Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Later Model Fixed Window Seals (Any tricks or suggestions?)
| Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81013] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 05:46  |
Dave Wilson
Messages: 94
Registered: September 2009
Location: Livonia, MI
Karma: 0
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Hi everyone,
I installed 2 new fixed window seals on the drivers side (front couch and rear) yesterday and my thumbs are completely shot. It was difficult and painful to open the toothpaste this morning! I had a hand-held sponge with dish detergent that I used to help aid the install, but I don't know how much it helped (if at all).
Is there any "trick" like maybe a coating to apply first? Or maybe a rolling type of tool? Also, is there an ideal temperature for the install? I was thinking the warmer the rubber is, the more it expands; but if it's colder (and the rubber contracts), it's not as flexible. I installed at roughly 60 deg F. Thanks for any help.
Dave Wilson
'77 Eleganza II
Photos @ http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member.php?uid=2183&protype=1
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81024 is a reply to message #81013] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 07:26  |
GMCWiperMan
Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 1
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Dave,
I've fortunately never installed GMC window seals -- I've heard too many
other sore thumb tales, from Jim Bounds and many less experienced than he.
But what I've always found to be the best lubricant for other rubber seal
manipulation is smooth mechanic's hand soap. It cleans everything up as it
goes and dries without leaving an objectionable residue. I've never found
any ill effects from it being in the joint and the exposed portion cleans up
with water.
Ken H.
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 6:46 AM, Dave Wilson <dwilso38@talkamerica.net>wrote:
>
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I installed 2 new fixed window seals on the drivers side (front couch and
> rear) yesterday and my thumbs are completely shot. It was difficult and
> painful to open the toothpaste this morning! I had a hand-held sponge with
> dish detergent that I used to help aid the install, but I don't know how
> much it helped (if at all).
>
> Is there any "trick" like maybe a coating to apply first? Or maybe a
> rolling type of tool? Also, is there an ideal temperature for the install?
> I was thinking the warmer the rubber is, the more it expands; but if it's
> colder (and the rubber contracts), it's not as flexible. I installed at
> roughly 60 deg F. Thanks for any help.
> --
> Dave Wilson
> '77 Eleganza II
>
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81027 is a reply to message #81013] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 08:18 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
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I found a trick that works well, and fast. I use a GM trim clip
release tool. Shaped like a handle with a hook on each end and is
used to reach between the glass and the SS trim on 70's autos to
release the spring loaded clip that retains the trim. I spray the
rubber with silicone first. It goes so fast it is hard to keep up
with the tool.
http://www.dmstools.com/products/tool_aid/ta_87700.htm
Using this tool I was able to do all of the windows in just a few hours.
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 3:46 AM, Dave Wilson <dwilso38@talkamerica.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I installed 2 new fixed window seals on the drivers side (front couch and rear) yesterday and my thumbs are completely shot. It was difficult and painful to open the toothpaste this morning! I had a hand-held sponge with dish detergent that I used to help aid the install, but I don't know how much it helped (if at all).
>
> Is there any "trick" like maybe a coating to apply first? Or maybe a rolling type of tool? Also, is there an ideal temperature for the install? I was thinking the warmer the rubber is, the more it expands; but if it's colder (and the rubber contracts), it's not as flexible. I installed at roughly 60 deg F. Thanks for any help.
> --
> Dave Wilson
> '77 Eleganza II
>
> Photos @ http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member.php?uid=2183&protype=1
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81032 is a reply to message #81013] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 08:26 |
nchapekis
Messages: 165
Registered: February 2004
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Karma: 0
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| Dave Wilson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 06:46 |
Is there any "trick" like maybe a coating to apply first? Or maybe a rolling type of tool? Also, is there an ideal temperature for the install? I was thinking the warmer the rubber is, the more it expands; but if it's colder (and the rubber contracts), it's not as flexible. I installed at roughly 60 deg F.
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Dave -
I did all six of our windows a couple of years ago and the best advice I could give is to lay the rubber trim out in the hot sun for about an hour before installing (of course this requires the hot sun being available). I also spread the install out over a couple of weeks to give my thumbs time to recover between windows.
Nick Chapekis
Ypsilanti, MI
former owner - 78 Kingsley
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81034 is a reply to message #81027] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 08:30 |
nchapekis
Messages: 165
Registered: February 2004
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 09:18 |
I found a trick that works well, and fast. I use a GM trim clip release tool.
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Steve -
Where were you when I needed you two years ago?
Nick Chapekis
Ypsilanti, MI
former owner - 78 Kingsley
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81049 is a reply to message #81041] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 10:12 |
Dave Wilson
Messages: 94
Registered: September 2009
Location: Livonia, MI
Karma: 0
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| Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 08:42 |
Right here Nick. I've posted this info before. I did find out the
hard way that if you warm the rubber insert, it will stretch slightly
during the install and shrinkage in inevitable. Leave the ends
hanging loose for a week or so and let the rubber shrink to it's final
dimension before trimming.
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 6:30 AM, Nick Chapekis <chapekis@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 09:18
>> I found a trick that works well, and fast. I use a GM trim clip release tool.
>
>
>
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Thanks Steve, I'll be getting that tool shortly. Great idea too about leaving the ends to trim later after shrinkage. I still can't move my thumbs!
Dave Wilson
'77 Eleganza II
Photos @ http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member.php?uid=2183&protype=1
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81053 is a reply to message #81049] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 10:48 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I watched Jim B. do the windows on several coaches in one day. About
the only thing his thumbs were good for after that was maybe, maybe,
hitchhiking.
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 8:12 AM, Dave Wilson <dwilso38@talkamerica.net> wrote:
>
>
> Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 08:42
>> Right here Nick. I've posted this info before. I did find out the
>> hard way that if you warm the rubber insert, it will stretch slightly
>> during the install and shrinkage in inevitable. Leave the ends
>> hanging loose for a week or so and let the rubber shrink to it's final
>> dimension before trimming.
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 6:30 AM, Nick Chapekis <chapekis@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 09:18
>> >> I found a trick that works well, and fast. I use a GM trim clip release tool.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>
> Thanks Steve, I'll be getting that tool shortly. Great idea too about leaving the ends to trim later after shrinkage. I still can't move my thumbs!
>
> --
> Dave Wilson
> '77 Eleganza II
>
> Photos @ http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/member.php?uid=2183&protype=1
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81062 is a reply to message #81041] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 11:46 |
nchapekis
Messages: 165
Registered: February 2004
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Steven Ferguson wrote on Mon, 19 April 2010 09:42 |
Right here Nick. I've posted this info before. I did find out the hard way that if you warm the rubber insert, it will stretch slightly during the install and shrinkage in inevitable. Leave the ends hanging loose for a week or so and let the rubber shrink to it's final dimension before trimming.
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Unlucky me, I missed your earlier post. If I were smart, I'd have asked for help like Dave. I had some shrinkage as well. But next time.... (and there will be a next time - those inserts are already beginning to harden up).
Nick Chapekis
Ypsilanti, MI
former owner - 78 Kingsley
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| Re: Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81079 is a reply to message #81077] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 15:11 |
Jon payne
Messages: 495
Registered: May 2008
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Steve,
I need to replace mine as well. I am trying to visualize how the tool you mentioned is used. Does the tool open up the groove so that the new seal can fit into place? Do you have any pics?
Thanks,
Jon
Jon Payne
76 Palm Beach
Westfield,IN
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #81083 is a reply to message #81079] |
Mon, 19 April 2010 16:55 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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No pics Jon. That double lip in the inside of the seal is what gives
everyone a hard time. Most just press hard enough with their thumbs
to force the lip into the groove. If you play around with the tool a
bit you can see where you can use it to actually do all the work, just
follow along on the outside of the seal with your thumb gently
providing downforce. It is impossible to describe, just fiddle with
it and in a short time you will be an expert. Don't forget a little
spray silicone on both surfaces.
On Mon, Apr 19, 2010 at 1:11 PM, Jon Payne <embrep@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>
> Steve,
>
> I need to replace mine as well. I am trying to visualize how the tool you mentioned is used. Does the tool open up the groove so that the new seal can fit into place? Do you have any pics?
>
> Thanks,
> Jon
> --
> Jon Payne/
> 76 Palm Beach/
> Westfield,IN
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
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--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #91320 is a reply to message #81013] |
Tue, 06 July 2010 20:40 |
Gary Mau
Messages: 152
Registered: February 2004
Location: Davenport, Iowa
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Restarting this thread-
Steve Ferguson,
You said: "If you play around with the tool a bit you can see where you can use it to actually do all the work, just follow along on the outside of the seal with your thumb gently providing downforce. It is impossible to describe, just fiddle with it and in a short time you will be an expert. Don't forget a little spray silicone on both surfaces."
I bought the tool you mentioned and still couldn't get the seal in. Guess I need a "dummies" course. Did you place it between the seal and the glass and push?
Gary Mau
Former 76 Royale owner
Davenport, IA
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #91323 is a reply to message #91320] |
Tue, 06 July 2010 20:45 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Gary,
No. First, my coach is a '76. I understand that there are
differences in the seals used over the years. On mine, there is a
double lip on the underside of the seal that fits into two small
slots. I squirted the seal with silicone spray, then used the tool to
force the lowest lip into the groove and the other one followed. Wish
I could explain it better.
On Tue, Jul 6, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Gary Mau <garyemau@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> Restarting this thread-
>
> Steve Ferguson,
>
> You said: "If you play around with the tool a bit you can see where you can use it to actually do all the work, just follow along on the outside of the seal with your thumb gently providing downforce. It is impossible to describe, just fiddle with it and in a short time you will be an expert. Don't forget a little spray silicone on both surfaces."
>
> I bought the tool you mentioned and still couldn't get the seal in. Guess I need a "dummies" course. Did you place it between the seal and the glass and push?
> --
> Gary Mau
> 76 Royale
> Davenport, IA
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
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>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #91346 is a reply to message #91323] |
Tue, 06 July 2010 23:39 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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I found that if you have minor gapping at the joints--let's say a half inch, you can easily unpeal the seal a bit, stretch it out and reinsert it. It has lasted at least 2 years on a couple of my windows.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #91404 is a reply to message #81013] |
Wed, 07 July 2010 12:17 |
Gary Mau
Messages: 152
Registered: February 2004
Location: Davenport, Iowa
Karma: 0
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Steve,
I also have a 76 (Royale). The seal I got from Jim B. only has one lip (if we are both referring to the same thing as lips). Where did you get your seal and do you have a part number? My window has two grooves so to speak, the first formed between the glass and a ridge that forms one side of what I'll refer to as the second groove. The second groove is where I believe the seal lip is supposed to go as the first groove contains the shims for locating the glass.
Gary Mau
Former 76 Royale owner
Davenport, IA
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| Re: Later Model Fixed Window Seals [message #91457 is a reply to message #81013] |
Wed, 07 July 2010 19:23 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Hey Nick when I have the time to do mine..... how about you come and show me how it's done. I bet your thumbs are still sore just thinking about it. GMC use so far this year----Zero. (too much work)
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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