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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110233 is a reply to message #110231] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 11:59   |
Dennis S
Messages: 3046
Registered: November 2005
Karma: 2
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| Carl S. wrote on Thu, 30 December 2010 11:15 |
| Dennis S wrote on Thu, 30 December 2010 09:06 |
Michael, Steve, et al
The remarks you attributed to Mark are classic defensive-offense. The individual finds him/her self in the wrong or accused of being wrong and goes on the offense. They can make comments about you, your mother, your dog or, as in this case, some material object to throw the attention from their own error or inadequacies. It can be quite effective -- most of us want to rise to defend the GMC, even though that is not or should not be the point. The point was about questionable workmanship and overbilling.
Consider filing a BBB complaint -- I see that they have only had one in the last two years and it was resolved.
Dennis Sexton
Steve, Mark at Spectrac was rude enough to actually say if the GMC was such
a good motorhome then it wouldn't of been discontinued. He actually said it
we'll known for its poor drive quality due to the size of its wheelbase. He
went on to say that if it were so good then GMC would of brought them back.
Once he told me if suspension work was so easy why can't I do it myself.
Jerry has never been like that, hes been polite and nice. Mark on the other
hand it another story. I clearly remember him telling me he did a 6 wheel
alignment. I know its buyer beware. And Im learning as I go along. But he
knew I knew nothing about this and charged me $230 for a 2 wheel alignment.
He said it was so expensive because they had to test drive it 4 times.
--
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Casa Grand___________________________________
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Michael,
I'm surprised he didn't call you a "racist" or "bigot".
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Carl,
You're right! Another great defense -- the race card.
Another favorite among some "we only worked on this POS as a favor to you. We don't need your business"
Dennis
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Memphis TN Metro
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| Re: [GMCnet] Why GM quit the GMCMH... Re: Road Wonder [message #110241 is a reply to message #110226] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 14:15 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
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One of the way they tried to reduce cost of production was to have
Coachman do the interior.
Coachman was able to throw in the interior for lot less tha
On Thu, Dec 30, 2010 at 8:01 AM, Desmond's GMC <980@opg.org> wrote:
> When I was shopping for my GMC, I was speaking to one of my shipmates in
> the Coast Guard Auxiliary who is a retired VP from GM. Â I asked him what
> he thought of my idea to buy the 33-year old coach. Â I only know him
> casually and I think he was being totally candid when he told me,
> "Desmond that was one of the finest products we ever built, a real gem.
> The only reason we ever stopped making them was that they were too
> expensive to produce..."
>
> DC
>
> --
> 1977 GMC ex-Palm Beach, 26-3
> Treasure Island, CA
> KC6VHG, KAG0675 "980"
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Why GM quit the GMCMH... Re: Road Wonder [message #110265 is a reply to message #110226] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 17:46 |
Bryan Davies
Messages: 18
Registered: October 2010
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Not to mention the Carter Administration financial mess and the first Gas Shortage... Remember gas lines around the block and 5 gal fill up limits? Tuff time to be selling Motorhomes of any quality.
On Dec 30, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Desmond's GMC wrote:
> When I was shopping for my GMC, I was speaking to one of my shipmates in
> the Coast Guard Auxiliary who is a retired VP from GM. I asked him what
> he thought of my idea to buy the 33-year old coach. I only know him
> casually and I think he was being totally candid when he told me,
> "Desmond that was one of the finest products we ever built, a real gem.
> The only reason we ever stopped making them was that they were too
> expensive to produce..."
>
> DC
>
> --
> 1977 GMC ex-Palm Beach, 26-3
> Treasure Island, CA
> KC6VHG, KAG0675 "980"
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] Why GM quit the GMCMH... Re: Road Wonder [message #110267 is a reply to message #110226] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 17:49 |
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First gas crisis was in 1974. I remember it well. I had a 74 Bonneville that
loved the stuff.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
Bryan Davies wrote:
> Not to mention the Carter Administration financial mess and the first Gas
> Shortage... Remember gas lines around the block and 5 gal fill up limits?
> Tuff time to be selling Motorhomes of any quality.
> On Dec 30, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Desmond's GMC wrote:
>
>> When I was shopping for my GMC, I was speaking to one of my shipmates in
>> the Coast Guard Auxiliary who is a retired VP from GM. I asked him what
>> he thought of my idea to buy the 33-year old coach. I only know him
>> casually and I think he was being totally candid when he told me,
>> "Desmond that was one of the finest products we ever built, a real gem.
>> The only reason we ever stopped making them was that they were too
>> expensive to produce..."
>>
>> DC
>>
>> --
>> 1977 GMC ex-Palm Beach, 26-3
>> Treasure Island, CA
>> KC6VHG, KAG0675 "980"
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110281 is a reply to message #110219] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 19:06 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Michael,
I realize this is a stupid question but do you intend to go back to Spectrac
to try and get them to rectify your problems?
If not I think that after you get to the root cause of your troubles you
send them a blast that knocks Mark off his feet.
Frankly I am particularly concerned by the fact you told us they adjusted
your steering box "because it was too tight."
If you look in the Maintenance Manual Ref: X-7525 Page 9-38 you will find it
is a complicated procedure that from what I can tell needs to be done with
the steering box out of the GMC. Is there any evidence of that being done?
Tom Hampton and I adjusted it as per the manual and it made a difference in
the way Double Trouble steered.
My gut feel is that they "adjusted" it in the coach by turning the
adjustment screw by feel!
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue StreakTZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2010 2:16 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
Steve, Mark at Spectrac was rude enough to actually say if the GMC was such
a good motorhome then it wouldn't of been discontinued. He actually said it
we'll known for its poor drive quality due to the size of its wheelbase. He
went on to say that if it were so good then GMC would of brought them back.
Once he told me if suspension work was so easy why can't I do it myself.
Jerry has never been like that, hes been polite and nice. Mark on the other
hand it another story. I clearly remember him telling me he did a 6 wheel
alignment. I know its buyer beware. And Im learning as I go along. But he
knew I knew nothing about this and charged me $230 for a 2 wheel alignment.
He said it was so expensive because they had to test drive it 4 times.
--
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Casa Grande, AZ
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110282 is a reply to message #110224] |
Thu, 30 December 2010 19:09 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Steve,
Well I reckon it's the right season for these kinds of comments, the old
saying; "he's full of s%#t like a Christmas turkey" comes to mind!
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue StreakTZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Steven Ferguson
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2010 2:50 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
Mike,
I hope you BCC'd Jerry with this!
Wheelbase has nothing to do with it. Mark is a parts guy and needs to stay
in his place.
The gas crisis killed the GMC.
Who knows, a couple more years of production might even have seen GM getting
a return on it's investment.
Steve Ferguson
Sierra Vista, AZ
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110337 is a reply to message #110282] |
Fri, 31 December 2010 06:46 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Rob,
I figure that if they were going to do something about the shortcomings in
their service, they would have done it by now. I have never said anything
about SpecTrak that I haven't CC'd them with. I have called, no return
calls. I have emailed, to replys.
Mark is a parts guy...period.
On Thu, Dec 30, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Steve,
>
> Well I reckon it's the right season for these kinds of comments, the old
> saying; "he's full of s%#t like a Christmas turkey" comes to mind!
>
> Regards,
> Rob M.
> USAussie - Downunder
> AUS '75 Avion-The Blue StreakTZE365V100428
> USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Steven Ferguson
> Sent: Friday, December 31, 2010 2:50 AM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
>
> Mike,
> I hope you BCC'd Jerry with this!
> Wheelbase has nothing to do with it. Mark is a parts guy and needs to stay
> in his place.
> The gas crisis killed the GMC.
> Who knows, a couple more years of production might even have seen GM
> getting
> a return on it's investment.
>
> Steve Ferguson
> Sierra Vista, AZ
> _______________________________________________
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--
Steve Ferguson
Sierra Vista, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Why GM quit the GMCMH... Re: Road Wonder [message #110338 is a reply to message #110267] |
Fri, 31 December 2010 06:48 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Byron,
I have vivid memories of hundreds of Winnebagos sitting in their storage
lot, never to be sold. Nearly all of the industry was failing at that time
because of the gas crisis. I have heard from those in the know that a few
more years of production just might have helped GM turn a profit on these
coaches.
On Thu, Dec 30, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Byron Songer
<bsonger@songerconsulting.net>wrote:
> First gas crisis was in 1974. I remember it well. I had a 74 Bonneville
> that
> loved the stuff.
>
> Byron Songer
> 1978 Royale by Coachmen
> Louisville, KY
> Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
> Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
>
>
>
> Bryan Davies wrote:
>
> > Not to mention the Carter Administration financial mess and the first Gas
> > Shortage... Remember gas lines around the block and 5 gal fill up
> limits?
> > Tuff time to be selling Motorhomes of any quality.
> > On Dec 30, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Desmond's GMC wrote:
> >
> >> When I was shopping for my GMC, I was speaking to one of my shipmates in
> >> the Coast Guard Auxiliary who is a retired VP from GM. I asked him what
> >> he thought of my idea to buy the 33-year old coach. I only know him
> >> casually and I think he was being totally candid when he told me,
> >> "Desmond that was one of the finest products we ever built, a real gem.
> >> The only reason we ever stopped making them was that they were too
> >> expensive to produce..."
> >>
> >> DC
> >>
> >> --
> >> 1977 GMC ex-Palm Beach, 26-3
> >> Treasure Island, CA
> >> KC6VHG, KAG0675 "980"
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> GMCnet mailing list
> >> List Information and Subscription Options:
> >> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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--
Steve Ferguson
Sierra Vista, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Why GM quit the GMCMH... Re: Road Wonder [message #110342 is a reply to message #110338] |
Fri, 31 December 2010 08:10 |
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There may well have been several reasons for discontinuing the TZE.
Some of us have read that a new VP of the GMC division wanted it killed
"just because". Some execs do live by whims. Steve Jobs returned to Apple
and killed the Newton Message Pad because it was developed under John
Sculley. Today we have the iPad, Jobs' pad development.
Another reason would be the high cost of fuel in 1978. Of course, the GMC
came to market when gas was scarce in 1974 and had to survive that. We
experienced the another slowdown again in 2008. Vacation places sat empty
and many RV dealers went belly up that year while inventory sat around.
Then there's the fact that the Toronado drivetrain (using the 455 and 403)
went away in 1979 as the Toronado continued the GM trend toward downsizing.
For muscle, attention was turned to the Chevy 454 which was mainly used in
trucks. By 1979 GM's hand had been slapped for putting one brand of engines
in another brand of car so I find it difficult to think that GMC couldn't
have lived on unless, of course, the newer front end wasn't quite heavy
enough or required too much retooling to fit. Even that argument doesn't
really hold water because Revcon started using the 454 teamed with a Dana so
they could continue with a FWD RV.
Several people are of the impression that by late 1977 GM had received it's
investment back in R&D. It was still the motorhome that stood out. Since it
made it through the rough times of late 1973 and early 1974 it could have
survived the slump of 1978. So, I come back to the impression that the VP
who ascended the throne at GMC just didn't like the idea of building
something other than a truck. Of course, look at what rides under the badge
of GMC now! You can't tell me that a crossover vehicle is a truck with a bed
that's covered; not when it sits on a unibody design with a suspension like
a typical car.
Just my opinion.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
Steven Ferguson wrote:
> Byron,
> I have vivid memories of hundreds of Winnebagos sitting in their storage
> lot, never to be sold. Nearly all of the industry was failing at that time
> because of the gas crisis. I have heard from those in the know that a few
> more years of production just might have helped GM turn a profit on these
> coaches.
>
> On Thu, Dec 30, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Byron Songer
> <bsonger@songerconsulting.net>wrote:
>
>> First gas crisis was in 1974. I remember it well. I had a 74 Bonneville
>> that
>> loved the stuff.
>>
>> Byron Songer
>> 1978 Royale by Coachmen
>> Louisville, KY
>> Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
>> Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Bryan Davies wrote:
>>
>>> Not to mention the Carter Administration financial mess and the first Gas
>>> Shortage... Remember gas lines around the block and 5 gal fill up
>> limits?
>>> Tuff time to be selling Motorhomes of any quality.
>>> On Dec 30, 2010, at 10:01 AM, Desmond's GMC wrote:
>>>
>>>> When I was shopping for my GMC, I was speaking to one of my shipmates in
>>>> the Coast Guard Auxiliary who is a retired VP from GM. I asked him what
>>>> he thought of my idea to buy the 33-year old coach. I only know him
>>>> casually and I think he was being totally candid when he told me,
>>>> "Desmond that was one of the finest products we ever built, a real gem.
>>>> The only reason we ever stopped making them was that they were too
>>>> expensive to produce..."
>>>>
>>>> DC
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> 1977 GMC ex-Palm Beach, 26-3
>>>> Treasure Island, CA
>>>> KC6VHG, KAG0675 "980"
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
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>>
>
>
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110346 is a reply to message #109821] |
Fri, 31 December 2010 08:27 |
kingd
Messages: 592
Registered: June 2004
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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to Mike(RadioActive), I believe from reading all the posts in this topic, that you and others maybe talking about two DIFFERENT things in the rear of your coach. Remember there are 4 (pair) of wheel Bearings and 4(pair) of BOGIE pin Bushings on a GMCMH. When others talked about jacking up a bogie to check for play, they were referring to the bogie pin bushings. The rear WHEEL bearing are similar to what the front wheel bearings were on an older rear wheel drive car and would have to be REALLY shot to cause wig wag(and then the wheel falls off).
Re Nitrogen in tires, yes normal air is almost 80% Nitrogen already and if ones shop air system has a dryer, there isn't much moisture in the air at the nozzle. I used to think Nitrogen was better as I was told the Nitrogen molecule was larger and the SLOWWWW leaking of tires through the rubber would be less, but my last year of Aerospce Engineering kid tells me the Nitrogen molecule is actually smaller than an Oxygen molecule. So much for that. I think it's HYPE !!!
DAVE KING
DAVE KING
lurker, wannabe
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
[Updated on: Fri, 31 December 2010 14:13] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110581 is a reply to message #109821] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 15:50 |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Well not to keep this topic alive but I just got back from my trip. About 80-90 miles each way.
I tried my best to relax, clam down and just drive. However I'm still pretty sure my coach needs a professionals touch.
Relaxing helped a lot. So did lower tire pressure. I adjusted our load so it was much more evenly placed inside. But theres something wrong there. Its a few different problems.
Hwy Speeds under 45 it seems pretty darn good. In fact I went down a SUPER CURVEY mountain road at 10-30 mph like a champ. Of course it was off the hwy.
Hwy Speeds over 45-55 "OK, fair I'd say, the slower the better"
Hwy Speeds over 60 not so great. Many Big trucks still blow me off the road. Like someone takes their arm and pushes the coach out of the way. Then it feels like I'm going to sway really bad. Calming down helps me not oversteer but it can be a little scary.
It seems to catch every rut and uneven road surface on many parts of the interstate. I know I'm a walking contradiction but sometimes when the road isn't bad and no big trucks are pushing me it drives at 60 mph fine. Not one handed car like driving but not bad.
Its almost like if you can keep the coach steady it drives fine but one false move and you got to correct it.
A member on the forum said they'd help me look at it. I'm going to take him up on it since I'd feel way better knowing someone that knows these will be helping me. This was our first full trip with no problems except for one leaky pipe and this suspension issue which at least with calming down allowed us to stay on the hwy.
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
[Updated on: Sun, 02 January 2011 15:51] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110583 is a reply to message #110581] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 16:23 |
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Michael,
Thanks for the encouraging report. I say encouraging because you made it
back home in one piece and didn't sell it along the way.
If you're rear end is bad I'd suggest a proctologist look at it. After he
gets through consider the following possibilities.
First, the tires could be terribly out of round or unbalanced or both. When
the tandems get to running over 55 or so, the tires can begin to fight each
other if they're not within some small tolerance of true. You will
experience a bouncing effect that is rather rapid. Chattering teeth comes to
mind. This is caused because while one has the high spot of the tire
touching the road the other tire may be hitting the road at the low spot.
The faster you go the more you exaggerate the problem until you hit the
speed of sound. At that point it goes away. By the way, trued tires will
produce better mileage and wear plus a more pleasurable ride.
Second, are the bushings, spindles, etc. all tight and OK back there?
Weebles wobble but don't fall down. Still, however, they wobble and that can
drive you crazy. You could have one tire bouncing freely as it tries to
figure out what it's supposed to be doing.
Third, if the bogies are out of alignment (one doesn't track with the other
and they both go straight) then you're at the mercy of the ruts interacting
with the tread interacting with the subtle direction of travel bothered just
a tad by the wind and other environmental issues.
Some trucks bother me, especially if they're driving in excess of 70 mph and
have a big air deflector on the cab roof just before the trailer. If they
get within a couple of feet then, of course, a vacuum gets created that will
make you go back and forth as the truck pulls next to you and then moves on.
It sounds like you may drive closer to the center line than others of us.
That makes you susceptible to the vacuum issue.
At any rate, a 23 footer shouldn't be whipping around like you seem to
imply.
Do as Chuck suggested. Get a good, straight stick about five feet long. Put
it about eight inches of the ground so that the front and rear of the stick
are touching from the front side of the tire on the middle axle to the back
side of the tire on the rear axle. If there are four points (two per tire)
that touch the stick then, in general, things are aligned. The next question
would by in which direction do they tend to point. Hopefully, they point the
same direction and parallel to the sides of the coach.
My father-in-law had a wagon that could dance around on the rear end if he
got going at a certain speed and the load on the wagon was just right. Both
wheels on the rear pointed in different directions. If the wagon was fully
loaded then the tires scraped along on the gravel roads. Not much load and a
person or two on one side make the rear end move about. Thank goodness it
was a farm wagon and rear end alignment didn't really matter. Tractors tend
not to go over 35 out in the field.
If someone with a nice-handling GMC drove yours you might get a good
opinion.
I do believe you're on the right path when it comes to learning to relax
while driving. The next task is to figure out the primary source of the
issue. It's beginning to sound like it isn't the front end.
One more question. How old are the shocks and what kind are they.
Welcome to the pursuit for excellence.
Byron Songer
1978 Royale by Coachmen
Louisville, KY
Personal - http://web.me.com/bnsonger
Eastern States - http://www.gmceast.com
Michael wrote:
>
>
> Well not to keep this topic alive but I just got back from my trip. About
> 80-90 miles each way.
> I tried my best to relax, clam down and just drive. However I'm still pretty
> sure my coach needs a professionals touch.
> Relaxing helped a lot. So did lower tire pressure. I adjusted out load so it
> was much more evenly placed inside. But theres something wrong there. Its a
> few different problems.
> Hwy Speeds under 45 it seems pretty darn good. In fact I went down a SUPER
> CURVEY mountain road at 10-30 mph like a champ. Of course it was off the hwy.
> Hwy Speeds over 45-55 "OK, fair I'd say, the slower the better"
> Hwy Speeds over 60 not so great. Many Big trucks still blow me off the road.
> Like someone takes their arm and pushes the coach out of the way. Then it
> feels like I'm going to sway really bad. Calming down helps me not oversteer
> but it can be a little scary.
> It seems to catch every rut and uneven road surface on many parts of the
> interstate. I know I'm a walking contradiction but sometimes when the road
> isn't bad and no big trucks are pushing me it drives at 60 mph fine. Not one
> handed car like driving but not bad.
> Its almost like if you can keep the coach steady it drives fine but one false
> move and you got to correct it.
> A member on the forum said they'd help me look at it. I'm going to take him up
> on it since I'd feel way better knowing someone that knows these will be
> helping me. This was our first full trip with no problems except for one leaky
> pipe and this suspension issue which at least with calming down allowed us to
> stay on the hwy.
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--
Byron Songer
Full-timing to enjoy the USA
Former owner but still an admirer
GMC paint schemes at -
http://www.songerconsulting.net
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110591 is a reply to message #109821] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 18:15 |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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LOL, trust me I've thought of selling it 100 times (still haven't ruled it out, but I'd still buy another!) I'll hang in there. Other then the problems, a 26 ft may have been a little better for us traveling with the 2 kids. But its fine for now, and we're going to be creative in the planning dept for sleeping down the road but thats another story....
All 6 tires are new, mounted on Alcoas.
I had a fellow from the forum that offered to help me check it out. I'm not afraid to dig in (even though I don't have much mechanical skill I've been learning as I go along). So I'm sure we'll find the problem. If not at this point its drivable and maybe I'll drive it to JimK. I'm going to start looking at the steering, and rear end with the help of the posts.
This GMC is about 100,000x better then when I bought it. It was so horrible I couldn't stand it, but this trip I have to fix one leaky pipe which I know where it is so its not hard.
I think I'm going to try to check the rear alignment using the method you both mention. Spectrac said they had done it, but now they said they never did.
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
[Updated on: Sun, 02 January 2011 18:18] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110603 is a reply to message #110591] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 19:57 |
Kosier
Messages: 834
Registered: February 2008
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Mike,
I'm a little late getting in on this discussion, but you might
have too much toe-out. That will make it dart around
if you deviate a little from absolutely straight. HTH
Gary Kosier
77EII & 77PB
Newark, Ohio
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael" <radioactive626@msn.com>
To: <gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 02, 2011 7:15 PM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
>
>
> LOL, trust me I've thought of selling it 100 times (still
> haven't ruled it out, but I'd still buy another!) I'll hang in
> there. Other then the problems, a 26 ft may have been a little
> better for us traveling with the 2 kids. But its fine for now,
> and we're going to be creative in the planning dept for
> sleeping down the road but thats another story....
> All 6 tires are new, mounted on Alcoas.
> I had a fellow from the forum that offered to help me check it
> out. I'm not afraid to dig in (even though I don't have much
> mechanical skill I've been learning as I go along). So I'm sure
> we'll find the problem. If not at this point its drivable and
> maybe I'll drive it to JimK. I'm going to start looking at the
> steering, and rear end with the help of the posts.
> This GMC is about 100,000x better then when I bought it. It was
> so horrible I couldn't stand it, but this trip I have to fix
> one leaky pipe which I know where it is so its not hard.
>
>
>
> --
> ***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
> Michael, Casa Grande, AZ
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110609 is a reply to message #109821] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 20:44 |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Well I am wondering if the front end alignment I got was done correctly.
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110610 is a reply to message #110609] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 21:34 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Michael,
Here's the spec out of the Maintenance Manual (MM):
Check:
Caster: +1 1/2° to +2 1/2°
Camber: LH = +1/2° to +1°
Camber: RH = +1/4° to 3/4°
Toe: 0 to -1/4" (toe out)
Note: I assume a minus -1/4" toe out is in fact 1/4" toe in, am I correct?
Set:
Caster: +2°
Camber: LH = +3/4°
Camber: RH = +1/2°
Toe: -1/8"
I copied the info below from one of your earlier messages and it appears
that they didn't follow the MM.
LEFT After
Caster +1°
Camber +1/2°
Toe +1/16"
RIGHT After
Caster +1 1/2°
Camber +1/4°
Toe +1/16"
In comparison to the MM spec:
They didn't put in enough caster on either side.
Note: It has been noted here that coaches produced in 1973-1974 seem to have
problems getting as much caster as those manufactured in 1975-1978.
They didn't put in enough camber on either side.
They adjusted the front end with Toe Out!
Now to further confuse you!
HOWEVER, IIRC the general consensus is that the following settings are the
best with the radial tires that are out there now a days.
Caster: as much as you can get with 0 camber
Note: I run 5° but to get that much I had to install a pair of Dave Lenzi's
Offset Upper Control arms.
Camber: 0
Toe: 0
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue StreakTZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 1:45 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
Well I am wondering if the front end alignment I got was done correctly.
--
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Casa Grande, AZ
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
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_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110616 is a reply to message #109821] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 22:02 |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ok that is a little confusing, But (3) questions after reading it....
1) Would the alignment specs I posted that they did cause some of the conditions I have?
2) Second would you type out clearly what the specs should be on the:
FRONT DRIVERS SIDE
FRONT PASSENGERS SIDE
3) And are there specs for the rear wheels? If so what are they.
I'll print out your answer and see if I can make it correct. I'm going to contact the BBB and see if I can get them to warranty their work perhaps if its actually incorrect.
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
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| Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder [message #110624 is a reply to message #110616] |
Sun, 02 January 2011 23:19 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Michael,
DO NOT PRINT OUT WHAT I HAVE SENT YOU AND USE IT TO ARGUE YOUR CASE WITH
SPECTRAC OR THE BBB. THE FIRST THING SPECTRAC OR THE BBB WILL SAY IS WHO THE
HELL IS THIS GUY AND WHAT THE HELL DOES HE KNOW ABOUT ALIGNMENT! AND THEY
WILL BE RIGHT! I HAVE NO CREDENTIALS!
You need to get a copy of the Maintenance Manual and study it. I have X-7525
which covers 1975 & 1976 models. I assume it also covers your 1973.
THEORY AND OPERATION of the front suspension can be found on pages 3A-5 and
3A-6. It includes drawings which will assist you in understanding the terms
caster, camber, and toe in/out.
The front wheel alignment specs are in Section 3 - FRONT SUSPENSION AND
FINAL DRIVE and can be found on pages 3A-20 and 21.
The rear wheel alignment specs are in Section 4 - REAR SUSPENSION and can be
found on pages 4-32 and 4-33.
Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue StreakTZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Michael
Sent: Monday, January 03, 2011 3:02 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Road Wonder
Ok that is a little confusing, But (3) questions after reading it....
1) Would the alignment specs I posted that they did cause some of the
conditions I have?
2) Second would you type out clearly what the specs should be on the:
FRONT DRIVERS SIDE
FRONT PASSENGERS SIDE
3) And are there specs for the rear wheels? If so what are they.
I'll print out your answer and see if I can make it correct. I'm going to
contact the BBB and see if I can get them to warranty their work perhaps if
its actually incorrect.
--
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Casa Grande, AZ
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: Road Wonder [message #110642 is a reply to message #109821] |
Mon, 03 January 2011 08:29 |
RadioActiveGMC
Messages: 1020
Registered: November 2010
Location: Hot AZ desert
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ahh no I wasn't planning on getting you involved at all! Just want the specs. Who can I call to buy a MM in print not cd.
***"Gettin There"-1973 23' Sequoia-
Michael, Onans smell, "Go solar/wind power!"
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