| [GMCnet] REAR BRAKE TORQUE REACTION ARM SYSTEM [message #86345] |
Thu, 27 May 2010 20:18  |
Charles Aulgur
Messages: 78
Registered: March 2006
Karma: 0
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Member |
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There have been some discussion as to what is available for a parking
brake when installing the rear brake torque reaction arm system. Rick
Flanagan and Jim K have the hydraulic line lock on there GMCs which
they are very happy with. You don't need to apply full brake
pressure for a parking brake and if you have a good brake system you
do not have to worry about leak-down. This is a much more reliable
system then having some additional air cylinder pulling on the brake
pedal which is also requiring your MC to stay under pressure which is
the most likely place for a hydraulic brake fluid leak. On most any
GMC, the MS will leak down if you push on your brake pedal as hard as
you can with the engine running. Just try it some time and most
likely your brake pedal will slowly move downward but it is so slow
that it does not affect your braking ability when driving. This is
something I have never been able to solve so I quite wasting money on
new MS. And yes; I do know how to properly bleed the MS and brake
system.
When Jim K. sent me the production version of the brake torque
reaction arm system to install on my GMC he also sent the 70 mm
Elderado calipers for the rear two wheels and asked me to invent some
type of actuator that would supply enough force to hold the GMC on an
incline of at least 15 degrees slope. What I have done is install a
HF 12vdc scissors jack on the floor on the left side of the driver
seat and connected it to the OEM parking brake cable which actuates
my much modified cable system which applies a balanced force to each
rear wheel caliper, which you cannot do on with the OEM cable
system. The jack will develop up to 4000# force so it has sufficient
force capability. I can hold my GMC on an 8% grade but I have been
having problems with cable fittings holding enough force. So far I
have broken the cables four times. When I get back to work on it I
will replace all the old OEM cable with higher strength cables.
I am doing all this testing for Jim K as I have a parking brake on
one side of my coach that I showed a lot of people at Auburn. It is
attached to the outer frame of the quad air bag support frame and has
a scissors jack action that forces brake pads out against the the two
rear wheels and locks the wheels together with enough force that
will hold the coach in the "braked" position if I let all the air out
of my air bags. Photos and descriptions have been on the GMC photo
site for over a year and I have had no interest shown. The funny
looking "U" shaped thing that was setting next to my GMC at Auburn
was a working model operated by the 12 vdc motor, gears and threaded
rod from another HF scissors jack. It is for sale for $200 if anyone
wants it but it only fits on the quad bag support frame. I made it
for Jim but he didn't think there would be enough interest to make
production worthwhile.
Chuck Aulgur
La Mesa, CA
76 Royale with full six wheel brakes
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| Re: [GMCnet] REAR BRAKE TORQUE REACTION ARM SYSTEM [message #86358 is a reply to message #86345] |
Thu, 27 May 2010 22:00  |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Chuck,
Maybe we can get Al Branscombe to look into a better cable.
He is working on a Caliper with parking brake for us also.
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 6:18 PM, Charles Aulgur <cwasdc@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> There have been some discussion as to what is available for a parking
> brake when installing the rear brake torque reaction arm system. Rick
> Flanagan and Jim K have the hydraulic line lock on there GMCs which
> they are very happy with. You don't need to apply full brake
> pressure for a parking brake and if you have a good brake system you
> do not have to worry about leak-down. This is a much more reliable
> system then having some additional air cylinder pulling on the brake
> pedal which is also requiring your MC to stay under pressure which is
> the most likely place for a hydraulic brake fluid leak. On most any
> GMC, the MS will leak down if you push on your brake pedal as hard as
> you can with the engine running. Just try it some time and most
> likely your brake pedal will slowly move downward but it is so slow
> that it does not affect your braking ability when driving. This is
> something I have never been able to solve so I quite wasting money on
> new MS. And yes; I do know how to properly bleed the MS and brake
> system.
>
> When Jim K. sent me the production version of the brake torque
> reaction arm system to install on my GMC he also sent the 70 mm
> Elderado calipers for the rear two wheels and asked me to invent some
> type of actuator that would supply enough force to hold the GMC on an
> incline of at least 15 degrees slope. What I have done is install a
> HF 12vdc scissors jack on the floor on the left side of the driver
> seat and connected it to the OEM parking brake cable which actuates
> my much modified cable system which applies a balanced force to each
> rear wheel caliper, which you cannot do on with the OEM cable
> system. The jack will develop up to 4000# force so it has sufficient
> force capability. I can hold my GMC on an 8% grade but I have been
> having problems with cable fittings holding enough force. So far I
> have broken the cables four times. When I get back to work on it I
> will replace all the old OEM cable with higher strength cables.
>
> I am doing all this testing for Jim K as I have a parking brake on
> one side of my coach that I showed a lot of people at Auburn. It is
> attached to the outer frame of the quad air bag support frame and has
> a scissors jack action that forces brake pads out against the the two
> rear wheels and locks the wheels together with enough force that
> will hold the coach in the "braked" position if I let all the air out
> of my air bags. Photos and descriptions have been on the GMC photo
> site for over a year and I have had no interest shown. The funny
> looking "U" shaped thing that was setting next to my GMC at Auburn
> was a working model operated by the 12 vdc motor, gears and threaded
> rod from another HF scissors jack. It is for sale for $200 if anyone
> wants it but it only fits on the quad bag support frame. I made it
> for Jim but he didn't think there would be enough interest to make
> production worthwhile.
>
> Chuck Aulgur
> La Mesa, CA
> 76 Royale with full six wheel brakes
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] REAR BRAKE TORQUE REACTION ARM SYSTEM [message #86364 is a reply to message #86358] |
Thu, 27 May 2010 22:40 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I had a customer that has a 23' coach that we supplied him all the
parts for the same Disc Brake kit as those that we are supplying about
8years ago.
He is still telling us how great they are.
He has the parking brake caliper on the back rear. It is set up
properly to where the unit adjusts properly.
He stopped over only for a grease job.
His was the first we supplied with the kit
We have over 80units running.
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 8:00 PM, Jim Kanomata <jimkanomata@gmail.com> wrote:
> Chuck,
> Maybe we can get Al Branscombe to look into a better cable.
> He is working on a Caliper with parking brake for us also.
>
> On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 6:18 PM, Charles Aulgur <cwasdc@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> There have been some discussion as to what is available for a parking
>> brake when installing the rear brake torque reaction arm system. Rick
>> Flanagan and Jim K have the hydraulic line lock on there GMCs which
>> they are very happy with. You don't need to apply full brake
>> pressure for a parking brake and if you have a good brake system you
>> do not have to worry about leak-down. This is a much more reliable
>> system then having some additional air cylinder pulling on the brake
>> pedal which is also requiring your MC to stay under pressure which is
>> the most likely place for a hydraulic brake fluid leak. On most any
>> GMC, the MS will leak down if you push on your brake pedal as hard as
>> you can with the engine running. Just try it some time and most
>> likely your brake pedal will slowly move downward but it is so slow
>> that it does not affect your braking ability when driving. This is
>> something I have never been able to solve so I quite wasting money on
>> new MS. And yes; I do know how to properly bleed the MS and brake
>> system.
>>
>> When Jim K. sent me the production version of the brake torque
>> reaction arm system to install on my GMC he also sent the 70 mm
>> Elderado calipers for the rear two wheels and asked me to invent some
>> type of actuator that would supply enough force to hold the GMC on an
>> incline of at least 15 degrees slope. What I have done is install a
>> HF 12vdc scissors jack on the floor on the left side of the driver
>> seat and connected it to the OEM parking brake cable which actuates
>> my much modified cable system which applies a balanced force to each
>> rear wheel caliper, which you cannot do on with the OEM cable
>> system. The jack will develop up to 4000# force so it has sufficient
>> force capability. I can hold my GMC on an 8% grade but I have been
>> having problems with cable fittings holding enough force. So far I
>> have broken the cables four times. When I get back to work on it I
>> will replace all the old OEM cable with higher strength cables.
>>
>> I am doing all this testing for Jim K as I have a parking brake on
>> one side of my coach that I showed a lot of people at Auburn. It is
>> attached to the outer frame of the quad air bag support frame and has
>> a scissors jack action that forces brake pads out against the the two
>> rear wheels and locks the wheels together with enough force that
>> will hold the coach in the "braked" position if I let all the air out
>> of my air bags. Photos and descriptions have been on the GMC photo
>> site for over a year and I have had no interest shown. The funny
>> looking "U" shaped thing that was setting next to my GMC at Auburn
>> was a working model operated by the 12 vdc motor, gears and threaded
>> rod from another HF scissors jack. It is for sale for $200 if anyone
>> wants it but it only fits on the quad bag support frame. I made it
>> for Jim but he didn't think there would be enough interest to make
>> production worthwhile.
>>
>> Chuck Aulgur
>> La Mesa, CA
>> 76 Royale with full six wheel brakes
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] REAR BRAKE TORQUE REACTION ARM SYSTEM [message #86365 is a reply to message #86345] |
Thu, 27 May 2010 22:48 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Chuck,
My experience with MC's has been different: During the weeks I've left the
GMC parked with the air operated parking brake engaged, I've never noticed
ANY pedal height loss. If I did, I'd have to change the leaking MC, as I'd
advise anyone to do if they experience pedal creep-down, with boost or
without.
Ken H.
On Thu, May 27, 2010 at 9:18 PM, Charles Aulgur <cwasdc@sbcglobal.net>wrote:
> There have been some discussion as to what is available for a parking
> brake when installing the rear brake torque reaction arm system. Rick
> Flanagan and Jim K have the hydraulic line lock on there GMCs which
> they are very happy with. You don't need to apply full brake
> pressure for a parking brake and if you have a good brake system you
> do not have to worry about leak-down. This is a much more reliable
> system then having some additional air cylinder pulling on the brake
> pedal which is also requiring your MC to stay under pressure which is
> the most likely place for a hydraulic brake fluid leak. On most any
> GMC, the MS will leak down if you push on your brake pedal as hard as
> you can with the engine running. Just try it some time and most
> likely your brake pedal will slowly move downward but it is so slow
> that it does not affect your braking ability when driving. This is
> something I have never been able to solve so I quite wasting money on
> new MS. And yes; I do know how to properly bleed the MS and brake
> system.
> ...
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
List Information and Subscription Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] REAR BRAKE TORQUE REACTION ARM SYSTEM [message #86441 is a reply to message #86358] |
Fri, 28 May 2010 16:05 |
midlf
Messages: 2212
Registered: July 2007
Location: SE Wisc. (Palmyra)
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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| jimk wrote on Thu, 27 May 2010 22:00 |
Chuck,
Maybe we can get Al Branscombe to look into a better cable.
He is working on a Caliper with parking brake for us also.
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
|
I believe Al B's powerpoint presentation made a comment that the ultimate limiter in the system was bending of the Pbrake actuating lever in the drum.
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
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