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| [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91519] |
Sat, 10 July 2010 18:08  |
Matthew Colie
Messages: 1
Registered: July 2010
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Junior Member |
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Did you ever hear that the Chinese use a phrase "May you live in
interesting times." as a curse?
Well, I have had some interesting times recently. Not my favorite way
to learn, as it is much more costly and time consuming than watching
other people learn.
You heard about the seized clutch on my A6. I mentioned the compressor
had both been making noise for a while and that it (the clutch) had
started recently but I had been unable to verify that it was the AC
clutch bearing until it was too late.
In a both my memory and a search of the net archive, I found a curious
level of difficulty with A6 rebuilds. Ken Henderson found a Sanden like
unit to put in and that got me started. Somebody (sorry, I am having
trouble getting access to the forum and archive) got me a supplier and
number for the A6 replacement kit mentioned below. That got me rolling
and I found another direction on E-Bay.
There are at least three paths to take. One can buy a kit to put a
Sanden SD508 or SD708 right where the A6 was from a company call
Nostalgic Air Parts <www.www.nostalgicairparts.com>. The compressor
they ship will have the GM style head so the original connections still
work. Both they and a company called Auto AC solutions
<www.autoacsolutions.com> both market a bolt in replacement for an A6.
The latter's website isn't clear, but their part is listed on E-bay.
While Emery doubted (and I don't blame him) that it could be a true bolt
in, I decided to give it a go and will report my results next week.
In the mean time, I found an article that describes why A6 rebuilds are
problematic and many other things to be aware of if you have to work on
your cab AC
<http://www.airsept.com/Articles/CompressorGuard/Motor4.01.pdf>. The
article is old, but I don't believe that this effects the application to
our situation.
Oh, and by the by, it's getting more interesting. The coach's reefer
has quit, it is a 23' with AC/DC no gas - and there is no replacement
that I can find. The failure is in the cycle, but more on that at a
later date.
Matt Colie
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91528 is a reply to message #91519] |
Sat, 10 July 2010 20:52  |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Keep it coming Matt.
On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 4:08 PM, Matthew Colie <mattcolie@gmail.com> wrote:
> Did you ever hear that the Chinese use a phrase "May you live in
> interesting times." as a curse?
>
> Well, I have had some interesting times recently. Not my favorite way
> to learn, as it is much more costly and time consuming than watching
> other people learn.
>
> You heard about the seized clutch on my A6. I mentioned the compressor
> had both been making noise for a while and that it (the clutch) had
> started recently but I had been unable to verify that it was the AC
> clutch bearing until it was too late.
>
> In a both my memory and a search of the net archive, I found a curious
> level of difficulty with A6 rebuilds. Ken Henderson found a Sanden like
> unit to put in and that got me started. Somebody (sorry, I am having
> trouble getting access to the forum and archive) got me a supplier and
> number for the A6 replacement kit mentioned below. That got me rolling
> and I found another direction on E-Bay.
>
> There are at least three paths to take. One can buy a kit to put a
> Sanden SD508 or SD708 right where the A6 was from a company call
> Nostalgic Air Parts <www.www.nostalgicairparts.com>. The compressor
> they ship will have the GM style head so the original connections still
> work. Both they and a company called Auto AC solutions
> <www.autoacsolutions.com> both market a bolt in replacement for an A6.
> The latter's website isn't clear, but their part is listed on E-bay.
>
> While Emery doubted (and I don't blame him) that it could be a true bolt
> in, I decided to give it a go and will report my results next week.
>
> In the mean time, I found an article that describes why A6 rebuilds are
> problematic and many other things to be aware of if you have to work on
> your cab AC
> <http://www.airsept.com/Articles/CompressorGuard/Motor4.01.pdf>. The
> article is old, but I don't believe that this effects the application to
> our situation.
>
> Oh, and by the by, it's getting more interesting. The coach's reefer
> has quit, it is a 23' with AC/DC no gas - and there is no replacement
> that I can find. The failure is in the cycle, but more on that at a
> later date.
>
> Matt Colie
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91543 is a reply to message #91527] |
Sun, 11 July 2010 11:18 |
tmaki
Messages: 200
Registered: September 2005
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 7/10/2010 6:48 PM, Ken Henderson wrote:
>
> Please keep me informed. I may be preparing a short article on Sanden
> installation for a forhtcoming publication and would like to include any
> recent lessons learned, especially about the direct A-6 replacement Sanden.
Ken,
Not that it is germane to your purpose, but in doing my own
research re: replacing the A6 with Sanden, I found this:
http://www.apairinc.com/detail.asp?Part=995-436
They have a number of bracket solutions.
I didn't say they were cheap.
And, of course, all the specs for Sanden are available on
their Web page. You have to do a little searching for the
non-current models, but just about everything you need to
know is there.
I also found in my research that the Sanden is probably the
easiest A/C compressor to work on. I have two of them (one
to replace a York in a Mopar application), and in
researching parts and service material, I'm thinking that if
one can change a headlight, servicing a Sanden could almost
be done just by thinking about it. I've had mine apart to
put in new reed valves and gaskets, and it's almost
embarrassingly easy.
Other resources (among many) in case you need a little
background info:
http://www.rparts.com/Catalog/Major_Components/compressors/sanden/conversion_guide.htm
http://www.sanden.com/
http://www.polarbearinc.com/pbpc/homepage/Search/OR/Seals_Sanden_Gaskets.html
Toby Maki
'73 Glacier 230
Riverside, CA
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91553 is a reply to message #91543] |
Sun, 11 July 2010 15:57 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Hang onto that old York Tobi. They make a heck of an air compressor
without much effort.
On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 9:18 AM, tmaki <tmaki@earthlink.net> wrote:
> On 7/10/2010 6:48 PM, Ken Henderson wrote:
>
>>
>> Please keep me informed. I may be preparing a short article on Sanden
>> installation for a forhtcoming publication and would like to include any
>> recent lessons learned, especially about the direct A-6 replacement Sanden.
>
> Ken,
>
> Not that it is germane to your purpose, but in doing my own
> research re: replacing the A6 with Sanden, I found this:
>
> http://www.apairinc.com/detail.asp?Part=995-436
>
> They have a number of bracket solutions.
>
> I didn't say they were cheap.
>
> And, of course, all the specs for Sanden are available on
> their Web page. You have to do a little searching for the
> non-current models, but just about everything you need to
> know is there.
>
> I also found in my research that the Sanden is probably the
> easiest A/C compressor to work on. I have two of them (one
> to replace a York in a Mopar application), and in
> researching parts and service material, I'm thinking that if
> one can change a headlight, servicing a Sanden could almost
> be done just by thinking about it. I've had mine apart to
> put in new reed valves and gaskets, and it's almost
> embarrassingly easy.
>
> Other resources (among many) in case you need a little
> background info:
>
> http://www.rparts.com/Catalog/Major_Components/compressors/sanden/conversion_guide.htm
>
> http://www.sanden.com/
>
> http://www.polarbearinc.com/pbpc/homepage/Search/OR/Seals_Sanden_Gaskets.html
>
>
>
>
> Toby Maki
> '73 Glacier 230
> Riverside, CA
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91592 is a reply to message #91580] |
Sun, 11 July 2010 21:32 |
 |
Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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| JohnL455 wrote on Sun, 11 July 2010 20:35 |
Does the Sanden have the volume/ pressure capacity of the A6?
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| JohnL455 wrote on Sun, 11 July 2010 20:37 |
P.S> Don't all our normal vendors Jim (west) Jim (east) Gateway, Grandview, Cinnabar all have the correct A6 reman ready to drop in? Why go import?
|
John,
The pressure capability is a design function for a refrigeration compressor. They are all built to manage the expected pressures - both high and low - of common refrigerants.
From what I have been discovering, the A6 is a seriously old design and was intended to have better lubricants than are either the Ester(POG) or PAG that must be used with R-134a. A new A6 is upwards of 600$ and still is not really ready for 134 as many are new old stock.
Why go to an import? Because Delco, York and Trane do not manufacture automotive compressors any longer. Personally, if Delco was manufacturing and selling an A6b that was a complete redesign made to be half the weigh or it's father and supposedly much quieter and more efficient. I would buy it instead.
If you are going to install a new A6, do not use 134. Use either R-12 (~25$/can on Ebay) or use HC-12a and void Delco's warranty. That is your choice.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91623 is a reply to message #91519] |
Mon, 12 July 2010 08:21 |
Rusty
Messages: 197
Registered: October 2005
Location: Philadelphia Pa
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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As some people know, I gutted my coach dash and built a custom replacement a couple years ago and installed all new components for the a/c : plenum with hi capacity blower and vaccum operated flow control, a control head for that, and air box with electronic heat valve and heater core, heavy duty evaporator, R-134 expansion valve, triac over-pressure cutoff switch, dryer with site glass, 4 large louvers and 2 defrost outlets, 2 inch vinyl accordian hoses connecting everything together. I used a brand new Delco A6 which at the time was about $475. I used the original condensor after clean and flush, and all new hoses and compression connectors. I charged with R-134. It blows ice cold. I usually have to turn it down or point the middle two louvers to the back of coach and close off the driver side. Now if I had to all this over again I would go with a Sanden compressor, but the new A6 is working fine, I am on my third summer with this setup.
Rusty
75 Glenbrook
Philadelphia Pa
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91630 is a reply to message #91519] |
Mon, 12 July 2010 10:14 |
idrob
Messages: 645
Registered: January 2005
Location: Central Idaho
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| Matthew Colie wrote on Sat, 10 July 2010 16:08 |
Oh, and by the by, it's getting more interesting. The coach's reefer
has quit, it is a 23' with AC/DC no gas - and there is no replacement
that I can find. The failure is in the cycle, but more on that at a
later date.
Matt Colie
|
Matt: The Tundra T85AC should be a direct replacement.
Now, parts for the old Norcold are not available, as far as I know.
Rob Allen
former owner of '76 x-PB
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91632 is a reply to message #91630] |
Mon, 12 July 2010 10:23 |
idrob
Messages: 645
Registered: January 2005
Location: Central Idaho
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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| idrob wrote on Mon, 12 July 2010 08:14 |
| Matthew Colie wrote on Sat, 10 July 2010 16:08 |
Oh, and by the by, it's getting more interesting. The coach's reefer
has quit, it is a 23' with AC/DC no gas - and there is no replacement
that I can find. The failure is in the cycle, but more on that at a
later date.
Matt Colie
|
Matt: The Tundra T85AC should be a direct replacement.
Now, parts for the old Norcold are not available, as far as I know.
|
Further look found the Novacool RFU 8220 and RFU 9000 are also the same size, but are bottom freezer units.
Rob Allen
former owner of '76 x-PB
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| Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements. [message #91633 is a reply to message #91630] |
Mon, 12 July 2010 10:29 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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When our Tundra T85AC threw craps some months back, we
bought a virtually identical Vitrifrigo (at one time it
was rebranded as Tundra, I think) from Defender Marine.
We paid a bit under $1500 with express (3-day) Fedex
Freight from CT to OK about two months ago.
We weren't able to find anybody to find/fix the leak in
the refrigerant plumbing.
We have brought the ca. 2001 Tundra back to Oklahoma City
in hopes of finding a repair in a more populated area.
If I can get it fixed, I'll either put it into Money Pit
(haven't tested its fridge yet) or use it in the garage
for a beer fridge!
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
~ Mac Macdonald ~
~ Oklahoma City ~
~~ "Money Pit" ~~
~ '76 ex - P.B. ~
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: profmail@wildblue.net
> Date: Mon, 12 Jul 2010 10:14:52 -0500
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Things recently learned about A6 compressors and replacements.
>
>
>
> Matthew Colie wrote on Sat, 10 July 2010 16:08
>> Oh, and by the by, it's getting more interesting. The coach's reefer
>> has quit, it is a 23' with AC/DC no gas - and there is no replacement
>> that I can find. The failure is in the cycle, but more on that at a
>> later date.
>>
>> Matt Colie
>
>
>
> Matt: The Tundra T85AC should be a direct replacement.
>
> Now, parts for the old Norcold are not available, as far as I know.
> --
> Rob Allen
> former owner of '76 x-PB
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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