Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » plug wire question
| plug wire question [message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 17:15  |
chasingsummer
Messages: 434
Registered: May 2011
Location: asheboro, nc
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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my timing chain came in, so presently i am taking pictures and etc. i hope to start real work saturday.
75 model coach with a 74 year build. i guess 455, but i have not confurmed with any block numbers. my M.M. is labeled 75 and 76. on page 6y-34 there is a drawing showing engine firing order and cap wire location. on page 6y-50 there is a similiar picture. both imply different location of plug wires on dist cap. neither matches how my coach is set up. my dizzy is hei but i assume that makes no true difference. my questions are, if i am facing my windshield, then look down at cap, where should number one wire be, and should my 2 marks on the gears align up when dizzy is at one or at 6
thanks bgk
brian
asheboro, nc
75 eleganza, 74 build
119k miles and counting,
DOG HOUSE
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143377 is a reply to message #143372] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 17:32  |
chasingsummer
Messages: 434
Registered: May 2011
Location: asheboro, nc
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i can see that my firing order is correct, but based on this picture, my number one wire from the left front side of engine goes to what is labeled as number 4 on the distributor cap.
my dizzy cap has the notch in it, so it can only fit one way. i have not removed dizzy since i have own. from iowa to nc it ran good, besides my visit to Blaines , and my recent trip on the parkway it ran good. i do assume it is important for number one to be at correct position, i am confused.
brian
asheboro, nc
75 eleganza, 74 build
119k miles and counting,
DOG HOUSE
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143381 is a reply to message #143377] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 17:55 |
GMC Cruse
Messages: 606
Registered: June 2009
Location: SE Michigan
Karma: 3
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| chasingsummer wrote on Wed, 14 September 2011 18:32 |
i can see that my firing order is correct, but based on this picture, my number one wire from the left front side of engine goes to what is labeled as number 4 on the distributor cap.
my dizzy cap has the notch in it, so it can only fit one way. i have not removed dizzy since i have own. from iowa to nc it ran good, besides my visit to Blaines , and my recent trip on the parkway it ran good. i do assume it is important for number one to be at correct position, i am confused.
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Whoever put the distributer in must have dropped it in a few teeth off and moved the plug wires to get #1 to line up with the rotor. If you redo it and the plug wires to the manual orientations, you might also have to swap the plug wires to different cylinders so that the lengths aren't too short or too long.
Mike K.
'75 PB
Southeast Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question [message #143383 is a reply to message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:01 |
Gary Worobec
Messages: 867
Registered: May 2005
Karma: -1
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When the timing marks on the engine line up either #1 or #6 will be at TDC.
The position of the cap is relative to how the distributor was inserted into
the block. For the HEI ideally #1 plug wire should be at 6 o'clock looking
down on the distributor and #6 should be at 12:00. If it's running fine
don;t touch it. Aligning the distributor cap has more to do with neat
looking plug wires than timing. Mine is off by a tooth so my #1 is at 7
o'clock.
Thanks
Gary and Joanne Worobec
1973 GMC Glacier
Anza, CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "brian" <chasingsummer@triad.rr.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 3:15 PM
Subject: [GMCnet] plug wire question
>
>
> my timing chain came in, so presently i am taking pictures and etc. i hope
> to start real work saturday.
> 75 model coach with a 74 year build. i guess 455, but i have not confurmed
> with any block numbers. my M.M. is labeled 75 and 76. on page 6y-34 there
> is a drawing showing engine firing order and cap wire location. on page
> 6y-50 there is a similiar picture. both imply different location of plug
> wires on dist cap. neither matches how my coach is set up. my dizzy is hei
> but i assume that makes no true difference. my questions are, if i am
> facing my windshield, then look down at cap, where should number one wire
> be, and should my 2 marks on the gears align up when dizzy is at one or at
> 6
> thanks bgk
> --
> brian
> asheboro, nc
> 75 eleganza 2 74 build
> 118k miles and counting,
> DOG HOUSE
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143385 is a reply to message #143381] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:09 |
chasingsummer
Messages: 434
Registered: May 2011
Location: asheboro, nc
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presently, i do not wish to redo as much as i wish to understand, and have good notes for doing my timing chain.
if dizzy is off 90 degrees, but running, should i assume my cam and crank gear line up when i am at my number one plug wire, or 90 degrees off so that it would line up when dizzy is at what should be number one on cap which is my number 7??
brian
asheboro, nc
75 eleganza, 74 build
119k miles and counting,
DOG HOUSE
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| Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question [message #143386 is a reply to message #143383] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:15 |
chasingsummer
Messages: 434
Registered: May 2011
Location: asheboro, nc
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Gary
so if i understand, i am making something out of nothing?
if my rotor is pointing to number one, and my timing mark is aligned up, then my cam and crank gears should be with the marks one at 6 and the other at 12. and once completed with chain replacement, i use my number one wire for to set timing like normal.
sorry to be so bothersome, but new to some of this and i hate creating additional problems
thanks
brian
brian
asheboro, nc
75 eleganza, 74 build
119k miles and counting,
DOG HOUSE
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| Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question [message #143387 is a reply to message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:18 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Brian,
When you disassemble the front of the engine and get down to the timing gears and chain align the gears as per the picture below:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=28476&nocache=1
You can then check where the dizzy is pointing.
Regards,
Rob M.
-----Original Message-----
From: brian
my timing chain came in, so presently i am taking pictures and etc. i hope to start real work saturday.
75 model coach with a 74 year build. i guess 455, but i have not confurmed with any block numbers. my M.M. is labeled 75 and 76. on
page 6y-34 there is a drawing showing engine firing order and cap wire location. on page 6y-50 there is a similiar picture. both
imply different location of plug wires on dist cap. neither matches how my coach is set up. my dizzy is hei but i assume that makes
no true difference. my questions are, if i am facing my windshield, then look down at cap, where should number one wire be, and
should my 2 marks on the gears align up when dizzy is at one or at 6
thanks bgk
--
brian
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143390 is a reply to message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:31 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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I matters for reasons of clearance on the vac diaphragm and wirecut lengths. You can go to whatever tooth and "fix" it with the dist position other than that.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question [message #143391 is a reply to message #143386] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 18:29 |
Gary Worobec
Messages: 867
Registered: May 2005
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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If the timing marks are at zero and the rotor is at #1 and the engine runs
fine then you really should just have to slide the timing chain sprockets on
and off. With that said you will need to check your inital spark advance
with a timing light because with new timing chain it is bound to be off by a
bit either too little or too much.
Thanks
Gary and Joanne Worobec
1973 GMC Glacier
Anza, CA
----- Original Message -----
From: "brian" <chasingsummer@triad.rr.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question
>
>
> Gary
> so if i understand, i am making something out of nothing?
> if my rotor is pointing to number one, and my timing mark is aligned up,
> then my cam and crank gears should be with the marks one at 6 and the
> other at 12. and once completed with chain replacement, i use my number
> one wire for to set timing like normal.
> sorry to be so bothersome, but new to some of this and i hate creating
> additional problems
> thanks
> brian
> --
> brian
> asheboro, nc
> 75 eleganza 2 74 build
> 118k miles and counting,
> DOG HOUSE
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143406 is a reply to message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 19:35 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
Karma: 0
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| chasingsummer wrote on Wed, 14 September 2011 15:15 |
... on page 6y-34 there is a drawing showing engine firing order and cap wire location. on page 6y-50 there is a similiar picture. both imply different location of plug wires on dist cap. neither matches how my coach is set up. ...
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In my earlier days, I would install a distributor by lining up #1 to top-dead-center and dropping the distributor in the hole. Wherever it was pointing I called #1 and plugged in the wires from there following the firing order. If it started I moved on to timing... If it didn't I swapped #1 to the connector 180 degrees from the "first #1", reconnected the rest in firing order and tried it again.
While it worked... the motor work run just fine. It just didn't match the manual. (Motors do not read manuals.)
I now take the time to index the teeth so it is at least close to the manual. I confused to many "mechanics."
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
[Updated on: Wed, 14 September 2011 19:36] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: plug wire question [message #143409 is a reply to message #143371] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 19:57 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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You are working with two different timing issues.
Crankshaft to cam and cam to distributor. Since the one youy are taking apart inthe crankshaft to cam that is the one you want to make sure you reinstall it correctly. The cam to distributor is not going to change if you do not mess with it.
Yes someone may in thepast have inserted the distributor incorrectly and move the wire eith ckockwise or counter clockwise around the cap to compensate for it. Who cares? Leave that along and install you timing chain.
After you are done with the timing chain installation and everything is running correctly, if you want to change the wiring on the cap and re-time the distributor, do that as a separate project. It will not hurt anything to leave the wiring installed as it is forever. Changing it will only allow you to match the picture in the book.
Please do check the distributor timing with a light before driving it anywhere. I know of one case where someone did not do this after changing the timing chain and he destroyed an engine do to detonation. The new chain is much tighter and will change the ignition timing by a few degrees.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] plug wire question [message #143411 is a reply to message #143406] |
Wed, 14 September 2011 19:59 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Mike,
EXCELLENT POINT!
Regards,
Rob
-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Miller
I now take the time to index the teeth so it is at least close to the manual. I confused to many "mechanics."
--
Mike
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GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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