Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes...
| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130757] |
Sat, 18 June 2011 14:21  |
sgltrac
Messages: 2797
Registered: April 2011
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Stupid question but how does the system on the electro level one know when it is level? Is there a switch in the compressor housing somewhere or is there some kind of manual set up or reset to initialize the system??
Sully
77royale
------Original Message------
From: John Sharpe
Sender: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
ReplyTo: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes...
Sent: Jun 18, 2011 11:02 AM
The diodes for both are located in the wiring harness at the switches next to the driver. I doubt if there is a problem with the diodes. It's more common to be switches or connectors.
ElectroLevel has one compressor ,an air tank & leveling valves. Electrolevel II has two small compressors and electronic level sensors.
--
John Sharpe
Humble,TX
'78 Eleganza TBI
'89 Spectrum 2000 V-10
'40 Ford Deluxe TBI
mailto:johnasharpe@gmail.com
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Sully
77 Royale basket case.
Future motorhome land speed record holder(bucket list)
Seattle, Wa.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130761 is a reply to message #130757] |
Sat, 18 June 2011 15:17  |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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There is a VERY GOOD description in the 1977 & 1978 Maintenance Manual
Supplement, X-7725 in section 4. If you have an EL I, it is a bit of a
hybrid, sharing some of the earlier coaches features including the air
valves for ride height control, and 2 small pressure tanks, and quite a few
air lines. The EL II did away with most of the pneumatic stuff, and relied
upon 1978 "state of the art" for the time electronic ride height controls.
Takes some sorting out, TZE number checking to tell exactly what you have.
None of the systems requires a degree in engineering to understand. Just a
healthy dose of curiosity and a willingness to learn what you don't already
know, which you have already demonstrated that you posess. Contact me off
net if you have more specific questions, because if my answers get too long,
we get into Bandwidth problems with the moderator police.<Grin>
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMc Royale 403 EL II
On Sat, Jun 18, 2011 at 12:21 PM, <sgltrac@gmail.com> wrote:
> Stupid question but how does the system on the electro level one know when
> it is level? Is there a switch in the compressor housing somewhere or is
> there some kind of manual set up or reset to initialize the system??
>
> Sully
> 77royale
> ------Original Message------
> From: John Sharpe
> Sender: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> ReplyTo: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes...
> Sent: Jun 18, 2011 11:02 AM
>
>
>
> The diodes for both are located in the wiring harness at the switches next
> to the driver. I doubt if there is a problem with the diodes. It's more
> common to be switches or connectors.
>
> ElectroLevel has one compressor ,an air tank & leveling valves.
> Electrolevel II has two small compressors and electronic level sensors.
> --
> John Sharpe
> Humble,TX
> '78 Eleganza TBI
> '89 Spectrum 2000 V-10
> '40 Ford Deluxe TBI
> mailto:johnasharpe@gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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>
> Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130779 is a reply to message #130757] |
Sat, 18 June 2011 19:42 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
Karma: 0
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| sgltrac wrote on Sat, 18 June 2011 12:21 |
... how does the system on the electro level one know when it is level? ...
|
Simple answer: They do not.
Longer answer:
None of the systems that came from the factory maintain "LEVEL." They all maintained ride HEIGHT. (Not the same thing.)
The power level (m.y. 1973 to just into 1976) and the Electro Level (EL1) (post PL to mid m.y. 1978) had height valves in each rear wheel well to control the height. (Note that NONE of the airlines from these valves go directly to the air-bags... the air pressure is routed up through the dash valves (PL) or solenoids (EL1) and back to the wheel well before reaching the air bags.)
The Electro Level 2 (EL2) system, installed only in the last half year of production, had electronic height sensors in place of the valves in the wheels. The greatly reduced the "plumbing" but added some "70's" electronics.
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130784 is a reply to message #130757] |
Sat, 18 June 2011 20:10 |
amdgmcman
Messages: 76
Registered: April 2007
Location: Long Beach, CA
Karma: 0
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Member |
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I have the 78 Royale Coachman Center kitchen floorplan with a ELll suspension. My dad bought it in 2001 from a gentleman that upgraded the coach in 1996-97.
When we first got the Royale the suspension worked great. Within the last few years it blows 30 amp fuses every time you level the coach. I have been buying Harbor Freight fuses, so maybe the fact they are so cheap is the reason. I just ordered some good quality 30A glass units on Amazon I expect to receive in a couple of days … I’ll see if they make a difference. I took it to Miguel at MGM a couple of years ago, (2009),before I went on a 6200 mile trip across the US, and he suggested that the PO installed heavy duty stabilizers on the front and rear of the coach that is pulling against the suspension thus working it harder. He checked the compressors and said they were fine. The fuses are extremely hot when they blow. I just keep replacing the burnt fuse and continue leveling. I’m always running the engine when leveling, and I have no other electric issues. It usually takes 2-3 blown fuses to level the coach. The fuses rarely blow when using the auto-level feature when driving, but often when running the compressors for an extended time like when leveling the coach at a campground or other uneven surface. If I raise one side at a time, the compressor runs faster and it DOES NOT blow a fuse .
Thanks,
AMDGMCMan
Alan M DeLuccio
78 Royale with
Coachmen,Center Kitchen Floorplan
09 Harley Davidson Street Glide
65 Corvair Monza Convertible
96 RAV4 2 door Manual 4WD
Long Beach, CA
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130819 is a reply to message #130761] |
Sat, 18 June 2011 18:24 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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G'day,
If you don't have copy of the MM for your coach you can find them here along
with the Parts Book (PB) and HEAPS of other manuals!
http://www.bdub.net/manuals/index.html
It's pretty easy to tell the Electro Level (EL) I and II apart, just look in
the wheel well. If you see a small device with two colored lines going into
it and one going to the air bag that's a height control valve which is used
in the Power Level or Electro Level I systems. If the small device has wires
going to it then it's an electronic height sensor then it's an Electro Level
II system.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of James Hupy
Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2011 6:18 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes...
There is a VERY GOOD description in the 1977 & 1978 Maintenance Manual
Supplement, X-7725 in section 4. If you have an EL I, it is a bit of a
hybrid, sharing some of the earlier coaches features including the air
valves for ride height control, and 2 small pressure tanks, and quite a few
air lines. The EL II did away with most of the pneumatic stuff, and relied
upon 1978 "state of the art" for the time electronic ride height controls.
Takes some sorting out, TZE number checking to tell exactly what you have.
None of the systems requires a degree in engineering to understand. Just a
healthy dose of curiosity and a willingness to learn what you don't already
know, which you have already demonstrated that you posess. Contact me off
net if you have more specific questions, because if my answers get too long,
we get into Bandwidth problems with the moderator police.<Grin>
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMc Royale 403 EL II
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130826 is a reply to message #130784] |
Sun, 19 June 2011 04:32 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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If the fuses are very hot when they blow than you have a bad connection at the fuses or the wire terminal connecting to the fuses. Heat in any electrical connection equals at bad (high resistance) connection. Clean up the connections and put more tension on the holder of the fuse.
You can buy a 30 amp circuit breaker from AutoZone that will plug-in in place of a fuse for around $3.00. This will trip and after a brief period of time reset and be ready to go again.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130840 is a reply to message #130829] |
Sun, 19 June 2011 08:34 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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Hardie, Another possibility that exists when one compressor blows a fuse and
the other does not is that it is not a mechanical/pneumatic problem, but one
of a compressor motor with a high current draw due to a bad relay,
conductor, connector or ground in that compressor circuit. Mentally separate
the functional issues from the electrical ones when you are trouble shooting
the problem and it is easier to understand, at least in my case. The EL II
is a quite simple system, but things like plugged dessicant (that black
plastic thing screwed into the compressors, can overload the compressor,
especially in high humidity areas like the midwest and southern US. The
reason that the compressors speed up when the outlet valves are closed, is
that they have reached their max limited pressure and are releasing or
popping off pressure to the atmosphere to prevent damage to the compressor
or the air bags from overpressure.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403 EL II
On Sun, Jun 19, 2011 at 5:42 AM, Hardie Johnson <hardie.j@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> amdgmcman wrote on Sat, 18 June 2011 21:10
> > I have the 78 Royale Coachman Center kitchen floorplan with a ELll
> suspension. My dad bought it in 2001 from a gentleman that upgraded the
> coach in 1996-97. <> If I raise one side at a time, the compressor runs
> faster and it DOES NOT blow a fuse.
>
> Now that's odd. A compressor that is pumping into a volume will slow when
> it is actually moving air, i.e., it is doing work. When you block the flow
> it speeds up because it is unloaded and is not moving air. It will also
> speed up if it is unloaded by releasing the load when the output just vents.
> Blowing fuses indicates that it is running under a load. Running faster
> might mean there is less of a load when you raise one side. I would suspect
> there is a restriction due to an undersize fitting or a pinched line. Maybe
> it is just time to update the compressor.
> I believe the height adjusting feature is important and should be retained.
> Others will suggest a fill valve on the bag or the remote control system.
>
> --
> Hardie Johnson "Crashj"
> 1973 26 foot Glacier, White Thing
> Raleigh NC
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Air Bag Suspension relays and diodes... [message #130850 is a reply to message #130840] |
Sun, 19 June 2011 09:13 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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---or---
you can do this
http://www.gmcmotorhome.info/wireless.html
gene
On Sun, Jun 19, 2011 at 6:34 AM, James Hupy <jamesh1296@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hardie, Another possibility that exists when one compressor blows a fuse
> and
> the other does not is that it is not a mechanical/pneumatic problem, but
> one
> of a compressor motor with a high current draw due to a bad relay,
> conductor, connector or ground in that compressor circuit. Mentally
> separate
> the functional issues from the electrical ones when you are trouble
> shooting
> the problem and it is easier to understand, at least in my case. The EL II
> is a quite simple system, but things like plugged dessicant (that black
> plastic thing screwed into the compressors, can overload the compressor,
> especially in high humidity areas like the midwest and southern US. The
> reason that the compressors speed up when the outlet valves are closed, is
> that they have reached their max limited pressure and are releasing or
> popping off pressure to the atmosphere to prevent damage to the compressor
> or the air bags from overpressure.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, OR
> 78 GMC Royale 403 EL II
>
> On Sun, Jun 19, 2011 at 5:42 AM, Hardie Johnson <hardie.j@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > amdgmcman wrote on Sat, 18 June 2011 21:10
> > > I have the 78 Royale Coachman Center kitchen floorplan with a ELll
> > suspension. My dad bought it in 2001 from a gentleman that upgraded the
> > coach in 1996-97. <> If I raise one side at a time, the compressor runs
> > faster and it DOES NOT blow a fuse.
> >
> > Now that's odd. A compressor that is pumping into a volume will slow when
> > it is actually moving air, i.e., it is doing work. When you block the
> flow
> > it speeds up because it is unloaded and is not moving air. It will also
> > speed up if it is unloaded by releasing the load when the output just
> vents.
> > Blowing fuses indicates that it is running under a load. Running faster
> > might mean there is less of a load when you raise one side. I would
> suspect
> > there is a restriction due to an undersize fitting or a pinched line.
> Maybe
> > it is just time to update the compressor.
> > I believe the height adjusting feature is important and should be
> retained.
> > Others will suggest a fill valve on the bag or the remote control system.
> >
> > --
> > Hardie Johnson "Crashj"
> > 1973 26 foot Glacier, White Thing
> > Raleigh NC
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
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