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electrical hookup [message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 09:31 Go to next message
kstockwell is currently offline  kstockwell   United States
Messages: 367
Registered: May 2016
Location: Putney VT
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the plug end of my electrical hookup is a wad of electrical tape. Before I go cutting and installing a new plug, I'm wondering if I need this big of a cable and a 50 amp plug.

My SOB has a 30 amp and it's been all I ever needed- the cable is much more manageable. As I use the current rig I only goto a standard house outlet.
The fridge is propane and electric, the water heater is propane and electric- that really just leaves the AC unit.

Can I replace the cable the size of my wrist with one that's 30amp rated or is there something I'm missing?

kelly

ps I have one roof AC unit.


1978 Kingsley Putney VT

[Updated on: Sat, 06 August 2016 09:33]

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Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #304994 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 09:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bdub is currently offline  bdub   United States
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Registered: February 2004
Location: Central Texas
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50A is needed to run both roof air conditioners at the same time.


On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 at 9:31 AM, kelly stockwell wrote:

> the plug end of my electrical hookup is a wad of electrical tape. Before
> I go cutting and installing a new plug, I'm wondering if I need this big of
> a cable and a 50 amp plug.
>
> My SOB has a 30 amp and it's been all I ever needed- the cable is much
> more manageable. As I use the current rig I only goto a standard house
> outlet.
>
> The fridge is propane and electric, the water heater is propane and
> electric- that really just leaves the AC unit.
>
> Can I replace the cable the size of my wrist with one that's 30amp rated
> or is there something I'm missing?
>
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bdub
'76 Palm Beach/Central Texas
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Re: electrical hookup [message #305001 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 10:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
A Hamilto is currently offline  A Hamilto   United States
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kstockwell wrote on Sat, 06 August 2016 09:31
the plug end of my electrical hookup is a wad of electrical tape.
Before I go cutting and installing a new plug, I'm wondering if I need this big of a cable and a 50 amp plug.

My SOB has a 30 amp and it's been all I ever needed- the cable is much more manageable. As I use the current rig I only goto a standard house outlet.
The fridge is propane and electric, the water heater is propane and electric- that really just leaves the AC unit.

Can I replace the cable the size of my wrist with one that's 30amp rated or is there something I'm missing?

kelly

ps I have one roof AC unit.
Install a 50A plug and build or buy a 50A F - 30A M adapter. That way you don't have to find out after you are done that the 30A wasn't enough and have to redo it.
http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mxdNfYWYCARNM5r3P8IYEnA.jpg
Re: electrical hookup [message #305003 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 11:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zhagrieb is currently offline  zhagrieb   United States
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With one AC you are good to go with a 30A cable. If you are running the coach at home connected to a standard (15 or 20amp) outlet I'd suggest you not use the AC. Extension cords are a great source of voltage loss and any loss could ruin the AC compressor. Install a 30A circuit on the side of the house and all will be fine.

Glenn Giere, Portland OR, K7GAG '73 "Moby the Motorhome" 26'
Re: electrical hookup [message #305005 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 11:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
larry.whisler is currently offline  larry.whisler   United States
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Kelly,

If the 50A cable is in good shape, I'd keep it and replace
the plug. That would be cheaper than replacing the entire
cable with 30A.

Maybe someone can chime in here with a quality replacement
plug.

larry
Re: electrical hookup [message #305009 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 12:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lqqkatjon is currently offline  lqqkatjon   United States
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Like Billy said, you need 50 amps to run 2 high amperage items in the coach at the same time. so to run 2 A/C units, the 50 amp is needed.

so downgrading to a 30amp cord/plug, would depend on your use.


either way, they make some really crappy plugs out there. So my post is this:

solder the wires/screws that hold the lug to the wire. and epoxy the wires in place, put as much epoxy in there as you can.

I had redid my cord end numerous times before, and finally got mad and made a permant epoxied plug on the end and it has held up to some abuse.


the Camco plug is complete garbage, I can't believe they have not had someone get electrcuted and sued after the wires came loose and fell out.


here is a plug that is still junk in my opinion, but way better then the camco. if you solder the wires, and epoxy them in, it should last along time:

https://www.amazon.com/ParkPower-Male-Replacement-Plug-250V/dp/B00432Q6AO/ref=sr_1_31?ie=UTF8&qid=1470502967&sr=8-31&keywords=RV+50+amp+ma le

and the epoxy that can be used:
https://www.amazon.com/Versachem-47829-Flow-Mix-Plastic-Welder/dp/B004I3WB2U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1470502829&sr=8-1&keywords=versachem+e poxy+mix






Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305010 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 11:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ken Henderson is currently offline  Ken Henderson   United States
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Kelly,

I'll vote for 30A. All Coachmen-fitted GMC's (Birchavens and Royales) were
fitted with 30A cords; I've never heard one of those owners complain about
insufficient current.

As long as you're only running a single air conditioner, 30A should be
adequate. Even if you have two A/C's to run, the second one can be put on
a second, independent 15A circuit so that you still don't need the 50A cord.

The 40' diesel pusher we had for 9 years had a 50A cord -- on an automatic
reel. During 50+ years of RVing, that's the only time I've ever needed 50A.

Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, etc., etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com

On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 at 10:31 AM, kelly stockwell wrote:

> the plug end of my electrical hookup is a wad of electrical tape. Before
> I go cutting and installing a new plug, I'm wondering if I need this big of
> a cable and a 50 amp plug.
>
> My SOB has a 30 amp and it's been all I ever needed- the cable is much
> more manageable. As I use the current rig I only goto a standard house
> outlet.
>
> The fridge is propane and electric, the water heater is propane and
> electric- that really just leaves the AC unit.
>
> Can I replace the cable the size of my wrist with one that's 30amp rated
> or is there something I'm missing?
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305012 is a reply to message #305010] Sat, 06 August 2016 12:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kstockwell is currently offline  kstockwell   United States
Messages: 367
Registered: May 2016
Location: Putney VT
Karma: 4
Senior Member
Thanks for all the replies. I don't have any outlet at the house, installing a larger one would be a good idea.

I just realized the plug into the coach (for when the genny is running) is also 50 amp. So you're right it might be easier to just get a new plug. That cable is just a bitch to get into and out of the compartment, and with one AC, no microwave, it's overkill.

My home circuit breaker would pop if my SOB was plugged in with the AC running, I've only turned on my AC once to make sure it worked. 95% of the time we have no hookups and when we do they always say no AC usage. That works for us

I'll holler if/when I decide to swap out the cables. Someone with two ACs could surely use it


this forum is great, helpful and encouraging and I haven't felt too dumb asking a question yet (I'll keep trying)

kelly


1978 Kingsley Putney VT

[Updated on: Sat, 06 August 2016 12:46]

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Re: electrical hookup [message #305014 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 13:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adrien G. is currently offline  Adrien G.   United States
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Registered: May 2008
Location: Burns Flat, OK 73624
Karma: 1
Senior Member
Kelly,

If your house 120vac is OEM GM setup, the 2 hot legs of the 50a cord feed 2 individual separate circuits in the main breaker box.
The 2 hot legs are connected to 2 40a main breakers.
The 30a cord has only 1 hot leg and a jumper connection wire will be needed between the 2 40a breaker.
You don't say anything about the water heater, microwave.

AC, WH, Micro, converter/charger can add up to more then 30a ( internal breaker are 40a ) it could overheat.

Oversize wire is better then undersize.


Adrien & Jenny Genesoto 75 Glenbrook (26-3) Mods LS3.70 FD / Reaction Sys / 80mm Front&Intermidiate / Hydroboost / 16" Tires / Frame Rebuild / Interior Rebuild Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305016 is a reply to message #305014] Sat, 06 August 2016 14:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kingsley Coach is currently offline  Kingsley Coach   United States
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Kelly

I'd go with what Glenn said except I'd put that box on the neighbour's
house. It'll keep your power bill down!
Mike in NS

On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 at 3:54 PM, Adrien Genesoto wrote:

> Kelly,
>
> If your house 120vac is OEM GM setup, the 2 hot legs of the 50a cord feed
> 2 individual separate circuits in the main breaker box.
> The 2 hot legs are connected to 2 40a main breakers.
> The 30a cord has only 1 hot leg and a jumper connection wire will be
> needed between the 2 40a breaker.
> You don't say anything about the water heater, microwave.
>
> AC, WH, Micro, converter/charger can add up to more then 30a ( internal
> breaker are 40a ) it could overheat.
>
> Oversize wire is better then undersize.
> --
> ”When we avoid the mistakes we might have made, we sometimes make the
> mistakes that we might have avoided.”
>
>
>
> Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
> 75 Glenbrook 26-3
> Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>



--
Michael Beaton
1977 Kingsley 26-11
1977 Eleganza II 26-3
Antigonish, NS

Life is too short to hold a grudge; slash some tires and call it even !
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Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305017 is a reply to message #305016] Sat, 06 August 2016 15:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kstockwell is currently offline  kstockwell   United States
Messages: 367
Registered: May 2016
Location: Putney VT
Karma: 4
Senior Member
we have no neighbors!

Our power bill is $40-60 a month (200-280 kw a month). How? Two adults, no kids, CFL bulbs, very few electronics (LP water heater and oven)- I spent a few months with a Kill-A-Watt and banished all superfluous electronics 5 years ago (a Direct TV box uses 45 watts when on, and 40 watts when off). One window AC unit runs a dozen hours a year.

I only plug the coach in to cool the fridge before a trip and charge the two 6V batteries.

kelly


Kingsley Coach wrote on Sat, 06 August 2016 15:08
Kelly

I'd go with what Glenn said except I'd put that box on the neighbour's
house. It'll keep your power bill down!
Mike in NS

On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 at 3:54 PM, Adrien Genesoto wrote:

> Kelly,
>
> If your house 120vac is OEM GM setup, the 2 hot legs of the 50a cord feed
> 2 individual separate circuits in the main breaker box.
> The 2 hot legs are connected to 2 40a main breakers.
> The 30a cord has only 1 hot leg and a jumper connection wire will be
> needed between the 2 40a breaker.
> You don't say anything about the water heater, microwave.
>
> AC, WH, Micro, converter/charger can add up to more then 30a ( internal
> breaker are 40a ) it could overheat.
>
> Oversize wire is better then undersize.
> --
> "When we avoid the mistakes we might have made, we sometimes make the
> mistakes that we might have avoided."
>
>
>
> Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
> 75 Glenbrook 26-3
> Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>



--
Michael Beaton
1977 Kingsley 26-11
1977 Eleganza II 26-3
Antigonish, NS

Life is too short to hold a grudge; slash some tires and call it even !
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1978 Kingsley Putney VT
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305022 is a reply to message #304994] Sat, 06 August 2016 15:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
fbhtxak is currently offline  fbhtxak   United States
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Registered: April 2006
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Senior Member
Ken,

Some owners have Coachmen-upfitted coaches with OEM 50 amp service. The
Royale I have is among the last 500 in the 1978 production run and it has
OEM 50 amp service. Apparently, then, at some time during the 1978 model
year, Coachmen began to provide 50 amp service in the transmodes they bought
from GM.

The 50 amp cord IS difficult to handle, especially at
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305023 is a reply to message #305022] Sat, 06 August 2016 16:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ken Henderson is currently offline  Ken Henderson   United States
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Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
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Senior Member
Thanks for that info, Fred. First I ever heard of a 50A Coachmen. Your
"cut it off" technique is exactly how I'd advise Kelly to do hers, except
that I'd use a 30A cord from the socket. Just no need for all that copper
-- especially with her conservative ways. Fact is, she could probably do
very well with a 10g, 15A cord, making life even easier.

Ken H.


On Sat, Aug 6, 2016 at 4:49 PM, Fred Hudspeth wrote:

> Ken,
>
> Some owners have Coachmen-upfitted coaches with OEM 50 amp service. The
> Royale I have is among the last 500 in the 1978 production run and it has
> OEM 50 amp service. Apparently, then, at some time during the 1978 model
> year, Coachmen began to provide 50 amp service in the transmodes they
> bought
> from GM.
>
> The 50 amp cord IS difficult to handle, especially at to
> cut the cord with about 6" extending below the floor of the Onan
> compartment. Then, install a 50 amp plug on the stub and a 50 amp
> receptacle
> on the end of the severed cord. The severed cord can be separated from the
> stub and more easily coiled at elsewhere.
>
> Both roof air-conditioners can be run at the same time with amps to
> spare...
> The downside is that when both ACs are needed (as late as October in
> Texas!), the voltage at many RV parks drops to such a level that only one
> AC
> can be run without tripping a coach circuit breaker.
>
> Fred
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
Re: electrical hookup [message #305024 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 16:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
larry.whisler is currently offline  larry.whisler   United States
Messages: 356
Registered: August 2005
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Senior Member
PPL sells a 50Amp male plug.

http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/rv-power-cords/power-grip-replacement.htm

about $21.00. You may want to check to see if it allows sufficient
clearanc to plug into the genset receptacle.

fwiw

larry
Re: electrical hookup [message #305026 is a reply to message #305024] Sat, 06 August 2016 16:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kstockwell is currently offline  kstockwell   United States
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Location: Putney VT
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I like Fred's method too. This is low on the list of to-do, but this all seems like a good solution.

Cheers!
kelly


1978 Kingsley Putney VT
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305038 is a reply to message #305012] Sat, 06 August 2016 21:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
wally is currently offline  wally   United States
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Location: Omaha Nebraska
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kstockwell wrote on Sat, 06 August 2016 12:34
Thanks for all the replies. I don't have any outlet at the house, installing a larger one would be a good idea.

I just realized the plug into the coach (for when the genny is running) is also 50 amp. So you're right it might be easier to just get a new plug. That cable is just a bitch to get into and out of the compartment, and with one AC, no microwave, it's overkill.

My home circuit breaker would pop if my SOB was plugged in with the AC running, I've only turned on my AC once to make sure it worked. 95% of the time we have no hookups and when we do they always say no AC usage. That works for us

I'll holler if/when I decide to swap out the cables. Someone with two ACs could surely use it


this forum is great, helpful and encouraging and I haven't felt too dumb asking a question yet (I'll keep trying)

kelly

We put on a Midwest C54U 50 amp plug. The cable clamp is stout and fits our large OEM cable. No handle like some others. It fits the generator outlet OK.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/power-level-valve-fitting/p55396-midwest-50-amp-plug.html
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/power-level-valve-fitting/p55395-midwest-50-amp-plug.html
On Ebay for $16.19 shipped
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Midwest-C54U-RV-Angle-Cap-Plug-50amp-125-250-Volts-/201607825254?vxp=mtr&hash=item2ef0c34766
JWID


Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook
Re: electrical hookup [message #305039 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 21:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JohnL455 is currently offline  JohnL455   United States
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Location: Woodstock, IL
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If you replace the cord set you have to parallel in the breaker box and understand how to do this. Technically you should switch to 2 15A beakers adding to the 30A in the event the post is not properly breakered. You also have to replace the generator 14-50R with a TT-30R. My suggestion --learn how to coil "over/under" so there are no net twists in the cable as you uncoil it fits neatly in the compartment and won't "phone cord" the conductors ruining the cable. I do this with air hose, garden hose and all types of cable. The trick to installing a new 14-50p is in the cable prep. Use the strip gauge on the plug, use stripers not dykes, and stagger the N and G lengths so they are offset by the distance of the pins so everything falls into place. I would never consider switching away from stock. I carry all adaptors to get down to Edison.

John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
Re: electrical hookup [message #305045 is a reply to message #304993] Sat, 06 August 2016 23:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pzerkel is currently offline  pzerkel   United States
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Location: Salisbury, IL
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Others have already commented about the poor quality of most 50 amp plugs designed for rv use. I agree.

If you choose to keep the 50 amp cord, my strong recommendation is to go to a local electrical supply house and ask for a Hubbel NEMA 14-50P (the p means plug). It will not be cheap, and will not have a gimmick handle. But it will be much higher quality and easier to install than those rv plugs, or even the Pass & Seymour plugs the electrical supply house also likely sells.

You won't need to solder the H plug. (Note: Hubbel is spelled with two L's, but for some reason the forum will not let me spell it correctly? It just changed the correct spelling to "H".)


Paul Zerkel
'78 Eleganza II
Salisbury IL (near Springfield)

[Updated on: Sat, 06 August 2016 23:46]

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Re: electrical hookup [message #305048 is a reply to message #305039] Sun, 07 August 2016 07:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kstockwell is currently offline  kstockwell   United States
Messages: 367
Registered: May 2016
Location: Putney VT
Karma: 4
Senior Member
I have a friend who is an electrician and also has an older RV. I'll ask for some professional help/oversight.
Thank you
kelly

JohnL455 wrote on Sat, 06 August 2016 22:07
If you replace the cord set you have to parallel in the breaker box and understand how to do this. Technically you should switch to 2 15A beakers adding to the 30A in the event the post is not properly breakered. You also have to replace the generator 14-50R with a TT-30R. My suggestion --learn how to coil "over/under" so there are no net twists in the cable as you uncoil it fits neatly in the compartment and won't "phone cord" the conductors ruining the cable. I do this with air hose, garden hose and all types of cable. The trick to installing a new 14-50p is in the cable prep. Use the strip gauge on the plug, use stripers not dykes, and stagger the N and G lengths so they are offset by the distance of the pins so everything falls into place. I would never consider switching away from stock. I carry all adaptors to get down to Edison.


1978 Kingsley Putney VT
Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup [message #305052 is a reply to message #305022] Sun, 07 August 2016 09:00 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
USAussie is currently offline  USAussie   United States
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
Senior Member
Fred,

Spot on, Mate!

I purchased a NEW 36 foot / 50 amp extension cord from AdventureRV while it was on sale for around $150. It is MUCH more pliable
than the 40 year old cord in the Avion.

Regards,
Rob M.
USAussie - Downunder
AUS '75 Avion - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
USA '75 Avion - Double Trouble TZE365V100426


-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Fred Hudspeth
Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2016 6:49 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] electrical hookup

Ken,

Some owners have Coachmen-upfitted coaches with OEM 50 amp service. The
Royale I have is among the last 500 in the 1978 production run and it has
OEM 50 amp service. Apparently, then, at some time during the 1978 model
year, Coachmen began to provide 50 amp service in the transmodes they bought
from GM.

The 50 amp cord IS difficult to handle, especially at


Regards, Rob M. (USAussie) The Pedantic Mechanic Sydney, Australia '75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428 '75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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