| Re: [GMCnet] Scuderi Split Cycle Engine [message #166577 is a reply to message #166217] |
Tue, 17 April 2012 05:59   |
Gary Casey
Messages: 448
Registered: September 2009
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Lots of interesting stories about the GM rotary project, and I think most are true. I was at GMES at the time as was my younger brother - he worked on the apex seal design. As with most features of the engine, the "improved" GM design didn't work until we just copied the Mazda design. Mazda had a particularly complex way of attaching the timing gear to the rotor and, of course, we knew better. After many "jail breaks" (we called them that because that's what the engine looked like after the timing gear came adrift, the rotor "rotated" and pushed fragments of the housing out between the "bars" that were the through bolts) we found that Mazda knew what they were doing.
Then there's the vertical-shaft single-rotor "washing machine" we put above the front drive wheels (transmission design was challenging, but we were up to it). Because the engine rotation was at cross-axis to the axles, we could mount it very soft so it wouldn't transmit idle torsional vibration to the car - hence the name "washing machine."
Of course, it had numerous problems. It needed a 4-speed automatic transmission and that was my project. We put a number of Mazda engines in Vegas with our 4-speed. Just cut the tunnel and raised it up, as well as changed the pinion angle on the rear axle. Easy, actually. Ed Cole maintained that the reason the engine was a dud was that there wasn't a car designed to take advantage of its "charactristics." So then came the Monza, essentially a Vega with a raised tunnel. Ed was apparently responsible (so he claimed, anyway) for the small-block Chevy engine and they should have paid for early retirement after that, as I never saw another useful idea come out of him. The final engine design wasn't all that bad, but some things just can't be wished away. I happened to acquire an official rotary Monza shop manual, but in my moves since it disappeared. Wish I had it now.
Gary Casey
Bob de Kruyff wrote on Mon, 16 April 2012 13:16
> There's quite a story behind GM's effort. It was going to debut in the Monza (Vega based) and was tooled by Hydramatic. Ed Cole was the sponser and pretty well everyone else hated it. The day Ed retired, people were dispatched across the organization to fetch and scrap every engine and component they could find. A few miscellaneous parts such as rotors were hidden in desk drawers as momentos. The Monza was already in prototype form and had to quickly be retooled to accept regular powertrains. The center tunnel was very high in order to accept the central output of the Wankel. Also, the round motif was extended throught the vehicle styling to emphasize the Wankel. Things light headlights were converted to rectangular shapes. I would guess that GM probably spent over a billion on that effort--and yes, it was also going to go into the midengine aluminum Vette. Fitting the V-8 into the Monza proved disastrous due to lack of testing and the tight engine
compartment.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Scuderi Split Cycle Engine [message #166581 is a reply to message #166542] |
Tue, 17 April 2012 06:24 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
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An interesting idea. I wonder if they're efficient and powerful at 3600 RPM (two pole generator) or whether you'd need to spin one faster and either gear or belt reduce its speed - which would add to the cost and complexity.
--johnny
'76 23' transmode norris
'76 palm beach
From: Larry Davick <ljdavick@comcast.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2012 9:09 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Scuderi Split Cycle Engine
This is an interesting thread. The death of the Wankel has been exaggerated before - it seems Audi is incorporating a very small Wankel as a range extender in a hybrid configuration. Would that little rotary be sweet humming along instead of the clatter-box Onan!
From Wikipedia:
A1 e-tron
The Audi A1 e-tron concept car is an electric variant of the A1, first shown at the 2010 Geneva Motor Show. [ 25 ] The A1 e-tron is a series plug-in hybrid (PHEV), powered by an electric motor with a continuous output of 45 kW (61 PS; 60 bhp), and a peak output of 75 kW (102 PS; 101 bhp). A fully charged 12 kWh lithium-ion battery gives a maximum range of 50 kilometres (31 mi), after which a 254 cc Wankel engine is used to power a 15 kW (20 PS; 20 bhp) generator with a 12 L (2.6 imp gal; 3.2 US gal) fuel tank. [ 26 ] This is estimated to provide an additional range of 124 mi (200 km). [ 25 ]
A field testing programme of twenty A1 e-tron vehicles began in Munich in late 2010. [ 27 ]
Larry Davick
Fremont, California
The Mystery Machine
'76 (ish) Palm Beach
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Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Scuderi Split Cycle Engine [message #166870 is a reply to message #166581] |
Thu, 19 April 2012 20:17 |
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ljdavick
Messages: 3548
Registered: March 2007
Location: Fremont, CA
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I'd bet their efficiency is better at 7,200 rpm - just gear it by half. My buddy's RX-2 had 2 very annoying buzzers for yellow line and red line. The engine was so smooth you couldn't tell how fast it was revving.
Larry Davick
The Mystery Machine
Buddy of a Mazda owner in my youth
On Apr 17, 2012, at 4:24 AM, Johnny Bridges wrote:
> An interesting idea. I wonder if they're efficient and powerful at 3600 RPM (two pole generator) or whether you'd need to spin one faster and either gear or belt reduce its speed - which would add to the cost and complexity.
>
> --johnny
> '76 23' transmode norris
> '76 palm beach
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Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, Ca
Howell EFI + EBL + Electronic Dizzy
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