| Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241508] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 13:23  |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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My power steering pump is leaking and while I had the front of the engine apart, I thought I'd change it.
The problem is that the Advance auto parts my son runs can't find any of the part numbers in the GMCMI parts list. I called NAPA and asked if they had the NAPA numbers on the list and they don't.
Anyone got a source and/or part number/brand?
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241514 is a reply to message #241508] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 14:08  |
gbarrow2
Messages: 765
Registered: February 2004
Location: Lake Almanor, Ca./ Red Bl...
Karma: 3
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Kerry,
Even if you go to a GM dealer with the numbers from the 78Z parts book or the GMCMI parts exchange book they won't find a number to cross to.
O'riellys has # 20-6883 (includes Reservoir) for a 76 Toronado- I just put one on along with a new steering gear box #27-7519. I'm not happy with the results yet after 350 miles.
See my posts from a couple of days ago with questiios about the pump.
I suspect, but no body seems to know, that the Toronado pump is under powered for the gearbox and additional weight of the MOHO.
Hopefully you, we will get more info.
You may be better off rebuilding/resealing the pump you have.
Gene Barrow
Lake Almanor, Ca.
1976 Palm Beach
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241516 is a reply to message #241514] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 14:40 |
Keith V
Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN
Karma: 0
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| gbarrow wrote on Wed, 26 February 2014 14:08 |
Kerry,
Even if you go to a GM dealer with the numbers from the 78Z parts book or the GMCMI parts exchange book they won't find a number to cross to.
O'riellys has # 20-6883 (includes Reservoir) for a 76 Toronado- I just put one on along with a new steering gear box #27-7519. I'm not happy with the results yet after 350 miles.
See my posts from a couple of days ago with questiios about the pump.
I suspect, but no body seems to know, that the Toronado pump is under powered for the gearbox and additional weight of the MOHO.
Hopefully you, we will get more info.
You may be better off rebuilding/resealing the pump you have.
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Make sure you use the pressure valve from the original pump.
It has the right size, meaning bigger, orifice for good boost.
I have tried drilling out the orifice a bit bigger and it didn't get any better.
I'll try and remember to post the desired orifice size when I get home tonight
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241520 is a reply to message #241514] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 14:44 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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| gbarrow wrote on Wed, 26 February 2014 14:08 |
...
I suspect, but no body seems to know, that the Toronado pump is under powered for the gearbox and additional weight of the MOHO.
Hopefully you, we will get more info.
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My first mistake was assuming a 77 Toro pump was the correct one. Looks the same but won't fit in the brackets.
| gbarrow wrote on Wed, 26 February 2014 14:08 |
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You may be better off rebuilding/resealing the pump you have.
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You may be right.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241528 is a reply to message #241508] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 16:14 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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Thanks Keith. So if I want LESS power assist, can I address this by a smaller orifice? I wouldn't mind a little road feel at speed and can handle a bit more effort in parking lots. Now I can basically steer with one finger from zero to max speed.
BTW a Cardone 206800 is the right bolt pattern for our brackets. It came from a 77 Chevy 1 ton. Have no idea about the orifice yet. I kept my old one and will investigate.
O-Reillys has the Cardone 20-8726 which is a number in the parts list. They can have it here tomorrow.
Wonder if I can find the specifications somewhere?
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241529 is a reply to message #241520] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 16:15 |
gbarrow2
Messages: 765
Registered: February 2004
Location: Lake Almanor, Ca./ Red Bl...
Karma: 3
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Kerry,
Before you change the pump look at message #204417 40/08/2013.
I started the thread and got feed back from several people about the steering pumps, shims and variable pressure.
If we can get some help from someone who knows these systems ; you can avoid the grief I'm going through and we can both get the mysterious power steering pump issue resolved.
It wasn't clear to me at the time where the shims were located and it is still unclear whether adding or removing shims will have a desired effect.
From Chuck Boyd's post I gathered that the shims were under the high pressure fitting on the back of the reservoir. My original and neither of the 2 new rebuilt pumps have shims under that fitting.
I have 2 of the high pressure fittings and relief valves removed from the pumps. The valves are not the same. Each of the valves have a 7/16 hex plug/cap fitted in the end of the valve that the spring fits onto. The center surface of the "plug" is concave. One of the "plugs" has a ~1/8" dia. hole in the bottom of the concave depression. The other "plug" has no hole.
The valve with the hole in the plug has a shim between the valve body and the plug. The other valve has no shim but there is a small gap between the valve body and the plug.
I haven't yet been able to separate the plug from the valve body- I cant grip the valve tightly enough with channel locks to hold it when twisting the 7/16 hex plug. I don't want to damage the valve in case I need to use one to make my new pump work properly.
The maint. manual (Thank you Rob M.) lists a procedure for testing steering pumps and gear boxes for proper pressure. It requires hydraulic lines and gauges which are available, but expensive. Non of the automotive shops around my small town have the equipment. They just change out a malfunctioning pump.
I have done that- twice. So far the replacements are worse than the original and I didn't like it.
Surely some one out there knows the answers and can tell us how to fix the problem instead of just changing pumps till we find one that works properly.
Awaiting informed replies.
Gene Barrow
Lake Almanor, Ca.
1976 Palm Beach
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241586 is a reply to message #241529] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 19:49 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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| gbarrow wrote on Wed, 26 February 2014 16:15 |
Kerry,
Before you change the pump look at message #204417 40/08/2013.
I started the thread and got feed back from several people about the steering pumps, shims and variable pressure....
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Got a link? I can't find it.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241596 is a reply to message #241586] |
Wed, 26 February 2014 21:09 |
gbarrow2
Messages: 765
Registered: February 2004
Location: Lake Almanor, Ca./ Red Bl...
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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Kerry,
Link to beginning of last year's thread.
http://gmc.mybirdfeeder.net/GMCforum/index.php?t=tree&goto=204017&rid=267#msg_204017
After you posted the 2 part numbers earlier, I went to O'Rielly's they have a 20-6800 in stock. But of course no one there knows the difference between that pump and 20-6883 that I already have installed.
They gave me a number for A1-Cardone tech support 888-280-8324. To late to call today. Tomorrow maybe we can discover which pump will work on the GMC and why.
The concave section the pressure relief valve that I described earlier is actually a small wire mesh screen. Younger eyes and better light discovered that.
Ya gotta wonder what the rebuilder checks if they send out valves with screens so crudded up that it looks like solid metal.
Regarding the orifice size mentioned by Kieth- I have two high pressure fittings; a 9/64 drill(.140625 in) passes through one easily but gets stuck part way in the other.
A 1/8 drill (.0125 in) passes easily through the fitting with the smaller orifice. So there is variation in the fittings that appear to be identical.
Hope we both get our answers tomorrow. I only want to R&R the pump once more. Third time's the charm!
Hopefully you will only get the pleasure once.
Gene Barrow
Lake Almanor, Ca.
1976 Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241680 is a reply to message #241637] |
Thu, 27 February 2014 16:47 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I know nearly nothing about the subject, but it's not logical to me that
reducing the flow in our system (don't care about rack & pinions) could
have ANY beneficial effect. The steering box has a BIG piston in it; it's
not going to like starving for fluid and will probably slow way down in
protest -- perhaps dangerously so.
Now pressure's a different matter. If there's a way to maintain flow, I'd
expect steering force to be directly proportional to pressure.
JMHO, with no expertise nor data to support it
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Thu, Feb 27, 2014 at 11:17 AM, gene barrow wrote:
>
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> Kerry,
> Check this link- Turn One can supply a pressure line fitting with a .093
> orifice for your pump.
>
>
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> http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/ccrp_1304_gm_power_steering_secrets/photo_03.html
>
> I talked to tech support at Cardone - no help with pump specifications or
> matching pump to steering box.
>
> Maybe your email requests will get a better response.
> --
> Gene Barrow
> Lake Almanor, Ca.
> 1976 Palm Beach
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Can't find a power steering pump at local auto stores...help [message #241689 is a reply to message #241508] |
Thu, 27 February 2014 17:54 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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Both my old (original I believe) pump and the new Cardone 20-6800 have a .140 orifice. I'm going to install the new one and see how it does. I kept the old one also. Never got a response from Cardone....disappointing...they failed the customer service test...no response in 24 hours.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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