| Entry Door [message #230292] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 12:05  |
tgeiger
Messages: 518
Registered: February 2006
Location: kansas city
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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Ok, I'm going to tackle the entry door issue. Starting my winter projects already on the old girl. Right now the bottom of the door dosn't seem to seal properly to the frame. I've replace the panel (wood) for the second time now. I know that there is a write up on correcting the middle age spread for it, and also possibly replacing the original gasket around the door with a new one. The question I have is I've seen a couple versions of methods to correct the middle age spread problem. Is there any one method that is the best to do?
Tom Geiger
76 Eleganza II
KCMO
[Updated on: Tue, 19 November 2013 12:06] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230318 is a reply to message #230317] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 14:33  |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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| ljdavick wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 13:17 |
I had always thought that the bulkheads offered support for the roof. But that doesn't make sense if you look at a trans mode.
Do the bulkheads really help hold up the roof?
Larry Davick
> On Nov 19, 2013, at 10:55 AM, David H. Jarvis <jarvis210@shaw.ca> wrote:
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>
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> Some people would bend the door to match the coach. I would rather fix the problem of the sagging body. There are a couple ways of doing it.
>
> --
> "I've always been crazy, but it kept me from going insane"
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I think there is enough room between the bulkheads and the roof to still allow the roof to sag a bit. However, they can be used to help support the whole shell if they are tied in more than originally designed. The whole shape of the coach gets sort of squashed and by pulling in the sides, the roof will probably go back up a bit.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: Entry Door [message #230331 is a reply to message #230292] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 16:28 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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| tgeiger wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 12:05 |
Ok, I'm going to tackle the entry door issue. Starting my winter projects already on the old girl. Right now the bottom of the door dosn't seem to seal properly to the frame. I've replace the panel (wood) for the second time now. I know that there is a write up on correcting the middle age spread for it, and also possibly replacing the original gasket around the door with a new one. The question I have is I've seen a couple versions of methods to correct the middle age spread problem. Is there any one method that is the best to do?
|
J Harper's album should help understand the effects of body sag on door fit -- and he includes links to other resources..
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g3754-securing-the-bath-module-and-it-s-benefits.html
Dennis
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: Entry Door [message #230333 is a reply to message #230292] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 16:55 |
bryant374
Messages: 563
Registered: May 2004
Location: Pleasant Valley, NY 12569
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Entry Door
Tue, 19 November 2013 13:05
tgeiger
Ok, I'm going to tackle the entry door issue. Starting my winter projects already on the old girl. Right now the bottom of the door dosn't seem to seal properly to the frame. I've replace the panel (wood) for the second time now. I know that there is a write up on correcting the middle age spread for it, and also possibly replacing the original gasket around the door with a new one. The question I have is I've seen a couple versions of methods to correct the middle age spread problem. Is there any one method that is the best to do?
>
>
Yes there is more than one way to get a good door fit. The factory fix can be found at: Dealer service Technical Bulletin #75-TM-19, the links here show that bulletin:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/miscellaneous-bryant-stuff/p31970-entrance-door-fit-ser.html
and
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/miscellaneous-bryant-stuff/p31971-service-bulletin-75-tm.html
I formed my door using the factory method about 15 years ago and the fit has held all this time and still seals well.
If you use the method of straighting the body side structure, I believe it must be secured (bolted/strapped)in place so it doesn't relax back to the sag position.
In the past I measured the side contours of many coaches at rallies with a plywood form I made to the body design contour, measuring at 3 points, each side. Front body seam, center by door and rear body seam.
My general findings were:
1973 models had the most serious deviations from design.
1974 models were slightly better.
1975,6&7 getting better than earlier models.
1978 models had the least of any other year and were generally quite good.
A larger sample size may have helped to be more specific but by the time I did close to 100 coaches I lost interest since I was only doing this for my own amazement.
other stuff:
high mileage did not indicate a difference.
load on roof (ACs or pod)did not indicate a difference.
Both sides of body (r or L) usually did not indicate a difference, my thought was the door might have weakened that sides structure, I could not prove that.
Bill Bryant
PO 1976~PB (owned 34 years)
1914 Ford (owned 70 years)
1965 Corvette (owned 39 years)
GMC Motorhome History
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230340 is a reply to message #230338] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 18:12 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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| emerystora wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 17:53 |
I came up with a fairly easy solution 15 or so years ago and I coined the term "middle age spread". (no, I didn't copyright that term ( .
Gene Fisher posted the information to his site. http://gmcmotorhome.info/spread.html
Emery Stora
On Nov 19, 2013, at 3:28 PM, Dennis Sexton <dennisfsexton@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> tgeiger wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 12:05
>> Ok, I'm going to tackle the entry door issue. Starting my winter projects already on the old girl. Right now the bottom of the door dosn't seem to seal properly to the frame. I've replace the panel (wood) for the second time now. I know that there is a write up on correcting the middle age spread for it, and also possibly replacing the original gasket around the door with a new one. The question I have is I've seen a couple versions of methods to correct the middle age spread problem. Is there any one method that is the best to do?
>
>
> J Harper's album should help understand the effects of body sag on door fit -- and he includes links to other resources..
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g3754-securing-the-bath-module-and-it-s-benefits.html
>
> Dennis
> --
> Dennis S
> 73 Painted Desert 230
> Germantown, TN
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Emery
Thank you for posting the link -- John credited you on his photo album and included a link to gene's site -- but gene has since established a new website --
and John is no longer with us to edit his album.
Dennis
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230344 is a reply to message #230340] |
Tue, 19 November 2013 18:30 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I had never seen John's writeup before. He did a good job with the photos.
Emery Stora
On Nov 19, 2013, at 5:12 PM, Dennis Sexton <dennisfsexton@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> emerystora wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 17:53
>> I came up with a fairly easy solution 15 or so years ago and I coined the term "middle age spread". (no, I didn't copyright that term (:).
>> Gene Fisher posted the information to his site. http://gmcmotorhome.info/spread.html
>>
>> Emery Stora
>>
>> On Nov 19, 2013, at 3:28 PM, Dennis Sexton <dennisfsexton@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> tgeiger wrote on Tue, 19 November 2013 12:05
>>>> Ok, I'm going to tackle the entry door issue. Starting my winter projects already on the old girl. Right now the bottom of the door dosn't seem to seal properly to the frame. I've replace the panel (wood) for the second time now. I know that there is a write up on correcting the middle age spread for it, and also possibly replacing the original gasket around the door with a new one. The question I have is I've seen a couple versions of methods to correct the middle age spread problem. Is there any one method that is the best to do?
>>>
>>>
>>> J Harper's album should help understand the effects of body sag on door fit -- and he includes links to other resources..
>>>
>>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g3754-securing-the-bath-module-and-it-s-benefits.html
>>>
>>> Dennis
>>> --
>>> Dennis S
>>> 73 Painted Desert 230
>>> Germantown, TN
>
>
> Emery
> Thank you for posting the link -- John credited you on his photo album and included a link to gene's site -- but gene has since established a new website --
> and John is no longer with us to edit his album.
>
> Dennis
> --
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| Re: Entry Door [message #230458 is a reply to message #230292] |
Wed, 20 November 2013 12:04 |
tgeiger
Messages: 518
Registered: February 2006
Location: kansas city
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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Thanks to all for your help on this. Looks like I got to take a trip to harbor freight for a pipe clamp. In my brief reading of this, it looks like I go through the jamb alignment first and then if the door needs it I go through the GM write up on correcting the door shape. Does that sound correct to you guys?
Tom Geiger
76 Eleganza II
KCMO
[Updated on: Wed, 20 November 2013 12:04] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230498 is a reply to message #230458] |
Wed, 20 November 2013 14:42 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
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Depending on how much of which kind of adjustment you need there are a few options. If the door has the same curvature as the body on the hinge side but needs to come in or out at top or bottom the holes in the door shell can be slotted with a spinning burr tool. If the door contour is the same as body on hinge side but not same on latch side then the door will likely need to be re arced.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Nov 20, 2013, at 10:04 AM, tom geiger <tgeiger@burnsmcd.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Thanks to all for your help on this. Looks like I got to take a trip to harbor freight for a pipe clamp. In my brief reading of this, it looks like I go through the jamb alignment first and then if the door needs it I go through the GM write up on correcting the door shape. Does that sound correct to you guys?
> _______________________________________________
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230615 is a reply to message #230498] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 04:14 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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I once watched Jim Bounds bend one back into shape by hand with nit tools at an Eastern States rally. It took him less than 5 minutes.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230636 is a reply to message #230615] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 08:35 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
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Please elaborate on that Ken.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Nov 21, 2013, at 2:14 AM, Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> I once watched Jim Bounds bend one back into shape by hand with nit tools at an Eastern States rally. It took him less than 5 minutes.
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230650 is a reply to message #230636] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 09:53 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Jim pulled a picnic table over next to the coach and stood on it. He proceeded to hold the door in the middle and forced the top in place. After that he got the top to fit perfectly he got off of the table and did the same for the bottom.
He had to open and close the door a few times while doing it checking that the seal was making correct contact all the way around. If it didn't fit he bent the door a little more.
That was all there was to it. I hope I did not give away a trade secret. It took him about 5 minutes.
| sgltrac wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 08:35 |
Please elaborate on that Ken.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
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Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Entry Door [message #230658 is a reply to message #230650] |
Thu, 21 November 2013 10:26 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
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There are no trade secrets. He re arced the door on the latch side. I believe the flattening of the door on the latch side is likely from the door swinging open un checked to slap against the body thus flattening the door arc on the latch side.
Todd Sullivan
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
> On Nov 21, 2013, at 7:53 AM, Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> Jim pulled a picnic table over next to the coach and stood on it. He proceeded to hold the door in the middle and forced the top in place. After that he got the top to fit perfectly he got off of the table and did the same for the bottom.
>
> He had to open and close the door a few times while doing it checking that the seal was making correct contact all the way around. If it didn't fit he bent the door a little more.
>
> That was all there was to it. I hope I did not give away a trade secret. It took him about 5 minutes.
>
>
>
> sgltrac wrote on Thu, 21 November 2013 08:35
>> Please elaborate on that Ken.
>>
>> Todd Sullivan
>>
>> Sully
>> 77 royale
>> Seattle
>
>
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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