Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » T bars
| T bars [message #160801] |
Sat, 18 February 2012 13:05  |
skip2
Messages: 544
Registered: September 2011
Location: Winter Haven,FL (center o...
Karma: 3
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Replacing a pork chop I noticed with some wear and as best as I can tell by "digital exam" and a flashlight a arm sockets look good. Just wondering if anyone has ever flipped the the tbars 180 so as to put new surfaces at the known wear points and i also believe I could see a little bow in the bar while under load. do the numbers 524 and 525 ean anything to anyone they were on the foreward ends witrh the L R marks
Thanks
Skip
74 Canyon Lands, FiTech,
3.7 FD LSD, Manny Tranny,
Springfield Distributor,
2001 Chevy Tracker Ragtop Towd
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #160864 is a reply to message #160860] |
Sun, 19 February 2012 08:01  |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Steve,
I hope you're not saying what I interpret your statement to mean: Don't
swap bars end-for-end. That matters not one iota. I THINK I've even
convinced that hard-headed Hoboken-Aussie of that.
One more time with my demonstration: Take a strip of sheet metal and twist
the ends until it forms a permanent sprial. You now have a pre-stressed
"Torsion Bar". Take one end in each hand and twist it slightly in the
"unwind" direction, simulating the installed loading of a TB; remember
which way your hands move. Now flip the TB end-for-end. Unwind it again.
I'll bet your hands move the same direction as before. QED
Now swapping side-to-side really IS verboten because that would cause the
TB to be twisted even more, NOT unwound.
Ken H.
On Sun, Feb 19, 2012 at 7:32 AM, Steven Ferguson wrote:
> 524 and 525 are the P/Ns for L & R. Flipping the Tbar will accomplish
> nothing unless you are talking about swapping end for end. That is a big
> no - no. Reinstallation must be accomplished with the same end for end
> orientation. The little bow you see is quite common, usually on the
> driver's side.
>
>
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Ken Henderson
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www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #160902 is a reply to message #160864] |
Sun, 19 February 2012 15:54 |
skip2
Messages: 544
Registered: September 2011
Location: Winter Haven,FL (center o...
Karma: 3
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No, I realized i might have given the wrong ideal but I just meant twisting not the "das Verbotten" end to end. When I saw the little curved arrow on the front end with the numbers I felt that meant "I'm made to handle load one way"
Thanks again
Skip Hartline
74 Canyon Lands, FiTech,
3.7 FD LSD, Manny Tranny,
Springfield Distributor,
2001 Chevy Tracker Ragtop Towd
[Updated on: Sun, 19 February 2012 15:55] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: T bars [message #160904 is a reply to message #160801] |
Sun, 19 February 2012 16:03 |
skip2
Messages: 544
Registered: September 2011
Location: Winter Haven,FL (center o...
Karma: 3
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Also noticed something else I saw at the end of the T bars especially at the front end there is thicker spot toward the end about 1/2 inch long and it seems that most of the strain would be on that "fat" spot rather than letting it spread over the whole socket, is that normal for tbars?
74 Canyon Lands, FiTech,
3.7 FD LSD, Manny Tranny,
Springfield Distributor,
2001 Chevy Tracker Ragtop Towd
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #160959 is a reply to message #160864] |
Mon, 20 February 2012 07:37 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Ken,
I am saying to just leave the bars as they are. Swapping sides and keeping
the twist in the same directions will only result in the replacement bar
eventually ending up as pig tailed as the one that was replaced. I
remember well the discussion on twist and orientation.
On Sun, Feb 19, 2012 at 7:01 AM, Ken Henderson <hend4800@bellsouth.net>wrote:
> Steve,
>
> I hope you're not saying what I interpret your statement to mean: Don't
> swap bars end-for-end. That matters not one iota. I THINK I've even
> convinced that hard-headed Hoboken-Aussie of that.
>
> One more time with my demonstration: Take a strip of sheet metal and twist
> the ends until it forms a permanent sprial. You now have a pre-stressed
> "Torsion Bar". Take one end in each hand and twist it slightly in the
> "unwind" direction, simulating the installed loading of a TB; remember
> which way your hands move. Now flip the TB end-for-end. Unwind it again.
> I'll bet your hands move the same direction as before. QED
>
> Now swapping side-to-side really IS verboten because that would cause the
> TB to be twisted even more, NOT unwound.
>
> Ken H.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Feb 19, 2012 at 7:32 AM, Steven Ferguson wrote:
>
> > 524 and 525 are the P/Ns for L & R. Flipping the Tbar will accomplish
> > nothing unless you are talking about swapping end for end. That is a big
> > no - no. Reinstallation must be accomplished with the same end for end
> > orientation. The little bow you see is quite common, usually on the
> > driver's side.
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Fathom the hypocrisy of a nation where every citizen must prove they have
health insurance......but not everyone has to prove they're a citizen.
Steve Ferguson
Sierra Vista, AZ
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| Re: T bars [message #160975 is a reply to message #160801] |
Mon, 20 February 2012 09:25 |
2-4 the road
Messages: 145
Registered: June 2009
Location: Fulltimers
Karma: 0
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Is there a consensus on whether or not wheel spacers
put undue pressure on the TB sockets?
Thanks in advance.
Bill
2-4 the road
77 Kingsley 455
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #160980 is a reply to message #160975] |
Mon, 20 February 2012 09:49 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Bill, If you haven't figured it out by now, there rarely is a consensus on
any subject on this forum. Some of the responses are by very talented and
gifted people, and some are interplanetary. Read em all, sort out what
seems correct to you at the time. Remember what you paid for the
information. Trust what you know and have learned for yourself. When you
put a longer flex handle on your lug wrench, does it make it any easier to
remove the lug nuts? Does having the wheels further away from the center
line of the control arm make the coach any heavier or lighter? I gurantee
that you will get conflicting opinions on this subject. Who is right is
difficult to tell. <Grin> The forgoing comments were/are not intended to
show disrespect to any contributor on the forum, and is intended to amuse
or bemuse. I am somewhat bored this morning, my signifigant other has
returned to San Rafael to take care of her house and taxes, and I am alone
again. Don't like it one bit, either. Hope to see many of you at Casa de
Fruta in April. Sign up as early as possible. Manny T and his family are
doing the food and much of the libations. Many good tech presentations are
on tap. Steinbeck Museum tours, lots to do and see in the area. Weather
should be ideal.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403
On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 7:25 AM, Bill and JoAnne Bissell <
dad.bbissel1@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Is there a consensus on whether or not wheel spacers
> put undue pressure on the TB sockets?
> Thanks in advance.
> Bill
> --
> 2-4 the road
> 77 Kingsley 455
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #160991 is a reply to message #160980] |
Mon, 20 February 2012 10:45 |
2-4 the road
Messages: 145
Registered: June 2009
Location: Fulltimers
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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The cheater on the lug wrench is a good analogy.
It tells me what I sort of knew. With the hammering
these roads give us they're coming off.
Thanks
Bill
2-4 the road
77 Kingsley 455
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| Re: T bars [message #161068 is a reply to message #160801] |
Tue, 21 February 2012 06:17 |
skip2
Messages: 544
Registered: September 2011
Location: Winter Haven,FL (center o...
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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13-20% is 1/5 more load but there is also the question of the extra strain from all the rut wandering and the continual correction required when the front and rear tires aren't in alignment on a bad road. How much extra wear and strain does that create on the whole suspension and steering system. Almost sometimes seems like a wash out either way, Which is the greater evil?
Skip
74 Canyon Lands, FiTech,
3.7 FD LSD, Manny Tranny,
Springfield Distributor,
2001 Chevy Tracker Ragtop Towd
[Updated on: Tue, 21 February 2012 06:54] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #161070 is a reply to message #161068] |
Tue, 21 February 2012 07:06 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I don't remember the numbers, even though it's only been a couple of months
now since my 1-Ton installation, but IIRC the increase in the moment on
the TB is about 20%. Frankly, I was surprised that the increase did not
translate to a lot more engagement of the adjusting screws. There's
something I'm missing in the calculation of the effects because I've been
expecting there to be a dramatic increase in demand for adjustable pork
chops.
I'm also surprised that the ride seems no softer than before. In fact,
with the urethane lower A-arm bushings, there's a new harshness to the
ride. Well, maybe I should call it "crispness" rather than "harshness".
Ken H.
On Tue, Feb 21, 2012 at 7:17 AM, Skip Hartline wrote:
>
> 13-20% is 1/5 more load but there is also the question of the extra strain
> from all the rut wandering and the continual correction required when the
> front and rear tires aren't in alignment on a bad road. How much extra wear
> and strain does that create on the whole suspension and steering system.
> Almost sometimes seems like a wash out either way, Which is the greater
> nessasary evil?
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] T bars [message #161072 is a reply to message #160975] |
Tue, 21 February 2012 07:29 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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No
There have been dire predictions of problems caused by spacers. None have come true over the past 20 years.
The one ton is a choice for the future of your gmc.
The question of tb problems was caused more by DIY alignment than spacers (we just started looking)
And
Why is the damage found only on the drivers side tb ?
Do what you have to do
Gene
FREE WIFI @ Mickey D
On Feb 20, 2012, at 7:25 AM, Bill and JoAnne Bissell <dad.bbissel1@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Is there a consensus on whether or not wheel spacers
> put undue pressure on the TB sockets?
> Thanks in advance.
> Bill
> --
> 2-4 the road
> 77 Kingsley 455
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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