Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website
| [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251776] |
Sun, 08 June 2014 19:35  |
Kimberlea Weeks
Messages: 675
Registered: July 2010
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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We are pleased to announce that we have added the materials from the GMCMI
Flashdrive to the GMCMI website. We invite you to check out this ongoing
selection of information. Check it out at:
http://www.gmcmi.com/technical-information-2/
Some of the items include the GMCMH Suppliers, Service & Repair and
Publications Listing, Parts, Operators, Maintenance, Manuals, Wiring
Diagrams, Structural Drawings, Factory Service, Recall Bulletins plus much
more.
We thank all of the contributors that took the time to scan and share these
great tools for all of us to utilize while keeping our coaches on the road.
We welcome all historical and technical information. If there is something
that you would like to share, please contact kimweeksgmc@gmail.com.
Thank you!
--
*Kimberlea Weeks*
VP Administration and Convention Manager
612.501.4600 | f.866.519.0047 | www.gmcmi.com
*GMC Motorhomes International*
1402 So. Cage Blvd | Unit 273 | Pharr | TX 78577
*Mark this on your calendar today!*
*GMCMI 2014 Fall Convention* | Friday, September 26 to Thursday, October 2
Northern Wisconsin State Fairgrounds | Chippewa Falls, Wisconsin
*GMCMI 2015 Spring Convention* | Friday, March 27 to Thursday, April 2
Kemper Williams Park & Patterson Area Civic Center | Patterson, Louisiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251782 is a reply to message #251776] |
Sun, 08 June 2014 20:20  |
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Hi Kim
What is the use of copying my web site and presenting it as your own? You
could just have easily linked to what is already out there.
Same goes for the supplier list you announced a while back. It is but an
out of date copy of what I've had up there for many years.
What gives? Are you planning to copy all the GMC web sites or just mine?
bdub
-----Original Message-----
From: On Behalf Of Kimberlea Weeks
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 7:35 PM
We are pleased to announce that we have added the materials from the GMCMI
Flashdrive to the GMCMI website. We invite you to check out this ongoing
selection of information. Check it out at:
http://www.gmcmi.com/technical-information-2/
Some of the items include the GMCMH Suppliers, Service & Repair and
Publications Listing, Parts, Operators, Maintenance, Manuals, Wiring
Diagrams, Structural Drawings, Factory Service, Recall Bulletins plus much
more.
We thank all of the contributors that took the time to scan and share these
great tools for all of us to utilize while keeping our coaches on the road.
We welcome all historical and technical information. If there is something
that you would like to share, please contact kimweeksgmc@gmail.com.
Thank you!
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bdub
bdub.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251784 is a reply to message #251782] |
Sun, 08 June 2014 20:43 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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Billy
She did not copy your website. Much of what she is using is from my collection of files. You might recall that I had the original books from GM that I purchased in 1981. In fact, I sent many of the books to you for you to scan to pdf files for your website many years ago including the Parts Book, Maintenance Manuals, Dealer Bulletins and Recall Manual and others.. The air conditioning, furnace, Onan and refrigerator manuals and several of the Owner's Manuals that she is using also came from me.
Emery Stora
On Jun 8, 2014, at 7:20 PM, Billy Massey wrote:
> Hi Kim
>
> What is the use of copying my web site and presenting it as your own? You
> could just have easily linked to what is already out there.
>
> Same goes for the supplier list you announced a while back. It is but an
> out of date copy of what I've had up there for many years.
>
> What gives? Are you planning to copy all the GMC web sites or just mine?
>
> bdub
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: On Behalf Of Kimberlea Weeks
> Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 7:35 PM
>
> We are pleased to announce that we have added the materials from the GMCMI
> Flashdrive to the GMCMI website. We invite you to check out this ongoing
> selection of information. Check it out at:
> http://www.gmcmi.com/technical-information-2/
>
> Some of the items include the GMCMH Suppliers, Service & Repair and
> Publications Listing, Parts, Operators, Maintenance, Manuals, Wiring
> Diagrams, Structural Drawings, Factory Service, Recall Bulletins plus much
> more.
>
> We thank all of the contributors that took the time to scan and share these
> great tools for all of us to utilize while keeping our coaches on the road.
> We welcome all historical and technical information. If there is something
> that you would like to share, please contact kimweeksgmc@gmail.com.
>
> Thank you!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251796 is a reply to message #251784] |
Sun, 08 June 2014 22:27 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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emerystora wrote on Sun, 08 June 2014 19:43Billy
She did not copy your website. Much of what she is using is from my collection of files. You might recall that I had the original books from GM that I purchased in 1981. In fact, I sent many of the books to you for you to scan to pdf files for your website many years ago including the Parts Book, Maintenance Manuals, Dealer Bulletins and Recall Manual and others.. The air conditioning, furnace, Onan and refrigerator manuals and several of the Owner's Manuals that she is using also came from me.
Emery Stora
On Jun 8, 2014, at 7:20 PM, Billy Massey wrote:
> Hi Kim
>
> What is the use of copying my web site and presenting it as your own? You
> could just have easily linked to what is already out there.
>
> Same goes for the supplier list you announced a while back. It is but an
> out of date copy of what I've had up there for many years.
>
> What gives? Are you planning to copy all the GMC web sites or just mine?
>
> bdub
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: On Behalf Of Kimberlea Weeks
> Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 7:35 PM
>
> We are pleased to announce that we have added the materials from the GMCMI
> Flashdrive to the GMCMI website. We invite you to check out this ongoing
> selection of information. Check it out at:
> http://www.gmcmi.com/technical-information-2/
>
> Some of the items include the GMCMH Suppliers, Service & Repair and
> Publications Listing, Parts, Operators, Maintenance, Manuals, Wiring
> Diagrams, Structural Drawings, Factory Service, Recall Bulletins plus much
> more.
>
> We thank all of the contributors that took the time to scan and share these
> great tools for all of us to utilize while keeping our coaches on the road.
> We welcome all historical and technical information. If there is something
> that you would like to share, please contact kimweeksgmc@gmail.com.
>
> Thank you!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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OH OH !
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251808 is a reply to message #251784] |
Mon, 09 June 2014 06:38 |
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Oh yes, she copied the files from my website, Emery.
Some of my collection did indeed come from material you loaned. I scanned
and returned those few miscellaneous manuals and documents and thanked you
for their use. Emery, your memory is failing. You are wrong on most of the
documents you mentioned. The parts book was scanned by a person up in New
York. That was the start of the project. I ran that 550 page manual
through OCR and hyperlinked it. My X7525 is now bound loose leaf because it
has had the spine cut off it. I borrowed the original Onan Manuals from a
local owner who found them at a garage sale. I scanned and returned them
promptly. This material came from several people from all over the country.
But where the files originated is not the point. The fact that she is
blatantly copying files from my site and presenting them as her or GMCMI's
own compilation is bothersome. I do not know of another instance of this
happening among our group. We link to each other's files. Same goes for
the supplier listing she copied recently. I put in many years of work
getting all this information together and putting it online. It is not
right that someone would present it as their own on another site.
She asked me for an updated supplier listing a while back and I welcomed her
to link to mine as it was recently updated. I suppose the fact that I used
part of it in the GMCMI Parts Interchange made her think that it was now
GMCMI property. Same deal for the manuals since I gave you permission to
use the files on a flash drive. She recently notified me of an incorrect a
link to one of the manuals, I now presume while preparing to present it as
her own.
I believe you and Kim grossly over stepping your bounds, Emery. Please have
her to remove any files available on bdub.net from the GMCMI web site. Same
goes for the files robbed from Western States. I'll expect them to be gone
by noon today.
bdub
www.bdub.net/manuals
-----Original Message-----
From: On Behalf Of Emery Stora
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 8:44 PM
Billy
She did not copy your website. Much of what she is using is from my
collection of files. You might recall that I had the original books from GM
that I purchased in 1981. In fact, I sent many of the books to you for you
to scan to pdf files for your website many years ago including the Parts
Book, Maintenance Manuals, Dealer Bulletins and Recall Manual and others..
The air conditioning, furnace, Onan and refrigerator manuals and several of
the Owner's Manuals that she is using also came from me.
Emery Stora
On Jun 8, 2014, at 7:20 PM, Billy Massey wrote:
> Hi Kim
>
> What is the use of copying my web site and presenting it as your own?
> You could just have easily linked to what is already out there.
>
> Same goes for the supplier list you announced a while back. It is but
> an out of date copy of what I've had up there for many years.
>
> What gives? Are you planning to copy all the GMC web sites or just mine?
>
> bdub
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: On Behalf Of Kimberlea Weeks
> Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 7:35 PM
>
> We are pleased to announce that we have added the materials from the
> GMCMI Flashdrive to the GMCMI website. We invite you to check out this
> ongoing selection of information. Check it out at:
> http://www.gmcmi.com/technical-information-2/
>
> Some of the items include the GMCMH Suppliers, Service & Repair and
> Publications Listing, Parts, Operators, Maintenance, Manuals, Wiring
> Diagrams, Structural Drawings, Factory Service, Recall Bulletins plus
> much more.
>
> We thank all of the contributors that took the time to scan and share
> these great tools for all of us to utilize while keeping our coaches on
the road.
> We welcome all historical and technical information. If there is
> something that you would like to share, please contact
kimweeksgmc@gmail.com.
>
> Thank you!
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bdub
bdub.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251813 is a reply to message #251808] |
Mon, 09 June 2014 08:59 |
Olly Schmidt
Messages: 1265
Registered: February 2014
Location: Germany and Scottsville, ...
Karma: 8
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Senior Member |
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My 0.02$ on this:
Backups of the original PDFs around the net are great.
Presenting stuff as ones own while it is not, is bad.
Linking to the original source of information is proper policy.
If/When stuff comes unavailable at the original location, one shall be
free to present it on ones own site, always making sure to reference the
original source.
Providing manuals to be scanned in is a very nice gesture. Scanning that
stuff in, is a *great* service for everybody.
I have no idea, and no inclination to dig into to find it out, but I am
sure that people that are involved know who the person was that scanned
manuals in. That person should always be referenced no matter what.
Linking to the source is always the best, instead of copying and
presenting it as own material.
Back to lurk-mode.
--
Best regards
Peer Oliver Schmidt
PGP Key ID: 0x83E1C2EA
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Best regards
Olly Schmidt
PGP Key ID: 0x18a9 3a1f 4196 bf22
'76a Eleganza II, VA
'73 Sequoia, SH, Germany
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251861 is a reply to message #251813] |
Mon, 09 June 2014 21:20 |
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Goodness, it seems that someone has punched the hornets nest and they've done it in a public way. It kind of reminds me of the remarks that came after the last race of this year's triple crown. Do I sense some jealousy in the air?
OK. Let's really be correct about this. GMC and other companies are responsible for originating the documentation in question. Sure, it may be out of copyright by now but, to be honest, the real work was started by those companies and the individuals tasked with creating it -- the verbiage and the drawings.
So, when someone comes along and scans the works to make them available with or without the permission of the developers of the material, things start to get foggy. That it is hosted on a website or two is the expense of individuals or organizations that are being reimbursed for some of the effort.
Now, let's look at the source of all this confusion. Who owns the information? That's my first question. My next question is this: Is someone offended that they aren't getting the attention they desire? Then, a third question comes to my mind. Who should keep this information alive for the next thirty years, and individual or an organization? All in all, this seems to have turned into a turf war of sorts. For sure, it's an ugly airing of dirty laundry that should have been handled differently.
In one corner we have Billy Massey who has invested time in getting information to the web. Along the way Billy has collected a few shekels from the fan base. In the other corner we have Kim Weaks representing GMCMI. She's being supported, apparently, by Emery Stora who is also well respected. Interestingly enough, however, is that Billy and Kim are both paid nicely for doing separate jobs for GMCMI. Above all, these individuals are doing it for the GMC community; or are they doing it for their own egotistical gain? Before throwing a bunch of punches it is my suggestion that all involved have some wine and then get together on a call to work things out. It is obvious that it's gotten to an emotional level and when things get to that level it becomes very difficult to be calm and rational. One thing I believe the GMC community doesn't need is finger pointing.
Speaking personally, I was approached by Billy to put an data management system I developed on the thumb drive. Honestly, I drug my feet on this project and didn't grant permission. I'm glad I didn't. The thumb drive turned into a semi-commercial product and it's unclear as to who is ultimately responsible for that product or who authorized it's development. It seems to be yet another mud puddle on the GMC infobahn.
Peer Oliver Schmidt wrote on Mon, 09 June 2014 09:59My 0.02$ on this:
Backups of the original PDFs around the net are great.
Presenting stuff as ones own while it is not, is bad.
Linking to the original source of information is proper policy.
If/When stuff comes unavailable at the original location, one shall be
free to present it on ones own site, always making sure to reference the
original source.
Providing manuals to be scanned in is a very nice gesture. Scanning that
stuff in, is a *great* service for everybody.
I have no idea, and no inclination to dig into to find it out, but I am
sure that people that are involved know who the person was that scanned
manuals in. That person should always be referenced no matter what.
Linking to the source is always the best, instead of copying and
presenting it as own material.
Back to lurk-mode.
--
Best regards
Peer Oliver Schmidt
PGP Key ID: 0x83E1C2EA
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Flashdrive Materials Added to the GMCMI Website [message #251876 is a reply to message #251865] |
Tue, 10 June 2014 08:11 |
Kingsley Coach
Messages: 2691
Registered: March 2009
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Karma: -34
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Senior Member |
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"Interestingly enough, however, is that Billy and Kim are both paid nicely
for doing separate jobs for GMCMI." *
Let's just hope the salaries paid to all the members of GMCMI do not total
an amount greater than what Ralph Luby was being paid.
He was criticized for drawing a salary and not having adequate personality
at rallies.
I remember what I would consider his most unfair ousting.
* Songer, Byron, gmclist, June 9th,2014
Mike in NS
On Mon, Jun 9, 2014 at 11:44 PM, Charles Wood wrote:
> This is the same thing I ran into when presenting the OnLine Parts site to
> GMCMI.
> I freely offered my site/time/etc for GMCMI to use as well as the general
> GMCMH public to use for the information and capabilities.
> Upon trying to work with GMCMI, only a couple of people were against it
> because they wanted GMCMI to do it.This site is not a simple thing that you
> can do online with a copy of site to 'build your own'. BDub & I
> collaborated together to have our sites co-exist, ie: I would link to his
> site for
> some of the information he already had there and maintained and He
> likewise.
>
> Some of the samples of what GMCMI was going to do that were shown to me
> sure seemed to have the same layout and function of the OLP site that they
> were going to do themselves(I still have the printouts).
>
> AS of today, I am retracting the offer for GMCMI to use the OLP site and
> am taking out ALL the GMCMI specific stuff that was involved in setting up
> the 'demo' for GMCMI to see how things would work.
>
> GMCMI members should review what their leadership is doing and see if they
> would condone it.
>
> I will diligently work with anyone who wants to help flesh out the data in
> the OLP to be more current. I do this everyday and am anticipating that
> most of the information that they value higher than the GMC community
> would be available for ALL to use.
>
> Some of the information that I will have/have on the OLP site will be the
> same as that contained in GMCMI's site, the difference is that mine comes
> from public domain information and other gmc'ers. I WILL NOT copy their
> Parts Interchange Guide even though I have it as a member, but I will use it
> to compare to see if I have the same information from public domain
> sources that they have in their 'copyrighted' document which came from the
> GMC
> community. The Parts Interchange Guide is the ONLY document that probably
> meets the guidline for them to call it theirs as I dont know who the
> original author(s) was.
>
> nuf said...
> JMHONM
> --
> CBWood
> 77 Kingslay
> MWC OK
> ONLINE PARTS PROGRAM
> http://cbwoodsr.no-ip.org/GMCParts/index.asp
>
>
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--
Michael Beaton
1977 Kingsley 26-11
1977 Eleganza II 26-3
Antigonish, NS
* This is my second trip through the 60's; the first time the drugs were
better !
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| [GMCnet] GMCMI Paid Contractors [message #251886 is a reply to message #251876] |
Tue, 10 June 2014 10:15 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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It all depends on what is meant by "nicely". When I took the position over from Ralph in 2003 I accepted a 37% "pay cut". However, based on the amount of time I put in I commented that I had not worked for so little per hour since I graduated from college. It was done for the effort to help the club, not the money. In fact it took so much time that after 4 years I suggested that the job be split in two. Billy and Kim also put in many, many hours. What they are being paid as contractors is a bargain for the club. However, the membership has dropped 35% in the last 11 years (still not as big a drop as most clubs) so the pay per member served has increased some. The membership side is paid from the dues but the convention side is self supporting and paid by the convention fees. However, as costs go up and membership declines the budget gets very strained. A big cost is postage and mailing. First class stamps have increased from 37 cents in 2003 to 49 cents in 2014. Th
at is a 37% increase just for mailing costs. The club is constantly looking for ways to save on costs in an effort to not have to increase the dues. For example, members can now get their mailings by email which helps keep some costs down.
Emery Stora
On Jun 10, 2014, at 7:11 AM, Kingsley Coach wrote:
> "Interestingly enough, however, is that Billy and Kim are both paid nicely
> for doing separate jobs for GMCMI." *
>
> Let's just hope the salaries paid to all the members of GMCMI do not total
> an amount greater than what Ralph Luby was being paid.
> He was criticized for drawing a salary and not having adequate personality
> at rallies.
> I remember what I would consider his most unfair ousting.
>
>
> * Songer, Byron, gmclist, June 9th,2014
>
> Mike in NS
>
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMCMI Paid Contractors [message #251899 is a reply to message #251886] |
Tue, 10 June 2014 13:08 |
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My two cents -- by "nicely" I didn't mean "handsomely" or anything else to
make it seem lucrative. I do believe, however, that some have the
impression that some (Billy and Kim) are doing what they do totally as
volunteers without consideration for remuneration. That they are both paid
by GMCMI with a public display of emotion being shown is regrettable. It
is as though we have another civil dispute on our hands when it is unclear
as to who actually owns the information in question. It also seems that
some intentions should have been handled offline and in advance of a
public announcement.
--
Byron Songer
Louisville, KY
Former owner, current admirer
Web guy for -
http://www.gmceast.com
http://www.gmcgreatlakers.org
http://www.songerconsulting.net
ATTENTION: This reply is in reference to what is provided below
> It all depends on what is meant by "nicely". When I took the position
> over from Ralph in 2003 I accepted a 37% "pay cut". However, based on
> the amount of time I put in I commented that I had not worked for so
> little per hour since I graduated from college. It was done for the
> effort to help the club, not the money. In fact it took so much time
> that after 4 years I suggested that the job be split in two. Billy and
> Kim also put in many, many hours. What they are being paid as
> contractors is a bargain for the club. However, the membership has
> dropped 35% in the last 11 years (still not as big a drop as most clubs)
> so the pay per member served has increased some. The membership side is
> paid from the dues but the convention side is self supporting and paid by
> the convention fees. However, as costs go up and membership declines the
> budget gets very strained. A big cost is postage and mailing. First
> class stamps have increased from 37 cents in 2003 to 49 cents in 2014. Th
> at is a 37% increase just for mailing costs. The club is constantly
> looking for ways to save on costs in an effort to not have to increase
> the dues. For example, members can now get their mailings by email which
> helps keep some costs down.
>
> Emery Stora
>
>
> On Jun 10, 2014, at 7:11 AM, Kingsley Coach wrote:
>
>> "Interestingly enough, however, is that Billy and Kim are both paid
>> nicely
>> for doing separate jobs for GMCMI." *
>>
>> Let's just hope the salaries paid to all the members of GMCMI do not
>> total
>> an amount greater than what Ralph Luby was being paid.
>> He was criticized for drawing a salary and not having adequate
>> personality
>> at rallies.
>> I remember what I would consider his most unfair ousting.
>>
>>
>> * Songer, Byron, gmclist, June 9th,2014
>>
>> Mike in NS
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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