Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Frame Bolts:
| Frame Bolts: [message #204414] |
Thu, 11 April 2013 22:13  |
noi
Messages: 293
Registered: October 2010
Location: South of Fremont
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Greetings:
I have an esoteric question regarding some frame bolt “features”, that will most likely be of little interest to the general community, but here goes….
The five (of six) 1/2 x 1-1/4 bolts (used in nearly all frame bolt locations), that hold the frame to the front clip, each have a SPACER under them that does not “appear” to serve any purpose other than to keep the nut from seating more than ~3/4 threads showing.
The bolts at the “cross members”, which would appear to be as “thick” as the frame to front clip would be, have ~ 4/5 threads showing and that does not appear to be a “problem”.
I have all the correct bolt sizes and spacers for replacement, but was just curios why GMC would have thought the spacers (additional expense) were necessary in the first place, rather than just the washers and more threads showing – The spacers also appear to be about the same diameter as the washers used, so it doesn’t seem to be for load distribution.
Like I said, just a curious esoteric questions to see if anyone had some insight as to why GMC felt they were needed – Thanks for any thoughts you can share!
Carl P.
76 Birchaven
South of Fremont
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Frame Bolts: [message #204425 is a reply to message #204414] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 05:39  |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
>five of six
Perhaps it was the answer to an assembly-line setup to have all the bolts the same?
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204431 is a reply to message #204414] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 08:00 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Carl,
Washers are used to spread the load of a bolt or nut over a larger area and prevent damage to the material being secured. There is serious loading where the frame and front clip are bolted together. The SAE washers that are used everywhere else on the frame are pretty flimsy as washers go and wouldn't hold up to the stresses involved. I don't think that the amount of exposed thread was much of a consideration in this part of the design. I intend to put those spacers back in when I re-attach my front clip.
Another bolt size curiosity (at least to me) are the 9/16 bolts used to secure the shocks to the frame. On my coach, roughly half of the contact area between the bolt and shock sleeve is on threaded bolt. There are thread marks cut into the insides of all the shock sleeves. The only reasons for this that I could think of is that they didn't want to use a longer bolt with more threads protruding. Thread length on a standard bolt is a multiple of the diameter so it would require making a non-standard bolt to avoid thread protrusion and get full contact with the shock sleeve. I intend to use longer bolts to get more contact area between the sleeve and the bolt. Just for bling I'll add an extra nut to protect the exposed threads.
JP
>________________________________
> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 11:13 PM
>Subject: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>
>
>Greetings:
>
>I have an esoteric question regarding some frame bolt “features”, that will most likely be of little interest to the general community, but here goes….
>
>The five (of six) 1/2 x 1-1/4 bolts (used in nearly all frame bolt locations), that hold the frame to the front clip, each have a SPACER under them that does not “appear” to serve any purpose other than to keep the nut from seating more than ~3/4 threads showing.
>
>The bolts at the “cross members”, which would appear to be as “thick” as the frame to front clip would be, have ~ 4/5 threads showing and that does not appear to be a “problem”.
>
>I have all the correct bolt sizes and spacers for replacement, but was just curios why GMC would have thought the spacers (additional expense) were necessary in the first place, rather than just the washers and more threads showing – The spacers also appear to be about the same diameter as the washers used, so it doesn’t seem to be for load distribution.
>
>Like I said, just a curious esoteric questions to see if anyone had some insight as to why GMC felt they were needed – Thanks for any thoughts you can share!
>
>Carl P.
>76 Birchaven
>South of Fremont
>
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: Frame Bolts: [message #204450 is a reply to message #204414] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 11:43 |
noi
Messages: 293
Registered: October 2010
Location: South of Fremont
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Greetings:
RC,
I should have said all “six” – Five bolts are 1-1/4 (“standard”) and the sixth bolt is 1-1/2 (the one that goes in the front of the front hold down clamp), and has a spacer under it as well.
JP,
Could be a loading issue as the spacer is against the inner frame (front clip), but GMC still used a washer on top of it and at the bolt head (frame) as well – But on the other hand, the bogie is under some pretty serious stress as well and GMC used just bolts & washer there – Though it may be a “thickness/stress” issue – The bogie area is pretty well “beefed” up whereas the front clip area is not – Maybe the spacers add “thickness” – Not sure, but just curious
Yes, I noticed the shock mount bolt size issue as well, but from a different perspective – At some point in time, “someone” must have been negligent in not unloading the air bags prior to raising the frame – All four shock mounts have been “pucker dimpled” [is that a real term  ] resulting in the bolts having a slight downward tilt.
I made up four 3/8 steel backing plates, that accommodate both bolts and now the 9/16 bolts are nearly “straight” – But try and find a grade 8 9/16 bolt at Home Depot  – Had to special order the longer ones I needed!
It will be interesting to see how you do your setup – I was wondering about all the “threads” under the shock sleeve as well.
Carl P.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204454 is a reply to message #204450] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 12:48 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Carl,
Thanks for the info about the 1-1/2" bolt. I failed to record that info during teardown.
Good point about the bogies. They mount on the outer frame and underneath on the ladder frame. This gives it much more structural stability.
HD, Lowes, Auto parts stores etc etc generally stink for buying bolts & nuts. Even when they carry what you want they are often out of stock. My local Fastenal store has much better selection and can get it pretty quickly if they don't have it. Go to their website and search for a location using your zipcode. McMaster Carr also works for those hard to find parts.
By shock mounts, I assume you mean the thick metal bracket that mounts to the frame. Mine don't sit flush on the frame. I did put a washer on the back side. Not sure if pucker dimpled is the right term but it ought to be applicable to a lot of situations.
I've posted some photos of my project. http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/u10844-jp-benson.html Mostly the engine/front clip stuff. I've got the frame finished and assembled but not many parts are attached. Hope to post some photos of that during the next few weeks.
JP
>________________________________
> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 12:43 PM
>Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>
>
>Greetings:
>
>RC,
>
>I should have said all “six” – Five bolts are 1-1/4 (“standard”) and the sixth bolt is 1-1/2 (the one that goes in the front of the front hold down clamp), and has a spacer under it as well.
>
>JP,
>
>Could be a loading issue as the spacer is against the inner frame (front clip), but GMC still used a washer on top of it and at the bolt head (frame) as well – But on the other hand, the bogie is under some pretty serious stress as well and GMC used just bolts & washer there – Though it may be a “thickness/stress” issue – The bogie area is pretty well “beefed” up whereas the front clip area is not – Maybe the spacers add “thickness” – Not sure, but just curious
>
>Yes, I noticed the shock mount bolt size issue as well, but from a different perspective – At some point in time, “someone” must have been negligent in not unloading the air bags prior to raising the frame – All four shock mounts have been “pucker dimpled” [is that a real term ;)] resulting in the bolts having a slight downward tilt.
>
>I made up four 3/8 steel backing plates, that accommodate both bolts and now the 9/16 bolts are nearly “straight” – But try and find a grade 8 9/16 bolt at Home Depot :o – Had to special order the longer ones I needed!
>
>It will be interesting to see how you do your setup – I was wondering about all the “threads” under the shock sleeve as well.
>
>Carl P.
>
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204456 is a reply to message #204454] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 13:05 |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Lookin pretty sweet JP!
Sully
77 royale
Seattle
Sent from my iPhone
On Apr 12, 2013, at 10:48 AM, Jp Benson <chocomo99@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Carl,
>
> Thanks for the info about the 1-1/2" bolt. I failed to record that info during teardown.
>
> Good point about the bogies. They mount on the outer frame and underneath on the ladder frame. This gives it much more structural stability.
>
>
> HD, Lowes, Auto parts stores etc etc generally stink for buying bolts & nuts. Even when they carry what you want they are often out of stock. My local Fastenal store has much better selection and can get it pretty quickly if they don't have it. Go to their website and search for a location using your zipcode. McMaster Carr also works for those hard to find parts.
>
> By shock mounts, I assume you mean the thick metal bracket that mounts to the frame. Mine don't sit flush on the frame. I did put a washer on the back side. Not sure if pucker dimpled is the right term but it ought to be applicable to a lot of situations.
>
>
> I've posted some photos of my project. http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/u10844-jp-benson.html Mostly the engine/front clip stuff. I've got the frame finished and assembled but not many parts are attached. Hope to post some photos of that during the next few weeks.
>
> JP
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> ________________________________
>> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>> Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 12:43 PM
>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Greetings:
>>
>> RC,
>>
>> I should have said all “six” – Five bolts are 1-1/4 (“standard”) and the sixth bolt is 1-1/2 (the one that goes in the front of the front hold down clamp), and has a spacer under it as well.
>>
>> JP,
>>
>> Could be a loading issue as the spacer is against the inner frame (front clip), but GMC still used a washer on top of it and at the bolt head (frame) as well – But on the other hand, the bogie is under some pretty serious stress as well and GMC used just bolts & washer there – Though it may be a “thickness/stress” issue – The bogie area is pretty well “beefed” up whereas the front clip area is not – Maybe the spacers add “thickness” – Not sure, but just curious
>>
>> Yes, I noticed the shock mount bolt size issue as well, but from a different perspective – At some point in time, “someone” must have been negligent in not unloading the air bags prior to raising the frame – All four shock mounts have been “pucker dimpled” [is that a real term ;)] resulting in the bolts having a slight downward tilt.
>>
>> I made up four 3/8 steel backing plates, that accommodate both bolts and now the 9/16 bolts are nearly “straight” – But try and find a grade 8 9/16 bolt at Home Depot :o – Had to special order the longer ones I needed!
>>
>> It will be interesting to see how you do your setup – I was wondering about all the “threads” under the shock sleeve as well.
>>
>> Carl P.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204468 is a reply to message #204456] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 15:54 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Thanks Sully,
I've been focused and making some progress lately. Looked at Carl's pics to see the pucker dimple he was describing. Guess I'm infected too. Also noticed his V-12 motor mated to a TH-425. That'll be something else.
JP
>________________________________
> From: Todd Sullivan <sgltrac@gmail.com>
>To: "gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
>Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 2:05 PM
>Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>Lookin pretty sweet JP!
>
>Sully
>77 royale
>Seattle
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On Apr 12, 2013, at 10:48 AM, Jp Benson <chocomo99@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Carl,
>>
>> Thanks for the info about the 1-1/2" bolt. I failed to record that info during teardown.
>>
>> Good point about the bogies. They mount on the outer frame and underneath on the ladder frame. This gives it much more structural stability.
>>
>>
>> HD, Lowes, Auto parts stores etc etc generally stink for buying bolts & nuts. Even when they carry what you want they are often out of stock. My local Fastenal store has much better selection and can get it pretty quickly if they don't have it. Go to their website and search for a location using your zipcode. McMaster Carr also works for those hard to find parts.
>>
>> By shock mounts, I assume you mean the thick metal bracket that mounts to the frame. Mine don't sit flush on the frame. I did put a washer on the back side. Not sure if pucker dimpled is the right term but it ought to be applicable to a lot of situations.
>>
>>
>> I've posted some photos of my project. http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/u10844-jp-benson.html Mostly the engine/front clip stuff. I've got the frame finished and assembled but not many parts are attached. Hope to post some photos of that during the next few weeks.
>>
>> JP
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>>> Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 12:43 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Greetings:
>>>
>>> RC,
>>>
>>> I should have said all “six” – Five bolts are 1-1/4 (“standard”) and the sixth bolt is 1-1/2 (the one that goes in the front of the front hold down clamp), and has a spacer under it as well.
>>>
>>> JP,
>>>
>>> Could be a loading issue as the spacer is against the inner frame (front clip), but GMC still used a washer on top of it and at the bolt head (frame) as well – But on the other hand, the bogie is under some pretty serious stress as well and GMC used just bolts & washer there – Though it may be a “thickness/stress” issue – The bogie area is pretty well “beefed” up whereas the front clip area is not – Maybe the spacers add “thickness” – Not sure, but just curious
>>>
>>> Yes, I noticed the shock mount bolt size issue as well, but from a different perspective – At some point in time, “someone” must have been negligent in not unloading the air bags prior to raising the frame – All four shock mounts have been “pucker dimpled” [is that a real term ;)] resulting in the bolts having a slight downward tilt.
>>>
>>> I made up four 3/8 steel backing plates, that accommodate both bolts and now the 9/16 bolts are nearly “straight” – But try and find a grade 8 9/16 bolt at Home Depot :o – Had to special order the longer ones I needed!
>>>
>>> It will be interesting to see how you do your setup – I was wondering about all the “threads” under the shock sleeve as well.
>>>
>>> Carl P.
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Frame Bolts: [message #204484 is a reply to message #204414] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 19:14 |
noi
Messages: 293
Registered: October 2010
Location: South of Fremont
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
JP,
Yup, you got it.... But I also see you already saw the pictures I posted - So for other who might not have.
“By shock mounts, I assume you mean the thick metal bracket that mounts to the frame”
The brackets themselves were slightly “bent” and would not fit flush held together:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/stuff/p46560-shock-bracket.html
And here you can see both the shock bracket bent out and if you look very close you can also see the “pucker dimple” on the frame!
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/stuff/p48652-shock-mount.html
I cut a 3” long piece from a 3” x 3/16 bar stock fits nicely inside the frame and provides a very large bearing surface for future support.
Our local HD has a pretty good stock of grade 8 stuff – Though do watch out for their washers! – They carry USS style, NOT SAE – Found that out the hard way - Fortunately, it was not an expensive lesson – Our local Fastenal is pretty good, but only has large bags and not convieuent when you only need a couple of parts – McM/C is great, but I have found their shipping, a lot of times, is nearly half the parts order – But they have lots of stuff on hand and you can get it now!
My frame is nearly back together and I was very happy/surprised to find the frame was only a 1/16 out of square – I feared it would be a lot more/worse – Now if I can only learn to read the tags I put on the bogies (left/right) BEFORE I put the left one on the RIGHT side…. D’OH!!!! – Oh well, removal/install practice makes perfect
What did you do/use for shims on the bogies? – Mine were rusted to almost nothing – Fortunately, JimK has replacements – They come in three sizes (~.1 ~.06 ~.03) and seeing as the original are ~.01 makes replacing mine easy – I needed 10 (one .1) on the left and 13 (.1 + .03) on the right so the “new” ones are a whole lot fewer!
Also, did you grease your rear bogie frame/H-frame mating surface? – I saw on Dan Stuckey’s web page that is what he does to help parts slide together and a little extra rust protection – I asked him what kind of grease to use and he said any high quality grease would do – So I figured, what the heck and greased it up.
Oh, one last thing…. I WISH the V-12 was mine – I was just a picture off the internet I found.
Winter,
An interesting thought…. Sounds plausible – I bought “replacements” for all the original bolts and will put the spacers back in as well – For backup, I was going to use Loctite Green 290 (capillary action).
Carl P.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204488 is a reply to message #204454] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 19:28 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Beautiful work, JP. You should get long, trouble free service from that
rig!
But I noticed one mod that I consider essential is missing: Sooner or
later you'll have to do something on the front of the engine, if only
change a fan belt. SO, I strongly suggest that you take this opportunity
to split your radiator fan shroud so you can easily remove the lower half.
Rig it so you can just reach up each side with a long screwdriver or
socket and remove 2-3 bolts to separate the top from the bottom. The
horizontal bolts into the radiator frame need not change.
Ken H.
On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 1:48 PM, Jp Benson <chocomo99@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ...
I've posted some photos of my project.
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/u10844-jp-benson.html Mostly the
> engine/front clip stuff. I've got the frame finished and assembled but not
> many parts are attached. Hope to post some photos of that during the next
> few weeks.
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204510 is a reply to message #204488] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 21:36 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Thanks Ken, It's great to have + feedback on all that effort. Reliability is my #1 goal. I've read many stories about dead on the road breakdowns and would rather not be in that situation. I was able to install the belts with the fan shroud in place but it would be much more difficult with the engine in the coach. It pains me to think of cutting up that nice looking shroud. It fits in place so well. Maybe I should carry a cutoff saw in my toolbox for that day.
JP
>________________________________
> From: Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net>
>To: gmclist <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
>Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 8:28 PM
>Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>Beautiful work, JP. You should get long, trouble free service from that
>rig!
>
>But I noticed one mod that I consider essential is missing: Sooner or
>later you'll have to do something on the front of the engine, if only
>change a fan belt. SO, I strongly suggest that you take this opportunity
>to split your radiator fan shroud so you can easily remove the lower half.
>Rig it so you can just reach up each side with a long screwdriver or
>socket and remove 2-3 bolts to separate the top from the bottom. The
>horizontal bolts into the radiator frame need not change.
>
>Ken H.
>
>On Fri, Apr 12, 2013 at 1:48 PM, Jp Benson <chocomo99@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> ...
>
>I've posted some photos of my project.
>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/u10844-jp-benson.html Mostly the
>> engine/front clip stuff. I've got the frame finished and assembled but not
>> many parts are attached. Hope to post some photos of that during the next
>> few weeks.
>>
>>
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204515 is a reply to message #204484] |
Fri, 12 April 2013 22:54 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
OK, now I see what you mean by pucker dimple. I'll don't recall seeing that on mine but I'll check tomorrow. Your inside the frame bracket should help. You probably already have hammered down the dimples. My frame had a lot of deformation caused by misplaced jacks. It straightened out fairly well with some big c-clamps.
Is there any problem with USS washers other than the size. I've got a lot of grade 8 USS washers on my frame.
1/4" is the max allowable out of square for the frame.
I'll fab my own bogie shims. The originals are in pretty bad shape.
I didn't grease the frame members but it makes sense. Hey, if everything holds up even half as long as the original did that'll be good enough for me.
From your pics it looks like were going through all the same drills. I can't quite determine how you're handling the sub-floor issues. We'll need to talk about that.
JP
>________________________________
> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 8:14 PM
>Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>
>
>JP,
>
>Yup, you got it.... But I also see you already saw the pictures I posted - So for other who might not have.
>
>“By shock mounts, I assume you mean the thick metal bracket that mounts to the frame”
>
>The brackets themselves were slightly “bent” and would not fit flush held together:
>
>http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/stuff/p46560-shock-bracket.html
>
>And here you can see both the shock bracket bent out and if you look very close you can also see the “pucker dimple” on the frame!
>
>http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/stuff/p48652-shock-mount.html
>
>I cut a 3” long piece from a 3” x 3/16 bar stock fits nicely inside the frame and provides a very large bearing surface for future support.
>
>Our local HD has a pretty good stock of grade 8 stuff – Though do watch out for their washers! – They carry USS style, NOT SAE – Found that out the hard way - Fortunately, it was not an expensive lesson – Our local Fastenal is pretty good, but only has large bags and not convieuent when you only need a couple of parts – McM/C is great, but I have found their shipping, a lot of times, is nearly half the parts order – But they have lots of stuff on hand and you can get it now!
>
>My frame is nearly back together and I was very happy/surprised to find the frame was only a 1/16 out of square – I feared it would be a lot more/worse – Now if I can only learn to read the tags I put on the bogies (left/right) BEFORE I put the left one on the RIGHT side…. D’OH!!!! – Oh well, removal/install practice makes perfect ;)
>
>What did you do/use for shims on the bogies? – Mine were rusted to almost nothing – Fortunately, JimK has replacements – They come in three sizes (~.1 ~.06 ~.03) and seeing as the original are ~.01 makes replacing mine easy – I needed 10 (one .1) on the left and 13 (.1 + .03) on the right so the “new” ones are a whole lot fewer!
>
>Also, did you grease your rear bogie frame/H-frame mating surface? – I saw on Dan Stuckey’s web page that is what he does to help parts slide together and a little extra rust protection – I asked him what kind of grease to use and he said any high quality grease would do – So I figured, what the heck and greased it up.
>
>Oh, one last thing…. I WISH the V-12 was mine – I was just a picture off the internet I found.
>
>
>Winter,
>
>An interesting thought…. Sounds plausible – I bought “replacements” for all the original bolts and will put the spacers back in as well – For backup, I was going to use Loctite Green 290 (capillary action).
>
>Carl P.
>
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: Frame Bolts: [message #204542 is a reply to message #204414] |
Sat, 13 April 2013 12:00 |
noi
Messages: 293
Registered: October 2010
Location: South of Fremont
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Greetings:
Winter/Matt – Thanks for the information/confirmation – I did not know that about large bolts and thin plates!
JP,
I tried to hammer the dimple down, but was not successful with the largest hammer I had – But figured it had worked OK up till than, I made the situation “better” with the backing plate, so just let it go  - But was successful, like you, straightening the lower frame section from misplaced jacks – Though I used a couple of GIANT Crescent ™ (plain old adjustable open end) wrenches.
Nothing wrong with USS washers, other than you said…. Size
Also, I tried to replicate what I found on the frame as close as possible – When I made my initial bolts order I noticed that they offered USS and SAE type washers – Not knowing what the difference was, I “goggled” it – When I went back and measured the original washers, I found the ID was closer to SAE than the USS style – So went with that – Probably should have said if you were buying washers from HD, make sure they are the ones you “expect”
What sub-floor issues you have????
Carl P.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204654 is a reply to message #204542] |
Sun, 14 April 2013 14:21 |
Jp Benson
Messages: 649
Registered: October 2011
Location: Fla
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Carl,
It turns out that my frame has no dimples at the shock mounts. I'm surprised your hammer didn't fix your dimple. Have you tried using a grade 8 bolt through the hole and backing it with a short section of pipe and some heavy duty washers? Then just turn the bolt with a breaker bar until something gives. I like the big square galvanized washers that are used on large timbers.
There were several rotted places on my floor. So, like you, I ripped up the floor boards and removed the aluminum backed foam panels. Everything was glued together so tight that I had to destroy it to get it out. That green adhesive is pretty awesome. So now I have to replace everything and was wondering if you had gone through this and came up with anything different/better than the original. The foam above my mufflers bubbled out several inches due to heat. Others have added heat shields but it would be nice to use something that didn't react to heat (fiberglass for instance). The aluminum skin glued to the foam panels is so flimsy that the foam is used to give it structural integrity. I like the design because it's so light but then which foam should be used and which glue is appropriate? Just contact cement or what. Then again maybe 1/16" diamond plate would work better and just use fiberglass batts for insulation. etc etc.
There are lots of choices out there.
JP
>________________________________
> From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
>To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:00 PM
>Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
>
>
>
>
>Greetings:
>
>Winter/Matt – Thanks for the information/confirmation – I did not know that about large bolts and thin plates!
>
>JP,
>
>I tried to hammer the dimple down, but was not successful with the largest hammer I had – But figured it had worked OK up till than, I made the situation “better” with the backing plate, so just let it go :p - But was successful, like you, straightening the lower frame section from misplaced jacks – Though I used a couple of GIANT Crescent ™ (plain old adjustable open end) wrenches.
>
>Nothing wrong with USS washers, other than you said…. Size
>
>Also, I tried to replicate what I found on the frame as close as possible – When I made my initial bolts order I noticed that they offered USS and SAE type washers – Not knowing what the difference was, I “goggled” it – When I went back and measured the original washers, I found the ID was closer to SAE than the USS style – So went with that – Probably should have said if you were buying washers from HD, make sure they are the ones you “expect”
>
>What sub-floor issues you have????
>
>Carl P.
>
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts: [message #204655 is a reply to message #204654] |
Sun, 14 April 2013 14:32 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I find the best heat shield material (this side of NASA stuff) is diamond
plate aluminum with spool stand offs between the floor and shield. When
moving, air will flow around both sides and carry the heat with it. I have
tried flush attachment and seem to get a lot of convected heat buildup,
even with foam behind it. But your experiences may vary.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 Gmc Royale 403
On Apr 14, 2013 12:21 PM, "Jp Benson" <chocomo99@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Carl,
>
> It turns out that my frame has no dimples at the shock mounts. I'm
> surprised your hammer didn't fix your dimple. Have you tried using a grade
> 8 bolt through the hole and backing it with a short section of pipe and
> some heavy duty washers? Then just turn the bolt with a breaker bar until
> something gives. I like the big square galvanized washers that are used on
> large timbers.
>
>
> There were several rotted places on my floor. So, like you, I ripped up
> the floor boards and removed the aluminum backed foam panels. Everything
> was glued together so tight that I had to destroy it to get it out. That
> green adhesive is pretty awesome. So now I have to replace everything and
> was wondering if you had gone through this and came up with anything
> different/better than the original. The foam above my mufflers bubbled out
> several inches due to heat. Others have added heat shields but it would be
> nice to use something that didn't react to heat (fiberglass for instance).
> The aluminum skin glued to the foam panels is so flimsy that the foam is
> used to give it structural integrity. I like the design because it's so
> light but then which foam should be used and which glue is appropriate?
> Just contact cement or what. Then again maybe 1/16" diamond plate would
> work better and just use fiberglass batts for insulation. etc etc.
> There are lots of choices out there.
>
>
> JP
>
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> > From: noi <v76_Birchaven@yahoo.com>
> >To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> >Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2013 1:00 PM
> >Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frame Bolts:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Greetings:
> >
> >Winter/Matt – Thanks for the information/confirmation – I did not know
> that about large bolts and thin plates!
> >
> >JP,
> >
> >I tried to hammer the dimple down, but was not successful with the
> largest hammer I had – But figured it had worked OK up till than, I made
> the situation “better” with the backing plate, so just let it go :p - But
> was successful, like you, straightening the lower frame section from
> misplaced jacks – Though I used a couple of GIANT Crescent ™ (plain old
> adjustable open end) wrenches.
> >
> >Nothing wrong with USS washers, other than you said…. Size
> >
> >Also, I tried to replicate what I found on the frame as close as possible
> – When I made my initial bolts order I noticed that they offered USS and
> SAE type washers – Not knowing what the difference was, I “goggled” it –
> When I went back and measured the original washers, I found the ID was
> closer to SAE than the USS style – So went with that – Probably should have
> said if you were buying washers from HD, make sure they are the ones you
> “expect”
> >
> >What sub-floor issues you have????
> >
> >Carl P.
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >GMCnet mailing list
> >Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> >http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Sat Sep 21 22:25:47 CDT 2024
Total time taken to generate the page: 0.01800 seconds
|
GMCforum
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
