Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80171 is a reply to message #80170] |
Sun, 11 April 2010 14:29   |
Terry Skinner
Messages: 379
Registered: January 2004
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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My point exactly!! Are we now morally judged by what brand of tires we
have/purchase??
On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com> wrote:
> I must've missed something here. What the heck are we talking about?
>
> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:45 AM, Terry Skinner <gmcnut@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Is this where the GMCnet is going??
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:24 AM, JoAnne Bissell
>> <joanne.bissell@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Could it possibly be due to the deaths incurred when someone else refuses to
>>> do the proven safe thing???????
>>>
>>> 2-4 the road
>>> 77 Kingsley 26' 455
>>> NLR,AR
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Terry Skinner
>> 253-686-2624
>> Roy. Washington
>> '76 GMC
>> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Steve Ferguson
> '76 EII
> Sierra Vista, AZ
> Urethane bushing source
> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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--
Terry Skinner
253-686-2624
Roy. Washington
'76 GMC
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80206 is a reply to message #80171] |
Sun, 11 April 2010 17:16 |
jw mills
Messages: 199
Registered: September 2006
Karma: -30
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Senior Member |
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Has Tom Warner resurfaced? ? ? ? ?
--
Jim Mills
Greeley, CO
1973 CanyonLands 260 TZE-063V100731(under renovation)
1973 Glacier 230 TZE-033V101993
On Sun, 2010-04-11 at 12:29 -0700, Terry Skinner wrote:
> My point exactly!! Are we now morally judged by what brand of tires we
> have/purchase??
>
> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I must've missed something here. What the heck are we talking about?
> >
> > On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:45 AM, Terry Skinner <gmcnut@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Is this where the GMCnet is going??
> >>
> >> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:24 AM, JoAnne Bissell
> >> <joanne.bissell@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Could it possibly be due to the deaths incurred when someone else refuses to
> >>> do the proven safe thing???????
> >>>
> >>> 2-4 the road
> >>> 77 Kingsley 26' 455
> >>> NLR,AR
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> GMCnet mailing list
> >>> List Information and Subscription Options:
> >>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Terry Skinner
> >> 253-686-2624
> >> Roy. Washington
> >> '76 GMC
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> GMCnet mailing list
> >> List Information and Subscription Options:
> >> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Steve Ferguson
> > '76 EII
> > Sierra Vista, AZ
> > Urethane bushing source
> > www.bdub.net/ferguson/
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80241 is a reply to message #80171] |
Sun, 11 April 2010 20:08 |
k2gkk
Messages: 4452
Registered: November 2009
Karma: -8
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Senior Member |
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Not in the least. There was a video link posted
which was by a tire manufacturer that demonstrated
why THEY recommended that if only two tires were
being purchased those two should be mounted on the
rear axle.
Nothing more, nothing less.
SHEESH!
* Mac Macdonald *
* Oklahoma City *
** "Money Pit" **
* '76 ex - P.B. *
----------------------------------------
> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2010 12:29:44 -0700
> From: gmcnut@gmail.com
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires
>
> My point exactly!! Are we now morally judged by what brand of tires we
> have/purchase??
>
> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Steven Ferguson wrote:
>> I must've missed something here. What the heck are we talking about?
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:45 AM, Terry Skinner wrote:
>>> Is this where the GMCnet is going??
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 11, 2010 at 8:24 AM, JoAnne Bissell
>>> wrote:
>>>> Could it possibly be due to the deaths incurred when someone else refuses to
>>>> do the proven safe thing???????
>>>>
>>>> 2-4 the road
>>>> 77 Kingsley 26' 455
>>>> NLR,AR
>>>> _______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
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http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80251 is a reply to message #80244] |
Sun, 11 April 2010 20:34 |
GMCNUSA
Messages: 283
Registered: August 2006
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Great! What six wheeled GMC year did they do the demonstration on?
Physics gurus question:
If a GMC has 2000 lb load on each wheel and tire tread, air pressure etc are all equal, in a turn on a wet road will the resistnce to sliding sideways be equal on all tires? If the answer is yes then we have twice the lateral stability on the rear wheels as the front. If this is true then our best tread/wet traction should be on the front wheels.
I'm probably all wet. LOL
Larry Dilk
Indianapolis, IN
76 Eleganza II
Patterson 455,Turbo City TBI,
Just LOVE It!
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80273 is a reply to message #80128] |
Mon, 12 April 2010 06:58 |
Gary Casey
Messages: 448
Registered: September 2009
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I may be incorrectly jumping in on the middle of this thread, as I haven't been following it very well, but: The traction coefficient of a tire is petty much independent of the load. In other words the tire with twice the load will have twice the side force in a turn, but twice the traction as well. Therefore, the fact that the front tires are loaded more doesn't mean the rears will never slide. Of course, to tell the truth, that's not quite true. The more highly loaded tires with more lateral force will have more tread, belt and sidewall distortion, all of which contribute to a higher slip angle and earlier loss of traction. Therefore, it is likely that the more heavily loaded end of the vehicle will lose traction first, but not by a lot. This is more true when the traction is highest. On very low traction surfaces like ice either end could go first. No, the rears don't have twice the "stability" as the fronts.
Gary
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> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> From: lwd222@msn.com
> Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2010 20:34:52 -0500
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires
>
>
>
> Great! What six wheeled GMC year did they do the demonstration on?
>
> Physics gurus question:
> If a GMC has 2000 lb load on each wheel and tire tread, air pressure etc are all equal, in a turn on a wet road will the resistnce to sliding sideways be equal on all tires? If the answer is yes then we have twice the lateral stability on the rear wheels as the front. If this is true then our best tread/wet traction should be on the front wheels.
> I'm probably all wet. LOL
> --
> Larry Dilk
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80302 is a reply to message #80128] |
Mon, 12 April 2010 12:19 |
kingd
Messages: 592
Registered: June 2004
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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One of the tire mnufacturers associations has actually "published" a poster that says "Best to the back" for front wheel drive AND rear wheel drive. They claim losing control to oversteer is worse than understeer. I guess if you want the best on the back one could put the new tires on the front and wait for them to wear down. JWID !!!!
DAVE KING
DAVE KING
lurker, wannabe
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
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| Re: [GMCnet] If you are buying new tires [message #80340 is a reply to message #80128] |
Mon, 12 April 2010 16:00 |
Gary Casey
Messages: 448
Registered: September 2009
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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I think I'll have to take exception to some the statements, mostly based on understeer desirability. A car that understeers will require progressively more steering angle as the lateral G's go up (like going faster around a give radius). Oversteer means that the steering angle goes down as the speed goes up. An understeering car is inherently stable in a turn or straight ahead and an oversteering car is inherently unstable and requires continuous driver input to maintain control. There can be a difference between behavior in the linear range (where we - most of us, anyway - drive our coaches) and the terminal behavior just before something lets go. All production cars worldwide (and almost all race cars) understeer in the linear range. Once upon a time several of us got into a big "discussion" on the subject so we procured a race car that we thought had the most highly developed suspension design - a Formula car (Lotus, I think). We tested it
and found, much to the consternation of macho amateur race drivers among us, that it had a very pronounced understeer. Nothing to do with the competence of the drivers.
And as for putting the new tires on the front or rear, it's a double-edged sword. With greater tread depth the tire will have a larger slip angle (again, in the linear range) that one with less tread. Putting the new tires on the front will increase understeer. But, at the limit, especially in the wet or in snow, the deeper tread may have better grip, preventing skids. Then you would like to have the new tires in back (they call it the "back" because that's where you want it to stay :-). Crosswinds present an interesting problem. The center of effort of a crosswind is close to the front, almost certainly ahead of the CG. Therefore, a gust will turn the vehicle away from the wind. A vehicle with less understeer will tend to keep going that way. More understeer will allow an initial deflection, but it will be stable and of a smaller magnitude. Therefore, more understeer reduces the effects of crosswinds. I'll put the new tires on the front since
I don't plan to drive in the snow.
FWIW
Gary
Denver, '73 23'
> One of the tire mnufacturers associations has actually "published" a
> poster that says "Best to the back" for front wheel drive AND rear wheel
> drive. They claim losing control to oversteer is worse than understeer. I
> guess if you want the best on the back one could put the new tires on the
> front and wait for them to wear down. JWID !!!!
>
> DAVE KING
Understeer is widely considered preferable to oversteer by
automotive designers due to the general incompetence that
is exhibited by most USA drivers. Better to plow somewhat
straight ahead than to have your tail pass your nose!
* Mac Macdonald *
* Oklahoma City *
** "Money Pit" **
* '76 ex - P.B. *
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