Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs
| [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 16:04  |
Marsh Wilkes
Messages: 155
Registered: January 2004
Karma: -3
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Senior Member |
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First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time to look at a car for me and make detailed pictures of it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sowersr/sets/72157632732447788/
I am in Florida and this is the best price in the southeast on this specialty car, it's
in North Carolina not too far from where lives.
It's one of the coolest cars you haven't heard of, last one made 2009 Pontiac G8 GT
Rear wheel drive, 4 wheel independent suspension, 6 speed auto, 4 door touring, 245/40/19 tires, 360 hp.
It will go stop and turn and look good doing it.
I don't know who else but a GMC'er would go and drive this car for you (I know he didn't have any fun doing it)
and make all the pictures.
Here is my Dilemma, Richard said the car handled perfect, sounded perfect, trans was perfect, AC worked, brakes
were perfect, etc. but the interior shows wear in the drivers seat and scratches in the plastic seat backs etc., Richard
said that the scratches look worse in the pictures, however they are there. It has some scratches in the paint also.
If a big guy with a dog drove it that would be a reasonable explanation for the interior and I would not be afraid to buy
the car, however maybe someone just mistreated the car in every way and it shows up in the interior and paint scratches.
Car fax does not show anything bad, it came from the dealer that is selling it, the first owner put 16,000 miles on it the second got it up to
47,000 and I suspect is responsible for the seat wear and scratches.
MY QUESTION IS with all the collective wisdom on the GMC net would you guys look at the pix and render your opinion on buying this car,
it is being offered for about $2500 below what others are asking.
Thanks in advance
Marsh Wilkes
Perry Florida
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198046 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 16:29  |
george beck
Messages: 66
Registered: December 2008
Karma: 0
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Sister has 09 Pontiac G6 Pulling out of the driveway the power steering froze, she called me and I grab
a quart of PS fluid and thought easy fix.
To my surprise there is no PS reservoir, they have been using an electric motor which to be repaired they
replace the steering column and that motor at the cost of $1500/2000. Check ur TSBs and go on line and search Pontiac G series.
Hope this helps
George Beck
73Sequoia 260
75Transmode
________________________________
From: Marsh Wilkes <gmc455@comcast.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2013 5:04 PM
Subject: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs
First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time to look at a car for me and make detailed pictures of it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sowersr/sets/72157632732447788/
I am in Florida and this is the best price in the southeast on this specialty car, it's
in North Carolina not too far from where lives.
It's one of the coolest cars you haven't heard of, last one made 2009 Pontiac G8 GT
Rear wheel drive, 4 wheel independent suspension, 6 speed auto, 4 door touring, 245/40/19 tires, 360 hp.
It will go stop and turn and look good doing it.
I don't know who else but a GMC'er would go and drive this car for you (I know he didn't have any fun doing it)
and make all the pictures.
Here is my Dilemma, Richard said the car handled perfect, sounded perfect, trans was perfect, AC worked, brakes
were perfect, etc. but the interior shows wear in the drivers seat and scratches in the plastic seat backs etc., Richard
said that the scratches look worse in the pictures, however they are there. It has some scratches in the paint also.
If a big guy with a dog drove it that would be a reasonable explanation for the interior and I would not be afraid to buy
the car, however maybe someone just mistreated the car in every way and it shows up in the interior and paint scratches.
Car fax does not show anything bad, it came from the dealer that is selling it, the first owner put 16,000 miles on it the second got it up to
47,000 and I suspect is responsible for the seat wear and scratches.
MY QUESTION IS with all the collective wisdom on the GMC net would you guys look at the pix and render your opinion on buying this car,
it is being offered for about $2500 below what others are asking.
Thanks in advance
Marsh Wilkes
Perry Florida
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198048 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 16:46 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Marsh,
From where I sit Richard has provided you with a terrific set of photos which; unfortunately, have caused you concern about the
vehicle.
Since the vehicle is being sold by a GM dealer I would think it's in pretty good shape, normally dealers wholesale cars they don't
think are good or won't sell. However, that makes why he's selling it for $2500 less than what others are asking a good question.
If I was REALLY interested in the car I would drive up to Lumberton, NC, look at it personally, and have it checked by a reputable
mechanic in the area. Google maps says it's about 500 miles from Perry, FL to Lumberton, NC.
Regards,
Rob M.
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Marsh Wilkes
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 9:04 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs
First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time to look at a car for me and make detailed pictures of it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sowersr/sets/72157632732447788/
I am in Florida and this is the best price in the southeast on this specialty car, it's
in North Carolina not too far from where lives.
It's one of the coolest cars you haven't heard of, last one made 2009 Pontiac G8 GT
Rear wheel drive, 4 wheel independent suspension, 6 speed auto, 4 door touring, 245/40/19 tires, 360 hp.
It will go stop and turn and look good doing it.
I don't know who else but a GMC'er would go and drive this car for you (I know he didn't have any fun doing it)
and make all the pictures.
Here is my Dilemma, Richard said the car handled perfect, sounded perfect, trans was perfect, AC worked, brakes
were perfect, etc. but the interior shows wear in the drivers seat and scratches in the plastic seat backs etc., Richard
said that the scratches look worse in the pictures, however they are there. It has some scratches in the paint also.
If a big guy with a dog drove it that would be a reasonable explanation for the interior and I would not be afraid to buy
the car, however maybe someone just mistreated the car in every way and it shows up in the interior and paint scratches.
Car fax does not show anything bad, it came from the dealer that is selling it, the first owner put 16,000 miles on it the second
got it up to
47,000 and I suspect is responsible for the seat wear and scratches.
MY QUESTION IS with all the collective wisdom on the GMC net would you guys look at the pix and render your opinion on buying this
car,
it is being offered for about $2500 below what others are asking.
Thanks in advance
Marsh Wilkes
Perry Florida
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198051 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 17:15 |
storm'n
Messages: 492
Registered: April 2007
Location: Ont. Can
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I don't believe those are scratches on the seats. They are poor quality seat covers that wore out before their time. I have a buddy with a trim shop & he gets new cars from GM that have been in a car show & the seats have wear damage from people getting in & out. Don't base the cars condition on the seats alone. Are you sure this car is rear wheel drive? I honestly didn't know GM built this configuration.
First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time to look at a car for me and make detailed pictures of it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sowersr/sets/72157632732447788/
I am in Florida and this is the best price in the southeast on this specialty car, it's
in North Carolina not too far from where lives.
It's one of the coolest cars you haven't heard of, last one made 2009 Pontiac G8 GT
Rear wheel drive, 4 wheel independent suspension, 6 speed auto, 4 door touring, 245/40/19 tires, 360 hp.
It will go stop and turn and look good doing it.
I don't know who else but a GMC'er would go and drive this car for you (I know he didn't have any fun doing it)
and make all the pictures.
Here is my Dilemma, Richard said the car handled perfect, sounded perfect, trans was perfect, AC worked, brakes
were perfect, etc. but the interior shows wear in the drivers seat and scratches in the plastic seat backs etc., Richard
said that the scratches look worse in the pictures, however they are there. It has some scratches in the paint also.
If a big guy with a dog drove it that would be a reasonable explanation for the interior and I would not be afraid to buy
the car, however maybe someone just mistreated the car in every way and it shows up in the interior and paint scratches.
Car fax does not show anything bad, it came from the dealer that is selling it, the first owner put 16,000 miles on it the second got it up to
47,000 and I suspect is responsible for the seat wear and scratches.
MY QUESTION IS with all the collective wisdom on the GMC net would you guys look at the pix and render your opinion on buying this car,
it is being offered for about $2500 below what others are asking.
Thanks in advance
Marsh Wilkes
Perry Florida
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http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198052 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 17:27 |
GeorgeRud
Messages: 1380
Registered: February 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I think that these cars and the last GTOs are actually based on the Australian Holden designs. Supposedly, neat cars that should be enjoyed.
From one that still bemoans the passing of Pontiac and Oldsmobile!
George Rudawsky
Chicago, IL
75 Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198054 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 18:01 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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I did the Chicago Auto Show Press launch of the G8 with Bob Lutz. As usual when GM hits a home run they discontinue the product. Car is new enough you should be able to order seat cover parts at the dealer (any GM with a real parts dept) just stand by for parts sticker shock. G8 GT is on my wanted list.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198055 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 18:35 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Just a note that the G6 and G8 are on different platforms from different hemispheres. G8 had most comfortable seats (as did Holden GTO) and the G6 rental car I once had, had the most uncomfortable seats I have ever sat I in my life. We joked that the interns must have done the interior ergonomics on the G6. That seat wear is above average at 50k but not impossible. My Tahoe took over100k to get that patina. But I was not the first owner. I did have a buddy at the dealer order the front leather covers in Neutral when they were still available and now I'm through to the foam on drivers side so they will get taken out of the GM boxes and installed this year.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198057 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 19:08 |
Craig Lechowicz
Messages: 541
Registered: October 2006
Location: Waterford, MI
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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You might see if the dealer would sell it with the GM certified used car warranty. It will raise the price $300 to $500 but might be worth it. I had a friend that bought a certified used Grand Prix for his daughter a while back, and unlike the new car warranty, they didn't seem to give him any grief at all for anything he brought it in for. For instance, he mentioned the knobs on the radio were scratched, and they put a whole new radio in it. Not completely sure if they administer the used warranty differently, or if he just got really lucky with this dealer.
Craig Lechowicz
'77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198077 is a reply to message #198044] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 23:30 |
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John Heslinga
Messages: 632
Registered: February 2011
Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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Hi Marsh:
According to Edmond’s, and Wikipedia the Pontiac G8 was built (or at least designed by Holden In Australia. Certainly is family. (Looks like the Aussies got it right EH? Should I say “Fair Dinkum”?)
| Quote: |
Edmond’s says: The Pontiac G8 is a mechanical twin of the Commodore sedan from Holden, GM's Australian subsidiary. That's a good thing, as the Commodore has garnered accolades Down Under for providing affordable full-size functionality in a swift and agile package.
|
Edmond’s Link
http://www.edmunds.com/pontiac/g8/2009/?sub=sedan#fullreview
| Quote: |
Wikipedia Says: The Pontiac G8 is a rear-wheel drive sedan that was produced by Holden, the Australian General Motors (GM) subsidiary. The G8, a re-badged Holden Commodore, was released in early 2008 for the 2008 model year in the United States, and in 2008 for the 2009 model year in Canada.
|
Wikipedia Link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_G8
Look out here comes an opinion!! 
From what I see in those pictures, I believe the weaknesses you see account for the lower price that you are seeing for that car. The body dings and large scratches in the paint, the wear in the seat upholstery and the scratches in the seat backs. It would have cost the used car department of the dealership close to that, to do the repairs and detailing. Polishing and paint touch-ups are not enough. (In a dealership, the used car department gets charged full price for repairs from the body and repair shops,and most customers would try to negotiate the repairs as part of the purchase price. Therefore they would just lower the price ahead of time ans sell “as is”.
There is also another dealership accounting trick that can account for part of the lower price: The total profit on a new car is not complete, until the last of all trade-ins linked to the new car are sold. (If you get rid of all the trades as fast as possible you can "Clean The Slate". (This releases all cash for financing too)
In a New Car dealership, the used car manager, prefers to have "Great" used cars that are only a few years old, they make the final decision on what to do with a trade-in. Therefore a non-perfect car would be sold as fast as possible by either wholesale auction (for independent used car dealers) or slightly lower price. This one would be considered borderline as good for "Dealer Used". They are expecting that they will get better than wholesale for the car.
This is actually good for you!!!  You can get the car at a price that is slightly higher than you might buy as an independent dealer at the dealer auction. This is one of the reasons independent used car dealers have more cars with flaws. They will usually accept more flaws in cars on their lots.
The upholstery damage on the drivers seat is actually quite common on a vehicle with the bolstering as large as it is on this one, especially if it has been driven in a colder climate. "Leather Seats" in most North American cars are only "Leather Trim". The centre panel is leather but the edges are vinyl. The driver entering (and exiting) constantly drags against that part of the seat cracking the vinyl during cold weather and peeling the vinyl off of the backing. (Hip pocket wallets and blue jeans with rivets, make it worse) I would not, necessarily consider that damage as an indication of rough treatment or excessive wear. Upholstery shops (especially in larger centres) can easily acquire the matching colour vinyl (or a pretty suitable close match) and remove the seat cover to sew in and replace that worn panel for a very reasonable price. (At least I've been able to get good prices)
The scratches in the back of the rear seat are also probably the result of putting something wrong in the rear seat and coming to a quick stop or a sharp edge of some item, put on the floor, coming in contact with the seat as the car shakes or as the driver seat moves while the driver squirms around. Again, I would not consider just that damage to be an indicator of rough treatment.
Even the body damage I see would not necessarily mean rough treatment by the owner. Parking lots are can be very daunting places for unprotected cars. 
This is all just my point of view from what I can see in a few pictures however. I believe they say "Caveat Emptor".
Best regards
John and Cathie Heslinga
1974 Canyonlands 260
455, Manny tranny and 1 ton, 3:70 LS,
Red Seal Journeyman, DTE, BEd. MEd.
Edmonton, Alberta
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198085 is a reply to message #198044] |
Mon, 11 February 2013 06:10 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Looks like normal wear and tear to me Marsh. Probably was a big, tall
guy. Looks like the back had a baby seat in and out and the cosmetic
exterior stuff is supermarket inconsiderations. Probably a car used by a
single car family. All the utility use markings are there. That car is
borderline for a dealership used car lot, verses Manneheim auction bait.
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 3:04 PM, Marsh Wilkes <gmc455@comcast.net> wrote:
> First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time to look at a car
> for me and make detailed pictures of it.
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/sowersr/sets/72157632732447788/
>
> I am in Florida and this is the best price in the southeast on this
> specialty car, it's
> in North Carolina not too far from where lives.
> It's one of the coolest cars you haven't heard of, last one made 2009
> Pontiac G8 GT
> Rear wheel drive, 4 wheel independent suspension, 6 speed auto, 4 door
> touring, 245/40/19 tires, 360 hp.
> It will go stop and turn and look good doing it.
> I don't know who else but a GMC'er would go and drive this car for you (I
> know he didn't have any fun doing it)
> and make all the pictures.
>
> Here is my Dilemma, Richard said the car handled perfect, sounded perfect,
> trans was perfect, AC worked, brakes
> were perfect, etc. but the interior shows wear in the drivers seat and
> scratches in the plastic seat backs etc., Richard
> said that the scratches look worse in the pictures, however they are
> there. It has some scratches in the paint also.
>
> If a big guy with a dog drove it that would be a reasonable explanation
> for the interior and I would not be afraid to buy
> the car, however maybe someone just mistreated the car in every way and it
> shows up in the interior and paint scratches.
>
> Car fax does not show anything bad, it came from the dealer that is
> selling it, the first owner put 16,000 miles on it the second got it up to
> 47,000 and I suspect is responsible for the seat wear and scratches.
>
> MY QUESTION IS with all the collective wisdom on the GMC net would you
> guys look at the pix and render your opinion on buying this car,
> it is being offered for about $2500 below what others are asking.
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> Marsh Wilkes
> Perry Florida
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Take care,
Steve
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| Re: [GMCnet] GMC'rs helping other GMC'rs [message #198092 is a reply to message #198044] |
Mon, 11 February 2013 07:38 |
John Sharpe
Messages: 489
Registered: February 2006
Location: Texas
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| Quote: |
First I want to thank Richard Sowers for taking the time .......
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Richard is a great guy and an asset to the GMC community. He helped me find a place to store my coach while it was in NC. He still works and finds time to help us. I hope to repay the favor to him someday. In the meantime, help everyone you can. You never know when you may need assistance.
John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 MPI V-10
'40 Ford Panel Delivery TPI
johnasharpe@gmail.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Passing of Bill Telgin [message #198115 is a reply to message #198084] |
Mon, 11 February 2013 10:26 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Jim,
Bill was a great person to be around.
He not only rebuilt the motors for us but enjoyed his company at
conventions and Bean Station.
He will be missed by many.
On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 4:01 AM, Jim Bounds <gmccoop@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Have been away and this may already have hit but I got word this morning
> that Bill Telgin has passed away.
>
> Those of you who knew Bill know how much of a fixture he was in the
> community. Long before there was the electric wiper option, Bill had the
> replacement paddle gaskets made and was THE source for having the original
> wiper motors rebuilt. He was a very quiet man and when Ken came up with
> his electric wiper option did not want to stand in the way so most of you
> may have never heard of him. He rebuilt the wiper motors as a service to
> the community, before there was no option-- then there was Bill. The
> knowledge and parts of his labor was passed down to Jeff Sirum who is
> carrying on his legacy. In many applications I still do seek the original
> system and Bill Telgin was the man!
>
> I had been meaning to go see Bill and had told him so but you know my
> schedule, I feel bad missing seeing him, is a loss in our community,
> someone you may never have heard of but still his efforts have impacted us
> all. His coach is listed for sale on my "for sale" page. Would be a good
> thing for his coach to go to someone deserving.
>
> I quiet, passionate man-- he will be missed,
>
> Jim Bounds
> --------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Passing of Bill Telgin [message #198135 is a reply to message #198084] |
Mon, 11 February 2013 15:58 |
UziYaH
Messages: 282
Registered: July 2007
Location: 10-O-C
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I too will miss Bill Telgin. He was a quiet man, like my dad. "Still water runs deep."
Howard Nylander
Royale Class of '78' - 'Rocinante'
Greeneville, Tn.
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=howard+nylander
http://www.youtube.com/user/uziyah
________________________________
From: Jim Bounds <gmccoop@yahoo.com>
To: "gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Monday, February 11, 2013 7:01 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] Passing of Bill Telgin
Have been away and this may already have hit but I got word this morning that Bill Telgin has passed away.
Those of you who knew Bill know how much of a fixture he was in the community. Long before there was the electric wiper option, Bill had the replacement paddle gaskets made and was THE source for having the original wiper motors rebuilt. He was a very quiet man and when Ken came up with his electric wiper option did not want to stand in the way so most of you may have never heard of him. He rebuilt the wiper motors as a service to the community, before there was no option-- then there was Bill. The knowledge and parts of his labor was passed down to Jeff Sirum who is carrying on his legacy. In many applications I still do seek the original system and Bill Telgin was the man!
I had been meaning to go see Bill and had told him so but you know my schedule, I feel bad missing seeing him, is a loss in our community, someone you may never have heard of but still his efforts have impacted us all. His coach is listed for sale on my "for sale" page. Would be a good thing for his coach to go to someone deserving.
I quiet, passionate man-- he will be missed,
Jim Bounds
--------------------------
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Howard Nylander
Royale Class of "78" "Rocinate"
E-10-o-C
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