Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements
| [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 16:25  |
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You all have been so great in providing feedback on one esoteric issue that
I thought Iąd run another past you.
As I've pondered whether to spend more on Silver Lady or look for another
coach I've done some analysis. Here are the figures based on nearly three
years of ownership (July 2007 - May 2010).
Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Labor to install parts - $13,751
Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
Suddenly I realize why I'm a pauper. I had suspicions but hadn't looked at
the data.
I wonder what the other guys include in their totals when they say what
they've spent. Taxes and freight total $1,301. Mere rubbish.
Since Silver Lady has been run more in the last three years than the
previous 15 it's safe to say she's been well maintained and road-worthy. She
isn't a total project though I can think of other things to do.
Among improvements/replacements are roof air, furnace, water heater, air
bags, alloy wheels, tires, suspension parts, and some other junk like
upholstery and captain's chairs.
How would you arrive at an asking price? (Today's market taken into account;
love of GMC included.) Place no value on the labor and only a portion of the
parts? Add all of parts and purchase price? Use a random number picker and
multiply by a factor of 1000? Dice with lots of dots?
How would you do it?
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83052 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 16:58  |
Rusty
Messages: 197
Registered: October 2005
Location: Philadelphia Pa
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Tough call. Depends how desperate you get. I'm in for about the same amount of cash - if I decided to sell I would feel lucky to get 20k. Probably significantly less in this market. One thing I have learned you already pointed out, if I had to do it over i would put up the 20 for something somebody else already put up 40. Fools we are. Happy ones, though.
Rusty
75 Glenbrook
Philadelphia Pa
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83065 is a reply to message #83060] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 18:38 |
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Well, I've failed. She already knows. Problem is, she said: "I told you it
was that much."
I don't keep anything from this wife. Life is better. Now, the other thing I
was married to ---
Byron
MICHAEL FOSTER wrote:
>
>
> "Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
> Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
> Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including taxes
> and shipping) comes to $43,424."
>
>
>
> shhh! Don't say that so loud. Your wife, or someone else's might hear.
>
> Michael
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83067 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 18:52 |
Luvn737s
Messages: 1106
Registered: June 2007
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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I think I would depreciate the improvements (labor and parts)over 7 years (straight line) and write off the repairs and maintenance (since they are ongoing and part of the operating expense of the coach). Add the basic value of the coach to that and you have a pretty close approximation of what it's book value is. However, what it's worth to someone buying is another thing altogether. When I saw how cheap the Sierra Vista coach went, I knew we were still in a down market.
One of the best ways to get the selling prices up on these is to get as much exposure to younger buyers as possible. The "cool" factor is a selling point and when young buyers realize that a 40 year old RV can be a dependable vehicle in which to share time as a family, they will seek out the better ones and pay a premium for them.
This GMC thing is one virus we don't want to let die off! The fewer the active coaches, the more likely we are to lose our supporting vendors and I don't think I have to tell anyone how that spiral will end up.
Randy
1973 26' Painted Desert
Ahwatukee (Phoenix) AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83071 is a reply to message #83065] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 19:05 |
Gary Cottingame
Messages: 85
Registered: January 2005
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Byron,
We don't even want to go there, I'm sure that's a loooong story.
On the other hand, I have added your figures up 4 times and I get $44,324 not $43,424..
Tried to fool her didn't you. LOL
Gary
TZE21
Denison, Tx
--- On Tue, 5/4/10, Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net> wrote:
Now, the other thing I
was married to ---
Byron
MICHAEL FOSTER wrote:
>
>
> "Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
> Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
> Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including taxes
> and shipping) comes to $43,424."
>
>
>
> shhh! Don't say that so loud. Your wife, or someone else's might hear.
>
> Michael
> _______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83072 is a reply to message #83067] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 19:18 |
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1977Production#0001
Messages: 197
Registered: January 2010
Location: Vallejo, California
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Luvn737s wrote on Tue, 04 May 2010 16:52 |
I think I would depreciate the improvements (labor and parts)over 7 years (straight line) and write off the repairs and maintenance (since they are ongoing and part of the operating expense of the coach). Add the basic value of the coach to that and you have a pretty close approximation of what it's book value is. However, what it's worth to someone buying is another thing altogether. When I saw how cheap the Sierra Vista coach went, I knew we were still in a down market.
One of the best ways to get the selling prices up on these is to get as much exposure to younger buyers as possible. The "cool" factor is a selling point and when young buyers realize that a 40 year old RV can be a dependable vehicle in which to share time as a family, they will seek out the better ones and pay a premium for them.
This GMC thing is one virus we don't want to let die off! The fewer the active coaches, the more likely we are to lose our supporting vendors and I don't think I have to tell anyone how that spiral will end up.
|
As a younger owner (born in the 70's.....the late 70's)I will agree that the different clubs/information sites online are MUCH different than navigating sites for my other hobby vehicles (mustangs, camaros, suv's g8's) I belong to message forum boards for each vehicle. Exposure is key to getting a fair price. I think most younger buyers are looking to purchase higher priced RV's are doing so with financing. The cool factor is definately a plus that got me hooked.
I looked at many coaches online and picked up my mostly well maintained 1977 Kingsley that had many upgrades but ran very rough. List price was $5000, I paid $2900. 6 Months Later As a nice maintained very rust free AZ coach, side dry bath, a very fresh rebuilt Applied GMC engine, 2 full lenghth Zip Dee awnings and other new goodies and upgrades (still has wheelcovers )----Nick at applied gave a very rough value estimate of $8,000 to $9,000 in today's market.
Giovanni(Carlo) 1977 GMC Kingsley 26ft
"Carbon Footprint"
Rear Twin, Dry Bath, Original Headliner
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83073 is a reply to message #83072] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 19:32 |
kjmartin
Messages: 19
Registered: July 2005
Location: Nova Scotia
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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"Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
Hours of enjoyment, miles travelled, good times had & friends made = priceless.
you knew someone was going to do... 
Kathy
Kathy & Tim Martin
74 Canyon Lands
Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83075 is a reply to message #83071] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 20:07 |
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I'm a full-fledged member of the DNA, National Association of Dyslexics.
Actually, I was trying to add the figures in my head while typing. Ain't as
sharp as I used to be.
Now it's worse than I suspected. Ha!
Byron
Gary Cottingame wrote:
> Byron,
>
> We don't even want to go there, I'm sure that's a loooong story.
> On the other hand, I have added your figures up 4 times and I get $44,324 not
> $43,424..
> Tried to fool her didn't you. LOL
>
> Gary
> TZE21
> Denison, Tx
>
>
> --- On Tue, 5/4/10, Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> Now, the other thing I
> was married to ---
>
> Byron
>
>
> MICHAEL FOSTER wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> "Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
>> Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
>> Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including taxes
>> and shipping) comes to $43,424."
>>
>>
>>
>> shhh! Don't say that so loud. Your wife, or someone else's might hear.
>>
>> Michael
>> _______________________________________________
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83078 is a reply to message #83065] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 20:31 |
dngmissett
Messages: 84
Registered: February 2004
Karma: 0
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Member |
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I always felt is was just as easy and sometimes better to ask for CFO for forgiveness as it was to ask for permission. No upfront argument or debate plus the making up was always fun. JWWFM :)
Dick Missett
Wyoming, PA
--- On Tue, 5/4/10, Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net> wrote:
From: Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net>
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Date: Tuesday, May 4, 2010, 7:38 PM
Well, I've failed. She already knows. Problem is, she said: "I told you it
was that much."
I don't keep anything from this wife. Life is better. Now, the other thing I
was married to ---
Byron
MICHAEL FOSTER wrote:
>
>
> "Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
> Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
> Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including taxes
> and shipping) comes to $43,424."
>
>
>
> shhh! Don't say that so loud. Your wife, or someone else's might hear.
>
> Michael
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
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List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83089 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 21:47 |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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Byron,
Market price ... not so much a function what you have spent to-date ... look at what coaches are selling for today -- pick several and compare them to yours and add/deduct for condition and features.. should get you in the ballpark. When you finish you may look at what you have spent and what you are likely to receive as a sales price and reconsider selling...
I have wondered recently if "we" are training prospective GMC owners to be "cheap". We, as an owner group, may have to change our $ perspective for the market price of GMC's to rebound..
Good luck!
Dennis Sexton
73 GMC
Germantown, TN
USA
-----Original Message-----
From: Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 4:25 pm
Subject: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements
You all have been so great in providing feedback on one esoteric issue that
thought IÂąd run another past you.
As I've pondered whether to spend more on Silver Lady or look for another
oach I've done some analysis. Here are the figures based on nearly three
ears of ownership (July 2007 - May 2010).
Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
arts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
abor to install parts - $13,751
Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
Suddenly I realize why I'm a pauper. I had suspicions but hadn't looked at
he data.
I wonder what the other guys include in their totals when they say what
hey've spent. Taxes and freight total $1,301. Mere rubbish.
Since Silver Lady has been run more in the last three years than the
revious 15 it's safe to say she's been well maintained and road-worthy. She
sn't a total project though I can think of other things to do.
Among improvements/replacements are roof air, furnace, water heater, air
ags, alloy wheels, tires, suspension parts, and some other junk like
pholstery and captain's chairs.
How would you arrive at an asking price? (Today's market taken into account;
ove of GMC included.) Place no value on the labor and only a portion of the
arts? Add all of parts and purchase price? Use a random number picker and
ultiply by a factor of 1000? Dice with lots of dots?
How would you do it?
Byron Songer
978 Royale by Coachmen
ouisville, KY
ersonal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
astern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
MCnet mailing list
ist Information and Subscription Options:
ttp://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
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List Information and Subscription Options:
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Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83091 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 22:11 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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SHIT!
that's a lot for labor, not to mention an additional 10K more than I paid for my wreck. "See honey what I save doing it all myself???"
| Byron Songer wrote on Tue, 04 May 2010 14:25 |
Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Labor to install parts - $13,751
Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
|
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83092 is a reply to message #83067] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 22:14 |
Chr$
Messages: 2690
Registered: January 2004
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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A carload of teenagers gave me the thumbs up this weekend while I was tooling around in the Kobyashi Maru. How cool is that???
| Luvn737s wrote on Tue, 04 May 2010 16:52 |
One of the best ways to get the selling prices up on these is to get as much exposure to younger buyers as possible. The "cool" factor is a selling point and when young buyers realize that a 40 year old RV can be a dependable vehicle in which to share time as a family, they will seek out the better ones and pay a premium for them.
|
-Chr$: Perpetual SmartAss
Scottsdale, AZ
77 Ex-Kingsley 455 SOLD!
2010 Nomad 24 Ft TT 390W PV W/MPPT, EV4010 and custom cargo door.
Photosite: Chrisc GMC:"It has Begun" TT: "The Other Woman"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83093 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 22:18 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Byron,
How about going at it from this direction?
GMC FOR SALE
Purchase price - $15,900 - Provide date
Mileage at purchase:
Current mileage:
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Provide a detailed list what you've done, dates, mileage
Labor to install parts - $13,751
Total invested: $44,324
All reasonable offers considered!
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Byron Songer
Sent: Wednesday, 5 May 2010 7:26 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements
You all have been so great in providing feedback on one esoteric issue that
I thought Iąd run another past you.
As I've pondered whether to spend more on Silver Lady or look for another
coach I've done some analysis. Here are the figures based on nearly three
years of ownership (July 2007 - May 2010).
Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Labor to install parts - $13,751
Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
Suddenly I realize why I'm a pauper. I had suspicions but hadn't looked at
the data.
I wonder what the other guys include in their totals when they say what
they've spent. Taxes and freight total $1,301. Mere rubbish.
Since Silver Lady has been run more in the last three years than the
previous 15 it's safe to say she's been well maintained and road-worthy. She
isn't a total project though I can think of other things to do.
Among improvements/replacements are roof air, furnace, water heater, air
bags, alloy wheels, tires, suspension parts, and some other junk like
upholstery and captain's chairs.
How would you arrive at an asking price? (Today's market taken into account;
love of GMC included.) Place no value on the labor and only a portion of the
parts? Add all of parts and purchase price? Use a random number picker and
multiply by a factor of 1000? Dice with lots of dots?
How would you do it?
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83095 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 22:27 |
Obegone
Messages: 20
Registered: February 2009
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Being an owner of a coach is always spendy, we purchased ours for 18k in
1989, remodeled it in 1991 for 5k, new motor,tranny,body parts replaced,
paint and front end for 20k in 1998, another new motor in 2003, painful that
one, and then we met Jim K, adding his new stuff in 2008 was 14.5k, along
with a Mcneil dash for 3.8k, and now remodeling the kitchen and living area
again for 10k, you gotta love the thing or just give up. We still get plenty
of enjoyment out of our coach and now that I have retired, plan on many
months of happy trails in her.
Wife's only comment, "Don't tell me how much, just make it work and keep
your job until it is paid for"
In a message dated 5/4/2010 4:38:54 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
bsonger@songerconsulting.net writes:
Well, I've failed. She already knows. Problem is, she said: "I told you it
was that much."
I don't keep anything from this wife. Life is better. Now, the other thing
I
was married to ---
Byron
MICHAEL FOSTER wrote:
>
>
> "Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
> Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
> Labor to install parts - $13,751 Total financial outlay (not including
taxes
> and shipping) comes to $43,424."
>
>
>
> shhh! Don't say that so loud. Your wife, or someone else's might hear.
>
> Michael
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83108 is a reply to message #83048] |
Tue, 04 May 2010 23:43 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Comps! ( I have you beat by maybe 20-30 thousand). However, we have
sure enjoyed the coach a lot in the past 12-13 years so I feel it was
well justified. It is an ongoing investment and it just never ends.
We drive our SOB a LOT! I bought if for $18K and have a grand total
of 6 tires, one dryer, two chairs and $500 worth of upholstery work
invested in it. At this point, I'd be crazy not to keep the GMC
pristine, and parked, and wear out the SOB.
I think you are spinning your wheels on this issue Byron. Where else
could you get this kind of gratification after making some
improvement, going to a rally, and having someone notice what you've
done. The answer is obvious.
Besides, what else would you be doing with your time that would bring
this kind of satisfaction?
On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Byron Songer
<bsonger@songerconsulting.net> wrote:
As I've pondered whether to spend more on Silver Lady or look for another
coach I've done some analysis. Here are the figures based on nearly three
years of ownership (July 2007 - May 2010).
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Arriving at a fair price for coach and enhancements [message #83119 is a reply to message #83048] |
Wed, 05 May 2010 07:12 |
C Boyd
Messages: 2629
Registered: April 2006
Karma: 18
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Senior Member |
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| Byron Songer wrote on Tue, 04 May 2010 17:25 |
You all have been so great in providing feedback on one esoteric issue that
I thought Iąd run another past you.
As I've pondered whether to spend more on Silver Lady or look for another
coach I've done some analysis. Here are the figures based on nearly three
years of ownership (July 2007 - May 2010).
Purchase price - $15,900 (coach had been repainted in 2005)
Parts added to repair, replace or upgrade - $14,673
Labor to install parts - $13,751
Total financial outlay (not including taxes and shipping) comes to $43,424.
Suddenly I realize why I'm a pauper. I had suspicions but hadn't looked at
the data.
I wonder what the other guys include in their totals when they say what
they've spent. Taxes and freight total $1,301. Mere rubbish.
Since Silver Lady has been run more in the last three years than the
previous 15 it's safe to say she's been well maintained and road-worthy. She
isn't a total project though I can think of other things to do.
Among improvements/replacements are roof air, furnace, water heater, air
bags, alloy wheels, tires, suspension parts, and some other junk like
upholstery and captain's chairs.
How would you arrive at an asking price? (Today's market taken into account;
love of GMC included.) Place no value on the labor and only a portion of the
parts? Add all of parts and purchase price? Use a random number picker and
multiply by a factor of 1000? Dice with lots of dots?
How would you do it?
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
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Byron:
Since you want to stay in a GMC, just not the one you have, I suggest you offer it for trade. Your 78 rear bath Royale is a prized possesion. Offer it for trade for a dry side bath model of equal value or accept boot for one that needs a little TLC or pay boot for exactly what you want. Since the money value of our coaches is down, a trade could be a win-win situation for both parties. Getting the word out is the key.
C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
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