Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II
| Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #90770] |
Thu, 01 July 2010 22:16  |
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Well I finally got a current meter and was able to get some draw readings for my electric fan setup, and wouldnt ou know they pull 60 amps on the nose when they go full tilt! the problem is my controller is rated to only 45 amps so this means one fan is gonna have to be tripped by relay which will be triggered by the VSC, so it will survive extended 100% duty cycle use as would be encountered when the AC is on or when in the desert.
I also will have to update the alternator, when I ran the headlights, AC blower motor on high and fans I maxed out the punny 80 amp alt and began pulling power from the battery, that is of course unacceptable, so I managed to get a recently remanufactured CS144 out of a 95 Caddy and its 140 amps, paid $30 for it at the mens mall and also got the 7 or so feet of 6 gauge charge wire with the alt for free. so hopefuly I will put that in the coach this weekend, as well as get pix and video up on the net. I have a buddy from Stuttgart Germany visiting tomorrow so perhaps we'll crack a bier and get'er done...
73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
[Updated on: Thu, 01 July 2010 22:18] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #90798 is a reply to message #90770] |
Fri, 02 July 2010 07:05  |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| Duce Apocalypse wrote on Thu, 01 July 2010 23:16 |
Well I finally got a current meter and was able to get some draw readings for my electric fan setup, and wouldn't you know they pull 60 amps on the nose when they go full tilt! the problem is my controller is rated to only 45 amps so this means one fan is gonna have to be tripped by relay which will be triggered by the VSC, so it will survive extended 100% duty cycle use as would be encountered when the AC is on or when in the desert.
I also will have to update the alternator, when I ran the headlights, AC blower motor on high and fans I maxed out the punny 80 amp alt and began pulling power from the battery, that is of course unacceptable, so I managed to get a recently remanufactured CS144 out of a 95 Caddy and its 140 amps, paid $30 for it at the mens mall and also got the 7 or so feet of 6 gauge charge wire with the alt for free. so hopefully I will put that in the coach this weekend, as well as get pix and video up on the net. I have a buddy from Stuttgart Germany visiting tomorrow so perhaps we'll crack a bier and get'er done...
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Duce,
Since you go to a 140 amp alternator and actually have means to run it near full load, please plan on going to a dual belt.
In recent years, I have put more than a few high load alternators in cruising boats. Every single one that could run over 100 amps and did, had very short (sometimes flash) belt life. Then I had to go back and pick one:
Reprogram the controller (many have microprocessor controlled regulators) to restrict the load,
Slow the alternator by installing a larger sheave (also reduces peak load capability) or
Making it dual belt or poly-V drive (seldom a practical choice because of room or parts availability).
The only thing better than learning by your mistakes is learning from the mistakes of others.
Please try to create some educational successes we can work from.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #90801 is a reply to message #90798] |
Fri, 02 July 2010 07:28 |
hertfordnc
Messages: 1164
Registered: September 2009
Location: East NC
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I started a thread on this topic a while back and I plan to install an electric fan as i put my engine back together so i am very interested;
Why is it necessary to have a variable speed controller?
You have two fans with two speeds so that's four levels of airflow available.
Does it really matter to the fan if it gets switched on and off abruptly? I don't think so.
For myself I'm planning to try just one fan (Revcon is lighter, roads are flat)
I have the same big Siemens fan from a Ford.
I'll put the low speed to the dash air and the high speed to an adjustable temp switch and see what happens.
I was thinking that if i added a second fan I would control them with temp sensors in different parts of the cooling system;
Like the first fan comes on low when the heat near he intake reaches a specified temperature. Other sensors sensors elsewhere in the cooling system would add airflow in steps, maybe the last one being on the radiator.
That seems simpler to me than counting on a variable speed controller.
Or, assuming that in real world operation this system will not go to max very often, what if you had a an override with a relay that bypassed the controller when the radiator temp got too high.
So your controller takes both fans up to the point where it's drawing 45 amps and if it goes past that a separate sensor engages a relay to put fuller power to both fans and drop out the controller.
Look forward to hearing your thoughts.
Dave & Ellen Silva
Hertford, NC
76 Birchaven, 1-ton and other stuff
Currently planning the Great american Road Trip Summer 2021
It's gonna take a lot of Adderall to get this thing right.
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #90852 is a reply to message #90802] |
Fri, 02 July 2010 13:45 |
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if you get the CS-144 off of a mid 90s caddy they have the same 6/12 ear spacing, the only thing is they use a larger M10 bolt, so some clearancing of the lower bracket may be needed. the wiring part is the easiest, just get Napa part EC-82 which has a 50 ohm resistor, and plugs right nto the stock harness, no cutting or anything needed.
Also if you take the charge cable off the doner caddy you will have the proper cable needed and theres enough to make it work. also the V belt pulley off the old alt will fit just fine. I'm gonna try the single belt first since the regulator is soft start it wont instantly load the system. also using good blets is a must, I use Gates.
| Keith V wrote on Fri, 02 July 2010 07:43 |
What does it take to mount a Cs140 on the 455?
It seems like a lot of bracket modification would be required.
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73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #90853 is a reply to message #90801] |
Fri, 02 July 2010 13:59 |
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Well actually the controller will pull 60 amps, but I read its rated for only 45, means im 15 amps over. Flexalite mant it to be used with their fans, which are just a tad smaller then what im running 
The reason I went with the VSC was because of the soft start and throtteling the fans from 60% to 100% based on temp of the coolant. so most of the time my controller is pulling its rated load, but its under 100% duty cycle usage that im concerned about, so I will put the lower fan which covers the trans cooler a relay to take the load off the controller which will allow worry free 100% operation, so only one fan will be 100% all the time when on the other will be governed as needed.
As for just using one fan on a revcon I dont see why that couldnt work. when I first wired up this system I only had 1 fan installed, and while it did take longer about 2 minutes to bring down the temp to where it would shut off, it did cool the coach under normal operating. I added the second fan because I believe that more is still infact, more! and the capacity to move up to 8,600 CFM should keep my rigs temps down under the most demanding of conditions.
Sofar for fans, parts and conroller, as well as alterntor upgrade using mens mall parts has kept expenses low for this project. keep in mind that unless the AC is on the fans will be off most of the tme and during highway cruise they shouldnt come on at all!
| hertfordnc wrote on Fri, 02 July 2010 07:28 |
I started a thread on this topic a while back and I plan to install an electric fan as i put my engine back together so i am very interested;
Why is it necessary to have a variable speed controller?
You have two fans with two speeds so that's four levels of airflow available.
Does it really matter to the fan if it gets switched on and off abruptly? I don't think so.
For myself I'm planning to try just one fan (Revcon is lighter, roads are flat)
I have the same big Siemens fan from a Ford.
I'll put the low speed to the dash air and the high speed to an adjustable temp switch and see what happens.
I was thinking that if i added a second fan I would control them with temp sensors in different parts of the cooling system;
Like the first fan comes on low when the heat near he intake reaches a specified temperature. Other sensors sensors elsewhere in the cooling system would add airflow in steps, maybe the last one being on the radiator.
That seems simpler to me than counting on a variable speed controller.
Or, assuming that in real world operation this system will not go to max very often, what if you had a an override with a relay that bypassed the controller when the radiator temp got too high.
So your controller takes both fans up to the point where it's drawing 45 amps and if it goes past that a separate sensor engages a relay to put fuller power to both fans and drop out the controller.
Look forward to hearing your thoughts.
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73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92111 is a reply to message #90770] |
Thu, 15 July 2010 22:50 |
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well we finally got heat in LA and I mean serious heat, 90s in the basin and 105+ in the valleys forcasted for this weekend. I will make a driving conditions test under this high heat conditions though the sepulveda pass to the San Fernando valley. this should be the proofing that I need to verify the fans functionality in a high heat, high stress situation...
73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92344 is a reply to message #90770] |
Sun, 18 July 2010 01:15 |
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well I was hoping to test them today but then I got the bright idea to hack into my beautiful wiring harness I made for the fans to put one on a relay to relieve the load on the controller. I told myself this would only take about a half hour. well after numerous attempts and a fried relay, blown fuse and several hours later, I finally got the fans back up and running. One now runs at full power, triggered off a relay which is switched on when the other fan comes on, and the other is controlled by the VSC. If I had it to do over again I would spend the extra $40 and use the controller from dakota digital since it can handle 70 amps and mind you these fans need every bit of that as they suck down 30-32 amps each as verified by my current meter.
but man do they cool fast, standing next to the wheel wells when they come on and you feel a rush of hot air flowing out from under the coach. hopefully tomorrow I can find some triple digit heat to test them with...
73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: [GMCnet] Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92353 is a reply to message #92344] |
Sun, 18 July 2010 06:59 |
gmcrv1
Messages: 839
Registered: August 2007
Location: Memphis
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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Shan,
Do you have the inner fenders on or off?
Thanks,
Tom Eckert N2VWN
73 Glacier
Oakland, TN
On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 1:15 AM, Shan Rose <defconfx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> well I was hoping to test them today but then I got the bright idea to hack
> into my beautiful wiring harness I made for the fans to put one on a relay
> to relieve the load on the controller. I told myself this would only take
> about a half hour. well after numerous attempts and a fried relay, blown
> fuse and several hours later, I finally got the fans back up and running.
> One now runs at full power, triggered off a relay which is switched on when
> the other fan comes on, and the other is controlled by the VSC. If I had it
> to do over again I would spend the extra $40 and use the controller from
> dakota digital since it can handle 70 amps and mind you these fans need
> every bit of that as they suck down 30-32 amps each as verified by my
> current meter.
>
> but man do they cool fast, standing next to the wheel wells when they come
> on and you feel a rush of hot air flowing out from under the coach.
> hopefully tomorrow I can find some triple digit heat to test them with...
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92395 is a reply to message #92353] |
Sun, 18 July 2010 13:14 |
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If you mean the wheel well liners, my coach never had any, I assume the PO must have removed them. I did make a sheet metal partial liner for the drives side to protect my airchimes from road dirt and rocks...
pray for another hot day today, if all goes well I will do the test this afternoon hopefully in 100+ heat! 
| gmcrv1 wrote on Sun, 18 July 2010 06:59 |
Shan,
Do you have the inner fenders on or off?
Thanks,
Tom Eckert N2VWN
73 Glacier
Oakland, TN
On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 1:15 AM, Shan Rose <defconfx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> well I was hoping to test them today but then I got the bright idea to hack
> into my beautiful wiring harness I made for the fans to put one on a relay
> to relieve the load on the controller. I told myself this would only take
> about a half hour. well after numerous attempts and a fried relay, blown
> fuse and several hours later, I finally got the fans back up and running.
> One now runs at full power, triggered off a relay which is switched on when
> the other fan comes on, and the other is controlled by the VSC. If I had it
> to do over again I would spend the extra $40 and use the controller from
> dakota digital since it can handle 70 amps and mind you these fans need
> every bit of that as they suck down 30-32 amps each as verified by my
> current meter.
>
> but man do they cool fast, standing next to the wheel wells when they come
> on and you feel a rush of hot air flowing out from under the coach.
> hopefully tomorrow I can find some triple digit heat to test them with...
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
|
73 Canyon Lands, (a.k.a. The Yellow Submarine) West Los Angeles CA
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| Re: [GMCnet] Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92413 is a reply to message #92395] |
Sun, 18 July 2010 13:57 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Stan,
Don't forget, Frank Jenkins now makes very nice fiberglass wheel well
liners.
Ken H.
On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Shan Rose <defconfx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> If you mean the wheel well liners, my coach never had any, I assume the PO
> must have removed them. I did make a sheet metal partial liner for the
> drives side to protect my airchimes from road dirt and rocks...
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Electric Radiator Fans: Practical cooling from the mens mall to your coach! Part II [message #92489 is a reply to message #92395] |
Sun, 18 July 2010 20:47 |
gmcrv1
Messages: 839
Registered: August 2007
Location: Memphis
Karma: -1
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Senior Member |
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Shan,
Sorry, I did mean the liners. Mine have been out since I bought mine. The
PO had installed Thorley headers and a SS 3" exhaust. Couldn't see putting
the liners back on until I get a chance to look at the front end.
Thanks,
Tom Eckert N2VWN
73 Glacier
Oakland, TN
On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 1:14 PM, Shan Rose <defconfx@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> If you mean the wheel well liners, my coach never had any, I assume the PO
> must have removed them. I did make a sheet metal partial liner for the
> drives side to protect my airchimes from road dirt and rocks...
>
> pray for another hot day today, if all goes well I will do the test this
> afternoon hopefully in 100+ heat! :)
>
> gmcrv1 wrote on Sun, 18 July 2010 06:59
> > Shan,
> >
> > Do you have the inner fenders on or off?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Tom Eckert N2VWN
> > 73 Glacier
> > Oakland, TN
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 18, 2010 at 1:15 AM, Shan Rose <defconfx@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > well I was hoping to test them today but then I got the bright idea to
> hack
> > > into my beautiful wiring harness I made for the fans to put one on a
> relay
> > > to relieve the load on the controller. I told myself this would only
> take
> > > about a half hour. well after numerous attempts and a fried relay,
> blown
> > > fuse and several hours later, I finally got the fans back up and
> running.
> > > One now runs at full power, triggered off a relay which is switched on
> when
> > > the other fan comes on, and the other is controlled by the VSC. If I
> had it
> > > to do over again I would spend the extra $40 and use the controller
> from
> > > dakota digital since it can handle 70 amps and mind you these fans need
> > > every bit of that as they suck down 30-32 amps each as verified by my
> > > current meter.
> > >
> > > but man do they cool fast, standing next to the wheel wells when they
> come
> > > on and you feel a rush of hot air flowing out from under the coach.
> > > hopefully tomorrow I can find some triple digit heat to test them
> with...
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > GMCnet mailing list
> > > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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