Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Better Cooling???
| Better Cooling??? [message #88530] |
Mon, 14 June 2010 11:38  |
g.winger
Messages: 792
Registered: February 2008
Location: Warrenton,Missouri
Karma: 0
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Had a great day saturday. The new caddy ran great, no leaks and all 3 gears. Was running some wire for gages and was thinking about cooling. My 78 r-bath Royale has those side baffles to direct air to the Rad. But it looks like alot of air would go around the radiator. Big space on both sides. Thought about a trans cooler on the side and ducted so the warm air would not go through the radiator. BUT,,, wouldn't it be better to block the air going past the side so that there would be a lower pressure "behind" the radiator??? Sure you might want sme for cold air to the carb. But woudn't this help cooling. And maybee some drag. Stock cars put tape over the grill to increase speed "ie. less drag". The air going around the radiator does nothing except maybee a little cooling to the powersteering. That could have a cooler too that was ducted around the rad. and not adding to the engine load. I guess you could experament with cardboard on a hot day. Or use one of those aircraft gages Ken's got. Just a thought. What do U think. I still remember a flap-spoiler that was raised up and down across the botom of the radiator. Havn't seen the foto for awhile,,,,sorry just rambling, no breakdowns today,,,,,,,,PL
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| Re: Better Cooling??? [message #88534 is a reply to message #88530] |
Mon, 14 June 2010 11:46  |
George Beckman
Messages: 1085
Registered: October 2008
Location: Colfax, CA
Karma: 11
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| g.winger wrote on Mon, 14 June 2010 09:38 |
Had a great day saturday. The new caddy ran great, no leaks and all 3 gears. Was running some wire for gages and was thinking about cooling. My 78 r-bath Royale has those side baffles to direct air to the Rad. But it looks like alot of air would go around the radiator. PL
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I had a 78 and I fiddled with those baffle thingies that were on it. They sort of shot straight forward. I thought my fan clutch came on too often, so I adjusted the baffles so that they started at the outer ends of the grill. Looked like a good idea, funneling the air to the radiator. I found no appreciable difference.
Our 74 has no baffles and runs cool as can be. Who knows?
'74 Eleganza, SE, Howell + EBL
Best Wishes,
George
[Updated on: Mon, 14 June 2010 11:47] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Better Cooling??? [message #88573 is a reply to message #88534] |
Mon, 14 June 2010 16:21 |
midlf
Messages: 2212
Registered: July 2007
Location: SE Wisc. (Palmyra)
Karma: 1
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| George Beckman wrote on Mon, 14 June 2010 11:46 |
I had a 78 and I fiddled with those baffle thingies that were on it. They sort of shot straight forward. I thought my fan clutch came on too often, so I adjusted the baffles so that they started at the outer ends of the grill. Looked like a good idea, funneling the air to the radiator. I found no appreciable difference.
Our 74 has no baffles and runs cool as can be. Who knows?
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Note to self: scratch radiator baffles for the 74 off the todo list until proven to be needed.
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88673 is a reply to message #88666] |
Tue, 15 June 2010 12:18 |
tphipps
Messages: 3005
Registered: August 2004
Location: Spanish Fort, AL
Karma: 9
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Part of the problem is the amount of heat that is trapped in the engine compartment. The hot air has no elegant way to depart the engine compartment, to aid in in-coming air flow. Relying on the incoming air to push the hot air out of the compartment may not be a total solution. Rick Denny and I had an interesting discussion about this subject this week-end.
My coach has a marine axial blower plumbed from the engine compartment to the outside of the coach, via an added vent behind the driver side wheel opening. Turn the switch on and the temp gauge will start dropping quickly. The blower used to have an elaborate system of relays and temp sensors to engage and disengage the blower. Also, a sensor for engine fire to shut the blower down and engage an engine compartment fire extinguisher. I removed this and rely on a simple switch. KISS principle. For an engine fire, I don't think that I want to hang around. The Halon engine compartment fire extinguisher does have an automatic trigger, so it should fire.
I did install the additional vanes to direct air into the radiator, but with the new AL radiator, I do not know if they provide any help. Heavy duty fan clutch engages only on topping these hills around Virginia, but it is very noisy.
Works for me.
Tom Phipps,
75 GMC Ex-Avion
2012 Phoenix Cruiser model 2552
KA4CSG
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88757 is a reply to message #88665] |
Tue, 15 June 2010 20:31 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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The 77 403 and later coaches all have the factory air control panels.
J.R. Wright
On Jun 15, 2010, at 1:00 PM, Arthur Mansfield wrote:
> I was looking at my 76 El and realized a good deal of air to the
> radiator goes under the front. This air would go around the
> radiator rather than thru it. Has anyone ducted this air so that it
> would go thru the radiator. If so did this make any difference.
>
> Art
> 76 El
> On Jun 14, 2010, at 7:26 PM, Larry Davick wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Funny, I was just thinking of putting those radiator baffles on my
>> '76! Maybe it can wait...
>> --
>> Larry Davick
>> The Mystery Machine
>> 1976 Palm Beach
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J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88765 is a reply to message #88682] |
Tue, 15 June 2010 21:31 |
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ljdavick
Messages: 3548
Registered: March 2007
Location: Fremont, CA
Karma: -3
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I'd guess something like this is what you have.
<http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370367029791&viewitem=&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching#ht_1087wt_646>
Larry Davick
On Jun 15, 2010, at 11:57 AM, D C *Mac* Macdonald <k2gkk@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Axial means "along the axis" and would commonly be called a
> bilge blower.
>
> Input and output are both 3" diameter or larger hoses. Intake
> is put low in the bilge (gasoline fumes are heavier than air)
> and exhaust hoses go to vents leading to exterior of boat.
>
> * Mac Macdonald *
> * Oklahoma City *
> ** "Money Pit" **
> * '76 ex - P.B. *
>
> (and 95 Carver 355 Aft Cabin)
>
>
>
>
>
>> From: ljdavick@comcast.net
>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 10:53:30 -0700
>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling???
>>
>> What is a marine axial blower, and would you happen to have any pictures? Is it a bilge fan?
>>
>> Larry Davick
>>
>> On Jun 15, 2010, at 10:18 AM, Thomas Phipps <tph1pp5@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> marine axial blower
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Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, Ca
Howell EFI + EBL + Electronic Dizzy
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88775 is a reply to message #88765] |
Tue, 15 June 2010 22:04 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Yeppers! The ones that came on my boat are very dark grey or black.
* Mac Macdonald *
* USAF, Retired *
* Oklahoma City *
** "Money Pit" **
* '76 ex - P.B. *
----------------------------------------
> From: ljdavick@comcast.net
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 19:31:23 -0700
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling???
>
> I'd guess something like this is what you have.
>
>
>
> Larry Davick
>
> On Jun 15, 2010, at 11:57 AM, D C *Mac* Macdonald wrote:
>
>>
>> Axial means "along the axis" and would commonly be called a
>> bilge blower.
>>
>> Input and output are both 3" diameter or larger hoses. Intake
>> is put low in the bilge (gasoline fumes are heavier than air)
>> and exhaust hoses go to vents leading to exterior of boat.
>>
>> * Mac Macdonald *
>> * Oklahoma City *
>> ** "Money Pit" **
>> * '76 ex - P.B. *
>>
>> (and 95 Carver 355 Aft Cabin)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> From: ljdavick@comcast.net
>>> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
>>> Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 10:53:30 -0700
>>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling???
>>>
>>> What is a marine axial blower, and would you happen to have any pictures? Is it a bilge fan?
>>>
>>> Larry Davick
>>>
>>> On Jun 15, 2010, at 10:18 AM, Thomas Phipps wrote:
>>>
>>>> marine axial blower
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88788 is a reply to message #88757] |
Tue, 15 June 2010 23:36 |
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mike miller
Messages: 3576
Registered: February 2004
Location: Hillsboro, Oregon
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The way I understood it, The baffles on the 403 coaches was NOT designed to direct airflow into the radiator. The baffles where to keep air from recirculating... air going around the radiator from the back to the front -- and back into the radiator. Recirculated air is warmer than non-recirculated air. There isn't anything to stop this flow on the earlier coaches.
I -DO- think the airflow from in front of coach, through the radiator and out of the engine compartment, could use some improvement. Some data collection and some thought is needed before some innovation.
A good solution would address the recirculation problem AND direct flow into, through and out of the engine bay.
| powerjon wrote on Tue, 15 June 2010 18:31 |
The 77 403 and later coaches all have the factory air control panels.
>> Funny, I was just thinking of putting those radiator baffles on
>> my '76! Maybe it can wait...
>> --
|
Mike Miller -- Hillsboro, OR -- on the Black list
(#2)`78 23' Birchaven Rear Bath -- (#3)`77 23' Birchaven Side Bath
More Sidekicks than GMC's and a late model Malibu called 'Boo'
http://m000035.blogspot.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88820 is a reply to message #88788] |
Wed, 16 June 2010 10:35 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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""The way I understood it, The baffles on the 403 coaches was NOT designed to direct airflow into the radiator. The baffles where to keep air from recirculating... air going around the radiator from the back to the front -- and back into the radiator. Recirculated air is warmer than non-recirculated air. There isn't anything to stop this flow on the earlier coaches.
""
That was my understanding as well.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88827 is a reply to message #88820] |
Wed, 16 June 2010 11:34 |
shawnee
Messages: 422
Registered: February 2004
Location: NC
Karma: 0
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| Bob de Kruyff wrote on Wed, 16 June 2010 11:35 |
""The way I understood it, The baffles on the 403 coaches was NOT designed to direct airflow into the radiator. The baffles where to keep air from recirculating... air going around the radiator from the back to the front -- and back into the radiator. Recirculated air is warmer than non-recirculated air. There isn't anything to stop this flow on the earlier coaches.
""
That was my understanding as well.
|
Bob,
It may not have been designed for that, but it works that way.
Gene Dotson
74 Canyonlands
www.bdub.net/Motorhome_Enhancements New Windows and Aluminum Radiators
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88852 is a reply to message #88827] |
Wed, 16 June 2010 14:30 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| shawnee wrote on Wed, 16 June 2010 10:34 |
| Bob de Kruyff wrote on Wed, 16 June 2010 11:35 |
""The way I understood it, The baffles on the 403 coaches was NOT designed to direct airflow into the radiator. The baffles where to keep air from recirculating... air going around the radiator from the back to the front -- and back into the radiator. Recirculated air is warmer than non-recirculated air. There isn't anything to stop this flow on the earlier coaches.
""
That was my understanding as well.
|
Bob,
It may not have been designed for that, but it works that way.
|
As we used to say at GM--"I love it when the lack of a plan comes together"
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88864 is a reply to message #88788] |
Wed, 16 June 2010 15:28 |
powerjon
Messages: 2446
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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For what ever the reason the baffles were added on the 403 77 & 78
coaches they do keep cooler air directed towards the radiator. As for
air flow the air dam spoiler that I designed in 2001 and road tested
for a year on several coaches directs additional air flow into the
radiator and causes a negative pressure behind it to help with air
movement out of the engine compartment. The first thing that most
noticed when they install the spoiler was that the fan clutch did not
engage as often than before the unit had been installed and there
water temp was more stable. My coaches water temp will run all day at
about 188 even on the hottest days.
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
TZE Zone Restorations
77 Eleganza Custom (For Sale)
1975 Avion (Under Reconstruction)
Michigan
On Jun 16, 2010, at 12:36 AM, Mike Miller wrote:
>
>
> The way I understood it, The baffles on the 403 coaches was NOT
> designed to direct airflow into the radiator. The baffles where to
> keep air from recirculating... air going around the radiator from
> the back to the front -- and back into the radiator. Recirculated
> air is warmer than non-recirculated air. There isn't anything to
> stop this flow on the earlier coaches.
>
> I -DO- think the airflow from in front of coach, through the
> radiator and out of the engine compartment, could use some
> improvement. Some data collection and some thought is needed
> before some innovation.
>
> A good solution would address the recirculation problem AND direct
> flow into, through and out of the engine bay.
> powerjon wrote on Tue, 15 June 2010 18:31
> Mike Miller
> `73 26' X Painted D.
> `78 23' Birchaven
> Hillsboro, OR
> ______________________
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GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
J.R. Wright
GMC GreatLaker
GMC Eastern States
GMCMI
78 30' Buskirk Stretch
75 Avion Under Reconstruction
Michigan
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| Re: [GMCnet] Better Cooling??? [message #88886 is a reply to message #88864] |
Wed, 16 June 2010 17:40 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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""As for
air flow the air dam spoiler that I designed in 2001 and road tested
for a year on several coaches directs additional air flow into the
radiator and causes a negative pressure behind it to help with air
movement out of the engine compartment. ""
That's an upgrade I want to do as well!
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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