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| [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339814] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 15:14  |
amansfield1104
Messages: 80
Registered: August 2009
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I guess I’m planning to replace the wheels, add fuel injection and either get the generator to be usable or replace it.
Tires are getting old so either put another set of out round firestone or change wheels. I had one rim fail and not sure how long before I have another rim crack and leak.
Vapor lock issue has to be fixed and I assume fuel injection will fix that.
Generator works great at home always quits when driving. I’m planing several trips that will require the generator to work or I might have to put my wife up in motel and sleep in the RV. I also have never got the dash AC to work good enough to cool the RV even a little and it has not worked in the last 4 years. Tired of driving unlit it get warm and have to find a place to stop and leave before sun rise to beat the heat.
Art
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339815 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 15:36  |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Art, you do not identify what area of the country you live in. That might
be helpful on the solutions for the A.C.
A good functioning dash unit in a 77 -78 coach should work well in
most areas under 90° temp. and 70% humidity. A hanging drape that separates
the cockpit from the rest of the coach is very, very helpful.
I assume that you are driving with full fuel tanks. If you are not,
you should try that and see if your generator continues to run. If it does,
that is your cure for both vapor lock and non-running generator problems.
Above 90° farenheit, vapor lock will likely rear it's ugly head in
most carburetor equipped motor homes with original fuel systems. Cures vary
with owners. Everything from in-tank fuel pumps, to fuel injection systems
are in use. Some successfully.
An overheated wife is not a good thing. Try to avoid that at all costs.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Sat, Dec 29, 2018, 1:14 PM amansfield1104@charter.net <
amansfield1104@charter.net wrote:
> I guess I’m planning to replace the wheels, add fuel injection and either
> get the generator to be usable or replace it.
>
> Tires are getting old so either put another set of out round firestone or
> change wheels. I had one rim fail and not sure how long before I have
> another rim crack and leak.
>
> Vapor lock issue has to be fixed and I assume fuel injection will fix that.
>
> Generator works great at home always quits when driving. I’m planing
> several trips that will require the generator to work or I might have to
> put my wife up in motel and sleep in the RV. I also have never got the
> dash AC to work good enough to cool the RV even a little and it has not
> worked in the last 4 years. Tired of driving unlit it get warm and have to
> find a place to stop and leave before sun rise to beat the heat.
>
> Art
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339816 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 15:35 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Art,
It's financially painful, but if, as it sounds, you're running radial tires
on non-radial rims, it's definitely time for wheel replacement, preferably
with 16" Alcoas, or Americans from Jim K. at Applied GMC.
EFI is definitely the best solution for vapor lock, but you might be able
to correct it sufficiently by installing an individual electric pump for
each tank back near the tanks, replacing all of the old rubber with new
rubber+steel lines, and, eliminating the selector valve. If that doesn't
correct the vapor lock, it will be a good addition for the EFI anyway.
As for the Onan which runs good except when driving, I'm curious about the
up-fitter of your GMC: I have to suspect that to be other than GMC. Most
of those use a tee in the fuel line to the engine so that a single 3/8"
hose is expected to feed both the engine and the Onan, a pretty tall
order. GMC provided a dedicated fuel fitting on the rear fuel tank, and
used it to feed the Onans when they installed them. You should check
whether your Onan has that dedicated fuel line.
As for the dash A/C, it's never likely to be GREAT, but it can definitely
be useful, regardless of the year of your coach, which you didn't tell us.
If you haven't done so, download from the oldGMCWS.org, the pamphlet
"Separating Hot from Cold", by Zay Brand. It's an excellent dissertation
on upgrading the three different GMC air conditioning systems.
Keep us posted on your progress, and include your coach model and your
location so we can be more helpful.
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, Troy-Bilt APU, etc., etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 4:14 PM amansfield1104@charter.net <
amansfield1104@charter.net> wrote:
> I guess I’m planning to replace the wheels, add fuel injection and either
> get the generator to be usable or replace it.
>
> Tires are getting old so either put another set of out round firestone or
> change wheels. I had one rim fail and not sure how long before I have
> another rim crack and leak.
>
> Vapor lock issue has to be fixed and I assume fuel injection will fix that.
>
> Generator works great at home always quits when driving. I’m planing
> several trips that will require the generator to work or I might have to
> put my wife up in motel and sleep in the RV. I also have never got the
> dash AC to work good enough to cool the RV even a little and it has not
> worked in the last 4 years. Tired of driving unlit it get warm and have to
> find a place to stop and leave before sun rise to beat the heat.
>
> Art
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339817 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 18:05 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Art,
You used to have a sigfile that said:
76 Eleganza II
Decatur, AL
Now that we know that . . .
The Cab A/C will work, and as said, a curtain helps a lot. Two things I will recommend based on personal experience with a 73 is that there can be two issues that will make it about useless. First is that the heater valve has failed open. This is typical. That valve is a vacuum to close, so be sure to check that when looking for a replacement or testing what you have.
The second is a little tougher and a severe PITA. The operating doors used to be foam covered. If nobody has done anything, that foam is gone. That foam both insulates things and makes the doors seal. If you undo the dozen screws in the HVAC box, you will know right away.
As for the generator, if it runs standing still but not underway, I really don't have an answer. But, if you have not replaced all the rubber parts of the fuel line going to it, then I strongly suggest that you do this before getting involved in anything else. Those old Onans can be as reliable as a DC3 if you give them the attention they both need and deserve. The only mod there that is cost (and very much so) is the Pertronix on the flywheel trick.
Let us know.
Are you planning to be at Tallahassee??
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339819 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 20:19 |
JerryW
Messages: 256
Registered: August 2018
Karma: 1
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Senior Member |
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Thanks, Jim. I was about to post something similar.
I have had different fuel injections on my GMC since 1993.
It did not solve vapor lock problems until I put in the in-tank fuel pumps.
Even now, with the ethanol laced gasoline there could be temperature and altitude conditions that could cause vapor lock. Fortunately I haven’t encountered it yet.
But there isn’t much more I could do prevent it
Emery Stora
77 Kingsley
Frederick , CO
> On Dec 29, 2018, at 3:10 PM, Jim Kanomata wrote:
>
> Fuel injection WILL NOT solve the vapor lock issue.
> It is a big ignorant belief.
> It can reduce the problems, but not a cure.
> If one understands some of the basics, then you'll know that it happens
> befor the fuel delivery at the carb or at the EFI.
> Running std. steel rims with radial tires a risky way to save money. There
> are lot of oil Radial rims out there people want to gey rid of.
>
>
> On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 1:36 PM Ken Henderson
> wrote:
>
>> Art,
>>
>> It's financially painful, but if, as it sounds, you're running radial tires
>> on non-radial rims, it's definitely time for wheel replacement, preferably
>> with 16" Alcoas, or Americans from Jim K. at Applied GMC.
>>
>> EFI is definitely the best solution for vapor lock, but you might be able
>> to correct it sufficiently by installing an individual electric pump for
>> each tank back near the tanks, replacing all of the old rubber with new
>> rubber+steel lines, and, eliminating the selector valve. If that doesn't
>> correct the vapor lock, it will be a good addition for the EFI anyway.
>>
>> As for the Onan which runs good except when driving, I'm curious about the
>> up-fitter of your GMC: I have to suspect that to be other than GMC. Most
>> of those use a tee in the fuel line to the engine so that a single 3/8"
>> hose is expected to feed both the engine and the Onan, a pretty tall
>> order. GMC provided a dedicated fuel fitting on the rear fuel tank, and
>> used it to feed the Onans when they installed them. You should check
>> whether your Onan has that dedicated fuel line.
>>
>> As for the dash A/C, it's never likely to be GREAT, but it can definitely
>> be useful, regardless of the year of your coach, which you didn't tell us.
>> If you haven't done so, download from the oldGMCWS.org, the pamphlet
>> "Separating Hot from Cold", by Zay Brand. It's an excellent dissertation
>> on upgrading the three different GMC air conditioning systems.
>>
>> Keep us posted on your progress, and include your coach model and your
>> location so we can be more helpful.
>>
>> Ken H.
>> Americus, GA
>> '76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
>> Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, Troy-Bilt APU, etc., etc., etc.
>> www.gmcwipersetc.com
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 29, 2018 at 4:14 PM amansfield1104@charter.net > amansfield1104@charter.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I guess I’m planning to replace the wheels, add fuel injection and either
>>> get the generator to be usable or replace it.
>>>
>>> Tires are getting old so either put another set of out round firestone or
>>> change wheels. I had one rim fail and not sure how long before I have
>>> another rim crack and leak.
>>>
>>> Vapor lock issue has to be fixed and I assume fuel injection will fix
>> that.
>>>
>>> Generator works great at home always quits when driving. I’m planing
>>> several trips that will require the generator to work or I might have to
>>> put my wife up in motel and sleep in the RV. I also have never got the
>>> dash AC to work good enough to cool the RV even a little and it has not
>>> worked in the last 4 years. Tired of driving unlit it get warm and have
>> to
>>> find a place to stop and leave before sun rise to beat the heat.
>>>
>>> Art
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>>
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
> jimk@appliedairfilters.com
> http://www.appliedgmc.com
> 1-800-752-7502
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339820 is a reply to message #339819] |
Sat, 29 December 2018 21:41 |
Carl S.
Messages: 4186
Registered: January 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ.
Karma: 13
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Senior Member |
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I've done everything BUT fuel injection and in-tank fuel pumps to eliminate vapor lock. The latest seems to be working the best; moving my electric fuel pump, filter, switching valve, and fuel lines to the OUTSIDE of the frame. This was Jim K's suggestion and so far, it seems to be doing the trick. on our mid Summer trip this year, I never had a hiccup in spite of 100+ degree temps, 7000' elevations, and 6 - 8% grades.
Crossing my fingers.
Carl Stouffer
'75 ex Palm Beach
Tucson, AZ.
Chuck Aulgur Reaction Arm Disc Brakes, Quadrabags, 3.70 LSD final drive, Lenzi knuckles/hubs, Dodge Truck 16" X 8" front wheels, Rear American Eagles, Solar battery charging. GMCSJ and GMCMI member
[Updated on: Sat, 29 December 2018 21:42] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339823 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sun, 30 December 2018 07:45 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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On my 23', after vapor locking and stalling going up US 23 N of Mountain City and damn near tucking it off Culowee Mountain, I installed a new water pump, had the radiator recored, and modified the fuel delivery like this:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g6198-cane-9-creek-rv-park-heflin-2c-al.html
From the tee forward, stock except for the blank plate and line fitting where the mechanical fuel pump used to be. After this mod, It would pull Monteagle and Culowee Mountain with the toad and never miss a beat. I ran it all over the Southeast in the summertime without problems. I point out, with very few exceptions I ran it on no alcohol gasoline. Pure-Gas.org is Your Friend 
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339824 is a reply to message #339823] |
Sun, 30 December 2018 10:10 |
James Hupy
Messages: 6806
Registered: May 2010
Karma: -62
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Senior Member |
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In today's time frame, the majority of "Vapor Lock" problems on Carburetor
equipped engines are NOT engine problems,
THEY ARE GASOLINE RELATED PROBLEMS. Alcohol blended fuel, along with
the reformulation for fuel injected engines are the PRIMARY PROBLEM.
Factor in winter blending vs summer blending and the seasonal holdover
issues and it begins to make sense.
Well maintained carb equipped coaches equipped with auxiliary electric
fuel pumps, new alcohol resistant fuel lines and tank switching valves can
manage most NORMAL conditions.
Like Johnny says, no alcohol fuel is your friend. Use it, if you can
find it.
But, if you like to stretch out fuel stops, and buy the cheapest fuel
you can find, "Rots a Ruck".
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
On Sun, Dec 30, 2018, 5:46 AM Johnny Bridges via Gmclist <
gmclist@list.gmcnet.org wrote:
> On my 23', after vapor locking and stalling going up US 23 N of Mountain
> City and damn near tucking it off Culowee Mountain, I installed a new water
> pump, had the radiator recored, and modified the fuel delivery like this:
>
>
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g6198-cane-9-creek-rv-park-heflin-2c-al.html
>
> From the tee forward, stock except for the blank plate and line fitting
> where the mechanical fuel pump used to be. After this mod, It would pull
> Monteagle and Culowee Mountain with the toad and never miss a beat. I ran
> it all over the Southeast in the summertime without problems. I point out,
> with very few exceptions I ran it on no alcohol gasoline. Pure-Gas.org is
> Your Friend :)
>
> --johnny
> --
> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> "I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me
> in hell" - ol Andy, paraphrased
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339826 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sun, 30 December 2018 10:44 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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When I look at the Left Coast, there ain't much 'boat gas' available. CA - 28 sources. Qregon ~215. Washington about the same. For comparison, in Georgia there are 615 listed. Yet, we got more GMCs out there than anyplace around here except Florida. Yall need to speak to your government
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
[Updated on: Sun, 30 December 2018 10:44] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339937 is a reply to message #339826] |
Fri, 04 January 2019 14:03 |
amansfield1104
Messages: 80
Registered: August 2009
Karma: 0
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Thanks everybody. My RV is a 76 26” Eleganza. Decatur AL.
I found out one of my problems with vapor lock and I will improve it … I think. My RV vapor pocks real bad when it gets above 85 and I have to drive in stop and go traffic. I made the mistake of driving in second to keep it running to do the last 20 miles to the park. I was lucky it did not burn up. The smell of gas was real strong as I guess I was pushing vapor thur the carb. We left the RV for a while until the order was gone. So vapor lock can be a problem more than just having the RV run.
I made the mistake and allow a muffler that goes across and is feed by both header. It is a little lower than two mufflers would be. On the last trip It was about 30 out side. My wife went to get something from the back of the RV. She said it was nice and warm in the back. I checked and had someone check and I do not have exhaust leaks. I assume the warmth was coming from the cross muffler. Maybe that has been part of the problem with the generator. The gas was to hot.
As for the carb I have no problem with it, once I change the jets and spring. I do not have a stock cam and I guess the carb setting were to lean. It runs much better and the gas mileage is about the same.
I guess I need to read up on the heater and AC to clean it up. My wife rides back at the table. Can I add an AC out let back there to help cool he under the rear facing seat. The dash unit would not help much back there as I under stand it.
As for the RIM I do not know what type they are. They had radials on it when I got it so thats what I had on it. I had one rim crack two years ago but other than that I had not trouble with them.
It is time to replace the tires. They look fine but. I can get another set of firestone tires but I expect it will not be possible to get a round set of tires.
Thanks again.
Art
> On Dec 30, 2018, at 10:44 AM, Johnny Bridges via Gmclist wrote:
>
> When I loo at the Left Coast, there ain't much 'boat gas' available. CA - 28 sources. Qregon ~215. Washington about the same. For comparison, in
> Georgia there are 615 listed. Yet, we got more GMCs out there than anyplace around here except Florida. Yall need to speak to your government :)
>
> --johnny
> --
> Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
> Braselton, Ga.
> "I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell" - ol Andy, paraphrased
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339938 is a reply to message #339814] |
Fri, 04 January 2019 16:30 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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Art- Money and time is best spent getting that Generator fixed and running reliably. You are in a hot part of the country, and you need that to work. do not waste time/Money on the dash air, until after you have a reliable generator. dash air can be improved, but if you generator and roof air works, that should be all you need. Dash air does nothing when the engine is not running, and in the hot summer it is important to keep the coach cool all the time, or you are fighting a loosing battle with too much heat gain if you park somewhere for an hour to go eat or shop. you can tune up the old onan, and add electronic ignition and work at getting it purring, or replace the entire thing. But that is where you need to put the money in. I am in the same boat as you, this season I am doing 4 things. 1. replace my broken onan. 2. upgrade the dash air, and 3. I am building a rack to carry a spare generator off the bumper. 4.I am going to tint the windows. My wife and family cooked out in 2018, and if I plan to keep the coach, they are going to be cooler in the coach then our house in 2019!
sounds like to me, you have fuel delivery issues, between vapor lock at 85 degrees and your generator shutting off, I think you have fuel delivery issues. (I never had vapor lock until at least 89-90+ degrees, and it was minor and a $50 electric fuel pump on the aux side has always worked for me at that point). so take a close look at all your tanks/fuel lines 1st. simple thing like bad body pads causing a line to pinch off, or a small crack somewhere will cause what you are dealing with. Until you are sure your fuel line system is perfect, can you think about other problems. an electric fuel pump close to the tanks will usually take care of almost all vapor lock problems, except for extreme. Fuel injection is nice, and people may say it solves vapor lock, but that is because fuel injection systems are running electric fuel pumps closer to the tanks in almost every install.
good luck!
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
[Updated on: Fri, 04 January 2019 16:30] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339941 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 05 January 2019 10:51 |
mghamms
Messages: 466
Registered: March 2016
Location: Ware, Massachusetts
Karma: 2
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Senior Member |
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As far as the Onan goes.
as long as there is no engine generator mechanical problems it should be easy to get it running great.
First the obvious things plugs points oil filters.
On mine I had to replace the control board. that made it run most of the time.
Then I had a fuel problem ran for a bit and shut down.
I found a small piece of rubber that would block the main jet, only when I wasn't driving.
The notion of the coach must have kept it out of the way most of the time.
Get a volt meter that measures Hertz and set the governor to 60HZ.
As far as what to fix first I always fix the things that would kill me, tires and brakes,
cosmetics always last,
Good luck.
1977 Kingsley 455 as stock as it gets except lots of Ragusa parts
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| Re: [GMCnet] Up Date MY GMC [message #339942 is a reply to message #339814] |
Sat, 05 January 2019 11:30 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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Art,
If the rims are steel 16.5s, look them over very carefully and see if you can find the "R" mark near the part number. If they are not so marked, they may well crack at some point. We got the coach with a full set of radial tires. Five of the rims had been replaced with radial capable. The other two cracked in service. Hunting up 16" can be a vocation. When Mary hits the lottery, I am going to buy a full set of someone's alloy.
I have found that the best ever device for setting the generator governor is a "Kill-A-Watt". Inexpensive and if you have an extension cord on board, just bring it out by the unit and there you are. It will read both voltage and frequency so you are all set.
Good Luck
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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