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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269262 is a reply to message #268991] |
Thu, 08 January 2015 20:11   |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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Your bank can take up to 10 days to reimburse money while it investigates fraudulent ATM or online use, and up to 20 days if the fraudulent transaction took place at a location such as a store or restaurant. In the meantime, your other legitimate transactions will not be covered. Not so bad if you're around home and can respond quickly. Traveling? S.O.L.
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269266 is a reply to message #269262] |
Thu, 08 January 2015 21:29 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Not trying to start "STUFF", but, has anyone on this net ever actually lost
any money due to Internet scams? I have been banking that way since 1993,
both through my business and personal bank accounts, and never had a
problem.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 Gmc ROYALE 403
On Jan 8, 2015 6:11 PM, "RC Jordan" wrote:
> Your bank can take up to 10 days to reimburse money while it investigates
> fraudulent ATM or online use, and up to 20 days if the fraudulent
> transaction took place at a location such as a store or restaurant. In the
> meantime, your other legitimate transactions will not be covered. Not so
> bad if you're around home and can respond quickly. Traveling? S.O.L.
> --
> 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
> 76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
> Elizabeth City, NC
>
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269274 is a reply to message #269266] |
Thu, 08 January 2015 22:08 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
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Senior Member |
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Jim:
I change my passwords often, and my bank uses Two Factor Authentication, which means we need a small electronic key that generates the “second factor"
I have not lost a dime.
I was hacked once. It was a social, and they got as far as my Twitter account. Other than followers asking why I was hawking blue and yellow pills, not a big deal. Two factor would have stopped it long before they got into my account.
Dolph
DE N8JPC
Wheeling, West Virginia
1977 GMC 26' Palm Beach
TZE167V100820
1976 GMC 26' Donor Coach
TZE166V101610
> On Jan 8, 2015, at 10:29 PM, James Hupy wrote:
>
> Not trying to start "STUFF", but, has anyone on this net ever actually lost
> any money due to Internet scams? I have been banking that way since 1993,
> both through my business and personal bank accounts, and never had a
> problem.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, Or
> 78 Gmc ROYALE 403
> On Jan 8, 2015 6:11 PM, "RC Jordan" wrote:
>
>> Your bank can take up to 10 days to reimburse money while it investigates
>> fraudulent ATM or online use, and up to 20 days if the fraudulent
>> transaction took place at a location such as a store or restaurant. In the
>> meantime, your other legitimate transactions will not be covered. Not so
>> bad if you're around home and can respond quickly. Traveling? S.O.L.
>> --
>> 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
>> 76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
>> Elizabeth City, NC
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269275 is a reply to message #269266] |
Thu, 08 January 2015 22:18 |
kerry pinkerton
Messages: 2565
Registered: July 2012
Location: Harvest, Al
Karma: 15
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Senior Member |
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James Hupy wrote on Thu, 08 January 2015 21:29Not trying to start "STUFF", but, has anyone on this net ever actually lost
any money due to Internet scams? ...
At last count, I'm in line to get 117 inheritances from relatives I didn't know I had in Nigeria. The total is, I think, about 180 million plus. Just want to let all my family and GMC friends know that as soon as the funds arrive, I'll be sending each of you a check. It should be any day now since Eric Holder, the head of the FBI, the Secretary General of the UN, and Barack Obama himself have assured me the last hurdle is almost over. ;0
Seriously, I do know someone who lost money on one of these scams. A retired engineer that I go to church with. I'd have never believed he would be that naive. Obviously this must work some percentage of the time or they wouldn't keep doing it.
We've used internet banking for a long long time with no problems. However, our bank (actually a Federal Credit Union) did get hacked and some folks accounts got hit but the credit union made it all good.
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
Had 5 over the years. Currently have a '06 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269276 is a reply to message #269266] |
Thu, 08 January 2015 22:28 |
Otterwan
Messages: 946
Registered: July 2013
Location: Lynnwood (north of Seattl...
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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James Hupy wrote on Thu, 08 January 2015 19:29Not trying to start "STUFF", but, has anyone on this net ever actually lost
any money due to Internet scams? I have been banking that way since 1993,
both through my business and personal bank accounts, and never had a
problem.
Jim Hupy
Couldn't help but notice that you did not get a positive answer. As for me, I have been nearly 100% online for years. I write exactly 2 checks each month. All other bills are paid online. All deposits are made online by scanning checks. All transfers are made online. Nearly all purchases are made online. I too have never had a problem.
A bit of advice. Don't save your browser history. Shred any document you discard that has your name on it. As for paying "in person", anyone you pay with a check now has your account number, bank routing number, name and address, perhaps phone number. And when you pay at the restaurant with a credit card, that teenager you just handed your card to could have done anything they like with it during the 15 minutes they were gone.
1977 Birchaven, Lynnwood WA - "We may not be able to stop all evil in the world, but I know that how we treat one another is entirely up to us."
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269285 is a reply to message #268991] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 07:03 |
rcjordan
Messages: 1913
Registered: October 2012
Location: Elizabeth City, North Car...
Karma: 1
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>scam
See my $9k comment above. This was pre-internet, but a fraudulent? series of 3 electronic bank drafts on a business account. As noted, it was the good 'ol signature card notation (which banks were technically supposed to verify with each-and-every transaction but did not) that shifted the liability to the bank.
WSJ: http://blogs.wsj.com/wallet/2009/03/27/help-my-checking-account-was-hacked/
Gigaom: https://gigaom.com/2013/08/07/how-scammers-drained-1700-from-my-bank-account-using-starbucks-cards/
LA Times: http://articles.latimes.com/2006/jan/01/local/me-lopez1
The takeaway is that personal accounts have protection but it will be a PITA to resolve. Debit cards are a disaster waiting to happen and have less protection. Your ATM card is probably a debit card now, btw. After paper checks to vendors-known-to-you, Your safest bet is doing everything by personal credit card.
Business accounts and business credit cards have little or no protection. Even banks aren't very aware of this, particularly at the local service rep level. I was on the board of directors of a substantial bank and -even then, I couldn't get a solid, well-researched answer from the legal department without raising hell. If you have business c-cards, kill them or at least reduce the $-limit to act as a firestop. I carry separate personal cards with my business name on them. The cc bill is paid by the company but they are technically personal cards (with relatively low $-limits).
For either personal or business, I think the greatest risk is in "the last mile" rather than the banking system. Think that crackhead gas station attendant or waiter can't read your pin# keystrokes upside-down? Then there are skimmers and loggers on the electronic side.
You pay -one way or another- for every convenience.
SOLD 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
76 Eleganza
Elizabeth City, NC
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269302 is a reply to message #269266] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 11:14 |
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burtco99
Messages: 31
Registered: September 2007
Location: Montreal
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Jim,
Yes I lost $$ through an eBay scam. I have also been the victim of fraud on 2 other occasions.
I lost about $500 through an eBay transaction using PayPal. This was mainly my fault because I was dumb enough to believe the scammer's stories. He asked for me to be patient while he prepared my purchase for shipment. This allowed the seller make the money disappear. I had funded the purchase from my bank account. I innocently waited while the seller emptied his PayPal account and closed his bank accounts. PayPal and eBay at the time had buyer protection, but it was limited to a refund of available funds in the seller's PayPal account. Since the seller had emptied his PayPal account and closed his bank accounts, PayPal was then no longer able to "retrieve" my funds from the seller. Had I funded the purchase with a credit card, I might have been able to pursue the fraud a bit further. That was about 10 years ago, and both eBay & PayPal have improved on their buyer protection methods, but the risk is still there.
About 2 years ago, My online Walmart shopping account was hacked to the point where the perpetrator managed to purchase a few items and charge them to my Credit card. Walmart had retained my CC number on file, without my authorisation, which led to the successful fraud. I noticed the erroneous charges and immediately challenged both Walmart and my CC issuer. My CC account was credited the full amount, and Walmart locked my account to prevent any further use. As a preventative measure, my existing Credit Card number was nullified, and I was issued a new card number.
I now do my online purchases by charging them to a credit card, directly, or through PayPal. I never fund my PayPal transactions from a bank Account. Most Canadian Credit card Issuers give 100% buyer protection in the form of refunds if they can't prove I made the purchase.
I was also the victim of identity theft about 15 years ago.
I had just renewed my mortgage with a new bank, and about 6-7 weeks later, I received three credit card invoices in the mail. These invoices were new cards in my name, 1 issued by a bank, 1 by a big hardware store chain, and the third by a furniture store franchise. I had not applied for any of them. The invoices totalled approximately $17k, with all the purchases taking place in the Toronto area(I'm in Montreal). I immediately contacted the CC issuers and informed them of the fraud. I also filed a police report. The investigation resulted in me being relieved of all responsibility, and my Credit rating was restored. It was determined that the bank leaked my personal info, the perpetrator used that info to apply for a credit card (in store) and immediately made some purchases. The perpetrators normally will request an address change (to a false address) on the CC account within 2 weeks of its creation. This re-directs the invoices so they never make it to the person who's ID was stolen. in my case, the request had been made too late, and the first invoices made it to my home, alerting me to the fraud.
A co-worker had a similar situation occur, but the address change was successful, allowing the fraud to continue to the max limit of the cards. He only found out when the creditors chased him down via a bailiff. In his case, the fraud totalled over $45k, and he incurred legal costs to correct the issue. It also took him several months to fix the damage done, especially to his Credit Rating.
My parents experienced a fraudulent credit card charge back before the internet was popular (early '80s). They had made a phone order purchase for an IBM PC clone and had it shipped to them. a few months later, a fraudulent charge of approx. $4500 appeared on their statement from the same vendor. The CC issuer reimbursed them after an investigation determined that an employee at the vendor had retained a copy of the CC transaction slip and used it for personal gain.
I laugh at how many are so fearful of the internet and the potential risks it provides. The truth is, risks exist everywhere. The internet has just made it easier for the perpetrators to gain access to our info and commit fraudulent acts. As a few have already pointed out, much of our personal info is rampantly available online, and we didn't even put it there. All it takes is a little bit of research for the perpetrators to find it.
Even with my past experiences with fraudulent acts, I still do my daily banking online, I still make online purchases, I still use both eBay and PayPal. I just don't keep any large amounts of MY money in any accounts that have online access to funds transfers.
Much like Rob M does, All my online purchases and most of my local store purchases are all done using the bank's money through a credit card. If fraud occurs, the bank then needs to come after me if they want my money. They carry the burden of risk on their shoulders. As long as I am not the one committing the fraud, I'm generally safe from any large financial risk.
To top it all off, The banks reward me for using their credit cards through their points earning schemes. So far, the benefits of doing so have far outweighed any inconveniences I've experienced, as long as I do not carry any balance owed on my cards.
For me, the convenience of the internet has simplified a large part of my life. I feel the risks surrounding internet use far outweigh the inconveniences of trying to live without it. Of course there are many who are comfortable living in their somewhat antiquated bubble. For them, its a comfort zone, and that is OK. I'm already being accused of similar faults by my own kids! Life still goes on, whether we like it or not. Different strokes for different folks.
Les Burt
Montreal
1975 Eleganza 26ft
A work in Progress
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269307 is a reply to message #269302] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 11:29 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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I guess that the point I was trying to make was that very few, if any,
innocent people are harmed financially through Internet banking hacks or
illegal access to their credit cards or online banking accounts. As far as
the Nigeria inheritance scams are concerned, if it sounds too good to be
true, it is. Don't send anyone money to "insure winnings" . As far as the
100's of beautiful women beating a breathless path directly to the door to
your bedroom, "Don't hold your breath waiting for them to arrive, either."
Be smart out there fellow GMCers, it is a brave new electronic world
here.(VERY BIG GRIN)
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Jan 9, 2015 9:14 AM, "Les Burt" wrote:
> Jim,
> Yes I lost $$ through an eBay scam. I have also been the victim of fraud
> on 2 other occasions.
>
> I lost about $500 through an eBay transaction using PayPal. This was
> mainly my fault because I was dumb enough to believe the scammer's stories.
> He
> asked for me to be patient while he prepared my purchase for shipment.
> This allowed the seller make the money disappear. I had funded the purchase
> from my bank account. I innocently waited while the seller emptied his
> PayPal account and closed his bank accounts. PayPal and eBay at the time had
> buyer protection, but it was limited to a refund of available funds in the
> seller's PayPal account. Since the seller had emptied his PayPal account
> and closed his bank accounts, PayPal was then no longer able to "retrieve"
> my funds from the seller. Had I funded the purchase with a credit card, I
> might have been able to pursue the fraud a bit further. That was about 10
> years ago, and both eBay & PayPal have improved on their buyer protection
> methods, but the risk is still there.
>
>
> About 2 years ago, My online Walmart shopping account was hacked to the
> point where the perpetrator managed to purchase a few items and charge them
> to
> my Credit card. Walmart had retained my CC number on file, without my
> authorisation, which led to the successful fraud. I noticed the erroneous
> charges and immediately challenged both Walmart and my CC issuer. My CC
> account was credited the full amount, and Walmart locked my account to
> prevent
> any further use. As a preventative measure, my existing Credit Card number
> was nullified, and I was issued a new card number.
>
> I now do my online purchases by charging them to a credit card, directly,
> or through PayPal. I never fund my PayPal transactions from a bank Account.
> Most Canadian Credit card Issuers give 100% buyer protection in the form
> of refunds if they can't prove I made the purchase.
>
> I was also the victim of identity theft about 15 years ago.
> I had just renewed my mortgage with a new bank, and about 6-7 weeks later,
> I received three credit card invoices in the mail. These invoices were new
> cards in my name, 1 issued by a bank, 1 by a big hardware store chain, and
> the third by a furniture store franchise. I had not applied for any of
> them. The invoices totalled approximately $17k, with all the purchases
> taking place in the Toronto area(I'm in Montreal). I immediately contacted
> the
> CC issuers and informed them of the fraud. I also filed a police report.
> The investigation resulted in me being relieved of all responsibility, and
> my
> Credit rating was restored. It was determined that the bank leaked my
> personal info, the perpetrator used that info to apply for a credit card (in
> store) and immediately made some purchases. The perpetrators normally will
> request an address change (to a false address) on the CC account within 2
> weeks of its creation. This re-directs the invoices so they never make it
> to the person who's ID was stolen. in my case, the request had been made too
> late, and the first invoices made it to my home, alerting me to the fraud.
>
> A co-worker had a similar situation occur, but the address change was
> successful, allowing the fraud to continue to the max limit of the cards. He
> only found out when the creditors chased him down via a bailiff. In his
> case, the fraud totalled over $45k, and he incurred legal costs to correct
> the
> issue. It also took him several months to fix the damage done, especially
> to his Credit Rating.
>
> My parents experienced a fraudulent credit card charge back before the
> internet was popular (early '80s). They had made a phone order purchase for
> an
> IBM PC clone and had it shipped to them. a few months later, a fraudulent
> charge of approx. $4500 appeared on their statement from the same vendor.
> The CC issuer reimbursed them after an investigation determined that an
> employee at the vendor had retained a copy of the CC transaction slip and
> used
> it for personal gain.
>
> I laugh at how many are so fearful of the internet and the potential risks
> it provides. The truth is, risks exist everywhere. The internet has just
> made it easier for the perpetrators to gain access to our info and commit
> fraudulent acts. As a few have already pointed out, much of our personal
> info is rampantly available online, and we didn't even put it there. All
> it takes is a little bit of research for the perpetrators to find it.
>
> Even with my past experiences with fraudulent acts, I still do my daily
> banking online, I still make online purchases, I still use both eBay and
> PayPal. I just don't keep any large amounts of MY money in any accounts
> that have online access to funds transfers.
>
> Much like Rob M does, All my online purchases and most of my local store
> purchases are all done using the bank's money through a credit card. If
> fraud
> occurs, the bank then needs to come after me if they want my money. They
> carry the burden of risk on their shoulders. As long as I am not the one
> committing the fraud, I'm generally safe from any large financial risk.
>
> To top it all off, The banks reward me for using their credit cards
> through their points earning schemes. So far, the benefits of doing so have
> far
> outweighed any inconveniences I've experienced, as long as I do not carry
> any balance owed on my cards.
>
>
> For me, the convenience of the internet has simplified a large part of my
> life. I feel the risks surrounding internet use far outweigh the
> inconveniences of trying to live without it. Of course there are many who
> are comfortable living in their somewhat antiquated bubble. For them, its a
> comfort zone, and that is OK. I'm already being accused of similar faults
> by my own kids! Life still goes on, whether we like it or not. Different
> strokes for different folks.
> --
> Les Burt
> Montreal
> 1975 Eleganza 26ft
> A work in Progress
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269319 is a reply to message #269275] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 15:01 |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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Senior Member |
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kerry pinkerton wrote on Thu, 08 January 2015 20:18James Hupy wrote on Thu, 08 January 2015 21:29Not trying to start "STUFF", but, has anyone on this net ever actually lost
any money due to Internet scams? ...
At last count, I'm in line to get 117 inheritances from relatives I didn't know I had in Nigeria. The total is, I think, about 180 million plus. Just want to let all my family and GMC friends know that as soon as the funds arrive, I'll be sending each of you a check. It should be any day now since Eric Holder, the head of the FBI, the Secretary General of the UN, and Barack Obama himself have assured me the last hurdle is almost over. ;0
.
Aw, man. I thought the inheritances were for me! Ha.
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269325 is a reply to message #269302] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 16:57 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Burt,
I had a similar experience (but for a two figure sum) on eBay MANY years ago and after that I funded ALL purchases with a credit
card through Pay Pal; that way I get fraud protection from eBay, Pay Pal, AND my credit card.
It is obvious that eBay and Pay Pal don't like that because the default payment method is from a bank account and you have to change
it to a credit card every time AND they don't make it obvious or easy to do that!
Regards,
Rob M.
Sydney, Australia
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Les Burt
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 4:15 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Facebook
Jim,
Yes I lost $$ through an eBay scam. I have also been the victim of fraud on 2 other occasions.
Les
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269333 is a reply to message #269325] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 17:59 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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I almost always use my credit card with PayPal payments unless it is somebody I know an wish to pay directly to avoid the charges.
Mac in OKC
Sent from my iPad
> On Jan 9, 2015, at 16:57, Robert Mueller wrote:
>
> Burt,
>
> I had a similar experience (but for a two figure sum) on eBay MANY years ago and after that I funded ALL purchases with a credit
> card through Pay Pal; that way I get fraud protection from eBay, Pay Pal, AND my credit card.
>
> It is obvious that eBay and Pay Pal don't like that because the default payment method is from a bank account and you have to change
> it to a credit card every time AND they don't make it obvious or easy to do that!
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> Sydney, Australia
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Les Burt
> Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2015 4:15 AM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Facebook
>
> Jim,
> Yes I lost $$ through an eBay scam. I have also been the victim of fraud on 2 other occasions.
>
> Les
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Facebook [message #269339 is a reply to message #268991] |
Fri, 09 January 2015 20:25 |
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dservati1
Messages: 109
Registered: December 2013
Location: Western New York -Rochest...
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Regarding the original post Facebook vs. GMC Forum ... I first want to say thank you to the "old guard" - those of you no mater the age, that have the knowledge and experience that was established here on the forum, that also SHARE, comment, advise, and direct the Facebook crowd. - so thanks.
I can relate to the Forum users as I experienced something similar with my car club we started on simple mail lists, then a bulletin board, then a threaded Forum, then came Flicker for pictures, and then Facebook. I act similar to some of the old guard here do when on Facebook - give some advice when it is short, then post a link to the Forum article/topic/thread on Facebook for the "newbie" to discover the wealth of info onthe Forum .. but I do share and I do understand the appeal of Facebook -ease of use and it's the new shiny thing ..  As I've posted I think it's okay to use both and I do .. anyway thank to those that I "know" on FaceBook Matt C., Billy, Dolph, Ernie, and others that are hear and posted there !!!!
Dave
'78 Palm Beach. car nut new to RV'ing 26 ft. 403 rebuilt in 2018, rebuilt tranny in 2014, Dave Lenzi knuckles & hubs, yada yada yada on ION wheels,Green Brady Bunch stock
David Martin on Facebook
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