Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] electrical help
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189517 is a reply to message #189515] |
Wed, 07 November 2012 19:22   |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Lawrence,
I don't remember having seen you here before, so presume you're a "newbie".
And that presumption is reinforced by the fact that you didn't include a
signature block that shows your location and what coach you have -- that
information is always useful when we try to provide help.
IF you have a Royale or a Birchaven, both fitted out by Coachmen
Industries, the main circuit breaker for 120 vac is a double unit with an
interlocking rocker between the two halves. If the Generator breaker is
ON, the Shore breaker WILL be OFF. And vice-versa. So check in your
circuit breaker box for that arrangement.
If that doesn't help, come back with more information about your coach.
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI+ & EBL
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Wed, Nov 7, 2012 at 8:17 PM, lawrence potts wrote:
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt
> power what do I need to look at?
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www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189518 is a reply to message #189515] |
Wed, 07 November 2012 19:26 |
C Boyd
Messages: 2629
Registered: April 2006
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Sir: It depends on which coach you have, some you have to unplug the gen then plug in the shore cable, some have transfer switches in the coach, some have po installed auto transfer switch. The year and model of your GMC and your location would help a lot.
| lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 20:17 |
I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
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C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189547 is a reply to message #189518] |
Wed, 07 November 2012 21:00 |
lawrence potts
Messages: 10
Registered: November 2012
Karma: 0
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I have a 1978 GMC Royale. I have auto transfer switches as I do not have do anything when i change either from shorepower to generator (other than flip the breakers off then on)
--- On Wed, 11/7/12, Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net> wrote:
From: Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Date: Wednesday, November 7, 2012, 7:26 PM
Sir: It depends on which coach you have, some you have to unplug the gen then plug in the shore cable, some have transfer switches in the coach, some have po installed auto transfer switch. The year and model of your GMC and your location would help a lot.
lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 20:17
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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--
C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189556 is a reply to message #189518] |
Wed, 07 November 2012 21:42 |
lawrence potts
Messages: 10
Registered: November 2012
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Charles I am located in Tulsa Ok
--- On Wed, 11/7/12, Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net> wrote:
From: Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Date: Wednesday, November 7, 2012, 7:26 PM
Sir: It depends on which coach you have, some you have to unplug the gen then plug in the shore cable, some have transfer switches in the coach, some have po installed auto transfer switch. The year and model of your GMC and your location would help a lot.
lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 20:17
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
--
C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189583 is a reply to message #189581] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 06:53 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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'Upfit' - interior finish work when the coach was sold by GM as a transmode instead of a finished coach. Most of the GM fitted coaches simply had a plug for the power cord which the genset fed, so you plugged into it instead of shore power when you wanted genset power. My Norris upfit Transmode had a toggle switch to choose between shore and genset power, which I replaced with a relay that energizes when the shore power is hot. Some have - as pointed out earlier - a manual transfer which will either be a locking breaker setup, or a three position switch. And over the years POs have made numerous modifications.. some sensible, some dangerous. We left Tulsa in 1984 - I wa sChief Engineer for KRAV/KFMJ before Cox bought it.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: Larry Potts <ldpotts1@yahoo.com>
To: "gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 8, 2012 7:33 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
1978 Royale. Not sure what upfit is
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 8, 2012, at 6:26 AM, Johnny Bridges <jhbridges@ymail.com> wrote:
> What year, model. And if it's a Transmode, what upfit?
>
> --johnny
> '76 23' transmode norris
> '76 palm beach
>
>
> From: lawrence potts <ldpotts1@yahoo.com>
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Sent: Wednesday, November 7, 2012 8:17 PM
> Subject: [GMCnet] electrical help
>
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189585 is a reply to message #189515] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 07:10 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
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| lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 17:17 |
I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
|
Lawrence,
I understand you have a Royale (Upfitted by Coachman).
You say that the PO told you that all you have to is turn off the main breaker and then turn it back on.
Has it ever worked that way for you?
The reason I ask is that Coachman products have curcuit breaker panels with TWO inputs. One for the 30 amp shore line and one for the generator. There is a little metal lever that only allows one to be turned on at the same time.
So, (as long as your coach has not been modified) If using the generator, and want to use shore power:
1.) You need to turn off the generator input into the panel.
2.) Connect the shore power cord to a KNOWN good power source.
3.) Turn on the shore power input breaker. (It is the breaker on the other end of the little toggle from the generator input breaker.)
You should have shore power.
I also understand that Royales have an additional panel and wiring to power a rear air conditioner, but as I only have Birchavens (the 23 foot Coachamn product), I would not know much about it. (Maybe you have that cord?) BDub's site has an owners manual for Coachman products. You might check there. (I am at work and can not supply a link... in fact I need to stop reading the forum and get back to work!)
If your coach has been modified, you might need to find someone close to eye-ball your set-up and help you figure it out.
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189586 is a reply to message #189580] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 07:18 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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OK, now it makes sense. Personally, I prefer to turn the breaker off at
the shore power post in a campground rather than in the coach; that's
easier and even more safe. WHEN I think of it -- which is very seldom.
For the generator, I don't worry about it. The main reason for turning the
CB off for it is to ensure that the voltage has stabilized before load is
applied. The original GMC roof top air conditioners had an internal
start-up delay for that purpose. And if you'll notice the wiring diagram I
referenced, it has a diode and an capacitor to delay closing of the relay.
I've never had a problem from cranking my generator with the CB's closed.
There's certainly nothing wrong with your procedure and many will applaud
it.
Before going any further, we need to know a bit about your knowledge,
skills, and equipment: Are you "electrically challenged"? Do you have a
120 vac meter or trouble light? Are you familiar with relays and their
operation?
If you "pass", we can go through a troubleshooting procedure to perhaps
identify your problem. Otherwise, you'll need knowledgeable help -- which
is why we always want to know where you're located.
Ken H.
On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 7:34 AM, Larry Potts wrote:
> I have always been told to turn main breakers off before hooking up shore
> power or using the generator
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189590 is a reply to message #189586] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 08:06 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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In my case, I follow the same procedures as I did in my
boat before it was destroyed a couple of years back.
When hooking up to shore power, I always plugged in with
the shore power breaker off! Keeps the contacts of the
plug from arcing when plugging in to hot power. I always
left the air conditioners in the boat off until AFTER I
brought the shore power up.
Did the reverse when disconnecting before going out on
the water. Turn big stuff (A/C and water heater) off,
turn dock breakers off, THEN disconnect from shore power.
When using the genset, I always turned A/C off before
starting the genny; again, to let generator stabilize.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
______________
*[ ]~~~[][ ][|\
*--OO--[]---O-*
> From: hend4800@bellsouth.net
> Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2012 08:18:39 -0500
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
>
> OK, now it makes sense. Personally, I prefer to turn the breaker off at
> the shore power post in a campground rather than in the coach; that's
> easier and even more safe. WHEN I think of it -- which is very seldom.
>
> For the generator, I don't worry about it. The main reason for turning the
> CB off for it is to ensure that the voltage has stabilized before load is
> applied. The original GMC roof top air conditioners had an internal
> start-up delay for that purpose. And if you'll notice the wiring diagram I
> referenced, it has a diode and an capacitor to delay closing of the relay.
> I've never had a problem from cranking my generator with the CB's closed.
>
> There's certainly nothing wrong with your procedure and many will applaud
> it.
>
> Before going any further, we need to know a bit about your knowledge,
> skills, and equipment: Are you "electrically challenged"? Do you have a
> 120 vac meter or trouble light? Are you familiar with relays and their
> operation?
>
> If you "pass", we can go through a troubleshooting procedure to perhaps
> identify your problem. Otherwise, you'll need knowledgeable help -- which
> is why we always want to know where you're located.
>
> Ken H.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 7:34 AM, Larry Potts wrote:
>
> > I have always been told to turn main breakers off before hooking up shore
> > power or using the generator
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189594 is a reply to message #189583] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 08:58 |
lawrence potts
Messages: 10
Registered: November 2012
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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I believe the Royale's went to Coachmen. This one has had the inverter changed out. If I have a correct understanding it automatically senses what the source is and directs accordingly. We just purchased it in August of this year so my knowledge is very basic as in the early learning stages. Will be taking RV to Cinnabar for some repair and rehab.
Do you make it back to Tulsa often?
--- On Thu, 11/8/12, Johnny Bridges <jhbridges@ymail.com> wrote:
From: Johnny Bridges <jhbridges@ymail.com>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
To: "gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Date: Thursday, November 8, 2012, 6:53 AM
'Upfit' - interior finish work when the coach was sold by GM as a transmode instead of a finished coach. Most of the GM fitted coaches simply had a plug for the power cord which the genset fed, so you plugged into it instead of shore power when you wanted genset power. My Norris upfit Transmode had a toggle switch to choose between shore and genset power, which I replaced with a relay that energizes when the shore power is hot. Some have - as pointed out earlier - a manual transfer which will either be a locking breaker setup, or a three position switch. And over the years POs have made numerous modifications.. some sensible, some dangerous. We left Tulsa in 1984 - I wa sChief Engineer for KRAV/KFMJ before Cox bought it.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: Larry Potts <ldpotts1@yahoo.com>
To: "gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 8, 2012 7:33 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
1978 Royale. Not sure what upfit is
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 8, 2012, at 6:26 AM, Johnny Bridges <jhbridges@ymail.com> wrote:
> What year, model. And if it's a Transmode, what upfit?
>
> --johnny
> '76 23' transmode norris
> '76 palm beach
>
>
> From: lawrence potts <ldpotts1@yahoo.com>
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Sent: Wednesday, November 7, 2012 8:17 PM
> Subject: [GMCnet] electrical help
>
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189596 is a reply to message #189585] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 09:03 |
lawrence potts
Messages: 10
Registered: November 2012
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Mike will check your suggestions I have not seen the lever. And yes it has worked like this before. I am starting to suspect a problem in the shore power cord, it is a bit worn and it maybe that it finally said enough is enough. Thank you for the suggestions.
--- On Thu, 11/8/12, Mike Miller <m000035@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Mike Miller <m000035@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Date: Thursday, November 8, 2012, 7:10 AM
lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 17:17
> I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
Lawrence,
I understand you have a Royale (Upfitted by Coachman).
You say that the PO told you that all you have to is turn off the main breaker and then turn it back on.
Has it ever worked that way for you?
The reason I ask is that Coachman products have curcuit breaker panels with TWO inputs. One for the 30 amp shore line and one for the generator. There is a little metal lever that only allows one to be turned on at the same time.
So, (as long as your coach has not been modified) If using the generator, and want to use shore power:
1.) You need to turn off the generator input into the panel.
2.) Connect the shore power cord to a KNOWN good power source.
3.) Turn on the shore power input breaker. (It is the breaker on the other end of the little toggle from the generator input breaker.)
You should have shore power.
I also understand that Royales have an additional panel and wiring to power a rear air conditioner, but as I only have Birchavens (the 23 foot Coachamn product), I would not know much about it. (Maybe you have that cord?) BDub's site has an owners manual for Coachman products. You might check there. (I am at work and can not supply a link... in fact I need to stop reading the forum and get back to work!)
If your coach has been modified, you might need to find someone close to eye-ball your set-up and help you figure it out.
--
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#1)'73 26' exPainted D. -- (#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189599 is a reply to message #189586] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 09:06 |
lawrence potts
Messages: 10
Registered: November 2012
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Ken I am a total novice when it comes to electrical. My shore power cord is a bit worn and is on my repair list for the repair shop next week.
--- On Thu, 11/8/12, Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net> wrote:
From: Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
To: "gmclist" <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Date: Thursday, November 8, 2012, 7:18 AM
OK, now it makes sense. Personally, I prefer to turn the breaker off at
the shore power post in a campground rather than in the coach; that's
easier and even more safe. WHEN I think of it -- which is very seldom.
For the generator, I don't worry about it. The main reason for turning the
CB off for it is to ensure that the voltage has stabilized before load is
applied. The original GMC roof top air conditioners had an internal
start-up delay for that purpose. And if you'll notice the wiring diagram I
referenced, it has a diode and an capacitor to delay closing of the relay.
I've never had a problem from cranking my generator with the CB's closed.
There's certainly nothing wrong with your procedure and many will applaud
it.
Before going any further, we need to know a bit about your knowledge,
skills, and equipment: Are you "electrically challenged"? Do you have a
120 vac meter or trouble light? Are you familiar with relays and their
operation?
If you "pass", we can go through a troubleshooting procedure to perhaps
identify your problem. Otherwise, you'll need knowledgeable help -- which
is why we always want to know where you're located.
Ken H.
On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 7:34 AM, Larry Potts wrote:
> I have always been told to turn main breakers off before hooking up shore
> power or using the generator
>
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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189600 is a reply to message #189594] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 09:08 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Lawrence,
Royale and Birchaven WERE Coachmen creations.
"This one has had the inverter changed out." is indicative of a
misunderstanding: GMC's (perhaps with rare exceptions) did not come with
inverters. You're possibly referring to the CONverter. A converter makes
12 VDC from 120 vac. An inverter makes the opposite change -- battery
voltage to 120 vac. All GMC motorhomes should have included converters so
their batteries could be charged from shore or generator power.
There are other options than Cinnabar for GMC repair and refurbishment.
There are a lot of GMC owners in Oklahoma; you need to join them for
companionship, advice, and help:
http://www.gmcclassics.com/
Ken H.
On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 9:58 AM, lawrence potts wrote:
> I believe the Royale's went to Coachmen. This one has had the inverter
> changed out. If I have a correct understanding it automatically senses what
> the source is and directs accordingly. We just purchased it in August of
> this year so my knowledge is very basic as in the early learning stages.
> Will be taking RV to Cinnabar for some repair and rehab.
> ...
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] electrical help [message #189601 is a reply to message #189556] |
Thu, 08 November 2012 09:26 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
|
Senior Member |
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First thing I can think of is contact Glyn Trimble,
also in Tulsa, to get with the good-sized Tulsa
GMC group. You can contact him by email at
rgtrimble@cox.net
I have taken the liberty of including him as a
recipient of this message.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ~ TZE166V101966 ~ ~ ~ ~
~ ~ ~ '76 ex-Palm Beach ~ ~ ~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
______________
*[ ]~~~[][ ][|\
*--OO--[]---O-*
> Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2012 19:42:57 -0800
> From: ldpotts1@yahoo.com
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
>
>
> Charles I am located in Tulsa Ok
>
> --- On Wed, 11/7/12, Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> From: Charles Boyd <covered-wagon@comcast.net>
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical help
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Date: Wednesday, November 7, 2012, 7:26 PM
>
>
>
> Sir: It depends on which coach you have, some you have to unplug the gen then plug in the shore cable, some have transfer switches in the coach, some have po installed auto transfer switch. The year and model of your GMC and your location would help a lot.
>
>
> lawrence potts wrote on Wed, 07 November 2012 20:17
> > I have no 120 volt shore power but if I use the generator I have 120 volt power what do I need to look at?
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> --
> C. Boyd
> 76 Crestmont
> East Tennessee
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