Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77418 is a reply to message #77417] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 00:43   |
zhagrieb
Messages: 676
Registered: August 2009
Location: Portland Oregon
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I'll be installing both the quadrabag system and True Track in the next few
weeks. Anyone in the Portland area who wants a look, come on by. I'll have
to take another look in the box but I believe the quadrabag kit includes
modified brackets for the "T" skirt.
Glenn Giere
'73 "Moby the Motorhome"
On Sat, Mar 20, 2010 at 10:33 PM, Mark Torgerson <a1nss@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Who could not install the T skirt?"
>
> Jim - it was posted on the GMC COOP site that the Qbag system requires
> modification and/or an aftermarket mounting bracket to re-attach the T
> shirt. Looks like Jim B has since gone in and changed his wording about
> it.
>
> "Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard"
>
> Really? Because I asked questions about the design of the Qbag
> system?
>
> It doesn't matter anymore.
>
> After asking questions of both companies concerning their
> product and careful review I have ordered the Harrison system for my
> coach. The Harrison design incorporates protection for both the air bags
> and the air lines should a tire fail.
> This is an important feature to me.
>
>
>
>
> 73' Canyon Lands
>
> ________________________________
> From: Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com>
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Sent: Fri, March 19, 2010 8:36:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
>
> Mark,
> both systems allows for the fender T skirt to be installed.
> Who could not install the T skirt ?
> Keep in mind that the Q Bag System have been in production for over 4
> years.
> Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard and Jim B
> is little ignorant when it comes to knowing product that are better
> engineered.
> I suggest you take time to look at both and get your hands on them.
> Reading and listening to comments is not sufficient for anyone to make
> comment o a product.
> Come to Western States and see coaches there with different systems.I
> will even feed you some rice.
> Words are words, I have a grin on my flat face as I get ready to press
> the send button.
>
> On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Mark Torgerson <a1nss@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Steve - just a note: you were using an earlier version of Harrison's
> system on your coach.
> > According to Idencorp the center bracket has since been changed for added
> strength - (however, still it could/should be beefed up even more).
> >
> >
> > '73 Canyon Lands
> > Portland, Oregon
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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Glenn Giere, Portland OR, K7GAG
'73 "Moby the Motorhome" 26'
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77435 is a reply to message #77434] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 08:21 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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JimB,
Can you explain to me as to how the Harrison system has the bags
better protected?
On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 5:59 AM, Nelson Wright <f25ccapt@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Mark,
>  Gee, I wish you would have let us know that you wanted  that old
> system as I am sure there are plenty of owners that would be real
> happy to make you a good buy on their "Harrison" system so they could
> upgrade to the new system and recoup some of their money.
>
> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:33 AM, Mark Torgerson wrote:
>
>>
>> It doesn't matter anymore.
>>
>> Â After asking questions of both companies concerning their product
>> and careful review I have ordered the Harrison system for my
>> coach. Â The Harrison design incorporates protection for both the
>> air bags and the air lines should a tire fail.
>> This is an important feature to me.
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77452 is a reply to message #77417] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 10:19 |
van.one
Messages: 70
Registered: March 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Mark,
When I get my first GMC I will be interested in updating and would
appreciate the favor if you would please give me your information on the
Harrison system.
van
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Torgerson" <a1nss@yahoo.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 12:33 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
"Who could not install the T skirt?"
Jim - it was posted on the GMC COOP site that the Qbag system requires
modification and/or an aftermarket mounting bracket to re-attach the T
shirt. Looks like Jim B has since gone in and changed his wording about it.
"Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard"
Really? Because I asked questions about the design of the Qbag system?
It doesn't matter anymore.
After asking questions of both companies concerning their product and
careful review I have ordered the Harrison system for my coach. The Harrison
design incorporates protection for both the air bags and the air lines
should a tire fail.
This is an important feature to me.
73' Canyon Lands
________________________________
From: Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Fri, March 19, 2010 8:36:26 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
Mark,
both systems allows for the fender T skirt to be installed.
Who could not install the T skirt ?
Keep in mind that the Q Bag System have been in production for over 4 years.
Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard and Jim B
is little ignorant when it comes to knowing product that are better
engineered.
I suggest you take time to look at both and get your hands on them.
Reading and listening to comments is not sufficient for anyone to make
comment o a product.
Come to Western States and see coaches there with different systems.I
will even feed you some rice.
Words are words, I have a grin on my flat face as I get ready to press
the send button.
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Mark Torgerson <a1nss@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Steve - just a note: you were using an earlier version of Harrison's
> system on your coach.
> According to Idencorp the center bracket has since been changed for added
> strength - (however, still it could/should be beefed up even more).
>
>
> '73 Canyon Lands
> Portland, Oregon
>
>
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77466 is a reply to message #77434] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 12:17 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I hear you Nelson. I GAVE my old system away. If I get a new coach,
I will install the Quadrabag system on it.
On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 5:59 AM, Nelson Wright <f25ccapt@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Mark,
> Gee, I wish you would have let us know that you wanted that old
> system as I am sure there are plenty of owners that would be real
> happy to make you a good buy on their "Harrison" system so they could
> upgrade to the new system and recoup some of their money.
>
> On Mar 21, 2010, at 1:33 AM, Mark Torgerson wrote:
>
>>
>> It doesn't matter anymore.
>>
>> After asking questions of both companies concerning their product
>> and careful review I have ordered the Harrison system for my
>> coach. The Harrison design incorporates protection for both the
>> air bags and the air lines should a tire fail.
>> This is an important feature to me.
>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77497 is a reply to message #77452] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 15:59 |
Jim Bounds
Messages: 842
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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What have I changed on my web site? My guess is the "slight modification" I mentioned is to cut the lower T skirt bracket a bit just as you will find you will have to do with your Harrison one.
You say you are going to modify the system for more support, good luck because it is not a "yea youall watch this" sort of thing to modify something as important as a suspension component! So you are buying a brand new product and even before you put it on you are modifying it? I would not do that. The big thing is 1/4" thick steel is not enough to build such a device out of-- heck everything bends, the upright twists as it did on Nelsons, the air bag mounting plates bend as it does on mine, using with only 1 wheel on a side the whole system deforms as it did on Steve's and the one I drove. I make nothing no matter which one you buy but really, do you want that? We're not making this up, this is not a soap opera, I have a business and I cannot put my customers in harms way knowing what I know and see!
You really need to see, touch and feel the 2 systems side by side-- really, there is no comparison-- Steve and I wrong?
When Liegh refused satisfaction to several of my customers because of serious issues with his product I told him right then that I would let everyone know what happened and that is my reason for telling you what I am. I can prove all I am saying so I can say it. If you are informed and still make your decision then you have thaqt right, you live in America but boy...
See I am not confused, I am first person informed, I am in the loop, the big loop-- I have the experience, the cuts on my hands and the customers telling me their troubles. Do not dismiss me thinking I am a dumb redneck-- I may be but this I do know about! I'm not hiding anything, I'm not "changing" my web site to hide anything, you are mistaken. This is not a game, I have the farm in this! You can bat around what people "say", I will tell you from first hand experiences!
I think I have made my point-- unless someone has something new on this we probably should let the thread go and I agree. We live in America and you can do anything you like but do not try and bring me around to your side on this one-- no way brother! Don;t run your coach with 1 wheel off the ground with that system. You can do it with no problem with a Quad bag system. Who was at Dothan, remember the pictures of the guy heading to the rally that lost a tire? I have absolute documented proof it works perfect with the Quas bag system!
I'll shu up now!
Jim Bounds
------------------------
----- Original Message ----
From: J. Leon Van landingham <van.one@cox.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 11:19:40 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
Mark,
When I get my first GMC I will be interested in updating and would
appreciate the favor if you would please give me your information on the
Harrison system.
van
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Torgerson" <a1nss@yahoo.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 12:33 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
"Who could not install the T skirt?"
Jim - it was posted on the GMC COOP site that the Qbag system requires
modification and/or an aftermarket mounting bracket to re-attach the T
shirt. Looks like Jim B has since gone in and changed his wording about it.
"Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard"
Really? Because I asked questions about the design of the Qbag system?
It doesn't matter anymore.
After asking questions of both companies concerning their product and
careful review I have ordered the Harrison system for my coach. The Harrison
design incorporates protection for both the air bags and the air lines
should a tire fail.
This is an important feature to me.
73' Canyon Lands
________________________________
From: Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Fri, March 19, 2010 8:36:26 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
Mark,
both systems allows for the fender T skirt to be installed.
Who could not install the T skirt ?
Keep in mind that the Q Bag System have been in production for over 4 years.
Your making it sound like our system is really sub standard and Jim B
is little ignorant when it comes to knowing product that are better
engineered.
I suggest you take time to look at both and get your hands on them.
Reading and listening to comments is not sufficient for anyone to make
comment o a product.
Come to Western States and see coaches there with different systems.I
will even feed you some rice.
Words are words, I have a grin on my flat face as I get ready to press
the send button.
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:32 PM, Mark Torgerson <a1nss@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Steve - just a note: you were using an earlier version of Harrison's
> system on your coach.
> According to Idencorp the center bracket has since been changed for added
> strength - (however, still it could/should be beefed up even more).
>
>
> '73 Canyon Lands
> Portland, Oregon
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2761 - Release Date: 03/21/10
07:33:00
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77504 is a reply to message #77497] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 16:49 |
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Personally, I'm rather tired of the 2/4 bagger war. And, it is a war.
Why is it a war? One man's product has been attacked directly. Along with
the attack of his product has been an offensive salvo to his character.
Fellows, it is possible to state a case for a product without being
antagonistic or hurtful toward another's. If the verbiage had come from
someone not involved in the development -- OK. But, when it comes from those
closely related to the development of a product it ceases to be a good,
ethical stand.
Present the facts of what your product will do, Mr. Vendor. The rest of us
are smart enough and free enough to make our own decisions.
In my opinion, when Vendor A runs down Vendor B's product, Vendor A winds up
loosing credibility and integrity. This yields lost sales.
I suspect I'm not alone in this opinion.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77509 is a reply to message #77504] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 17:13 |
Jim Bounds
Messages: 842
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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You are right Byron and being "vendor A" I appologise to those listening. I would love to bring it up with "vendor B" first person but that will never happen. If I cause people to think less of me, I can't help it and quit. I would think badly of myslef if I did not say something.
There are times to be diplomatic, there are times to not pull punches. It's OK with me, we do need to move on though and I am sorry for creating a scene here. Hey, what ever DID happen to that kid that said the king was not wearing any clothes anyway!
Jim Bounds
------------------------
----- Original Message ----
From: Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 5:49:41 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
Personally, I'm rather tired of the 2/4 bagger war. And, it is a war.
Why is it a war? One man's product has been attacked directly. Along with
the attack of his product has been an offensive salvo to his character.
Fellows, it is possible to state a case for a product without being
antagonistic or hurtful toward another's. If the verbiage had come from
someone not involved in the development -- OK. But, when it comes from those
closely related to the development of a product it ceases to be a good,
ethical stand.
Present the facts of what your product will do, Mr. Vendor. The rest of us
are smart enough and free enough to make our own decisions.
In my opinion, when Vendor A runs down Vendor B's product, Vendor A winds up
loosing credibility and integrity. This yields lost sales.
I suspect I'm not alone in this opinion.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77519 is a reply to message #77504] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 17:34 |
Mark Torgerson
Messages: 19
Registered: March 2010
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Well worded and true - thank you Sir.
'73 Canyon Lands
________________________________
From: Byron Songer <bsonger@songerconsulting.net>
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 2:49:41 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
Personally, I'm rather tired of the 2/4 bagger war. And, it is a war.
Why is it a war? One man's product has been attacked directly. Along with
the attack of his product has been an offensive salvo to his character.
Fellows, it is possible to state a case for a product without being
antagonistic or hurtful toward another's. If the verbiage had come from
someone not involved in the development -- OK. But, when it comes from those
closely related to the development of a product it ceases to be a good,
ethical stand.
Present the facts of what your product will do, Mr. Vendor. The rest of us
are smart enough and free enough to make our own decisions.
In my opinion, when Vendor A runs down Vendor B's product, Vendor A winds up
loosing credibility and integrity. This yields lost sales.
I suspect I'm not alone in this opinion.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77588 is a reply to message #77512] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 22:36 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I was informed by Walt Hally that when they had the air bag cut on
Gary Kosier's coach , he was amazed how easy it was to change the bag
and get back on the road. He has seen how the other unit bags are
changed.
Also the boggie nut on our unit fits without an overhang.
On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 3:21 PM, Nelson Wright <f25ccapt@earthlink.net> wrote:
> Dan, I'm not calling it a "fix" as much as it is a "crutch" and it
> certainly isn't esthetically attractive, but it will allow the full
> amount of down travel. As for raising I doubt that it will go as high
> as the original or the Quad bag due to the smaller size bags.
> Nelson
>
> On Mar 21, 2010, at 5:43 PM, Dan Gregg wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Nelson, does the "fix" allow the Harrison setup to have full travel
>> again so the coach can be lowered and raised the full extent as the
>> original and Quadra bag units?
>> Dan
>> --
>> Dan & Teri Gregg
>>
>> danandteri.blogspot.com
>>
>>
>>
>> ///Halon Automatic Fire Extinguishers
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77592 is a reply to message #77519] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 23:13 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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I have only looked closely at 3 of those 4 bag systems.
#1 was on a coach that I was looking to buy. It was bent. I went looking for a different coach.
#2 was on a coach belonging to a friend. It was bent. He claimed he was going to weld up some braces for it and install them. I do not know what he ever did with it.
#3 was on a coach of a GMCer who stopped by looking for help on a front wheel problem. It was also bent. Since I did not know him well, I did not say anything and he went on his way. I saw him later at a rally still driving the bent 4 bagger.
After seeing those three I have made my decision on which one to buy.
I know I do not want one that is bent or subject to bending. BUT it appears that some bending can be tolerated as all three of the above coaches were being driven down the road. I just do not know or care to find out how much bending can be tolerated before it needs to be replaced.
BTW, I still have the original 2 bag system which works satisfactorily for me.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77593 is a reply to message #77592] |
Sun, 21 March 2010 23:24 |
 |
USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ken,
Steve F. posted pictures of his bent 4 bagger and it was the plate that
supported the bags attached to the forward facing swing arm.
Jim B. has reported that the 1/4" frame bends also.
Do you remember what specifically was bent on the three units you looked at?
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ken Burton
Sent: Monday, 22 March 2010 3:13 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger
I have only looked closely at 3 of those 4 bag systems.
#1 was on a coach that I was looking to buy. It was bent. I went looking
for a different coach.
#2 was on a coach belonging to a friend. It was bent. He claimed he was
going to weld up some braces for it and install them. I do not know what he
ever did with it.
#3 was on a coach of a GMCer who stopped by looking for help on a front
wheel problem. It was also bent. Since I did not know him well, I did not
say anything and he went on his way. I saw him later at a rally still
driving the bent 4 bagger.
After seeing those three I have made my decision on which one to buy.
I know I do not want one that is bent or subject to bending. BUT it appears
that some bending can be tolerated as all three of the above coaches were
being driven down the road. I just do not know or care to find out how much
bending can be tolerated before it needs to be replaced.
BTW, I still have the original 2 bag system which works satisfactorily for
me.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fw: 2/4 bagger [message #77607 is a reply to message #76959] |
Mon, 22 March 2010 01:28 |
Luvn737s
Messages: 1106
Registered: June 2007
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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My concern with any modification of the original design is that the load it being carried from the wheels through the bogie arms to the airspring. In the modified (4bag/Qbag) design, the stoutness of the bogie arm inevitably gets reduced to much thinner material that is bolted in place.
I am not an engineer, but I do know that any design is only as good as the weakest part. I have a hard time understanding how the components of the modified systems are as strong as the simple bogie and airspring. Perhaps the load analysis proves it's more than adequate, but just eyeballing it, it still looks like it needs to be as stout as the bogie arm.
Randy
1973 26' Painted Desert
Ahwatukee (Phoenix) AZ
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