Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever
| [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183431] |
Thu, 06 September 2012 19:40  |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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As I've recounted here numerous times, I cured a "notchy" steering CV joint
some years ago (8+?) by greasing it with Valvoline Synpower grease with
MS02. During the intervening years I've never had a problem again and have
only rarely greased either of the Zerk's on the steering column (neither of
which does anything for the CV anyway).
During the just-finished 400 mile Labor Day weekend trip, the "notchiness"
came back. I'd had some inkling that something was fishy during my
previous trip, but nothing dramatic. During the last trip, there was no
doubt -- a couple of times, if I hadn't nudged the wheel back to straight
ahead, I'd have been in the ditch.
Today I pulled the steering shaft and disassembled it. The CV joint balls
and races looked perfect, but after cleaned, the thing was almost
completely rigid -- I used a plastic mallet when I wanted to change the
orientation of the pieces. After removing each ball and cleaning it and
its races, I re-Synpower-ed the whole thing, Smooth as silk again now.
There was no sign of any deterioration of any part of the CV, nor of the
grease. I'd packed it tightly with grease and there was a good solid
"plug" of it in the top of the coupling -- there's been no water intrusion.
Despite that fact, this time I machined a Nylon plug to go in the
coupling, below the steering shaft. I have no idea why the notchiness
returned.
I'd installed a lower boot, over the blue splined shaft, thinking to
prevent water intrusion there. That may have been a mistake. The boot was
deteriorated to the point that it was open most of the way around just
above where the lower (outer) shaft begins. Before it became porous, it
had been holding water -- I know because the entire circumference of the
shell which holds the seal on the top of that shaft was severely rusted &
pitted. I don't think I'll replace that boot, but leave the blue shaft
exposed, as it was from the factory. The rubber 3-lip seal at the top
seems to still be in good condition, so little water should get into the
lower shaft (which one Zerk lubricates). If I do anything, it will be to
put a simple "umbrella" over the joint to minimize the water striking the
seal, without holding water in the area.
n. :-(
I'll squirt the lower U-joint Zerk before I re-install the shaft -- it may
never be touched again, hard as it is to reach. :-(
The moral of this story is: "As good as Synpower may be, it doesn't last
forever!"
Ken H.
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183452 is a reply to message #183431] |
Thu, 06 September 2012 21:56  |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Sounds like phase separation in the grease as you mention the hard plug. Not as bad as with Mobil 1 I would think. So 5 years might be as long as one should go without refreshing. As for me I grease the entire coach before any major trip as part of pre trip inspection.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183484 is a reply to message #183452] |
Fri, 07 September 2012 06:00 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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I think you're right, John. I've seen Synpower drip brown liquid from the
tube, much like Mobil 1's red blood but nowhere near as badly. I've also
found the grease hardened to a clay-like substance in long-drained tubes.
I guess this tendency is another good reason for frequent greasing of
other wear points. Surely you don't R&R the column shaft for those major
trips' pre-greasing?
What I don't understand is where the emulsifier went in this case -- there
was no sign of any leakage from the boot -- the shaft below was completely
dry.
Ken H.
On Thu, Sep 6, 2012 at 10:56 PM, John R. Lebetski wrote:
>
> Sounds like phase separation in the grease as you mention the hard plug.
> Not as bad as with Mobil 1 I would think. So 5 years might be as long as
> one should go without refreshing. As for me I grease the entire coach
> before any major trip as part of pre trip inspection.
> --
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183496 is a reply to message #183484] |
Fri, 07 September 2012 08:29 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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| Ken Henderson wrote on Fri, 07 September 2012 07:00 |
I think you're right, John. I've seen Synpower drip brown liquid from the tube, much like Mobil 1's red blood but nowhere near as badly. I've also found the grease hardened to a clay-like substance in long-drained tubes.
I guess this tendency is another good reason for frequent greasing of other wear points. Surely you don't R&R the column shaft for those major trips' pre-greasing?
What I don't understand is where the emulsifier went in this case -- there was no sign of any leakage from the boot -- the shaft below was completely dry.
Ken H.
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Ken,
Many years ago, I was told by a grease guy (product salesman to us OEs) that the emulsifiers actually either sublime or evaporate. This is a real problem with synthetics trying to push both longevity and temperature.
It is less of a problem, but still problem with less expensive products as the components leave behind a solid mass. This is what killed an inherited power tool.
The bleeding is not restricted to synthetics. I have seen bleeding from some run of the mill GL2s in recent years. My grease gun shelf is a disaster if you touch it.
At least with a moly loaded grease, you know that can't harden or leave.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183510 is a reply to message #183484] |
Fri, 07 September 2012 09:50 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Ken,
As you know Double Trouble is stored for eight months a year. I learned what you noted below about Synpower the hard way. I have two
grease guns stored under the raised section of flooring in the aisle of the Avion that I can get to by lifting a hinged panel. One
is Mobil 1 the second is Synpower. The reason for two is Dave Lenzi delivered my rebuilt hubs/knuckles with Mobil 1 in them and I
continue to use it. The first year I stored the grease guns there when I returned to the USA to un-mothball Double Trouble I found a
MESS! They were both wrapped in red rags and the rags, floor, and anything nearby was soaked with red and a clear-ish fluid. Emptied
out the storage area, cleaned it up with lots of brake cleaner and paper towels. I then wrapped both grease guns in red rags and put
them individually in DOUBLE zip lock bags. That solved that problem,
HOWEVER, both of the greases still bleed which brings up a question - is it OK to use grease that has bled or does it effect the
"lubricity?"
Every year when I mothball Double Trouble I grease everything including the zerks on the knuckles. As far as lubing the steering CV
joint goes, some PO drilled a hole in it and installed a grease zerk making that job simple.
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Henderson
I think you're right, John. I've seen Synpower drip brown liquid from the
tube, much like Mobil 1's red blood but nowhere near as badly. I've also
found the grease hardened to a clay-like substance in long-drained tubes.
I guess this tendency is another good reason for frequent greasing of
other wear points. Surely you don't R&R the column shaft for those major
trips' pre-greasing?
What I don't understand is where the emulsifier went in this case -- there
was no sign of any leakage from the boot -- the shaft below was completely
dry.
Ken H.
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183557 is a reply to message #183510] |
Fri, 07 September 2012 13:27 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I can imagine your mess! I keep all my grease guns stuck down in a 5
gallon bucket -- which always has a pool of SOMETHING in the bottom.
If I suspected that a tube of grease had "bled out", I wouldn't try to use
it. If it HAD bled out to the extent I've seen at least one do, my
air-powered grease gun wouldn't move the grease anyway.
I probably should have installed a Zerk in this CV joint while I had it
apart. But I can probably live with 5+ year PM schedule (especially since
I probably won't make the next one anyway). :-)
Ken H.
On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 10:50 AM, Rob Mueller wrote:
> Ken,
>
> As you know Double Trouble is stored for eight months a year. I learned
> what you noted below about Synpower the hard way.
...
HOWEVER, both of the greases still bleed which brings up a question - is it
OK to use grease that has bled or does it effect the
> "lubricity?"
>
> Every year when I mothball Double Trouble I grease everything including
> the zerks on the knuckles. As far as lubing the steering CV
> joint goes, some PO drilled a hole in it and installed a grease zerk
> making that job simple.
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Synpower Ain't Forever [message #183573 is a reply to message #183561] |
Fri, 07 September 2012 17:33 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Hal,
Time do fly, don't it!
Ken H.
On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 3:40 PM, Hal Kading wrote:
>
>
> Well Ken, if my experience with time is any indication for you, 5 years
> will be up about next month! 8o
>
> "I probably should have installed a Zerk in this CV joint while I had it
> apart. But I can probably live with 5+ year PM schedule (especially since I
> probably won't make the next one anyway). :-)"
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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