Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Darned Grounds!
[GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97358] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 17:34 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726 Registered: March 2004 Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Today was light bulb day. I'm more than a little casual about the operation
of lights -- I don't do much night travelling so don't miss a twinkle or
two. But I figured there were enough inoperable that I'd better operate
today -- it being only about 95*F outside & all. On the agenda: Both right
side clearance lights, 2 rear roof clearance lights, one backup light, and,
most important of all, HER porch light.
The side clearance lights turned out to be just corroded bulb connections;
easily repaired with a little CRC 2-26 and wiggling. But the lenses of all
4 were so crudded up on the inside that I had to remove and clean them. I
got lucky and all the rusted screws came out -- and were replaced with
stainless.
The roof clearance lights have never been opened since I "sealed" them with
cement before the paint job in 2002 (IIRC). "Sealed" being a euphemism for
"H20 can get in but not out". One of the failed ones was somewhat corroded
but mostly poor quality showed up in the seat spring having worked its way
around the center wire insulating washer. I managed to return that to its
proper location and bend it so it should stay. The other light had the same
spring problem, but it was so rusty that I had to break the socket out of
the plastic, install a new socket, and fabricate an internal bracket for the
lens retaining screw -- to replace the bracket I broke. These lamps are the
larger teardrop shaped variety or I'd go ahead and replace them all with the
LED versions that were too expensive in '02. Maybe after a few more quit
working.
The Subject: above comes from the right backup light. The bulb looked good.
the test lamp showed the socket had +12 VDC and ground. The bulb tested
good with the bench power supply. HUH??? Then I noticed that the RR side
clearance light, which I'd just repaired, was burning without parking lights
being on. And going off when the shift lever was not in Reverse. Hmmm.
That spells ground problems to me. The wiring diagram was no help -- the
backup lights circuits are about a foot away from all the other lights on my
8' long wiring diagram. A jumper wire from the backup light's ground lead
to the bumper solved the problem and didn't seem to cause any others. If I
recall correctly, the ground for all those lights is behind the rear panel,
screwed to the aluminum rear crossmember. That panel is behind the toilet,
and the base upon it sits. And that comes out only after the lavatory
cabinet and the shower walls and the bath tub are removed. So I ran a new
ground wire through the fiberglass insulation into the right rear
compartment (where most folks have an LPG tank but I have a bath tub).
Fini.
Don't anyone DARE tell HER that the porch light's been inoperative for 3
years because I wouldn't snap the lens out and replace the bulb -- PLEASE.
Tomorrow maybe I'll fix the dedicated tow light on the CRV -- the right rear
one's been on the fritz for the past few trips.
Mustn't forget to deflate and stow the 6' plastic rattlesnake from the fig
tree before the yard man arrives. He came running up from the back yard on
Tuesday, almost white, yelling, "Bring yo' shotgun -- they's a BIG ol' snake
in that there fig tree!" He had a school mate bitten and killed by a water
moccasin a few years ago, so I guess he's justified in his terror. He's
already called today to be sure the snake will be gone when he arrives
tomorrow.
Ken H.
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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Re: [GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97361 is a reply to message #97358] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 17:40 |
emerystora
Messages: 4442 Registered: January 2004
Karma: 13
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On Aug 26, 2010, at 4:34 PM, Ken Henderson wrote:
>
> The Subject: above comes from the right backup light. The bulb looked good.
> the test lamp showed the socket had +12 VDC and ground. The bulb tested
> good with the bench power supply. HUH??? Then I noticed that the RR side
> clearance light, which I'd just repaired, was burning without parking lights
> being on. And going off when the shift lever was not in Reverse. Hmmm.
> That spells ground problems to me. The wiring diagram was no help -- the
> backup lights circuits are about a foot away from all the other lights on my
> 8' long wiring diagram. A jumper wire from the backup light's ground lead
> to the bumper solved the problem and didn't seem to cause any others. If I
> recall correctly, the ground for all those lights is behind the rear panel,
> screwed to the aluminum rear crossmember. That panel is behind the toilet,
> and the base upon it sits. And that comes out only after the lavatory
> cabinet and the shower walls and the bath tub are removed. So I ran a new
> ground wire through the fiberglass insulation into the right rear
> compartment (where most folks have an LPG tank but I have a bath tub).
> Fini.
Ken -
on most GMC motorhomes there is a ground wire lug just below the area inside of the rear when the license plate is.
Cleaning this ground will usually fix a lot of problems with all the rear lights.
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Santa Fe, NM
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Re: [GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97364 is a reply to message #97361] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 17:48 |
bukzin
Messages: 840 Registered: April 2004 Location: North California
Karma: 0
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So I might find this ground connection
by removing the inside panel just below
the rear window?
Bukzin
1977 Palm Beach
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Re: [GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97365 is a reply to message #97361] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 17:48 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726 Registered: March 2004 Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Uh, yeah. I can get to that pretty easily after I get all that other stuff
out and then remove the closet. :-)
Ken H.
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Emery Stora <emerystora@mac.com> wrote:
> ... If I
> > recall correctly, the ground for all those lights is behind the rear
> panel,
> > screwed to the aluminum rear crossmember. That panel is behind the
> toilet,
> > and the base upon it sits. And that comes out only after the lavatory
> > cabinet and the shower walls and the bath tub are removed. So I ran a
> new
> > ground wire through the fiberglass insulation into the right rear
> > compartment (where most folks have an LPG tank but I have a bath tub).
> > Fini.
>
>
>
> Ken -
> on most GMC motorhomes there is a ground wire lug just below the area
> inside of the rear when the license plate is.
> Cleaning this ground will usually fix a lot of problems with all the rear
> lights.
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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Re: [GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97367 is a reply to message #97364] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 17:55 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726 Registered: March 2004 Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Actually, on a normal GMC, I think that area is exposed when you lift the
seat and whatever horizontal closure panel is at the left rear -- below the
vertical finish panel. Right on top of the rear aluminum body crossmember.
Fact is, I'll take a look at that the next time I deign to remove everything
from the closet, lay sort of cattycornered across its floor, and remove the
recessed floor panel at the rear above the electric cord storage
compartment, where that screw is located -- I just had to pull Emery's chain
about REMOVING the closet. :-)
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI+ & EBL
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 6:48 PM, Richard <bukzin@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> So I might find this ground connection
> by removing the inside panel just below
> the rear window?
> --
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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Re: [GMCnet] Darned Grounds! [message #97379 is a reply to message #97372] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 19:28 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726 Registered: March 2004 Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Thanks, Rob, but the problem's not finding replacements, it's actually doing
the replacement. I installed the larger-than-OEM, teardrop shaped lights
with polyurethane adhesive under their bases before the paint job. When
they come off, that whole area will require repainting, even if the
replacements have the same profile. If I decide to do anything before it's
time for another paint job, I'll probably convert the removable lens section
to LEDs and not disturb the bases. I may even have to install LED's and pot
the lenses with epoxy myself. Hope not.
Truth be known, I don't do much worrying about clearance lights, especially
since I consider them an anachronism -- a throwback to the days of two lane
roads and needing observers to be sure the bridges are high enough to clear.
As long as I don't get ticketed, I'm happy. In over 50 years of RVing, no
one's ever even looked at them AFAIK. :-)
Ken H.
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 7:46 PM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Ken,
>
> Here's a link to the LED clearance lights I installed on Double Trouble:
> ...
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97388 is a reply to message #97382] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 20:39 |
tmaki
Messages: 200 Registered: September 2005
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On 8/26/2010 5:37 PM, KRDietz wrote:
>> Truth be known, I don't do much worrying about clearance lights, especially
>> since I consider them an anachronism
>
> My thinking exactly. I think I'll fill them in when I finally get
> around to paint.
Me, too. Albeit, DOT and FMVSS still require them.
That notwithstanding, I went with these:
http://xr.com/gpu5
several years ago. Can be seen for over 500 ft. The light
diffracts inside the lens and is visible around 90 degrees
off axis. Maybe a little more.
LED, colors - who could ask for anything more. Great for
side markers, too. More or less "invisible" when not
illuminated. Nothing to corrode, easy to service/replace,
but you do have to be able to get to the inner side of the
caps or body panels.
A nod to the law, but fulfills the need for smooth and
invisible. Not for die hard originalists/OEM'rs.
Toby Maki
'73 Glacier 230
Riverside, CA
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97389 is a reply to message #97382] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 20:52 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446 Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Still a DOT requirement for the clearance lights on our coaches.
JR Wright
On Aug 26, 2010, at 8:37 PM, KRDietz wrote:
>> Truth be known, I don't do much worrying about clearance lights,
>> especially
>> since I consider them an anachronism -- a throwback to the days of
>> two lane
>> roads and needing observers to be sure the bridges are high enough
>> to clear.
>> As long as I don't get ticketed, I'm happy. In over 50 years of
>> RVing, no
>> one's ever even looked at them AFAIK. :-)
>
> My thinking exactly. I think I'll fill them in when I finally get
> around to paint. Heck... this thing isn't much bigger than a full-
> sized
> van and you don't see clearance lights on those.
>
> One less thing to wash/wax around. I'm all about smooth - hence those
> OEM mirrors hit the trash as soon as I found a better option.
>
> The stock rooftop AC just keeps on providing cool air so I can't get a
> smoother version yet...
>
> Kelvin
> '73 23' in Eugene,OR
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97397 is a reply to message #97388] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 21:49 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260 Registered: January 2004 Location: Chandler, AZ
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""Me, too. Albeit, DOT and FMVSS still require them.
""
Keep in mind that the DOT is the regulatory umbrella under which many other agencies exist, including NHTSA And FMVCSA. The only agency that has any enforcement capability (for us that is) is the FMVSCA. It is highly unlikely that they will ever pull you over since they are focused primarily on truckers. Yes, locals can pull you over, but their ability to interpret regulations is second only to figuring out a Dunkin Dough nuts menu. I know there have been exceptions to that but it is very rare and could easily be contested on the spot. Additionally, if you are out of state you have an additional level of protection that falls under interstate commerce regulations. Ask me how I know
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97413 is a reply to message #97397] |
Thu, 26 August 2010 23:33 |
kelvin
Messages: 608 Registered: February 2004 Location: Eugene, OR
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Bob de Kruyff wrote:
>
> ""Me, too. Albeit, DOT and FMVSS still require them. ""
>
> Keep in mind that the DOT is the regulatory umbrella under which many
> other agencies exist, including NHTSA And FMVCSA. The only agency
> that has any enforcement capability (for us that is) is the FMVSCA.
> It is highly unlikely that they will ever pull you over since they
> are focused primarily on truckers. Yes, locals can pull you over, but
> their ability to interpret regulations is second only to figuring out
> a Dunkin Dough nuts menu. I know there have been exceptions to that
> but it is very rare and could easily be contested on the spot.
> Additionally, if you are out of state you have an additional level of
> protection that falls under interstate commerce regulations. Ask me
> how I know :)
What Bob said. I would bet a months pay that nobody would ever notice.
Oregon is pretty lax about "inspections". They don't really do them at
all. I haven't had a front license plate on any of my Datsuns since
1983. (ruins the look of the simple front bumper) and I also remove and
fill the ugly, DOT approved license plate lights that sully the
taillight panel. Never put a new light back on.
Yes... I'm a scofflaw. I believe in breaking the rules that don't
matter so I'm less tempted to break the ones that really do.
Tobi's LEDs do look pretty simple and elegant, though.
Kelvin
'73 23' in Eugene, OR
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97440 is a reply to message #97389] |
Fri, 27 August 2010 07:34 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452 Registered: November 2009
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I'm pretty sure it depends upon with the width of the vehicle.
The clearance lights are also required on 1 ton dually pickups.
Travel and fifth-wheel trailers also have them. I also believe
that most boat trailers and wider utility trailers have them.
I don't know the vehicle width that triggers the requirement
for the clearance lights.
* * * * * * * * *
* Mac Macdonald *
* Oklahoma City *
** "Money Pit" **
* '76 ex - P.B. *
* * * * * * * * *
* "An unarmed man can but flee *
* from evil. Evil can NEVER be *
* overcome by flight FROM it." *
From: powerjon@chartermi.net
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 21:52:36 -0400
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights...
Still a DOT requirement for the clearance lights on our coaches.
JR Wright
On Aug 26, 2010, at 8:37 PM, KRDietz wrote:
Truth be known, I don't do much worrying about clearance lights,
especially since I consider them an anachronism -- a throwback
to the days of two lane roads and needing observers to be sure
the bridges are high enough to clear.
As long as I don't get ticketed, I'm happy. In over 50 years of
RVing, no one's ever even looked at them AFAIK. :-)
My thinking exactly. I think I'll fill them in when I finally get
around to paint. Heck... this thing isn't much bigger than a full-
sized van and you don't see clearance lights on those.
One less thing to wash/wax around. I'm all about smooth - hence
those OEM mirrors hit the trash as soon as I found a better
option.
The stock rooftop AC just keeps on providing cool air so I can't
get a smoother version yet...
Kelvin
'73 23' in Eugene,OR
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Re: [GMCnet] Clearance lights... [message #97451 is a reply to message #97413] |
Fri, 27 August 2010 08:26 |
tmaki
Messages: 200 Registered: September 2005
Karma: 0
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On 8/26/2010 9:33 PM, Kelvin Dietz wrote:
> Bob de Kruyff wrote:
>> It is highly unlikely that they will ever pull you over since they
>> are focused primarily on truckers
>
>
> What Bob said. I would bet a months pay that nobody would ever notice.
>
> do look pretty simple and elegant, though.
I found them at a Pilot truck stop in Victorville.
Originally bought five of them at $11/ea. Mocked them up on
a piece of vinyl eaves trough with the correct layout and
spacing. I taped the whole assembly to top of the GMC and
took it out to the local airport on a Raymond Chandler night
(Well, it wasn't stormy - just dark.) No traffic, little
ambient light.
I parked the GMC and walked away estimating my distance
every 100 or so feet and looking back at the coach. The
lights were still visible at nearly 1000 ft., but I figured
500 was their practical working distance. In my research
before I decided to use these, I was never able to find a
specification for candelas or luminance required for
clearance lights. I suppose it may be buried in an obscure
paragraph in the regulation, but I couldn't find it. So I
figured that if I could see the lights at 500 ft., so could
just about anybody.
The Fresnel-like lens element gives a nice focused beam
on-axis, while the angled part allows the off-axis visibility.
Pilot doesn't carry them anymore, but I bought 10 more (five
in each color) from an Ebay vendor (R and P Carriages) for
about $7/ea. They put bullet terminals on and heat shrink
the wires. The ones at Pilot were just stripped 6" pigtails.
Like I said, they're not for everybody, but for anyone
wanting to discard what I refer to as the "forehead warts",
they can be a solution. And they are simpler to install than
fairing in something even more elegant.
Toby Maki
'73 Glacier 230
Riverside, CA
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