Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » What's the fatal flaw with CNG?
| What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 06:32  |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166908 is a reply to message #166907] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 06:48  |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
But that's propane conversion, not CNG.
I'm not talking about the practicality of doing a conversion on a single coach but rather, is there a big future for CNG as a major transportation fuel?
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166909 is a reply to message #166907] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 06:54 |
 |
USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Gene,
AFAIK the conversions you have listed are Liquid Petroleum Gas not
Compressed Natural Gas.
BIG DIFFERENCE!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquefied_petroleum_gas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compressed_natural_gas
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: gene Fisher
has been done often, see here
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showgallery.php?cat=3866
and here for the onan and others
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
not talking about SOBs ;>)
gene
On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 4:32 AM, dave silva <admin@oldrv.net> wrote:
>
>
> I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a
> CNG powered truck.
>
> http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
>
> I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
>
> THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too
> small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
>
> We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's
> impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global
> market and right now it's under $2/gal.
>
> But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal
> flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
>
> 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
"Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166911 is a reply to message #166909] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 07:05 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
|
Senior Member |
|
|
TIS TRUE
one is done
other is prob not in my life time ;>)
gene
On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 4:54 AM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Gene,
>
> AFAIK the conversions you have listed are Liquid Petroleum Gas not
> Compressed Natural Gas.
>
> BIG DIFFERENCE!
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquefied_petroleum_gas
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compressed_natural_gas
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gene Fisher
>
> has been done often, see here
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showgallery.php?cat=3866
>
> and here for the onan and others
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/
>
> not talking about SOBs ;>)
>
> gene
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 20, 2012 at 4:32 AM, dave silva <admin@oldrv.net> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in
> a
> > CNG powered truck.
> >
> > http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
> >
> > I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
> >
> > THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too
> > small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
> >
> > We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's
> > impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global
> > market and right now it's under $2/gal.
> >
> > But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal
> > flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
> > --
> > Dave & Ellen Silva
> >
> > 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
> "Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
> -------
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/
> Alternator Protection Cable
> http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166914 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 07:55 |
 |
Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| hertfordnc wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 07:32 |
I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
|
Dave,
I have only worked three CNG programs and one of those was a crash certification, but I will pass on what I learned.
Yes, the tanks are expensive, but they won't rust out (in Michigan - that matters) even still, according to current laws, they still have to be removed and recertified every five years like CO2 and SCUBA tanks. But, at 10KPSI and no local tank people could do that.
Tank range is a serious issue because the tanks shape is limited by engineering and material standards and that limits location and total volume. We had a very hard time fitting them into the passcar mules. Could I fit a good collection under a GMC? I bet I could.
The third is not a vehicle problem, but an infrastructure investment issue. There are CNG filling stations in many metro areas, but without the promise of demand they are very rare in rural areas. It cost us about 30K$ to put in the compression station we needed to run the development and another 10K$ to tap that to fuel the mule vehicles. Can you imagine a convenience store owner popping for 50K$+ on the speculation of demand?
I am sure that many of the tank issues could be mitigated with production volume and the vehicle issues better addressed in the platform design phase. That could get tank range equal to gasoline, and an engine redesigned to take advantage of the ~130 octane could provide a performance benefit that made these vehicle so marketable that they would sell effectively without any government subsidy.
Just what I know first hand.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166917 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 08:21 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| hertfordnc wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 05:32 |
I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
|
The infrastructure is seriously lacking at this point but there's plenty of the stuff. Individuals who have natural gas at home can get expensive compressors to fill your own vehicle. GM and Ram over bi fuel CNG trucks currently and Honda Civics have been available for years as dedicated CNG vehicles. Many municipalies use Ford Crown Vics which run on CNG. Fuel economy and performance is equivalent to gasoline at currently about half the price. Some have experienced exhaust valve issues but not prevelent. Very clean burning as well. I think the entire Pheonix area only has 2 public filling points. Others are private for city or taxicab operations. If the vehicle is dedicated CNG, many states allow HOV usage.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166918 is a reply to message #166914] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 08:24 |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
So, there is no fatal flaw? It sounds like it's just a matter of time.
It's a viable fuel for gas and deisel and when the economy recovers gas prices will continue to go up and investors may show up to populate the andscape with stations.
It actually seems more inevitable than hybrid or electric cars.
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166919 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 08:31 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
|
Senior Member |
|
|
It isn't a flaw, it's a lackof infrastructure to get the stuff to vehicles. It doesn't liquefy at any reasonable temperature, so to get a sufficient amount to be worthwhile you have to compress it dam' near to degenerate matter. This takes a robust tank, which isn't cheap.
My plan is to finish the PB, and then whichever coach sells, convert the other by removing the front tank and replacing it with CNG tankage.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: dave silva <admin@oldrv.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 7:32 AM
Subject: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG?
I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
--
Dave & Ellen Silva
1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166920 is a reply to message #166918] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 08:37 |
jknezek
Messages: 1057
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 5
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| hertfordnc wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 09:24 |
So, there is no fatal flaw? It sounds like it's just a matter of time.
It's a viable fuel for gas and deisel and when the economy recovers gas prices will continue to go up and investors may show up to populate the andscape with stations.
It actually seems more inevitable than hybrid or electric cars.
|
Perhaps. But you are missing a point. CNG is still a dino fuel and, therefore, at best a sidestep to eventual scarcity issues. I'm not much for peak oil theory, but I do believe we have tapped the vast majority of "easy" or "inexpensive" sources of oil.
The same thing would eventually happen with CNG. So the drive to renewable energy sources is inevitable if currently expensive and inefficient versus dino sources. We can postpone, but not put off, the inevitable.
I'm in my early 30s and it would be very easy to say lets not make hard choices in my generation because we don't need to. But I'd prefer to keep plugging away at long term solutions, even if they are currently inefficient, and help sacrifice a little bit for my eventual grandkids future.
That being said, I do believe in part of Boone Pickens' plan. I think we could mandate a 10 or 15 year switch of interstate commercial trucks to CNG. Guarantee the big truck stops the income and they are mostly major chains these days and could raise the money to do the investment. Probably ease diesel prices a bit and burn a little cleaner on the highways.
Thanks,
Jeremy Knezek
1976 Glenbrook
Birmingham, AL
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166921 is a reply to message #166920] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 08:53 |
Don A
Messages: 895
Registered: October 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
<<< I do believe in part of Boone Pickens' plan. >>>
Always remember the main part of Pickens plan is to make himself more rich from taaxpayer's money.
Don Adams Dallas, TX
'76 26' Glenbrook, '90 Sidekick
rebuilt by R Archer, powered by J Bounds, Koba
[IMG]http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/data/6109/G2.jpg[/IMG]
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166925 is a reply to message #166921] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 09:38 |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| Don A wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 08:53 |
<<< I do believe in part of Boone Pickens' plan. >>>
Always remember the main part of Pickens plan is to make himself more rich from taaxpayer's money.
|
Really? I'm not seeing any sign of him making more money on this than he was already making on oil. I think he invested in a lot wind but but Idoubt there has been more profit to date than he could have made just putting his billions back into fossil fuel.
I actually think he is sincerely interested in steering the country in a better direction.
SO far he's lost a pile of money on wind and he's 83 years old.
But this isn't about Boone- I think NG will evolve into a game changer through market forces.
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166927 is a reply to message #166925] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 09:47 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Dave
I agree. Of course since coal is being outlawed, and I live over ground zero for fracking gas, I'm far from impartial.
Three of our fleet vehicles are CNG. We have two Phill units at the office.
Two bucks a gallon.
Dolph Santorine
Dolph@DolphSantorine.com
Phone: 304-219-3100
Cell: 740-312-5342
Http://www.DolphSantorine.com
Excuse me for not being my usual wordy and sporadically verbose self. This message is sent from my iPad, which is, in many ways, an iPhone on steroids.
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. Few long dead dinosaurs were involved. A large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
On Apr 20, 2012, at 10:38 AM, dave silva <admin@oldrv.net> wrote:
>
>
> Don A wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 08:53
>> <<< I do believe in part of Boone Pickens' plan. >>>
>>
>> Always remember the main part of Pickens plan is to make himself more rich from taaxpayer's money.
>
>
> Really? I'm not seeing any sign of him making more money on this than he was already making on oil. I think he invested in a lot wind but but Idoubt there has been more profit to date than he could have made just putting his billions back into fossil fuel.
>
> I actually think he is sincerely interested in steering the country in a better direction.
>
> SO far he's lost a pile of money on wind and he's 83 years old.
>
> But this isn't about Boone- I think NG will evolve into a game changer through market forces.
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
>
> 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166930 is a reply to message #166925] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 10:04 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
|
Senior Member |
|
|
One "semi-local" chain of gas-n-go convenience stores
in the Oklahoma City area (On-Cue) offers a wide choice
of fuels; E0 (87/89/91 Octane), E10, E15, E85, and
now CNG.
Some larger/newer 7-11 stores offer a similar range
but no CNG yet of which I am aware.
Will CNG ever be practical for small privately owned
vehicles? I think not. Big over-the-road (even long-
haul trucks) vehicles? Probably. Lots of space to
be used for storage tanks. Distribution systems?
Yep. Major long-haul outfits are outfitting their
terminals with CNG facilities, even as we watch.
FedEx, UPS, and many other companies in OKC now buy
only CNG powered vehicles except for long-haul usage.
Nearby Tinker Air Force Base also is using some CNG
vehicles and has a refill point on the base. Strangely
enough, at least some of their gasoline powered vehicles
fuel up at a nearby On-Cue station!
T. Boone is a very complicated person; probably a mix
of self-interest AND altruism. Many folks today are
unaware of his reputation as a ruthless corporate
raider in years past. I suspect his ideas are along
the line of a one-time CEO of GM who stated "What's
good for GM is good for the nation and vice versa."
or words to that effect! However, he has donated some
$100 million to his college alma mater, Oklahoma State
University over the past few years.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ex-Palm Beach, 76 ~ ~ ~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: admin@oldrv.net
> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2012 09:38:37 -0500
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG?
>
>
>
> Don A wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 08:53
> > <<< I do believe in part of Boone Pickens' plan. >>>
> >
> > Always remember the main part of Pickens plan is to make himself more rich from taaxpayer's money.
>
>
> Really? I'm not seeing any sign of him making more money on this than he was already making on oil. I think he invested in a lot wind but but Idoubt there has been more profit to date than he could have made just putting his billions back into fossil fuel.
>
> I actually think he is sincerely interested in steering the country in a better direction.
>
> SO far he's lost a pile of money on wind and he's 83 years old.
>
> But this isn't about Boone- I think NG will evolve into a game changer through market forces.
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
> 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166931 is a reply to message #166918] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 10:07 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| hertfordnc wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 07:24 |
So, there is no fatal flaw? It sounds like it's just a matter of time.
It's a viable fuel for gas and deisel and when the economy recovers gas prices will continue to go up and investors may show up to populate the andscape with stations.
It actually seems more inevitable than hybrid or electric cars.
|
I think the US has an abundance of natural gas and won't be dependent on any other country for several generations. However, wall street is in the middle of any pricing issues just as they are today with oil. The technical promise of something like this isn't always what wins when it comes to widespread adoption.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166940 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 10:58 |
mickeysss
Messages: 1476
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I use cng every day for the last 5 years, in cal. there are l lot of stations. The bottles can be daisy chained, i get 220 miles
on my van and it has a 318 cubic inch dodge 5.9 liter engine. I think the 445 would get at least 8 or 9 miles per gallon.
But the tanks are not that expensive if you buy them at other places, and take them from junked cars. They do have a date
on them for use. Expiration date. In california these do not really stop people from using them for they are never checked on
a personal car. They do vehicles used for money and transport like mine. It is a very good use of fuel and it is safe from
wrecks, better than gas in this regard. I have found takes for $150. You can find these systems on cars and vans here in l.a. area
that are just being given away and you can put these on with the whole system if you know what you are doing.
The only flaw is it is still fossil fuel and is bad for the air, better but still not as good as electric. It is much better than gas
and 1/2 the price, i save $40 a day using it with my airport shuttle van. It runs a little less power but worth it. I am selling one of
my cng vans now that used it. It is a very cheap way to get around and you can go on the hov lane alone out here.
On Apr 20, 2012, at 4:32 AM, dave silva wrote:
>
>
> I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
>
> http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
>
> I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
>
> THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
>
> We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
>
> But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
>
> 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166942 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 11:50 |
bwevers
Messages: 597
Registered: October 2010
Location: San Jose
Karma: 5
|
Senior Member |
|
|
I see a lot of Honda Civics and Ford Crown Vics taxis running around San Jose with CNG tanks. The local filling station is at the airport a few blocks from HWY 101, in a convenient location. They say you have to burn 30% more CNG to get the same energy as gasoline.
Regards,
Bill
Bill Wevers GMC49ers, GMC Western States
1975 Glenbrook - Manny Powerdrive, OneTon
455 F Block, G heads
San Jose
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166943 is a reply to message #166906] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 11:55 |
rssbob
Messages: 259
Registered: January 2004
Location: La Mesa, Ca. (San Diego a...
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
On Apr 20, 2012, at 4:32 AM, dave silva wrote:
>
>
> I've been following this blog about a guy making a cross country trip in a CNG powered truck.
>
> http://old-moho.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
>
> I looked at the CNG conversion web site.
>
> THe whole thing seems to have potential except that the tanks are too small for a decent range and they are stupidly expensive.
>
> We apprently have three Saudi Arabia's worth of NG under the US. It's impractical to export offshore so it's not as vulnerable to the global market and right now it's under $2/gal.
>
> But I figure there would be more mainstream buzz unless there is a fatal flaw and if so, i figure someone here knows what it is.....
> --
> Dave & Ellen Silva
>
> 1972 Revcon Olds 455, toro drive train. All Stock
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
This is something I have been interested for quite a while. In my life's priority's CNG has never quite made it to the top of the list.
I did find that there are 15 stations listed on a website for San Diego County so that would be enough for me to give it a try. There is also a web site that provides a lot of info for those who are interested.
http://www.cngunited.com/
I am sure Pickens has his own hidden agenda but I agree with his push to get us going in the direction of using wind power and also his views on CNG.
Some day when I find my life getting boring I am going to get into the CNG thing and maybe my latest 78 (heading for the junk yard) find will be the test case.
Bob Sobrito
1978 Palm Beach
La Mesa, Ca
antique pocket watch repair
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Bob Sobrito
78 Palm Beach
La Mesa, Ca
|
|
|
|
| Re: What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166945 is a reply to message #166942] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 12:09 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
|
|
| bwevers wrote on Fri, 20 April 2012 10:50 |
I see a lot of Honda Civics and Ford Crown Vics taxis running around San Jose with CNG tanks. The local filling station is at the airport a few blocks from HWY 101, in a convenient location. They say you have to burn 30% more CNG to get the same energy as gasoline.
Regards,
Bill
|
Fuel economy is about the same.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
|
|
|
|
| Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG? [message #166946 is a reply to message #166930] |
Fri, 20 April 2012 12:04 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
|
Senior Member |
|
|
From: D C *Mac* Macdonald <k2gkk@hotmail.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] What's the fatal flaw with CNG?
Will CNG ever be practical for small privately owned
vehicles? I think not.
We're gonna disagree here. My pickup runs to the bus stiop and back daily - 30 miles total. On weekends it chases pieces for the GMC, hauls garbage, whatever. The home filling station for CNG and a single tank - 150 miles or so - is a natural for it. At $2 per gallon savings, against the 155K miles I've put on it, it begines to look attractive, even before the lessend pollution, cleaner running internally and higher octane. Which is good, alternate fuels will not sell on environmental issues. People for the most part atre price driven.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
|
|
|
|
Goto Forum:
Current Time: Sat Sep 28 00:22:24 CDT 2024
Total time taken to generate the page: 0.01803 seconds
|
GMCforum
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
