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| [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #197974] |
Sat, 09 February 2013 18:05  |
Robin Hood
Messages: 1078
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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I know this is off-topic for the GMC list, but there is such a
cross-section of skills and experience here I thought I would just throw it
out.
I have learned that a $4000 boat motor came off of a bass boat near the
place where my wife and I go fishing. Some sort of Japanese
four-cycle outboard thing. It was not running when it fell off the boat and
is fuel injected. So there are a number of things that will not be wrong
with it due simply to sinking
The water is very murky visibility is only 6 inches or so, so a camera like
the ones used in icefishing won't do any good. The water is just too murky.
You would have to be literally on top of the motor before you could see it
with the camera.
The sportfishermen quality side scan sonars have been tried but the
relatively small motor cannot be distinguished from the bottom.
The motor is in only about 13 feet of water however there is a strong
current and there is quite possibly submerged trees or other underwater
hazards, not to mention alligators and the water is cold. Nobody is going
diving for this thing. If it can't be brought up via a hook or claw or
something, it's staying down there.
I don't think I have the electronics skills to build a towfish magnetometer
or metal detector. Also, I've been told that I cannot simply extend the
cable on my little coinmaster metal detector so that I could stick the
sensor below the surface while I stay on top with the rest of the metal
detector. It has something to do with the length of the cable and the way
the metal detector works.
I am open to suggestions, advice, or even interesting stories about crazy
things that y'all did in your younger days in similar situations. At least
it might be interesting. :-)
--
Robin Hood
Jackson, MS
2003 Buick Lesabre
1968 Pontiac Catalina
1978 GMC Royale motorhome
1977 GMC Palm Beach motorhome
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #197983 is a reply to message #197974] |
Sat, 09 February 2013 19:01  |
Nelson Wright
Messages: 147
Registered: May 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Robin,
If you do find it keep in the water until you are ready to get it a service shop that has any electronics that may be needed to get it running.
Nelson Wright
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 9, 2013, at 7:05 PM, Robin Hood <loxley@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know this is off-topic for the GMC list, but there is such a
> cross-section of skills and experience here I thought I would just throw it
> out.
>
> I have learned that a $4000 boat motor came off of a bass boat near the
> place where my wife and I go fishing. Some sort of Japanese
> four-cycle outboard thing. It was not running when it fell off the boat and
> is fuel injected. So there are a number of things that will not be wrong
> with it due simply to sinking
>
> The water is very murky visibility is only 6 inches or so, so a camera like
> the ones used in icefishing won't do any good. The water is just too murky.
> You would have to be literally on top of the motor before you could see it
> with the camera.
>
> The sportfishermen quality side scan sonars have been tried but the
> relatively small motor cannot be distinguished from the bottom.
>
> The motor is in only about 13 feet of water however there is a strong
> current and there is quite possibly submerged trees or other underwater
> hazards, not to mention alligators and the water is cold. Nobody is going
> diving for this thing. If it can't be brought up via a hook or claw or
> something, it's staying down there.
>
> I don't think I have the electronics skills to build a towfish magnetometer
> or metal detector. Also, I've been told that I cannot simply extend the
> cable on my little coinmaster metal detector so that I could stick the
> sensor below the surface while I stay on top with the rest of the metal
> detector. It has something to do with the length of the cable and the way
> the metal detector works.
>
> I am open to suggestions, advice, or even interesting stories about crazy
> things that y'all did in your younger days in similar situations. At least
> it might be interesting. :-)
>
>
>
>
> --
> Robin Hood
> Jackson, MS
> 2003 Buick Lesabre
> 1968 Pontiac Catalina
> 1978 GMC Royale motorhome
> 1977 GMC Palm Beach motorhome
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #197990 is a reply to message #197983] |
Sat, 09 February 2013 20:10 |
Kingsley Coach
Messages: 2691
Registered: March 2009
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Karma: -34
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Senior Member |
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If you have a boat, what about building yourself a drag set up like the off
shore trawlers use? It's called Beam trawling.
Modify this idea to suit!
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.gulfofmaine-census.org/wp-content/images/Technology/STPCOImage04b.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.gulfofma ine-census.org/education/research-technology/sampling-tools-for-physical-capture/&h=800&w=1028&sz=126&tbnid=GkHBpdDNLLImmM:&tbnh=6 9&tbnw=89&zoom=1&usg=__V9ncRn869kDJyj0klbovTZk9NBk=&docid=8AZhaMu5rBD3xM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=6wAXUcLgBtP3yAHUwYGwCg&ved=0CDY Q9QEwAQ
I don't know how to shrink these..sorry
Mike in NM
Mike in NM
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 9:01 PM, Nelson Wright <f25ccapt@gmail.com> wrote:
> Robin,
> If you do find it keep in the water until you are ready to get it a
> service shop that has any electronics that may be needed to get it running.
> Nelson Wright
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 9, 2013, at 7:05 PM, Robin Hood <loxley@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I know this is off-topic for the GMC list, but there is such a
> > cross-section of skills and experience here I thought I would just throw
> it
> > out.
> >
> > I have learned that a $4000 boat motor came off of a bass boat near the
> > place where my wife and I go fishing. Some sort of Japanese
> > four-cycle outboard thing. It was not running when it fell off the boat
> and
> > is fuel injected. So there are a number of things that will not be wrong
> > with it due simply to sinking
> >
> > The water is very murky visibility is only 6 inches or so, so a camera
> like
> > the ones used in icefishing won't do any good. The water is just too
> murky.
> > You would have to be literally on top of the motor before you could see
> it
> > with the camera.
> >
> > The sportfishermen quality side scan sonars have been tried but the
> > relatively small motor cannot be distinguished from the bottom.
> >
> > The motor is in only about 13 feet of water however there is a strong
> > current and there is quite possibly submerged trees or other underwater
> > hazards, not to mention alligators and the water is cold. Nobody is going
> > diving for this thing. If it can't be brought up via a hook or claw or
> > something, it's staying down there.
> >
> > I don't think I have the electronics skills to build a towfish
> magnetometer
> > or metal detector. Also, I've been told that I cannot simply extend the
> > cable on my little coinmaster metal detector so that I could stick the
> > sensor below the surface while I stay on top with the rest of the metal
> > detector. It has something to do with the length of the cable and the way
> > the metal detector works.
> >
> > I am open to suggestions, advice, or even interesting stories about crazy
> > things that y'all did in your younger days in similar situations. At
> least
> > it might be interesting. :-)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Robin Hood
> > Jackson, MS
> > 2003 Buick Lesabre
> > 1968 Pontiac Catalina
> > 1978 GMC Royale motorhome
> > 1977 GMC Palm Beach motorhome
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Michael Beaton
1977 Kingsley 26-11
1977 Eleganza II 26-3
Antigonish, NS
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198005 is a reply to message #197974] |
Sat, 09 February 2013 23:29 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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In the interesting story department. When I was about 6 my Dad bought a lot and built a one room fishing cabin on Elk River which flows into the Tennessee. A fishing camp nearby rented flat bottom boats and 10 hp two stroke motors by the day. One day in the early 60's, a new motor fell off a rotten transom in the slough not too far from the dock. All sorts of things were tried to recover the motor. Several people had seen the event and had a very good idea of where it was. No one ever found it.
Fast forward a few years...probably around 1960. A cofferdam was being used to rebuild the locks at Wheeler Dam on the Tennessee River near Florence, Al. It failed and the entire impoundment went downriver in about 6 hours. I expect things got really exciting downstream..... 
Anyway, Dad and I had been out fly fishing and Dad noticed the water dropping fast. He commented that something bad must have happened at the dam because they couldn't dump that much water over the spillways. We barely got back to the cabin and were sliding on the mud in places where the water was normally 10' deep. We drove down to the fish camp to find out what was going on. When we got there one of the workers had a pair of binoculars and was scanning the mud in the slough. About the time I got a coke of the cooler, he yelled. "There it is!" and took off for the boats. After it was pointed out to me, I could see the bottom of the motor and the prop sticking out of the mud about a foot.
With everyone watching, he took a flat bottom boat and literally pulled and poled himself across the mud with a paddle and some sticks. With considerable effort, he was able to wrestle the motor out of the mud and back to shore.
While we watched (wasn't anything else to do!!!), he hosed everything down, cleaned the fuel tank and carb, cleaned the spark plug, blew everything dry with a bicycle pump (remember those?), put in some fresh gas/oil mix, pulled it a few times and off it went. The old drunk who owned the fish camp had already been paid by the insurance and told the young man the motor was his.
On the subject at hand. Is there enough steel in the thing for a magnet to hold on? If so, you might be able to get a few of those sweeper magnets, put them on a pole about 10' wide, and pull it around the area. Or perhaps some grappling hooks similar to what they drag for bodies with.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198020 is a reply to message #197974] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 08:35 |
habbyguy
Messages: 896
Registered: May 2012
Location: Mesa, AZ
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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First off, I'd say that it would be dead simple to dive in and hook a rope onto the thing. Alligators aren't THAT stealthy, and a wet suit - or even six layers of clothing - will keep you plenty warm enough to survive a short dip in any water.
But to locate it, I'd just use one of the recovery magnets you can find at Harbor Freight, on a rope. Even if there isn't much steel on the thing, you should be able to feel the magnet "tugging" on the motor if you do drop it on/next to it. Heck, you might even be able to use the rope to guide a lasso made of 1/4" or 1/8" steel cable down to hook the motor (since you could twist/push/cajole the loop around something that would let you pull it up).
Mark Hickey
Mesa, AZ
1978 Royale Center Kitchen
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198022 is a reply to message #197974] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 09:20 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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We lost a trawling motor back in the 70's. My dad dragged the area with a hook for hours before he finally gave up. Insurance replaced it with a little 7.5 Gamefisher which he only used a few times afterwards. I sold that motor a few years ago at a yard sale for $50. It had a rusted gas tank and was useless to me. I'd bet the guy I sold it to cleaned it up and is still using it.
Perhaps one day when all the water dries up on this planet, future aliens will find all sorts of boat motors..
...And shopping baskets...
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198029 is a reply to message #197974] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 10:54 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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Robin,
I don't know where my first reply went, but I will try again....
The fisherman's sidescan can be probably be retuned to reveal better detail of the bottom features. It may be required that someone dige through the documentation to find out how to do this. The thing we found out early with sidescan (even big expensive units) was that you have to look at the shadows as well as the actual reflections. If you can get him out there again, have him "mow the lawn" in two directions about square to each other. Sometimes an object on the bottom will not present well in one direction. (We almost missed a submarine!) And make sure the the scans overlap. It may take people on shore to help the scan hold straight. A common GPS without augment may not have the resolution you will need for an object this small.
The coil on your Coinmaster maybe extendable, some are. You will also need the waterproof coil. I bet the tech support at Coinmaster can help you on that one. I made the part so a friend could put the coil on the end of an extendable roller (for painting) pole. With that much metal, you won't need to get very close. The cover is probably machine processed SMC or other FRP, there will be very little magnetic steel and lots of aluminum, so set the detector to find an aluminum pop can at the greatest distance you can make it work. You will still have to set up the reference to mow the lawn.
Another resource may be a local dive club. If there is a dive shop in striking range, contact them. Be sure to offer at least the cost of the charge, but these people are usually up for a recovery challenge and working in 0-0 qualifies as a challenge. They will need a good place to start to do either a multi-diver straight rope search or a circular search. Again, the 0-0 will make everything more difficult.
Can you guess that I have had to find a few things lost overboard?
Matt
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198039 is a reply to message #198029] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 14:29 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Like Matt, I have some experience in river recovery in can't-see-your-hands dark water (cypress tree tannin staining). Outboards, whole hydroplanes, cell phones (it worked after the first time over but not the 2nd).
Anyway, my first question is are you sure it's still there? Most outboards don't stay lost long but if the guys who do the recovery aren't the owner then they usually come back and hoist it after dark. That's easier than explaining finders-keepers or the nuances of maritime salvaging.
But if it is there, I've been most successful with probes. I like thin-walled aluminum tubing for the handle with a steel pitchfork bolted to the end. The tubing acts as a sounding board and you can often differentiate roots and soft debris from metal.
Have a few floats tied to bricks to quickly drop off as markers when you have a find.
>current
Nothing ever sinks where you think it should be. The new outboards have pretty good gaskets and cam latches on the cowling, so it's going to keep some air trapped while it goes to the bottom and it likely drifted some.
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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| Re: [GMCnet] OT: underwater recovery [message #198041 is a reply to message #198040] |
Sun, 10 February 2013 15:30 |
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jaholland
Messages: 565
Registered: June 2010
Location: Sweet Home Alebamy
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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~ Hood ;
Contact my buddy's x-wife
She Knows Everything
and can find anything ~
OR
If There Is Any Monetary Value Involved
Just Contact Atty Arvin Reingold
In Chattanooga ~
He Can Get Blood Out Of Turnips ~
~ Joe ~
o
r
/_]*[__][] *[__|] ~ * '73 TZE063V101887 "
"
O----------OO--]* ~ '78 TZE168V100234 "
"
" Joe & Lavelle " "
"
'sweet home alebamy'
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