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| ignition module and mystery [message #85265] |
Wed, 19 May 2010 13:05  |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
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bringing the coach home yesterday it started stumbling/cutting out and finally quit all together and would not restart.
i pulled the air cleaner and saw i was getting no fuel squirt in the carb. looked at the clear filter by the engine and it was all but empty. turn on the elec. pump; no fuel but pump was running. 1/2 tank of gas.
pulled fuel line off suction side of elec. pump; had gas there. pulled line off pump outlet, turned it on no gas.
John Nichols, bless his heart, drove over with a new pump. i installed it and got gas to the carb only to find i had no spark.
pulled the module out and went to Autozone. they tested it and said it failed but didn't have one. went to O'Riley's and tested it and they said it was OK. wow, now what. bought a new one and installed it and the engine fired up on the first crank.
now the mystery:
i run on the mechanical pump and use the elec. one for priming the carb. so why was the carb empty when the engine quit? i drove home on the mechanical pump so i know it was working.
second: what are the odds of the elec. pump and module both going out at the same time? it is possible that the elec. pump was not working all along and i just discovered it but still why was the carb empty?
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85314 is a reply to message #85265] |
Wed, 19 May 2010 19:58  |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
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Fred,
That's a weird one. It sounds similar to the near-simultaneous electrical
and fuel problems I was having while trying to get the Cad500 running
right.
How is your electric pump wired and plumbed? Have you bench tested the
"failed" electric pump? How about the "failed" ignition module?
Ken H.
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:05 PM, fred veenschoten <fredntoni@cox.net> wrote:
> bringing the coach home yesterday it started stumbling/cutting out and
> finally quit all together and would not restart.
> ...
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76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85330 is a reply to message #85314] |
Wed, 19 May 2010 21:37 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
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| Ken Henderson wrote on Wed, 19 May 2010 19:58 |
Fred,
That's a weird one. It sounds similar to the near-simultaneous electrical
and fuel problems I was having while trying to get the Cad500 running
right.
How is your electric pump wired and plumbed? Have you bench tested the
"failed" electric pump? How about the "failed" ignition module?
Ken H.
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:05 PM, fred veenschoten <fredntoni@cox.net> wrote:
> bringing the coach home yesterday it started stumbling/cutting out and
> finally quit all together and would not restart.
> ...
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the pump is located back by the tanks and is wired through a toggle switch on the dash to the ign. switch. the more i think about it the more i think the went out awhile ago.
seems like it took a long time to prime the carb and a lot of cranking after sitting for a month. that still doesn't explain why the carb was dry with the mechanical pump working.
i don't know how to test the module at home. i could take it to another parts shop and get a "best 2 out of 3" test on it.
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85335 is a reply to message #85330] |
Wed, 19 May 2010 21:49 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Fred,
Does the mechanical pump draw fuel through the electrical one? What kind is
the electric pump? Does it have a bypass check valve? Is the switch
connection directly from IGN through the switch to the pump -- no alternator
or oil pressure protection?
How about putting the ignition module back in the distributor; now that
you've apparently solved the fuel problem, maybe the module will prove to be
OK.
What I'm speculating is that the fuel pump, if failed, might have resisted
the mechanical pump's "pull" enough to cause vapor lock (aided by our
finally warmer weather). By the time you checked spark, the battery might
have been low enough to fail to trigger the (maybe weak) ignition module.
WAGs!
Ken H.
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:37 PM, fred veenschoten <fredntoni@cox.net>wrote:
> the pump is located back by the tanks and is wired through a toggle switch
> on the dash to the ign. switch. the more i think about it the more i think
> the went out awhile ago.
>
> seems like it took a long time to prime the carb and a lot of cranking
> after sitting for a month. that still doesn't explain why the carb was dry
> with the mechanical pump working.
>
> i don't know how to test the module at home. i could take it to another
> parts shop and get a "best 2 out of 3" test on it.
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85377 is a reply to message #85335] |
Thu, 20 May 2010 09:26 |
fred v
Messages: 999
Registered: April 2006
Location: pensacola, fl.
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title=Ken Henderson wrote on Wed, 19 May 2010 21:49]Fred,
Does the mechanical pump draw fuel through the electrical one? What kind is the electric pump? Does it have a bypass check valve?
YES, IT PULLS THROUGH THE ELEC. PUMP, NO BY PASS, PO INSTALLED AND HAS BEEN WORKING FINE FOR 5 YEARS. OFF BRAND PUMP, NO NAME ON IT.
Is the switch connection directly from IGN through the switch to the pump -- no alternator or oil pressure protection?
CORRECT, NO PROTECTION SWITCHES.
How about putting the ignition module back in the distributor; now that you've apparently solved the fuel problem, maybe the module will prove to be
OK.
I COULD DO THAT BUT FOR 17 BUCKS WITH LIFETIME WARRANTY I PROBABLY WON'T.
What I'm speculating is that the fuel pump, if failed, might have resisted the mechanical pump's "pull" enough to cause vapor lock (aided by our finally warmer weather).
I CAN EASILY BLOW THROUGH IT JUST LIKE THE CARTER WE PUT BACK ON IT. IT WAS WARM THAT DAY BUT NOT HOT AND I ONLY DROVE 5 MILES BEFORE IT QUIT. I DID TEST THE PUMP AND IT HAD NO SUCTION.
By the time you checked spark, the battery might
have been low enough to fail to trigger the (maybe weak) ignition module.
WAGs!
ENGINE WAS STILL SPINNING FAST SO I DON'T THINK THAT WAS IT. ENGINE DIED LIKE I TURNED IT OFF BUT BY THEN IT HAD NO FUEL OR SPARK.
Ken H.
Fred V
'77 Royale RB 455
P'cola, Fl
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85381 is a reply to message #85377] |
Thu, 20 May 2010 10:44 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Fred,
You've sure got me stumped! Please let us know if you figure it out.
Ken H.
On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 10:26 AM, fred veenschoten <fredntoni@cox.net>wrote:
>
> oes the mechanical pump draw fuel through the electrical one? What kind is
> the electric pump? Does it have a bypass check valve?
> YES, IT PULLS THROUGH THE ELEC. PUMP, NO BY PASS, PO INSTALLED AND HAS BEEN
> WORKING FINE FOR 5 YEARS. OFF BRAND PUMP, NO NAME ON IT.
>
> Is the switch connection directly from IGN through the switch to the pump
> -- no alternator or oil pressure protection?
> CORRECT, NO PROTECTION SWITCHES.
>
> How about putting the ignition module back in the distributor; now that
> you've apparently solved the fuel problem, maybe the module will prove to be
> OK.
> I COULD DO THAT BUT FOR 17 BUCKS WITH LIFETIME WARRANTY I PROBABLY WON'T.
>
> What I'm speculating is that the fuel pump, if failed, might have resisted
> the mechanical pump's "pull" enough to cause vapor lock (aided by our
> finally warmer weather).
> I CAN EASILY BLOW THROUGH IT JUST LIKE THE CARTER WE PUT BACK ON IT. IT WAS
> WARM THAT DAY BUT NOT HOT AND I ONLY DROVE 5 MILES BEFORE IT QUIT. I DID
> TEST THE PUMP AND IT HAD NO SUCTION.
>
> By the time you checked spark, the battery might
> have been low enough to fail to trigger the (maybe weak) ignition module.
> WAGs!
> ENGINE WAS STILL SPINNING FAST SO I DON'T THINK THAT WAS IT. ENGINE DIED
> LIKE I TURNED IT OFF BUT BY THEN IT HAD NO FUEL OR SPARK.
>
> Ken H.
>
>
> --
> Fred V
> '77 Royale RB 455
> P'cola, Fl
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] ignition module and mystery [message #85395 is a reply to message #85388] |
Thu, 20 May 2010 15:50 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I can confabulate with that!
Ken H.
On Thu, May 20, 2010 at 3:36 PM, Emery Stora <emerystora@mac.com> wrote:
>
> On May 20, 2010, at 9:44 AM, Ken Henderson wrote:
>
> > Fred,
> >
> > You've sure got me stumped! Please let us know if you figure it out.
> >
> > Ken H.
> >
>
>
> Pretty straightforward, Ken.
>
> His frazzledap multidorfed into his swizzledipper and blupofaded his module
> and fuel pump. One really has to watch out for that. :)
>
> Emery Stora
> 77 Kingsley
> Santa Fe, NM
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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