Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Pure Sine Wave inverters (Are the name brands really that much better)
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307688 is a reply to message #307686] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 11:16   |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Xantrex and and Trace merged a few years back. They were both highly regarded. Can't comment on the others.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307695 is a reply to message #307694] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 11:57 |
pzerkel
Messages: 212
Registered: September 2007
Location: Salisbury, IL
Karma: 0
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We are considering replacing the Norcold with a dorm or possibly apartment sized ac only fridge. Hence the reason for considering a larger inverter.
Paul Zerkel
'78 Eleganza II
Salisbury IL (near Springfield)
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307698 is a reply to message #307695] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 12:12 |
A Hamilto
Messages: 4508
Registered: April 2011
Karma: 39
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pzerkel wrote on Fri, 23 September 2016 11:57We are considering replacing the Norcold with a dorm or possibly apartment sized ac only fridge. Hence the reason for considering a larger inverter. The dorm fridge will pull a little more power than the Norcold all the time, and more surge current, but if all you are powering is a dorm sized fridge, you do not need OR want a 1500W inverter. 500W will be way plenty, and you can probably get away with 300W. Think of it this way: An inverter will waste a percentage of its rating whether idling or running something. A 1500W inverter will waste 3 times as much power idling as a 500W inverter, and continue wasting power when it is well below rated capacity.
If you are the boondocking type trying to minimize the amount of time you run your generator to recharge batteries, you need the smallest, most efficienct inverter you can get away with for each appliance, and turn the inverters off when not in use.
You do not want a single 1500W inverter on all the time if you need 100W for the fridge and only need more than that when the TV or something else is on. Get an inverter for the fridge, an inverter for the TV, an inverter for the laptop, and so on. Turn off the inverter when you turn off the device. Always turn the inverter on first, then the device, and when powering down, turn off the device, then the inverter.
Don't spend extra money for full wave inverter if your appliance will be happy with modified wave.
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307701 is a reply to message #307686] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 13:30 |
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RF_Burns
Messages: 2277
Registered: June 2008
Location: S. Ontario, Canada
Karma: 3
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With a dorm size compressor fridge you need an inverter powerful enough to handle the startup surge of the motor, not just its running power. We have an Avanti apartment size fridge, (about the same size as the OEM Norcold), it takes about 600 watts to start, then settles down to about 80 running. The compressor looks to be the same Danfoss unit as my small wine cooler at home. We use a 1500 watt Samlex pure sine wave. I would not go under a 1000Watt since the instantaneous peak is going to be higher than the 600 watts that occurs in the first second or so.
As far as inverters go, we've have no failures with Samlex equipment that runs 24/7 at radio tower sites.
Bruce Hislop
ON Canada
77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
1 ton front end
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
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| Re: [GMCnet] Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307703 is a reply to message #307701] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 13:47 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
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Paul:
What Bruce said.
Dolph
DE N8JPC
Wheeling, West Virginia
1977 26’ ex-PalmBeach
1-Ton, Sullybilt Bags, Reaction Arms, 3.70 LSD, Manny Transmission, EV-6010
“The Aluminum and Fiberglass Mistress"
> On Sep 23, 2016, at 2:30 PM, Bruce Hislop wrote:
>
> With a dorm size compressor fridge you need an inverter powerful enough to handle the startup surge of the motor, not just its running power. We have
> an Avanti apartment size fridge, (about the same size as the OEM Norcold), it takes about 600 watts to start, then settles down to about 80 running.
> The compressor looks to be the same Danfoss unit as my small wine cooler at home. We use a 1500 watt Samlex pure sine wave. I would not go under a
> 1000Watt since the instantaneous peak is going to be higher than the 600 watts that occurs in the first second or so.
>
> As far as inverters go, we've have no failures with Samlex equipment that runs 24/7 at radio tower sites.
> --
> Bruce Hislop
> ON Canada
> 77PB, 455 Dick P. rebuilt, DynamicEFI EBL EFI & ESC.
> Hubler 1 ton front end
> http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showphoto.php?photo=29001
> My Staff says I never listen to them, or something like that
>
> _______________________________________________
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307718 is a reply to message #307686] |
Fri, 23 September 2016 21:47 |
PigPen4x4
Messages: 61
Registered: March 2014
Location: Chattanooga Tn
Karma: 1
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I had good success with Aims inverters.
Only had one fail in a customers van,
and it had gotten wet.
Christopher Brewer
Chattanooga Tn
Well, no longer an owner.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307723 is a reply to message #307705] |
Sat, 24 September 2016 07:38 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Quote:From: Gmclist on behalf of Paul Zerkel
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Pure Sine Wave inverters
We are considering replacing the Norcold with a dorm or possibly apartment sized ac only fridge. Hence the reason for considering a larger inverter.
Steve Jess wrote:
For the price of a dorm fridge AND a sine wave inverter you could get a fridge designed to run on 12 volts, like the Norcold DE-0061. That model is the logical successor to the fridges that came in our coaches.
Steve,
Check you prices.
The math doesn't work by a few hundred dollars.
And, you are also discounting the available additional AC for other purposes.
And, you are assuming that a some kind of pure sine inverter is required when that just is not the case.
AC motors whether capacitor start, split phase or shaded pole will run just fine on a modified square (it isn't even close to sine) inverter. Yes, it will be a tad less efficient, and so will run a little warmer. (example: investigate how all the VF motor drives work)
In our case, for a 23 with a smaller ice chest, the cash out of pocket difference was about 1200$us. I don't know about everybody else, but I can put a lot of hours on the Onan for that much cash.
Something that does have to be considered is that the typical residential hardware is all "case cooled". The condenser has not been an open coil on the back for many decades. This means that sufficient cooling air has to be provided to the sides and provision made for its circulation. There is also the fact that they are not provided with any means to secure them in place (except some California models have an earthquake bracket) and do not have any positive door holding provided. Personally, I never found either of those to be serious challenges.
And, Mary is very happy with the reefer we have now.
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307729 is a reply to message #307686] |
Sat, 24 September 2016 09:49 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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The missing ingredient here is propane. That will give the longest bang for buck dry camping.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Pure Sine Wave inverters [message #307730 is a reply to message #307723] |
Sat, 24 September 2016 09:42 |
Dolph Santorine
Messages: 1236
Registered: April 2011
Location: Wheeling, WV
Karma: -41
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Senior Member |
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Matt:
The last comment is probably the single most important issue.
The CFO gets what the CFO wants
We use child locks to keep the doors from flinging open.
Like these -
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Safety-1st-HS038-Lock-Release-Fridge-Latch/16383404
They have a button you can push so when you’re parked, you don’t need to push the the button to open the fridge.
When the fridge bites the dust, I”m going to post mortem the compressor to see what caused the failure.
From what I’ve seen, that could be a long time.
Dolph
DE N8JPC
Wheeling, West Virginia
1977 26’ ex-PalmBeach
1-Ton, Sullybilt Bags, Reaction Arms, 3.70 LSD, Manny Transmission, EV-6010
“The Aluminum and Fiberglass Mistress"
> On Sep 24, 2016, at 8:39 AM, Matt Colie wrote:
>
> Quote:
>> From: Gmclist on behalf of Paul Zerkel
>> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Pure Sine Wave inverters
>>
>> We are considering replacing the Norcold with a dorm or possibly apartment sized ac only fridge. Hence the reason for considering a larger
>> inverter.
>>
>> Steve Jess wrote:
>> For the price of a dorm fridge AND a sine wave inverter you could get a fridge designed to run on 12 volts, like the Norcold DE-0061. That model
>> is the logical successor to the fridges that came in our coaches.
>
>
> Steve,
> Check you prices.
> The math doesn't work by a few hundred dollars.
>
> And, you are also discounting the available additional AC for other purposes.
>
> And, you are assuming that a some kind of pure sine inverter is required when that just is not the case.
> AC motors whether capacitor start, split phase or shaded pole will run just fine on a modified square (it isn't even close to sine) inverter. Yes, it
> will be a tad less efficient, and so will run a little warmer. (example: investigate how all the VF motor drives work)
>
> In our case, for a 23 with a smaller ice chest, the cash out of pocket difference was about 1200$us. I don't know about everybody else, but I can put
> a lot of hours on the Onan for that much cash.
>
> Something that does have to be considered is that the typical residential hardware is all "case cooled". The condenser has not been an open coil on
> the back for many decades. This means that sufficient cooling air has to be provided to the sides and provision made for its circulation. There is
> also the fact that they are not provided with any means to secure them in place (except some California models have an earthquake bracket) and do not
> have any positive door holding provided. Personally, I never found either of those to be serious challenges.
>
> And, Mary is very happy with the reefer we have now.
>
> Matt
>
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
> '73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
> Now with both true Keyless and remote entry
> SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
_______________________________________________
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