Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Centramatic wheel balancing system.
| Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346224] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 10:03  |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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Anyone using these:
http://www.centramatic.com/wheel-balance.rhtml?type=Light-Duty
I did a search and found a single thread from 2014 which immediately went sideways off topic.
Anyway, from youtube videos I saw, everyone seems to be happy with them.
I've had my wheels dynamically balanced last year and again this year. Last year they balanced them without my tire pressure sensor in place, So I had to pay them to do it again!! Before that I had beads which seemed ok, but they seemed to get stuck in the wrong place many times and a railway track would usually shake them loose and back to normal again.
Anyway, just came back from 3,000 miles of shaking so looking for something better.
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346228 is a reply to message #346224] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 11:25  |
emerystora
Messages: 4442
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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I used Centramatic balances from 1973 to 1979 on my Dodge Travco. At that time they weee a round tube filled with oil and small ball bearings. They clipped inside the rim of my 17-1/2” wheels. Today they are on a disc which mounts behind the wheel lugs.
I haven’t used the new style but the old ones worked very well. I met the inventor and bought mine from him at an FMCA convention booth
Emery Stora
> On Aug 8, 2019, at 9:03 AM, Bruce Hislop via Gmclist wrote:
>
> Anyone using these:
>
> http://www.centramatic.com/wheel-balance.rhtml?type=Light-Duty
>
> I did a search and found a single thread from 2014 which immediately went sideways off topic.
>
> Anyway, from youtube videos I saw, everyone seems to be happy with them.
>
> I've had my wheels dynamically balanced last year and again this year. Last year they balanced them without my tire pressure sensor in place, So I had
> to pay them to do it again!! Before that I had beads which seemed ok, but they seemed to get stuck in the wrong place many times and a railway track
> would usually shake them loose and back to normal again.
>
> Anyway, just came back from 3,000 miles of shaking so looking for something better.
>
> --
> Bruce Hislop
> ON Canada
> 77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.1 ton front end
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
> My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346240 is a reply to message #346228] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 14:13 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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My suggestion is go back to the balancing beads and this time use air-soft pellets from Walmart in the sporting goods section. The are plastic and will not cake together from moisture or excessive use of rubber lub. 1 bottle will do more than just your coach. Cost $10.00 to 15.00. Weight out six 4 oz. bags. Break the bead of each tire and throw then inside. No need to remove the existing wheel weights. One coach we put them in the guy showed up with a big c-clamp and was able to break the tire bead loose without removing the wheel from the coach.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346244 is a reply to message #346240] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 15:35 |
6cuda6
Messages: 975
Registered: June 2019
Karma: -6
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Bruce is there any high end car shops or Euro performance car shops in your area? Alot of times those shops will have high speed balancing machines for those wide/thin side walled euro tires.
Alot of the balancers in use today in general shops dont spin the tires very fast so you'll end up with wheels that are ok for the average use but not good enough for stuff like this....we had the same problem at VW when i worked there till they installed the high speed balancer.
The the best option in my opinion, although not to common, is "on vehicle" balancing".....i did a bunch of that as well. You might be able to get it done at a semi truck tire shop but i would call and ask first.
Rich Mondor,
Brockville, ON
77 Hughes 2600
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346250 is a reply to message #346240] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 16:50 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I heartily agree with Ken B. Over the years with the GMC I've used
conventional balancing with and without truing, and Counteract balancing
beads. The current set of tires, nearing 6 years old and replacement
before GMCMI Mansfield, were balanced with the Walmart airsoft pellets when
installed. I've already got the 6 bags of with 4 oz. each ready (from the
jar I bought 6 years ago) for the new set. I MAY have noticed a little
unbalance a couple of times, below 30 mph. Otherwise, the balance has been
excellent -- at least as good as with any of the other techniques.
Ken B's advice is perfect AFAIC.
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, Troy-Bilt APU, etc., etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Thu, Aug 8, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ken Burton via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> My suggestion is go back to the balancing beads and this time use air-soft
> pellets from Walmart in the sporting goods section. The are plastic and
> will not cake together from moisture or excessive use of rubber lub. 1
> bottle will do more than just your coach. Cost $10.00 to 15.00. Weight out
> six 4 oz. bags. Break the bead of each tire and throw then inside. No
> need to remove the existing wheel weights. One coach we put them in the guy
> showed up with a big c-clamp and was able to break the tire bead loose
> without removing the wheel from the coach.
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346255 is a reply to message #346224] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 18:24 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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I got fed up and bought a 240V Central Machinery computer spin balancer for home. Then bought the wall
mount coated weight selection package from Rubber Inc. Never looked back. When I get any new tires mounted for any vehicle ( I bring in loose wheels never the vehicle) I check them for balance and have to correct 50% of them that come up .50 or more wrong. They don't care, it's not their car or RV close enough is good enough for most people not to complain and actually take time off to come back. Looking for a tire machine now to eliminate that step too.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346259 is a reply to message #346224] |
Thu, 08 August 2019 19:50 |
bobby5832708
Messages: 237
Registered: November 2006
Location: Winter Springs FL
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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In 2017 I bought a spin balancer and some weights and now mount and balance my own tires.
The latest version: https://www.derekweaver.com/rodders-garage/wheel-balancers/weaver-w-937-40-wheel-balancer/
I got tired of the vehicles (cars, rv) shaking at highway speeds after tires being replaced. I also got tired of taking the cars or, for the GMC, the tires/wheels back to the tire shops to be rebalanced over and over again. In the GMC tires, both airsofts and ceramic beads worked OK some of the time but were inconsistent. I gave the ceramic beads to Ken H, hopefully he has better luck with them than I did.
We had taken our vehicles to Walmart, Sears, and several local tire shops with limited success.
Some reasons why I gave up and bought my own balancer:
example: I found that the Michelin tires purchased at Sears for the Avalon were in better balance with no weights than with those Sears had put on. Took it back, they say it's fine. Got my balancer and balanced them properly and the car is smooth again. Donna drove around for over a year with shaking tires.
example: For the tires purchased at Walmart, the Dodge rims take hammer on weights for the inner and stick-on weights for the outer, there is a ledge just behind the spokes to put the sticky weights on. Walmart put the proper weights on the inner but nothing on the outer. I put the proper outer sticky weights on and the van rides smooth again. Brand new tires, van drove fine on the old tires, Walmart says everything was as good as it gets.
example: On the GMC tires, I watched the local shop guy spin balance one of them. Then I told him to hit the button spin it again. Different reading. Spin again, different reading. Over and over. Apparently his balancer was not calibrated or something was wrong with it. Can't balance a tire accurately if the machine isn't working properly.
example: Crown Vic drives fine, old Goodyear tires are worn, go to local shop and buy 4 new Falken tires, car now shakes at highway speed. Take it back several times, better but not right. Now I have my balancer and find several tires over 1 oz out. Rebalance and car drives almost as good as it did with the old tires. Falkens are awesome in the rain though.
Anyway, the usual disclaimers: JWID and YMMV.
Bob Heller
2017 Winnebago 29VE
Winter Springs FL
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346264 is a reply to message #346250] |
Fri, 09 August 2019 00:32 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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While Ken H. was using Counteract in the same time frame I was using Equal. Neither of us had any real complaints but when someone suggested airsoft beads / pellets, I tried them on my 4 wheel 11,000 GVW trailer. They worked great. Since then I have used them in just about everything. I get most of my odd ball tires mounted and balanced at Walmart and they are use to me. $10.00 each. One time I left a couple of tires there to be mounted and picked up that evening. The tire guy called me about 1.5 hours later and asked where the bags of airsoft beads were. I forgot to leave them and was then about 70 miles away. He said, do not worry about it. I'll mount them, balance them, and then break the bead on only one side so the tire vs. rim position will not move. When you come in we can just drop the airsoft beads in and air them up again. OR I can go grab a new bottle off of the shelf in Sporting Goods and charge you for one bottle. How much weight do you want in each tire?
The point is more and more places are becoming use to people using airsoft beads and this place knew enough to call me when I forgot to leave the pre-measured baggies of them with the tires.
I like the airsoft because they work, are inexpensive, and you do not need filtered valve cores. They also do not clump if installed with moist air. Just do not put slime in your tires later. I assume that will make them clump.
Ken B.
Ken Henderson wrote on Thu, 08 August 2019 16:50I heartily agree with Ken B. Over the years with the GMC I've used
conventional balancing with and without truing, and Counteract balancing
beads. The current set of tires, nearing 6 years old and replacement
before GMCMI Mansfield, were balanced with the Walmart airsoft pellets when
installed. I've already got the 6 bags of with 4 oz. each ready (from the
jar I bought 6 years ago) for the new set. I MAY have noticed a little
unbalance a couple of times, below 30 mph. Otherwise, the balance has been
excellent -- at least as good as with any of the other techniques.
Ken B's advice is perfect AFAIC.
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, Troy-Bilt APU, etc., etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Thu, Aug 8, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ken Burton via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> My suggestion is go back to the balancing beads and this time use air-soft
> pellets from Walmart in the sporting goods section. The are plastic and
> will not cake together from moisture or excessive use of rubber lub. 1
> bottle will do more than just your coach. Cost $10.00 to 15.00. Weight out
> six 4 oz. bags. Break the bead of each tire and throw then inside. No
> need to remove the existing wheel weights. One coach we put them in the guy
> showed up with a big c-clamp and was able to break the tire bead loose
> without removing the wheel from the coach.
> --
> Ken Burton - N9KB
> 76 Palm Beach
> Hebron, Indiana
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346270 is a reply to message #346224] |
Fri, 09 August 2019 09:08 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Once I get 00 on my spin balancer I loosen and rotate the assembly some random amount and repeat. If different then the wheel was not homed correctly on the machine. Since I am not being hounded to get to the next vehicle, I can repeat 3 or more times for locked consistent results. The other clue is at first spin you are off by like 2.50 or more. Don't just hammer on weights like the kid at the tire place would do. Question the concentric fit to the machine. I find the Alcoa hubs are high precision and that you have to select the correct cone size. Not unlike seating a wheel bearing before adjusting, I spin the wheel as it snugs to help self center it. If an assembly is in question after consistent good balance, I have removed it and started over just to prove it is correct. That way I don't get " come backs" which would actually be me to my garage.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346271 is a reply to message #346270] |
Fri, 09 August 2019 09:53 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Many years ago, when dirt was young, I worked weekends and evenings in a
SERVICE STATION. A flying A, if memory serves me. I used to mount and
balance bias ply tires, this was before radials. The balancer was a Coates
& Clark, and the mounting machine was an Iron Tireman. Mostly steel wheels
in those days. The wheels were nearly all miles out of round, and wobbled
like crazy. Even newer stuff was poorly made. It was always a challenge to
get them mounted and balanced correctly. There were syncrobalancers back
then. They mounted like hubcaps. Never had one apart, but they rattled like
they were full of lead shot or ball bearings. Anyhow, it was always a big
hassle to get them spot on. Promised myself 2 things back then. Never work
in a tire shop, or an exhaust shop. Never did, either.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019, 7:09 AM John R. Lebetski via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> Once I get 00 on my spin balancer I loosen and rotate the assembly some
> random amount and repeat. If different then the wheel was not homed
> correctly
> on the machine. Since I am not being hounded to get to the next vehicle, I
> can repeat 3 or more times for locked consistent results. The other clue is
> at first spin you are off by like 2.50 or more. Don't just hammer on
> weights like the kid at the tire place would do. Question the concentric
> fit to
> the machine. I find the Alcoa hubs are high precision and that you have to
> select the correct cone size. Not unlike seating a wheel bearing before
> adjusting, I spin the wheel as it snugs to help self center it. If an
> assembly is in question after consistent good balance, I have removed it
> and
> started over just to prove it is correct. That way I don't get " come
> backs" which would actually be me to my garage.
> --
> John Lebetski
> Woodstock, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346283 is a reply to message #346277] |
Fri, 09 August 2019 13:12 |
Dave Stragand
Messages: 307
Registered: October 2017
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Back in the 1980's, a customer at our Goodyear came back complaining of
a bad vibration from one of the front tires I had replaced less than an
hour before. I found the affected wheel, but no matter how I added
weight it simply would not balance. I decided to completely remount the
tire and hope for better luck. Only then did I see that I had somehow
knocked our valve stem puller tool down inside the tire. That tool
weighed probably 8 ounces or more, but remained remarkably quiet inside
the tire. Once removed, it balanced without issue.
These days mounting always seems include balancing, but back then we
charged around $30-$40 for balancing a set of 4. At least half of the
folks skipped it as that was the price of a whole average tire.
Considering that we sometimes used up to 5 ounces or more of weights to
balance out a wheel or tire, I can only imagine how those cars must have
felt to drive without being balanced.
I wonder how many GMCs rolled on 6 unbalanced tires in those days?
-Dave
1978 Transmode near Pittsburgh
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of
Bruce Hislop via Gmclist
Sent: Friday, August 09, 2019 12:35 PM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Cc: Bruce Hislop
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Centramatic wheel balancing system.
Dave,
I checked your link for a tire shop using the Hunter GSP9700 and it
shows up that the local tire shop I used last year and again last month
has this
machine!
Both time they put the same guy on my job. This past time I saw him
hammering the clip-on weights onto my aluminum wheels so I walked back
to ask him
not to use those (my experience is they fall off too easily). He was
having a hard time understanding me since he is a recent immigrant. I
then
noticed all the stones stuck in the tire. I had to drive through
construction on their street so It was pretty well loaded with stones.
I'm not sure whether to go back to this place and give them one more
shot at it.
--
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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1978 Transmode (403)
Pittsburgh, PA
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| Re: Centramatic wheel balancing system. [message #346370 is a reply to message #346224] |
Mon, 12 August 2019 11:31 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Thr problem with trueing is that then the tread is running true, but the carcas is not. This can cause uneven stiffness as it rotates. Driving a GMC with newer balaced tires, good shocks, proper FE and quite exhaust on smooth road is a lot like being in smooth air in a Gulfsteam G aircraft.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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