Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Height Level Valve (I dont think its operating correctly)
| Height Level Valve [message #128036] |
Mon, 30 May 2011 23:55  |
Donovan-formerly Jase386
Messages: 139
Registered: January 2009
Location: Greenville SC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent working properly?
i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same height, and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to raise it with the knob inside and let it settle back to its set height. The passenger side rises....and rises and rises some more no matter where i set the valve..
maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from center rest which way should the body move?
to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
Donovan, Greenville SC
1975 Eleganza II
81,500 miles
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128040 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 02:25  |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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G'day,
The instructions to overhaul the Height Control Valves can be found in
Maintenance Manual X-7525 pages 4-21 TO 4-26 HEIGHT CONTROL VALVE OVERHAUL.
If you don't have a copy of the MM you can download it here:
http://www.bdub.net/factory-manuals.html
If after you review the manual if you do not have the tools or expertise to
rebuild the height control valves you can get rebuilt ones here:
http://www.bdub.net/lenzi/index.html#HeightControlValve
NOTE: Dave also sells adjustable links that replace the fixed length ones.
Ken Henderson also sells adjustable length links:
GMCWiperMan@bellsouth.net
New Height Control Valves are available here:
http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/685
I'm sorry but I don't understand the way you are describing your problem
well enough to respond.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of jase386
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 2:55 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve
Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent working
properly?
i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same height,
and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to raise it with the
knob inside and let it settle back to its set height. The passenger side
rises....and rises and rises some more no matter where i set the valve..
maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from center rest
which way should the body move?
to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
--
Donovan, Greenville SC
1975 Eleganza II (Ella)
72,500 miles
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128041 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 04:21 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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I suggest you read through these articles
http://gmcmotorhome.info/list.html#Rear
and in particular this one by Duane
http://www.gmcws.org/Tech/dsimmons/air_suspension/air-suspension-system.html
this might give you and indication of how your system operates, and what you
can do to fix it..
and then there is the new "wireless system" that might just be the easy way
go get-er-done
http://gmcmotorhome.info/wireless.html
good luck
gene
gene
On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 9:55 PM, jase386 <jase386@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent working
> properly?
>
> i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same height,
> and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to raise it with the
> knob inside and let it settle back to its set height. The passenger side
> rises....and rises and rises some more no matter where i set the valve..
>
> maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from center rest
> which way should the body move?
>
>
> to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
>
>
> thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
> --
> Donovan, Greenville SC
> 1975 Eleganza II (Ella)
> 72,500 miles
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128043 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 05:06 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Donovan,
The ride height control valves are not an item that can be rebuilt
easily. It does require some special tools and the silicone fill
fluid has a somewhat high viscosity at 3000 Cp and is not generally
available and it is quite expensive in small quantities (250ML). You
cannot beat the price and cost of having Dave Lenzi rebuild your
units. <http://www.bdub.net/lenzi/index.html#HeightControlValve>. If
you decide that you want to purchase new valves then Jim K has them. <http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/685
> I also recommend the adjustable links for the height control
valves. <http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/704>
J. R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
78 Buskirk 30' Stretch
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
On May 31, 2011, at 12:55 AM, jase386 wrote:
>
>
> Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent
> working properly?
>
> i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same
> height, and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to
> raise it with the knob inside and let it settle back to its set
> height. The passenger side rises....and rises and rises some more
> no matter where i set the valve..
>
> maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from
> center rest which way should the body move?
>
>
> to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
>
>
> thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
> --
> Donovan, Greenville SC
> 1975 Eleganza II (Ella)
> 72,500 miles
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: Height Level Valve [message #128048 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 07:26 |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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Just wondering if there is an electric ride height control kit available. As I write this I did not look at the link for the wireless unit, but others I have seen only set the airbag pressure, not the ride height.
I have a 77 with ElectroLevel II so I already have all the electric air valves that are required. All that is needed is a ride height sensor and controller.
With an electric (electronic), setting the ride height would adjusted just by varying an internal reference number in the controller for each side. Electronic controls means only one air line going to each side and a wire to each sensor. Also ride height hysteresis and auto adjust delays could be adjusted to suit the GMC and would not be affected by temperature.
Presets could allow for a higher setting in the city (for driveway clearance) verses best handling on the highway.
A memory setting for the campsite could also allow you to reset level periodically in case of leak-downs.
My level controls are not GM OEM as it is, but they seem to work Ok except they fixed, no adjustment.
I'm sure there are controls available that are electronic, otherwise at some point I'll roll my own.
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128056 is a reply to message #128054] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 08:53 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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Bruce, probably a good 1/3 to 1/2 of all the early coaches have shut off
valves at the air bags because the long air lines & numerous connections &
etc. have a tendency to lose air. Many of them just have shrader valves, and
have eliminated the leveling valves & height leveling knobs in the dash.
Some people even carry air compressors & notched stick type height
adjustment gages. What ever you wind up with, each system has plusses and
minuses. As far as OEM systems go, I personally prefer the EL II. Fewer air
lines, shorter air lines, no air tanks, electronic ride height control. The
wireless system I have only seen demonstrated, although, I have seen the
brand Shock Wave on hot rods & they work really well. I believe that air
valve ride height controls are like hard drives in computers. There are two
basic types. One that has already crashed, and one that hasn't crashed yet.
With the ride height controllers, same deal, only substitute the word leaked
for crashed. I have quite a good bit of experience with EL II controllers,
there are no user servicible parts inside. Shutter wheel, photo transistors
and light emitting diodes are visible, everything else is in molded epoxy.
Circuits are fairly straight forward, and the supplemental 77-78 Shop manual
has a very detailed section on them. JWIK.
Jim Hupy
Salem, OR
78 GMC Royale 403
On Tue, May 31, 2011 at 6:33 AM, Bruce Hislop <bruce@perthcomm.com> wrote:
>
>
> Quote:
> > > Just wondering if there is an electric ride height control kit
> available.
> > > As I write this I did not look at the link for the wireless unit, but
> > > others I have seen only set the airbag pressure, not the ride height.
> > >
> >
> > which is all you need.....
> > you will find this is going to be the way of the future
>
>
> Using pressure only would mean the ride height would change with the
> loading of the vehicle? Full fuel to low fuel... add in fresh and black
> water tanks levels... and its been said ride height is critical for
> handling.
>
> or am I missing something?
>
> --
> Bruce Hislop,
> S. Ontario Canada
> 77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI and ESC.
> Hubler front end installed and WOW! !:)
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128057 is a reply to message #128054] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 08:56 |
Mr ERFisher
Messages: 7117
Registered: August 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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In fact, the load almost never changes.
I always run in travel and my pumps never run /-- and my level system is perfect
JWID
Gene
FREE WIFI @ Mickey D
On May 31, 2011, at 6:33 AM, Bruce Hislop <bruce@perthcomm.com> wrote:
>
>
> Quote:
>>> Just wondering if there is an electric ride height control kit available.
>>> As I write this I did not look at the link for the wireless unit, but
>>> others I have seen only set the airbag pressure, not the ride height.
>>>
>>
>> which is all you need.....
>> you will find this is going to be the way of the future
>
>
> Using pressure only would mean the ride height would change with the loading of the vehicle? Full fuel to low fuel... add in fresh and black water tanks levels... and its been said ride height is critical for handling.
>
> or am I missing something?
>
> --
> Bruce Hislop,
> S. Ontario Canada
> 77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI and ESC.
> Hubler front end installed and WOW! !:)
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: Height Level Valve [message #128091 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 14:33 |
Donovan-formerly Jase386
Messages: 139
Registered: January 2009
Location: Greenville SC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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unless the plumbing is mixed up somewhere other than the dash, the colored tubes all correspond with where they are supposed to.
would a faulty height valve cause one side to continue raising and not ever bleed it when in travel?
Donovan, Greenville SC
1975 Eleganza II
81,500 miles
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| Re: Height Level Valve [message #128096 is a reply to message #128036] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 14:48 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Donovan-formerly Jase386 wrote on Mon, 30 May 2011 21:55 |
Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent working properly?
i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same height, and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to raise it with the knob inside and let it settle back to its set height. The passenger side rises....and rises and rises some more no matter where i set the valve..
maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from center rest which way should the body move?
to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
|
I suspect you have "stuff" in your airlines. The following link has a good flushing procedure.. (I know it is titled EL(1) and you have a power level... but that part is the same.): <http://gmcmotorhome.info/levelsch.htm#FLUSH>
Rick has a good power level trouble shooting. (Some of which applies to the Electro-Level systems.) It can be found here:
<http://gmcmotorhome.info/levelsch.htm#power>
Basically, Get the system to hold air on HOLD. Then get it to go up and down MANUALLY. THEN and only THEN, work on the automatic TRAVEL.
All systems could use adjustable linkages. I tried to "make" a set from hardware store bits and pieces.... I'll be buying a set of "real" links soon.
For info:
I have one example of each system. I like the EL2 system best. It has the fewest airlines and valves, but the "electronics" are from the'70's... and could be a bit better.
Reliability could be better and it would be nice to have a couple of different pre-set levels. An newer ELECTRONIC system could do this. Some have gone to a wireless electronic system, but I would like it to actually measure the height... not pressure. Wireless would be nice, but not a requirement.
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128099 is a reply to message #128096] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 16:39 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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G'day,
I like the Power Level System best as it follows the KISS principle. As
noted in a previous message I've rebuilt both Avions with the best
components available and that's that! ;-)
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Miller
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2011 5:49 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve
I have one example of each system. I like the EL2 system best. It has the
fewest airlines and valves, but the "electronics" are from the'70's... and
could be a bit better.
Reliability could be better and it would be nice to have a couple of
different pre-set levels. An newer ELECTRONIC system could do this. Some
have gone to a wireless electronic system, but I would like it to actually
measure the height... not pressure. Wireless would be nice, but not a
requirement.
--
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
'73 26' exPainted D. -- `78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- `77 23' Birchaven
Side Bath
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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GMCnet mailing list
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128103 is a reply to message #128096] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 17:06 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Mike,
Why don't you find an off-the-shelf ride height sensor with analog
output and design a controller? With a 0-5 VDC or 0-12 VDC output
from a sensor and a comparator driving a pair of relays, it would be
simple to control an Electrolevel II compressor. on each side. A
potentiometer could provide the reference input to the comparator and
be used for ride height control. Ideally a pot with detent at
standard ride height would be used. Or switch selected resistances
could provide multiple fixed ride heights.
If anyone really wants to eliminate wires, the bang-bang operation of
ELII would be easily handled for both sides with a 4-channel remote
controller like:
http://www.lightobject.com/4CH-RF-Wireless-Remote-Control-1527-TxRx-Kit-Metal-case-P351.aspx
http://goo.gl/YDoZX
I suspect the design would be trivial for you, Bruce, or any one of
several other regulars here who have expressed an interest in the
problem.
The only question is whether the improvement vs ELII is worth the trouble.
Ken H.
On Tue, May 31, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Mike Miller <m000035@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Donovan-formerly Jase386 wrote on Mon, 30 May 2011 21:55
>> Does anyone have instructions on rebuilding them if they arent working properly?
>>
>> i have tried and tried and tried to get both sides set at the same height, and the drivers side wont raise up on its own, i have to raise it with the knob inside and let it settle back to its set height. The passenger side rises....and rises and rises some more no matter where i set the valve..
>>
>> maybe im setting them wrong.. if i push up on the valve from center rest which way should the body move?
>>
>> to have a lower right level i should set the linkage shorter?
>>
>> thanks for the help, sometimes i get confused.
>
>
> I suspect you have "stuff" in your airlines. The following link has a good flushing procedure.. (I know it is titled EL(1) and you have a power level... but that part is the same.): <http://gmcmotorhome.info/levelsch.htm#FLUSH>
>
> Rick has a good power level trouble shooting. (Some of which applies to the Electro-Level systems.) It can be found here:
> <http://gmcmotorhome.info/levelsch.htm#power>
>
> Basically, Get the system to hold air on HOLD. Then get it to go up and down MANUALLY. THEN and only THEN, work on the automatic TRAVEL.
>
> All systems could use adjustable linkages. I tried to "make" a set from hardware store bits and pieces.... I'll be buying a set of "real" links soon.
>
> For info:
>
> I have one example of each system. I like the EL2 system best. It has the fewest airlines and valves, but the "electronics" are from the'70's... and could be a bit better.
>
> Reliability could be better and it would be nice to have a couple of different pre-set levels. An newer ELECTRONIC system could do this. Some have gone to a wireless electronic system, but I would like it to actually measure the height... not pressure. Wireless would be nice, but not a requirement.
> --
> Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
> '73 26' exPainted D. -- `78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- `77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
> http://m000035.blogspot.com
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128117 is a reply to message #128103] |
Tue, 31 May 2011 21:24 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Ken Henderson wrote on Tue, 31 May 2011 15:06 |
Mike,
Why don't you find an off-the-shelf ride height sensor with analog
output and design a controller? ...
|
Right.... I'll get right on that!
I am so far behind on my GMC projects and upgrades. (I just got my Maceator installed... now I need to figure out a discharge hose holder... or maybe I should be thinking "holster.")
In theory it shouldn't be to hard to design a system working off a potentiometer and a comparator. I like the remote module, looks like an interesting parts source. I already have a remote module (different brand from DinoDirect) but plan on using it for steering wheel controls on a GM Electronic CC... just picked up a 4 output buffer to complete a "kit".
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Height Level Valve [message #128141 is a reply to message #128117] |
Wed, 01 June 2011 07:43 |
Keith V
Messages: 2337
Registered: March 2008
Location: Mounds View,MN
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Mike Miller wrote on Tue, 31 May 2011 21:24 |
| Ken Henderson wrote on Tue, 31 May 2011 15:06 |
Mike,
Why don't you find an off-the-shelf ride height sensor with analog
output and design a controller? ...
|
Right.... I'll get right on that!
I am so far behind on my GMC projects and upgrades. (I just got my Maceator installed... now I need to figure out a discharge hose holder... or maybe I should be thinking "holster.")
In theory it shouldn't be to hard to design a system working off a potentiometer and a comparator. I like the remote module, looks like an interesting parts source. I already have a remote module (different brand from DinoDirect) but plan on using it for steering wheel controls on a GM Electronic CC... just picked up a 4 output buffer to complete a "kit".
|
I've mentioned this before but I already have a 4 channel open source air ride controller. I have plans to convert it to use on the GMC, that should be very easy, once it bubbles to the top of my todo list.
It uses an off the shelf PC board, the GPIO controller for the Megasquirt EFI system. the GPIO board has plenty of high power IO so it can drive solenoids.
It works like a comparator would, with one Pot to control height and for campsite leveling another pot would control side to side tilt.
a future enhancement may be to to add auto leveling via an accelerometer.
Keith Vasilakes
Mounds View. MN
75 ex Royale GMC
ask me about MicroLevel
Cell, 763-732-3419
My427v8@hotmail.com
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