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| Low Oil Pressure [message #353543] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 12:44  |
Dreamweaver
Messages: 16
Registered: November 2018
Location: Tampa, FL
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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1975 Palm Beach 70K miles
I wasn't there when they started it after sitting a long time. I don't know what preparations they went through, if any. When I bought it the factory oil gauge read about 1/4. Having a '99 Tahoe that has always read low but has 250K miles, I didn't put much stock in the gauge. I should have. All I know is what I can garner from sparse old records. I think it could have sat for up to 20 years.
I drove it home from Chattanooga to Tampa. It has 70K miles which seems to be confirmed by wear on other parts which I won't go into. I think it had about 69K miles on it when it was first started. It was driven from South Carolina to Atlanta to Chattanooga and the engine held together. I drove it to Tampa and have put about 1,400 since picking it up so it has an estimated 2,000 - 2,500 miles since having been stored. These are my estimates, the best I can do. The gentleman that owned it passed away. I cannot get any further info other than what I guessed at here.
It starts and runs great. Good compression, 170# all around. Then during a visit to Alex Sirum for new batteries, etc. Jeff said I had low oil pressure, which brings me to this forum. I installed a new manual gauge. The Auto Meter gauge reads 43# on start up then when hot reads about 17#, then about 5# at idle. Based on what Larry wrote (below), the diagnosis is quite likely dry bearings when started causing scarring and dropping the oil pressure.
The following is a good write-up I found in the forum:
- Starting an engine that has been sitting for an extended period. [message #336250] Tue, 21 August 2018 17:18 Go to next message
Larry is currently offline Larry United States
Messages: 2385
Registered: January 2004
Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 15
Senior Member
The following is just my humble opinion. I offer this FYI. Your milage may vary.
Over the last 15 yrs I have seen a number of people get into GMCing buying a GMC that has been sitting for a number of years. In several of those cases, they were able to get the GMC started, put it in gear and drove it home. Sometimes they didn't make it when the engine went bad. Sometimes they made it home, but within a short number of miles the engine went bad. I have a theory about engines that go bad after sitting for an extended period of time.
Gravity is an idle engine's worst enemy. Over long periods of idle time, gravity will pull oil off of everything that needs lubricant, into the pan leaving bearing surfaces, cam lobes and cylinder walls dry. So, when a person pulls the air cleaner off and squirts a little gas or starter fluid down the carb, and the engine starts right away, it may run for...who knows how long before oil can get to those surfaces. No oil and there is immediate metal to metal contact and excessive wear that takes place during the first few minutes of operation. Then it is only a matter of a short time before you have cylinder wall scoring, cam lobe and lifter scoring and rod and main bearing scoring. The rod and main bearing being the most critical, because that can leave you on the side of the road within a couple of hundred miles.
May I suggest the following to reduce or eliminate the inevitable.
If the engine has not been running for extended periods, do the following.
Do not start or try to start or even turn the engine over without first doing this procedure.
Drain and replace oil in the oil pan and oil cooler.
Replace the oil filter, filling the oil filler with oil before spinning it on.
Refill with 5w30 or 5w40 of your choice. (the 5 weight will flow to bearing surfaces quicker)
Pull all spark plugs out and put a couple of squirts of the same oil into each cylinder.
Leave the plugs out for now.
Turn engine over by hand to line up timing marks with #1 cylinder at TDC compression.
Pull the distributor out making note of where the rotor is pointing with engine at TDC compression.
Pull both valve covers off.
Using a extender/adaptor where the distributor was, drive the oil pump with an electric drill until you can see oil coming out of the rocker arms....ALL OF THEM.
Now you have fresh oil to all bearing surfaces.
Using a squirt can, oil down the valve train on the heads and put the valve covers back on.
Turn the engine over with the starter, with the plugs out, only long enough, until you can see oil pressure at the gauge. As soon as the gauge needle starts to move, stop turning over.
Now you have oil on the cylinder walls. All that is left is oil to the cam lobes. To get oil to the cam, you must start the engine.
Turn engine over by hand and line up timing marks with #1 at TDC compression.
Drop the distributor in with rotor pointed as noted earlier.
Put plugs back in.
Put the cap back on and put plug wires to proper cylinder (1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2 accept for the Cadillac engine. Which is 1,5,6,3,4,2,7, 8.)
Prepare to start the engine.
Confirm that there is gas in the carb, and that there is spark, and you are at TDC compression.
Squirt a little fuel down the carb primaries, put the air cleaner back on incase of a backfire.
Turn the engine over to start and bring to 2000 RPM immediately.
Run at 2000 RPM for a minimum of 1 minute to lube the cam and lifters. At 2k RPM, the rods will be throwing lots of oil on the cylinders and camshaft.
There will be lots of smoke out the tail pipe from the oil you squirted into the cylinders earlier.
Set the timing to factory specs.
Now you can check all other things, like brakes, antifreeze, transmission fluid...etc...etc. and other essentials before you drive it home.
This procedure should significantly reduce the amount of start-up wear on long sitting engines, leading to normal engine life, taking you many trouble free miles. JMHO
Larry Smile
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
First, a tip of the hat to Larry!
Before I jump into the arduous task of dropping the engine out the bottom in my driveway, onto a dolly, into the garage and up to the engine stand via chain hoist, I'm searching for any clues to avoid an overhaul. I was given these two suggestions which I will work on before removal.
"Take the block off of the filter adapter (round part the hoses go to) and reinstall the filter. That eliminates the cooler completely"
and:
"Do check the small spring loaded relief valve in the oil filter mounting adapter (three bolts to block) , it is designed to allow the oil to flow if the filter is plugged"
If anyone can offer anything else, I would be grateful
Thanks
John Kent
Tampa, FL
1975 Palm Beach
[Updated on: Tue, 07 April 2020 12:47] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Low Oil Pressure [message #353551 is a reply to message #353543] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 15:21  |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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John,
Welcome to the group, family, cult, asylum.....
Now, to your issue.
The 43# is probably the limit of the pump bypass as cold.
If the 17# as road speed is real, that is kind of low.
But the 5# for a hot idle is no issue at all.
If the owner's cold start had damaged bearing, getting the 1400 miles that you have gone would have been problematic (at best).
My suggestions are:
Drain the oil and sample same as stated prior.
Remove the cooler adapter and be ready for a mess when the cooler drains.
Install a new oil filter and refill with 6 quarts of something with w (winter) of 10 (i.e. 10W30).
So, lets look at the numbers and listen carefully.
Take it out on the road if you can and get it warm. Be cautious as you are running without the auxiliary lube oil cooler. That won't matter unless you seriously cook the lube oil and you will be changing it again soon anyway.
When it is now at a hot idle listen carefully (yes, again). If there is insufficient oil delivery, you will hear the lash adjusters clatter and maybe a bearing knock. If that is the case shut it down.
Now, Tell us where the oil pressures ended up. When you get us some numbers, we can be more confident of the answers.
There is really too much value placed on measured lube oil pressure. Lots of engines were/are splash lube. All the need is to get the lube oil where it needs to be.
When you get results from Blackstone, if you have real trouble, they will tell you.
If you do have to pull the engine and transmission (they best come out as a pair), have a very heavy duty engine stand. I had just a little 4 wheeled guy that I have used for years and it was not up to the task.
What does this guy (Matt) know? He knows engines. A ship's engineer by trade that came ashore to work in the Detroit engine testing labs for a couple of decades. I'm even so old that I ran so big block Olds in test labs.
Again, welcome to the family. I am glad you found your way here because we have a lot of knowledge to share. Everybody here wants you to get to enjoy both your coach and what it can do for you. It is much more that a big new toy, it connects you to this community. This is a very helping and supportive community like very few others. There are others here with way many miles and decades of GMC time. As this community reminds me so of the watermen that are my world, I like to welcome new owners here much as you might be welcomed there. So,
May the Good Lord bless this coach and all those that set forth within her.
Welcome John
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: Low Oil Pressure [message #353553 is a reply to message #353543] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 15:56 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Matt's advice is spot on. Notice he mentioned 10W-30. Notice he did NOT mention SEAFOAM and LUCAS. Give it a shot with actual oil and not snake oil additives. Recent data shows adding things to your oil degrades the oil's as engineered performance.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353564 is a reply to message #353547] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 19:04 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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Another mystery message! I've no idea what y'all are answering. :-(
Ken H.
On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 2:27 PM Larry via Gmclist
wrote:
> If the oil pressure readings are accurate, IMO the next thing you might do
> is a oil change. Go to Blackstone Labs web site and ask for a couple of
> their sample Test Kits. When you receive them, do that oil change and
> half way through the drain, take a sample and send it to them. They will
> advise you as to what the sample revealed. The sample Test Kits are free,
> and analysis is $30.00.
>
>
> https://www.blackstone-labs.com/?session-id=k5odv555d2kvyg45pwgv0vae&timeout=20&bslauth&urlbase=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.blackstone-labs.net%2FBs tone%2F%28S%28k5odv555d2kvyg45pwgv0vae%29%29%2F
>
> Just more data to help you with your decision. Just what I'd do.
> --
> Larry
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353567 is a reply to message #353564] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 21:48 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Hi Ken,
Here is the info on this user:
jkent01's Profile
Date Registered: Wed, November 21, 2018
Message Count: 2 Messages (0 average messages per day)
Show all messages by jkent01
Real Name:
Status: Junior Member
Last Message: Tue, 07 April 2020 15:08
Re: Low Oil Pressure
Last Visited: Tue, 07 April 2020 19:59
You need to forward this to one of the people doing the admin work on the email server. Ask then to fix it for this user and come up with a solution for the future. Patrick? Billy?
HTH
Ken B.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353568 is a reply to message #353567] |
Tue, 07 April 2020 22:05 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Ken Burton wrote on Tue, 07 April 2020 21:48Hi Ken,
Here is the info on this user:
jkent01's Profile
Date Registered: Wed, November 21, 2018
Message Count: 2 Messages (0 average messages per day)
Show all messages by jkent01
Real Name:
Status: Junior Member
Last Message: Tue, 07 April 2020 15:08
Re: Low Oil Pressure
Last Visited: Tue, 07 April 2020 19:59
You need to forward this to one of the people doing the admin work on the email server. Ask then to fix it for this user and come up with a solution for the future. Patrick? Billy?
HTH
Ken B.
It looks like Billy fixed this user. Thanks Billy.
What process do we do use in the future when these are found? The problem on this one started in 2018 through no fault of the new user. I am sure there are more. Should we just alert Billy and have him manually fix them as they are found?
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Low Oil Pressure [message #353735 is a reply to message #353733] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 13:14 |
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Richard RV
Messages: 631
Registered: July 2012
Location: Full-timer for 12 years, ...
Karma: -17
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Senior Member |
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Sorry to hear about your surgery and pain, John. Sending some positive vibes your way.
Richard
'77 Birchaven TZE...777;
'76 Palm Beach under construction;
‘76 Edgemont waiting its turn
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353736 is a reply to message #353568] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 14:11 |
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Works for me, Ken.
On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 10:06 PM Ken Burton via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> Ken Burton wrote on Tue, 07 April 2020 21:48
>
> It looks like Billy fixed this user. Thanks Billy.
>
> What process do we do use in the future when these are found? The problem
> on this one started in 2018 through no fault of the new user. I am sure
> there are more. Should we just alert Billy and have him manually fix them
> as they are found?
>
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bdub
bdub.net
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353740 is a reply to message #353736] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 17:07 |
Dreamweaver
Messages: 16
Registered: November 2018
Location: Tampa, FL
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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I need to try to BRIEFLY explain how we got where we are and what has been done. I'll cut and past part of my original post for context.
"1975 Palm Beach 70K miles
I wasn't there when they started it after sitting a long time. I don't know what preparations they went through, if any. When I bought it the factory oil gauge read about 1/4. It has 70K miles. It had about 69K miles on it when it was first started. It was then driven from South Carolina to Atlanta to Chattanooga. I then drove it to Tampa. It has had an estimated 2,100 miles put on it since having been stored.
It starts, runs, and drives great. Good compression, 170# all around. Then during a visit to Alex Sirum for new batteries, etc. Jeff said I had low oil pressure, which brings me to this forum. I installed a new manual gauge. The Auto Meter gauge reads 43# on start up then when hot reads about 17#, then about 5# at idle."
We, my wife and I, got it up on blocks and were in the process of removing parts from the engine prepping it to be pulled. Then I noticed the engine oil cooler which I did not know the GMCs had. It was suggested that I disconnect and bypass the engine oil cooler while testing the oil pressure which I did. Also I was to check for the oil pressure port in the oil filter adapter. I cleaned it. It doesn't stick and has some tension in the spring when depressing it with a pencil eraser.
We have put many of the parts back and are nearly ready to start it, let it warm up and re-check the oil pressure hoping we can get more than 17# at a fast idle. It cannot be driven at this time. Still on blocks and PS pump an AC compressor not installed and connected. I will post the results later this evening.
HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE!
John and Sharon
[Updated on: Sun, 12 April 2020 17:09] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353744 is a reply to message #353740] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 18:26 |
lcoldren
Messages: 28
Registered: March 2004
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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John
What weight and type oil are you using?
Larry Coldren
Ft Collins CO
1974 Canyon Lands
________________________________
From: Gmclist on behalf of jkenttampa--- via Gmclist
Sent: Sunday, April 12, 2020 04:07 PM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Cc: jkenttampa@outlook.com
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure
I need to try to BRIEFLY explain how we got where we are and what has been done. I'll cut and past part of my original post for context.
"1975 Palm Beach 70K miles
I wasn't there when they started it after sitting a long time. I don't know what preparations they went through, if any. When I bought it the factory
oil gauge read about 1/4. It has 70K miles. It had about 69K miles on it when it was first started. It was then driven from South Carolina to Atlanta
to Chattanooga. I then drove it to Tampa. It has had an estimated 2,100 miles put on it since having been stored.
It starts, runs, and drives great. Good compression, 170# all around. Then during a visit to Alex Sirum for new batteries, etc. Jeff said I had low
oil pressure, which brings me to this forum. I installed a new manual gauge. The Auto Meter gauge reads 43# on start up then when hot reads about 17#,
then about 5# at idle."
We, my wife and I, got it up on blocks and were in the process of removing parts from the engine prepping it to be pulled. Then I noticed the engine
oil cooler which I did not know the GMCs had. It was suggested that I disconnect and bypass the engine oil cooler while testing the oil pressure which
I did. Also I was to check for the oil pressure port in the oil filter adapter. I cleaned it. It doesn't stick and has some tension in the spring when
depressing it with a pencil eraser.
We have put much of the parts back and are nearly ready to start it, let it warm up and re-check the oil pressure hoping we can get more than 17# at a
fast idle. It cannot be driven at this time. Still on blocks and PS pump an AC compressor not installed and connected. I will post the results later
this evening.
HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE!
John and Sharon
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353745 is a reply to message #353740] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 18:54 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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John,
As I said before, Welcome to the group, family, cult, asylum....
I am very glad that you found your way here because the brain trust of experience with these coaches is all here.
The importance right now is that as an owner you are part of an amazing community of helping and supportive people the likes of which you have never known. The support that these people can provide is completely awesome in the true sense of the word. So, if you have questions or need assistance, ask because this groups limits of timing and geography are not that restrictive. The only way to annoy these people is to ignore good advice.
To this end, please fill in a sigfile. As you seem to be working the forum, go to <Control Panel/Account Settings> and then scroll to and select <Preferences>. There will be a box labeled "Signature". Fill in your name, a short about the coach including major mods and then a geographic reference. This servers several purposes. We like to know who we are helping and it is even better when we actually meet. The coach we need to know because of the 13,000 coaches manufactured over 6 production years and upfit by several different companies, there can be important variations. Lastly the geography will tell us what you are dealing with for climate and if someone is in striking range to assist, he will know that. This sort of thing is not uncommon.
Does Sharon know that this is largely a couples community? If she doesn't she should ask when she meets other. My wife likes to drive in the daylight (only because here night vision is not what it was). There is often a lady's driving instruction at the internationals. Most of the instructors are also ladies that drive their coaches. And we even have a few single ladies that show up from time to time.
You also should hook up with Sunshine Statesmen and/or Dixielands at your first opportunity. That is even if you take a 4-wheeler to the rally location just to meet people.
It sounds to me like you have a good plan. But again, do not let the low oil pressure throw you off course here. If you went over 2000 miles with that oil pressure, it may be just fine with it there.
So again
Welcome John and Sharon
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353748 is a reply to message #353745] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 22:45 |
Dreamweaver
Messages: 16
Registered: November 2018
Location: Tampa, FL
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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Hi Matt
I'm sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. Blackstone is quite probably in my future. I was mistaken, thinking they take 30 days minimum to get results. I called them and they said that is not true. I told them I saw something to that effect in their Q&A. I hope they check into it. They said they could have test results to me online in two or three days. That would be fine. I'm not in a big rush, I just didn't want to tie it up for 30 days up on blocks in my driveway.
I specifically wanted to get back to you regarding a sample for Blackstone. Sirum changed the oil and I put 280 miles on it It is VR1 and a qt of Lucas. I carefully drained it and saved it before I put some cheaper oil in to try the Seafoam test, which was a waste of time, but I was desperate. I could pull a sample from the VR1 I saved and send it to Blackstone. You had urged me to start fresh with new oil and filter and Blackstone wants at least 500 miles, preferably 1,000. I would think putting the VR1 back in and a new filter and continue to drive it for another 700 miles, then take a sample and send it to Blackstone would work. But I can tell that you are of a scientific mind (not joking) and you would prefer me to start fresh for a sample for Blackstone. In a way I can't blame you, we are kind of like minded, but I was careful in saving the oil, not contaminating it, thoroughly cleaning the bottom of the engine oil pan and the drain plug, continuing to clean the plug as I unscrewed it until the oil came out. First time in my almost 70 years on this earth that I ever saved the oil I drained. I had super cleaned my drain pan and had it under the 5 qt jug but I got lucky and hit the neck of the jug and didn't spill a drop. So I feel safe in putting the VR1 with 280 miles back in, install a new filter and continue on. I hope that is not an insult to your experience, especially when you are trying to help me.
This brings me to my questions regarding bypassing the oil cooler and also testing the oil bypass valve. I can see how, if the spring in the bypass valve had gotten a little weak, (perhaps from being stored ?) it would allow all that oil pressure the pump generated to be routed back into the pan and never make it to the oil gauge, leaving me with a low oil pressure reading. How do I test the oil bypass valve? Maybe just buy a new one?
When I spotted the engine oil cooler, it made me wonder, again especially because it had been stored. I can see how some portion of the oil cooling system could be partially plugged, restricting oil pressure. I have it unhooked and it will be bypassed when I start it up tomorrow. This is the first time I have ever had a vehicle with an oil cooler. Probably a dumb question but do I need an oil cooler? To be clear, if by process of elimination, I find that the oil cooler makes no difference in oil pressure, I will reinstall it.
If I don't get any increase in oil pressure, my next step will be sending a sample to Blackstone after logging more miles on the oil. I will keep you posted. I will also update my sigfile (as soon as I get a moment) and tell Sharon about the interests for women in the clubs, etc.
Finally, you sure have given us hope that we are not as likely to need an overhaul as we thought. For that I am grateful. An overhaul just didn't make any sense to me. Then Larry posted the article about starting a stored engine the wrong way and I thought I'd found an explanation for my low oil pressure. But then you came to the rescue and said if we've put 2,100 miles on it without any internal engine issues, it is unlikely that we have damaged bearings. This engine starts and runs great. It drives great and has plenty of power. There are no odd noises coming from the engine. At the risk of sounding like I'm boasting, though I'm not an expert, I am pretty tuned in to being aware of what I am driving and how it is operating. Blackstone is definitely in our future. It's just a matter of when, now, in 700 miles or somewhere in between?
Best
John
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353750 is a reply to message #353748] |
Sun, 12 April 2020 23:49 |
jimk
Messages: 6734
Registered: July 2006
Location: Belmont, CA
Karma: 9
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Senior Member |
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I learned as a youngster in Junior High that when you add an additive to
thicken the oil, it should be done with a warm engine and pour in the
additive slowly as the engine runs at a rapid idle.
This way the thick additive will blend and not lump at the bottom of the
pan.
On Sun, Apr 12, 2020 at 8:46 PM jkenttampa--- via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> wrote:
> Hi Matt
>
> I'm sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. Blackstone is quite probably in
> my future. I was mistaken, thinking they take 30 days minimum to get
> results. I called them and they said that is not true. I told them I saw
> something to that effect in their Q&A. I hope they check into it. They said
> they could have test results to me online in two or three days. That would
> be fine. I'm not in a big rush, I just didn't want to tie it up for 30 days
> up on blocks in my driveway.
>
> I specifically wanted to get back to you regarding a sample for
> Blackstone. Sirum changed the oil and I put 280 miles on it It is VR1 and a
> qt of
> Lucas. I carefully drained it and saved it before I put some cheaper oil
> in to try the Seafoam test, which was a waste of time, but I was desperate.
> I could pull a sample from the VR1 I saved and send it to Blackstone. You
> had urged me to start fresh with new oil and filter and Blackstone wants at
> least 500 miles, preferably 1,000. I would think putting the VR1 back in
> and a new filter and continue to drive it for another 700 miles, then take a
> sample and send it to Blackstone would work. But I can tell that you are
> of a scientific mind (not joking) and you would prefer me to start fresh for
> a sample for Blackstone. In a way I can't blame you, we are kind of like
> minded, but I was careful in saving the oil, not contaminating it,
> thoroughly
> cleaning the bottom of the engine oil pan and the drain plug, continuing
> to clean the plug as I unscrewed it until the oil came out. First time in my
> almost 70 years on this earth that I ever saved the oil I drained. I had
> super cleaned my drain pan and had it under the 5 qt jug but I got lucky and
> hit the neck of the jug and didn't spill a drop. So I feel safe in putting
> the VR1 with 280 miles back in, install a new filter and continue on. I
> hope that is not an insult to your experience, especially when you are
> trying to help me.
>
> This brings me to my questions regarding bypassing the oil cooler and also
> testing the oil bypass valve. I can see how, if the spring in the bypass
> valve had gotten a little weak, (perhaps from being stored ?) it would
> allow all that oil pressure the pump generated to be routed back into the
> pan
> and never make it to the oil gauge, leaving me with a low oil pressure
> reading. How do I test the oil bypass valve? Maybe just buy a new one?
>
> When I spotted the engine oil cooler, it made me wonder, again especially
> because it had been stored. I can see how some portion of the oil cooling
> system could be partially plugged, restricting oil pressure. I have it
> unhooked and it will be bypassed when I start it up tomorrow. This is the
> first time I have ever had a vehicle with an oil cooler. Probably a dumb
> question but do I need an oil cooler? To be clear, if by process of
> elimination, I find that the oil cooler makes no difference in oil
> pressure, I will reinstall it.
>
> If I don't get any increase in oil pressure, my next step will be sending
> a sample to Blackstone after logging more miles on the oil. I will keep you
> posted. I will also update my sigfile (as soon as I get a moment) and tell
> Sharon about the interests for women in the clubs, etc.
>
> Finally, you sure have given us hope that we are not as likely to need an
> overhaul as we thought. For that I am grateful. An overhaul just didn't make
> any sense to me. Then Larry posted the article about starting a stored
> engine the wrong way and I thought I'd found an explanation for my low oil
> pressure. But then you came to the rescue and said if we've put 2,100
> miles on it without any internal engine issues, it is unlikely that we have
> damaged bearings. This engine starts and runs great. It drives great and
> has plenty of power. There are no odd noises coming from the engine. At the
> risk of sounding like I'm boasting, though I'm not an expert, I am pretty
> tuned in to being aware of what I am driving and how it is operating.
> Blackstone is definitely in our future. It's just a matter of when, now,
> in 700 miles or somewhere in between?
>
> Best
> John
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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>
--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
http://www.gmcrvparts.com
1-800-752-7502
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Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC
jimk@appliedairfilters.com
www.appliedgmc.com
1-800-752-7502
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| Re: [GMCnet] Low Oil Pressure [message #353776 is a reply to message #353748] |
Mon, 13 April 2020 15:25 |
|
Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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John,
Sorry about the delay responding, but you seem to have enough to do so I hope it didn't matter.
Before you chuck that oil filter, call around to the local speed shops and see if anybody has a filter cutter. This is a very common tool. Opening a used oil filter is a great window to an engine's condition. When you get the filter out of the can, use a sharp knife to cut the paper from the end plates and spread the element out on either something easily cleaned or disposable. Now, shine a light on the paper and run a magnet over it.
Simple guide but not inclusive:
The bright and shiny flakes are probably bearing material. There will be some, there always is.
The magnetic material can be a problem if there is much of it. Again, there will be some, but the magnet should not look fuzzy.
The oil cooler adjunct to the coach engine is not essential to most operation. The 455 is pretty good at cooling oil as it is and there are two considerations here.
First is that most modern engines have some lube oil cooling capability built in. If you look at the pictures of an open engine, you will see the that the lube oil returns from the valve gear are at lead across the top of the cylinder head casting and then down the cylinder liner cooling jacket. This provides adequate cooling in a passcar application. This and pan dwell time are typically adequate for lube oil cooling.
Second is that you will most likely not run hard or long this way. It would be my guess from the way my engine behaves, that the oil cooler in the radiator severs more to keep the lube oil warm than it does to cool it during most of the engines operation.
I also suggested that you do a six quart fill. The knowledgeable folks reading this are scratching their heads. (What is he doing to John?) Well most of us know that the real fill level for a 455 in coach service is a quart low on the stick (a five quart fill), but because we have some concern here, the extra oil will stay in the pan and add to cooling and it will also be thrown up under the piston crowns and that is not a problem right now.
That extra quart will probably be gone if you drive 500 or more miles. This is why many of us use a five quart fill.
The spring you were pushing on in the filter adapter is the filter by-pass. The actual system pressure regulation is in the lubricating oil pump itself.
Too bad you didn't save that first oil drain. Actually, you could put the VR1/Lucas mix back in if it is convenient.
Summary: She isn't making bad noises. If you didn't see sparklies in the drained oil (If drain pan is plastic, you could drag a magnet around in it). There is no reason at this time to assume that the engine is a lost cause. OK, the lube oil pressure is a little low. That is interesting but hardly fatal.
Oh, when you go to drive her with the LO cooler disconnected, take the adapter off the ends of the steel lines, tie them where they won't get somewhere they shouldn't be and cover the ends to keep them clean.
Be sure to come back and let us know how it is going.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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Fortunately there are no deed restrictions nor county codes being broken. I'm afraid I could not wait around for Blackstone's results although I get a kick out of their FAQ headings! 
