Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70717 is a reply to message #70714] |
Wed, 13 January 2010 08:39   |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
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Correct me if I'm wrong here Ken but is see a specific reference to
mechanical/solid lifters. Nothing about hydraulics.
On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 7:35 AM, Ken Henderson <ken0henderson@gmail.com> wrote:
> bulletin which Rob forwarded to me. It discusses the ZDDP deficiency, tells
> about their tool for grooving lifter bores, and promotes their flat tappet
> lifters with oil holes on the cam fact. Also discusses their nitrided
> camshafts.
>
> It's probably available on the Comp Cams web site.
>
> Ken H.
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:22 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Ken,
>> What bulletin? This is a precedure that I've never heard of before.
>> Is this a play on reduced levels of ZDDP or has someone invented
>> another "you hafta do this" or else ploy?...
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--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70718 is a reply to message #70717] |
Wed, 13 January 2010 09:05 |
GMCWiperMan
Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Steve,
On re-reading the bulleting and searching the web site, I see that you're
apparently correct. I didn't give sufficient importance to the
parenthetical "solid/mechanical" after seeing "(Hydraulic &
Solid/Mechanical)" in the Subject.
There's a reference in two places to "Lubrited" cam faces on race hydraulic
lifters for Chevy's, with no explanation ANYWHERE of what that means; I'm
going to assume that it's Ad-Speak for nitrided faces.
The only place I could find reference to hole lubricated lifters WAS for
some solid lifters with "EDM oiling hole".
Now I've got to wonder about the applicability of the bore grooving to
hydraulic lifters also! Maybe the reduction in pressure would be too much?
Ken H.
On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:39 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com>wrote:
> Correct me if I'm wrong here Ken but is see a specific reference to
> mechanical/solid lifters. Nothing about hydraulics.
>
> On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 7:35 AM, Ken Henderson <ken0henderson@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > bulletin which Rob forwarded to me. It discusses the ZDDP deficiency,
> tells
> > about their tool for grooving lifter bores, and promotes their flat
> tappet
> > lifters with oil holes on the cam fact. Also discusses their nitrided
> > camshafts.
> >
> > It's probably available on the Comp Cams web site.
> >
> > Ken H.
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:22 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Ken,
> >> What bulletin? This is a precedure that I've never heard of before.
> >> Is this a play on reduced levels of ZDDP or has someone invented
> >> another "you hafta do this" or else ploy?...
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > List Information and Subscription Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Steve Ferguson
> '76 EII
> Sierra Vista, AZ
> Urethane bushing source
> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70719 is a reply to message #70718] |
Wed, 13 January 2010 09:47 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ken,
I personally, would not do it. We've got the reduced ZDDP thing
pretty well sorted out here and we know better than most how to deal
with it.
On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 8:05 AM, Ken Henderson <ken0henderson@gmail.com> wrote:
> Steve,
>
> On re-reading the bulleting and searching the web site, I see that you're
> apparently correct. I didn't give sufficient importance to the
> parenthetical "solid/mechanical" after seeing "(Hydraulic &
> Solid/Mechanical)" in the Subject.
>
> There's a reference in two places to "Lubrited" cam faces on race hydraulic
> lifters for Chevy's, with no explanation ANYWHERE of what that means; I'm
> going to assume that it's Ad-Speak for nitrided faces.
>
> The only place I could find reference to hole lubricated lifters WAS for
> some solid lifters with "EDM oiling hole".
>
> Now I've got to wonder about the applicability of the bore grooving to
> hydraulic lifters also! Maybe the reduction in pressure would be too much?
>
> Ken H.
>
> On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:39 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Correct me if I'm wrong here Ken but is see a specific reference to
>> mechanical/solid lifters. Nothing about hydraulics.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 7:35 AM, Ken Henderson <ken0henderson@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > bulletin which Rob forwarded to me. It discusses the ZDDP deficiency,
>> tells
>> > about their tool for grooving lifter bores, and promotes their flat
>> tappet
>> > lifters with oil holes on the cam fact. Also discusses their nitrided
>> > camshafts.
>> >
>> > It's probably available on the Comp Cams web site.
>> >
>> > Ken H.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 9:22 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >> Ken,
>> >> What bulletin? This is a precedure that I've never heard of before.
>> >> Is this a play on reduced levels of ZDDP or has someone invented
>> >> another "you hafta do this" or else ploy?...
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > GMCnet mailing list
>> > List Information and Subscription Options:
>> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Steve Ferguson
>> '76 EII
>> Sierra Vista, AZ
>> Urethane bushing source
>> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70744 is a reply to message #70719] |
Wed, 13 January 2010 16:15 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Steve,
Sorry about sending in the same info Ken did, I didn't see the ones that
went back and forth between you two.
It's funny but the title of the bulletin is; "Subject: Flat Tappet Camshaft
Failures (Hydraulic & Solid/Mechanical)" but as Ken noted it looks like they
don't sell any hydraulic tappets with holes in them to lube the cam. That
makes sense as whenever you shut down the engine the oil in the lifters
would get squeezed out by valve spring pressure and I'd hate to think what
the engine would sound like the next time you start it up!
I agree with you and will not be grooving the lifter bores, however, I did
have the cam I got for the Caddy nitrided and I will use the information
provided when I assemble the engine.
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Steven Ferguson
Sent: Thursday, 14 January 2010 2:47 AM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
Ken,
I personally, would not do it. We've got the reduced ZDDP thing
pretty well sorted out here and we know better than most how to deal
with it.
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70839 is a reply to message #70836] |
Thu, 14 January 2010 21:29 |
GMCWiperMan
Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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"Mounts"? Or "mount"? Remember, with the '68-'72 front brackets, there's a
single Cad mount. With the CadCo or Dale Fromm mount, you use the Olds
mount.
Or is it the whole '68-'72 mount you need?
I'm about to send my '72 mount off for re-vulcanizing, per Larry Weidner's
STRONG recommendation since his busted on his first trip with the Cad.
Shall I send yours also if I find one? About $70, IIRC.
Ken H.
On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 10:05 PM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Ken,
>
> Just realized that I don't have any motor mounts for the Caddy 500 I have
> in
> Humble!
>
> I would appreciate it if you could pick up a pair for me if they have them
> out of a car already. I'd rather you not crawl around under a car to get
> them!
>
> Regards,
> Rob Mueller
> Sydney, Australia
> AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
> USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Larry
> Sent: Friday, 15 January 2010 12:58 PM
> To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
>
> You should try to get as many of the motor mounts as you can...they are
> getting scarce. JWID
> --
> Larry :)
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
> _______________________________________________
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>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70847 is a reply to message #70839] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 01:52 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Ken,
I have a Caddy 500 engine block with no mounts at all so I don't know what I
need.
In the pictures on page two of the Dale Fromm mount that I posted there are
two brackets with a rubber mid section. They bolt to the front of the Caddy
engine block and the bracket that Dale designed. They are labeled Left Side
and Right Side. I assumed they are Caddy Eldorado engine mounts. If they are
Olds 455 mounts I don't need anything as I will use the ones out of The Blue
Streak, I guess!
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ken Henderson
Sent: Friday, 15 January 2010 2:30 PM
To: gmclist
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
"Mounts"? Or "mount"? Remember, with the '68-'72 front brackets, there's a
single Cad mount. With the CadCo or Dale Fromm mount, you use the Olds
mount.
Or is it the whole '68-'72 mount you need?
I'm about to send my '72 mount off for re-vulcanizing, per Larry Weidner's
STRONG recommendation since his busted on his first trip with the Cad.
Shall I send yours also if I find one? About $70, IIRC.
Ken H.
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
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http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70850 is a reply to message #70847] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 03:41 |
GMCWiperMan
Messages: 1248
Registered: December 2007
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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OOoops! I misremembered Dale's design! He uses the Cad mounts, NOT the
Olds mount!
I've got the Cad mounts from this '76 engine of mine, but they're yours if
you want them. Someone closer to Houston probably has some for you also.
If the guy in Macon calls me back and has '68-'72 Cad mounts I'll get those
-- for you or whomever needs them.
Ken H.
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 2:52 AM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au>wrote:
> Ken,
>
> I have a Caddy 500 engine block with no mounts at all so I don't know what
> I
> need.
>
> In the pictures on page two of the Dale Fromm mount that I posted there are
> two brackets with a rubber mid section. They bolt to the front of the Caddy
> engine block and the bracket that Dale designed. They are labeled Left Side
> and Right Side. I assumed they are Caddy Eldorado engine mounts. If they
> are
> Olds 455 mounts I don't need anything as I will use the ones out of The
> Blue
> Streak, I guess!
>
> Regards,
> Rob Mueller
> Sydney, Australia
> AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
> USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
> [mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Ken Henderson
> Sent: Friday, 15 January 2010 2:30 PM
> To: gmclist
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
>
> "Mounts"? Or "mount"? Remember, with the '68-'72 front brackets, there's
> a
> single Cad mount. With the CadCo or Dale Fromm mount, you use the Olds
> mount.
>
> Or is it the whole '68-'72 mount you need?
>
> I'm about to send my '72 mount off for re-vulcanizing, per Larry Weidner's
> STRONG recommendation since his busted on his first trip with the Cad.
> Shall I send yours also if I find one? About $70, IIRC.
>
> Ken H.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
_______________________________________________
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70852 is a reply to message #70847] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 06:50 |
Larry
Messages: 2875
Registered: January 2004
Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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| Robert Mueller wrote on Fri, 15 January 2010 01:52 |
Ken,
I have a Caddy 500 engine block with no mounts at all so I don't know what I
need.
In the pictures on page two of the Dale Fromm mount that I posted there are
two brackets with a rubber mid section. They bolt to the front of the Caddy
engine block and the bracket that Dale designed. They are labeled Left Side
and Right Side. I assumed they are Caddy Eldorado engine mounts. If they are
Olds 455 mounts I don't need anything as I will use the ones out of The Blue
Streak, I guess!
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
|
FYI. Look at these pics to see what you need. Last pic is of the Cadco mount.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=3749&cat=3375
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=3750&cat=3375
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=9504&cat=3375
Here is where to send your mount for vulcanizing.
http://166.82.96.9/homeframes.html
Steele Rubber Products™
6180 Hwy 150 East,
Denver NC, 28037 USA
704-483-9343 - 800-544-8665
HTH
Larry 
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70858 is a reply to message #70855] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 08:10 |
Steven Ferguson
Messages: 3447
Registered: May 2006
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Yup. Beat me with my own stick :>)
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 7:04 AM, Larry <weidnerl@wwt.net> wrote:
>
>
> Steven Ferguson wrote on Fri, 15 January 2010 07:01
>> Here's what you need:
>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=19842&cat=4695
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 12:52 AM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au> wrote:
>> Ken,
>>
>> I have a Caddy 500 engine block with no mounts at all so I don't know what I
>> need.
>> .--
>> Steve Ferguson
>> '76 EII
>> Sierra Vista, AZ
>> Urethane bushing source
>> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
> Hey Steve,
> I think this one of yours is an even better pic...
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=19841&cat=4695
>
>
> --
> Larry :)
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Steve Ferguson
'76 EII
Sierra Vista, AZ
Urethane bushing source
www.bdub.net/ferguson/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70863 is a reply to message #70858] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 08:50 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I think we use the 1971 mounts as it is simple and clean like Steve's.
On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:10 AM, Steven Ferguson <botiemad11@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yup. Â Beat me with my own stick :>)
>
> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 7:04 AM, Larry <weidnerl@wwt.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Steven Ferguson wrote on Fri, 15 January 2010 07:01
>>> Here's what you need:
>>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=19842&cat=4695
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 12:52 AM, Rob Mueller <robmueller@iinet.net.au> wrote:
>>> Â Ken,
>>>
>>> I have a Caddy 500 engine block with no mounts at all so I don't know what I
>>> Â need.
>>> .--
>>> Steve Ferguson
>>> '76 EII
>>> Sierra Vista, AZ
>>> Urethane bushing source
>>> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>> Hey Steve,
>> I think this one of yours is an even better pic...
>> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=19841&cat=4695
>>
>>
>> --
>> Larry  :)
>> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
>> Menomonie, WI.
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> List Information and Subscription Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Steve Ferguson
> '76 EII
> Sierra Vista, AZ
> Urethane bushing source
> www.bdub.net/ferguson/
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> List Information and Subscription Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Fremont,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
_______________________________________________
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70927 is a reply to message #70714] |
Fri, 15 January 2010 22:52 |
Bob de Kruyff
Messages: 4260
Registered: January 2004
Location: Chandler, AZ
Karma: 1
|
Senior Member |
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This is probably the wrong place to interject into this thread, but why would you want to replace a 455 or even a 403 with a Cad 500? I got wrapped up in the cadillac presidential limo construction while still with engineering staff and this became an issue that I'm still familiar with-in fact it was still a consideration for several recent versions.
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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| Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken [message #70972 is a reply to message #70927] |
Sat, 16 January 2010 14:41 |
|
USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
|
Senior Member |
|
|
Bob,
I am building mine to convert to LPG and just figger'd BIGGER is BETTER! ;-)
Regards,
Rob Mueller
Sydney, Australia
AUS '75 Avion-The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion-Double Trouble TZE365V100426
-----Original Message-----
From: gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org
[mailto:gmclist-bounces@temp.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Bob de Kruyff
Sent: Saturday, 16 January 2010 3:53 PM
To: gmclist@temp.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Fwd: Cadillac 500 Tips for Ken
This is probably the wrong place to interject into this thread, but why
would you want to replace a 455 or even a 403 with a Cad 500? I got
wrapped up in the cadillac presidential limo construction while still with
engineering staff and this became an issue that I'm still familiar with-in
fact it was still a consideration for several recent versions.
--
Bob de Kruyff
78 Eleganza
Chandler, AZ
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Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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