Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » trans temp sensor
| trans temp sensor [message #153153] |
Thu, 15 December 2011 23:21  |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
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Sorry to ask so many questions but I have been trying to monitor my trans temps and have a fast one. People mentioned temp reading will vary depending on where the temp sensor is located. When under the coach I saw what I thought was the sensor. Looks like its on the passenger side of the trans pan. Is that the correct place to have it located for accurate temp readings?
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153155 is a reply to message #153153] |
Thu, 15 December 2011 23:38  |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
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Michael,
I have been taught by numerous people in the past that the best thing
is to know what the temp of the fluid is entering the system.
That is the pan temp.
The sensor on the driver side is monitoring the temp of fluid that is
going out to the cooler.
Pan temp will range 130-200, the Exit temp will run 180-290 or higher.
Exit temp is proportional to the load on the trans.
Pan temp is more dependent on the ambient temp.
I'm sure there will be people that will argue my point of view.
Frankly I do not care at an age of 69 and having logged over million
miles on these coaches.
On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 9:21 PM, Michael <radioactive626@msn.com> wrote:
>
>
> Sorry to ask so many questions but I have been trying to monitor my trans temps and have a fast one. People mentioned temp reading will vary depending on where the temp sensor is located. When under the coach I saw what I thought was the sensor. Looks like its on the passenger side of the trans pan. Is that the correct place to have it located for accurate temp readings?
> --
> ***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
> Michael, Casa Grande, AZ
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
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www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153158 is a reply to message #153155] |
Fri, 16 December 2011 00:38 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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| jimk wrote on Thu, 15 December 2011 23:38 |
Michael,
I have been taught by numerous people in the past that the best thing is to know what the temp of the fluid is entering the system.
That is the pan temp.
The sensor on the driver side is monitoring the temp of fluid that is going out to the cooler.
Pan temp will range 130-200, the Exit temp will run 180-290 or higher.
Exit temp is proportional to the load on the trans.
Pan temp is more dependent on the ambient temp.
I'm sure there will be people that will argue my point of view.
Frankly I do not care at an age of 69 and having logged over million miles on these coaches.
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That's good info. What is there there argue about?
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: trans temp sensor [message #153170 is a reply to message #153153] |
Fri, 16 December 2011 07:32 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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| Mr.RadioActive wrote on Thu, 15 December 2011 22:21 |
Sorry to ask so many questions but I have been trying to monitor my trans temps and have a fast one. People mentioned temp reading will vary depending on where the temp sensor is located. When under the coach I saw what I thought was the sensor. Looks like its on the passenger side of the trans pan. Is that the correct place to have it located for accurate temp readings?
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Do you have a steel or aluminum pan. If it is steel, you may be looking at the wire for the kickdown switch.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153189 is a reply to message #153186] |
Fri, 16 December 2011 11:15 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Yep, that's the one in question.
With so many miles on my coach, I want to be able
to be sure that I won't lug the engine and get up
to highway speed as quickly as possible.
Thanks for the info!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ex-Palm Beach, 76 ~ ~ ~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
_______________
*[ ]....[][ ][]\
*--OO---[]---O-*
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: weidnerl@wwt.net
> Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2011 11:02:10 -0600
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor
>
> k2gkk wrote on Fri, 16 December 2011 09:21
> > Hi, Larry.
> >
> > What is the last picture in that series?
> > Is it an adjustable transmission modulator or similar?
> > Is it still available and from what source?
> >
> > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
> > ~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
>
> IF you mean this pic...
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=26806&title=img-0716&cat=3382
>
> Then the answer is yes it is and adjustable vacuum modulator. Pic shows the instruction sheet that came with the adjustable modulator. The modulator is a replacement for the original, as shown on the sheet. Most vacuum modulators are adjustable. Pull the vacuum line off of the modulator and using a flashlight, look into the end of the modulator. You will see a screw adjustment. Follow the directions on the sheet.
>
> This modulator brand and part # are:
>
> ATP part# JX-66
>
> I got this one from NAPA
> --
> Larry :)
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153190 is a reply to message #153170] |
Fri, 16 December 2011 11:21 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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There is a kit where it comes with a sharp piercing tool with a thread tap.
The piercing Acton Will fold back enough metal to fold back so that
the tap will tap on to the material and insert a sender wit a seal
washer.
We offer that for customers that had a recent work done on the trans,
On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 5:32 AM, Bob de Kruyff <NEXT2POOL@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> Mr.RadioActive wrote on Thu, 15 December 2011 22:21
>> Sorry to ask so many questions but I have been trying to monitor my trans temps and have a fast one. People mentioned temp reading will vary depending on where the temp sensor is located. When under the coach I saw what I thought was the sensor. Looks like its on the passenger side of the trans pan. Is that the correct place to have it located for accurate temp readings?
>
> Do you have a steel or aluminum pan. If it is steel, you may be looking at the wire for the kickdown switch.
> --
> Bob de Kruyff
> 78 Eleganza
> Chandler, AZ
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153200 is a reply to message #153199] |
Fri, 16 December 2011 13:31 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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Probably yes, Larry (and all).
I don't know if I can get Money Pit usable by then, but
even if not, maybe we won't catch TOO much flack if we
resort to bringing our 30' travel trailer!
Judy has entered it into her appointment calendar! AND,
she keeps asking me if I'm gonna get the coach ready to
go by then. Sure wish I had a warm, dry place to work
on it!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ D C "Mac" Macdonald ~ ~~
~ ~ Amateur Radio - K2GKK ~ ~
~ ~ USAF and FAA, Retired ~ ~
~ ~ ~ Oklahoma City, OK ~ ~ ~
~~ ~ ~ "The Money Pit" ~ ~ ~~
~ ~ ~ ex-Palm Beach, 76 ~ ~ ~
~ www.gmcmhphotos.com/okclb ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
_______________
*[ ]....[][ ][]\
*--OO---[]---O-*
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: weidnerl@wwt.net
> Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2011 13:25:02 -0600
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor
>
> Hey Mac,
> Will we see you GMCMI rally in Shawnee OK this spring?
>
> --
> Larry :)
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
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| Re: trans temp sensor [message #153261 is a reply to message #153175] |
Sat, 17 December 2011 07:55 |
shawnee
Messages: 422
Registered: February 2004
Location: NC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Larry wrote on Fri, 16 December 2011 09:07 |
| Mr.RadioActive wrote on Thu, 15 December 2011 23:21 |
Sorry to ask so many questions but I have been trying to monitor my trans temps and have a fast one. People mentioned temp reading will vary depending on where the temp sensor is located. When under the coach I saw what I thought was the sensor. Looks like its on the passenger side of the trans pan. Is that the correct place to have it located for accurate temp readings?
|
Here's where I put my temp sensor in an original pan.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=3851&cat=3382
I'm using a mechanical water temp gauge.
JWID
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Just about anywhere in the pan will work. Manny told me once to never measure the output of the transmission or the engine oil. It will scare you to death and nothing you can do about it. Measure in the pan.
Gene Dotson
74 Canyonlands
www.bdub.net/Motorhome_Enhancements New Windows and Aluminum Radiators
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153276 is a reply to message #153274] |
Sat, 17 December 2011 10:25 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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It's important to read every sentence in that section carefully: While
they state the normal location of the temperature sensor as at the output
from the converter, most of the information, including the explanations of
the temperature ranges, and the fluid life table are base on IN PAN
temperatures. IIRC, the only place the converter output temperature is
really emphasized is in expressing how rapidly the temperature there can
rise during "stuck" conditions. I personally wouldn't worry about the
temperature until it rises in the pan. I've run with both locations
monitored, and usually the converter output is about 50*F above the pan; on
a HARD pull, that might rise to +100*F -- without the pan temperature
reaching anywhere near that level. Remember that the converter output goes
directly to the cooler, and the hotter the fluid, the more efficient that
cooler.
The information was probably written to cover most transmissions, and
merely repeated in the P-30 manual about the 4L80, which is VERY similar to
the TH400.
Ken H.
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 11:12 AM, A. wrote:
>
>
> Ken Henderson wrote on Sat, 17 December 2011 08:19
> > For some very good information on transmission temperatures, read that
> section in
> > http://www.bdub.net/manuals/P30/P30.pdf
> >
> > Ken H.Gene Dotson wrote on Sat, 17 December 2011 08:55
> > > ...Just about anywhere in the pan will work. Manny told me once to
> never measure the output of the transmission or the engine oil. It will
> scare you to death and nothing you can do about it. Measure in the pan.
> Appendix 8.1 of the document at Ken's url implies that, contrary to what
> Manny told Gene, it would be a good idea to measure the temperature at the
> output of the transmission, and to act quickly if it reaches 350 degrees.
> But I suppose this could be related to a different transmission. If so,
> then would the pan temperature table of Appendix 8.1 be applicable?
> --
>
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Ken Henderson
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www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153352 is a reply to message #153276] |
Sat, 17 December 2011 19:43 |
A Hamilto
Messages: 4508
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 39
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Senior Member |
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| Ken Henderson wrote on Sat, 17 December 2011 10:25 |
It's important to read every sentence in that section carefully: While they state the normal location of the temperature sensor as at the output from the converter, most of the information, including the explanations of the temperature ranges, and the fluid life table are base on IN PAN temperatures. IIRC, the only place the converter output temperature is really emphasized is in expressing how rapidly the temperature there can rise during "stuck" conditions. I personally wouldn't worry about the temperature until it rises in the pan. I've run with both locations monitored, and usually the converter output is about 50*F above the pan; on a HARD pull, that might rise to +100*F -- without the pan temperature reaching anywhere near that level. Remember that the converter output goes directly to the cooler, and the hotter the fluid, the more efficient that cooler.
The information was probably written to cover most transmissions, and merely repeated in the P-30 manual about the 4L80, which is VERY similar to the TH400.
Ken H.
|
I see most of what you are saying. But I interpret the following to say that the converter output is THE place to install a gage AND when the temperature on the output of the converter hits 350 degrees, ACT IMMEDIATELY TO PREVENT DAMAGE:
"OIL TEMPERATURE MEASURED AT CONVERTER OUTLET TO COOLER
350°F is the maximum temperature.
This is the normal place to install a temperature gage or signal.
The temperature in this location will vary significantly with each vehicle start-up or hill.
If the temperature reaches 350°F, reduce throttle. To lower the transmission temperature with the transmission in NEUTRAL, run the engine at 1,200 RPM for 2-3 minutes to cool the oil.
Do not allow the converter outlet temperature to exceed 350°F."
The NEXT paragraph explains pan temperatures:
"OIL TEMPERATURES MEASURED IN THE SUMP OR OIL PAN
150°F - Minimum operating temperature for continuous operation. It is possible in low ambient temperature to overcool the transmission with oil to air-type coolers; it is hard to overcool if used in conjunction with oil to water coolers installed in most standard automotive radiators.
190°-200°F- Proper oil level checking temperature.
200°F - Maximum oil level checking temperature. Beyond this, readings are not reliable because of expansion.
285°F - Maximum sump/oil pan temperatures for short duration, such as a long hill climb.
300°F- Metal parts inside the transmission begin to warp and distort in varying degrees, seals melt rapidly, and transmission fluid life is extremely short due to oxidation and distress."
I don't see how you could go wrong with instrumentation to alert you if/when the converter output temperature exceeds 350 degrees.
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153681 is a reply to message #153158] |
Tue, 20 December 2011 08:02 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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Well, if I put one, I'll put two. What I want to know is the rise across the trans. I do the same with high powered transmitters - look at the inlet (pan) and the outlet (feed to the cooler) and subtract. Difference is temp rise. Apropos of which, what should we expect as a rise, at highway speeds and stressing it up a long grade?
--johnny
'76 23' Transmode Norris
'76 Palm Beach
________________________________
From: Ken Burton <n9cv@comcast.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 1:38 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor
jimk wrote on Thu, 15 December 2011 23:38
> Michael,
> I have been taught by numerous people in the past that the best thing is to know what the temp of the fluid is entering the system.
> That is the pan temp.
> The sensor on the driver side is monitoring the temp of fluid that is going out to the cooler.
> Pan temp will range 130-200, the Exit temp will run 180-290 or higher.
> Exit temp is proportional to the load on the trans.
> Pan temp is more dependent on the ambient temp.
> I'm sure there will be people that will argue my point of view.
> Frankly I do not care at an age of 69 and having logged over million miles on these coaches.
That's good info. What is there there argue about?
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] trans temp sensor [message #153682 is a reply to message #153681] |
Tue, 20 December 2011 08:18 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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About 50*F cruising, 100*F towing uphill, IIRC
Ken H.
On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 9:02 AM, Johnny Bridges wrote:
> Apropos of which, what should we expect as a rise, at highway speeds and
> stressing it up a long grade?
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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