: Measurement needed [message #255822 is a reply to message #255818] Fri, 18 July 2014 20:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hal StClair   United States
Messages: 971
Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM
Karma: -12
Senior Member
I bought an engine/trans from a 12,500 mile H1 Hummer for $3000, I paid $100 for the transfer case and $100 for the Dana 70 and stub axles. I do most all of the work myself. I guess I don't get the 'money' comment.
Hal


"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM
Re: Measurement needed [message #255823 is a reply to message #255817] Fri, 18 July 2014 20:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
A Hamilto is currently offline  A Hamilto   United States
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Hal StClair wrote on Fri, 18 July 2014 19:45
...I've been looking for a supplier for a 8.5", 3/16 frame to give me a 2.5" body lift. ...
Why?

Any fuel economy gains you hope to pick up from the diesel will be negated by the additional drag when you raise the body. Not to mention instability in crosswinds and from opposite-going tractor trailers on the interstate. That body lift amounts to an additional 5.4 square feet of side surface area (crosswind consideration) and 1-2/3 square feet of frontal area (drag consideration).
Re: Measurement needed [message #255827 is a reply to message #255822] Fri, 18 July 2014 20:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lotsofspareparts is currently offline  lotsofspareparts   United States
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Registered: May 2014
Location: Arlington, WA
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Hal StClair wrote on Fri, 18 July 2014 18:01
I bought an engine/trans from a 12,500 mile H1 Hummer for $3000, I paid $100 for the transfer case and $100 for the Dana 70 and stub axles. I do most all of the work myself. I guess I don't get the 'money' comment.
Hal


That's my bad, the way I read the post I was under the impression you bought a H1 Hummer and robbed the running gear out of it.

........ Carry on Sir, can't wait to see it finished.

LOL, Jared


Jared & Tina Lazaron + 14yr old Daughter..... 77 Eleganza II "Recherché"..... 73 Canyon Lands 230 "Elephant"
Re: [GMCnet] Measurement needed [message #255829 is a reply to message #255822] Fri, 18 July 2014 20:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James Hupy is currently offline  James Hupy   United States
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Hal, best to "soft pedal" Jared's evening comments. I have met him, he is
young, but the force is strong with him.( grin)
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Jul 18, 2014 6:01 PM, "Hal StClair" wrote:

> I bought an engine/trans from a 12,500 mile H1 Hummer for $3000, I paid
> $100 for the transfer case and $100 for the Dana 70 and stub axles. I do
> most
> all of the work myself. I guess I don't get the 'money' comment.
> Hal
> --
> 1977 Royale 101348,
>
> 1977 Royale 101586,
>
> 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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Re: Measurement needed [message #255876 is a reply to message #255797] Sat, 19 July 2014 15:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
midlf is currently offline  midlf   United States
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Senior Member
Hal StClair wrote on Fri, 18 July 2014 13:44
Would anyone have the dimensions for the CV flange to flange width of our final drives? I'd like to get the dimensions pretty close, better than I can manage from under the coach. If someone had one on a bench that would be great. I'm trying to work out the axle lengths needed on the diesel swap and which IFS to use. Any help would certainly be appreciated.
Thanks again,Hal


21-1/4" with RH axle extension fully seated. This measurement is from my original 3.07




Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
Re: Measurement needed [message #255878 is a reply to message #255876] Sat, 19 July 2014 16:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hal StClair   United States
Messages: 971
Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM
Karma: -12
Senior Member
Is that measurement from the outside flange or from the flat area where the cv flush seats? It's probably only about a 1/4" recess but I'm trying to get as close as possible. Thank you, Hal

"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM
Re: Measurement needed [message #255881 is a reply to message #255878] Sat, 19 July 2014 17:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
midlf is currently offline  midlf   United States
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Hal StClair wrote on Sat, 19 July 2014 16:22
Is that measurement from the outside flange or from the flat area where the cv flush seats? It's probably only about a 1/4" recess but I'm trying to get as close as possible. Thank you, Hal


I'm not familiar with the therm "cv flush seats". The dimension I gave is the overall out side distance from where the inner CV bolts to the face. The recess there is to accommodate the seal cup of the inner CV joint. Of the two dimensions one could get the one I gave is the greater of the two.

I'll post some pictures a bit later tonight.


Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
Re: Measurement needed [message #255909 is a reply to message #255881] Sat, 19 July 2014 21:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
midlf is currently offline  midlf   United States
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midlf wrote on Sat, 19 July 2014 17:22
The dimension I gave is the overall out side distance from where the inner CV bolts to the face. The recess there is to accommodate the seal cup of the inner CV joint. Of the two dimensions one could get the one I gave is the greater of the two.

I'll post some pictures a bit later tonight.


Four pictures of the FD flange measurements starting here:


http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/miscellaneous-pictures/p55292-fd-flange-measurements.html

When I was taking the photos I realized I didn't get the dimension exactly correct. It is 21-3/16"


Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
Re: Measurement needed [message #255916 is a reply to message #255909] Sat, 19 July 2014 22:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hal StClair   United States
Messages: 971
Registered: March 2013
Location: Rio Rancho NM
Karma: -12
Senior Member
Thank you so much Steve,that's perfect. I owe you one.
Hal


"I enjoy talking to you. Your mind appeals to me. It resembles my own mind, except you happen to be insane." 1977 Royale 101348, 1977 Royale 101586, Diesel powered, 1974 Eagle Bus 45',w/slideout, Rio Rancho, NM
Re: Measurement needed [message #255928 is a reply to message #255916] Sun, 20 July 2014 04:51 Go to previous message
midlf is currently offline  midlf   United States
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Hal StClair wrote on Sat, 19 July 2014 22:30
Thank you so much Steve,that's perfect. I owe you one.
Hal


Yeah it helps to have spare parts laying around, even if they do take up space. If you need a more accurate number I can drag the spare FD off the shelf and set it up on the bench. However there is a lot of play in the inner CV joint to cover for any small difference. That CV appears to have been made to work with 70's automotive production tolerances. <GRIN>


Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
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