Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455
| [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292112] |
Mon, 14 December 2015 23:03  |
Anonymous
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What a club to discover for newbies.
We just adopted ALF (Aluminum Falcon) the end of September (TZE336V100703) and moved it to Lake Oswego, OR - so still the same damp weather.
odometer has about 54K if that can be believed - mmmm -
Anyway, upgraded the steel rims to AL 16” and Michelin LT225/75R16 E load tires with T/P sensors on the stems - having the front hub bearings replaced along with the upper and lower ball joints and KYB - KG5435 shocks. While it is apart will have the brake system drained, disk brake pads and master cylinder checked, 3 dot brake fluid added and rear drums checked as well. Jim Bounds curbed some of my ideas about the upgrade process before a long trip to Phoenix in Feb. Will replace the mirrors with RAMCO, quad bags, and install foam fire extinguishers in the motor and frig areas. Jan & I saw an RV on fire during our Oct trip to Cimarron, NM. The rig did not stand a chance. Was to have driven ALF, but too much was needed in the preparation time.
Safety is the main concern for now.
I am looking for a heater plug for the block. Something like the Zerostart Engine Block Heater - that is installed through the plug hole (were is that located and size?).
Also looking to replace the shag with cork which wears well, is natural, and has sound and insulation capabilities.
I do have 6 GMC hub caps and 9 - 16.5 steel rims (7 with tires that have about 2 years left).
Would appreciate any comments and recommendations - have been reading so much, but maybe my ideas are dangerous.
Certainly thankful for the opportunity to view all the data you all have - what a wealth of experience you are sharing.
Virgil
ALF is viewable within my profile with new wheels
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292121 is a reply to message #292112] |
Mon, 14 December 2015 23:59  |
Guy Lopes
Messages: 499
Registered: April 2004
Location: Sacramento, CA
Karma: 3
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Senior Member |
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Virgil,
Welcome aboard! Not only do you have the best motorhome ever built (ok, I'm biased), but I believe that you live not too far from what could be a very valuable resource to you. Jim Hupy is in Salem, just down the road from you I believe. He is a wealth of knowledge and, if you've been monitoring here for more than two weeks, you already know how helpful he can be to his fellow GMC owners on the net. I suggest that you give him a call and get to know him.
Thank you for telling us your name and where you're from. It helps keep the feeling that we're all just sitting around the campground and tossing ideas back and forth.
Guy Lopes
76 Birchaven "Orion"
Sacramento, CA
W6TOL
www.GMC-Guy.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces@list.gmcnet.org] On Behalf Of Virgil Pearce
Sent: Monday, December 14, 2015 9:03 PM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455
What a club to discover for newbies.
We just adopted ALF (Aluminum Falcon) the end of September (TZE336V100703) and moved it to Lake Oswego, OR - so still the same damp weather.
odometer has about 54K if that can be believed - mmmm -
Anyway, upgraded the steel rims to AL 16” and Michelin LT225/75R16 E load tires with T/P sensors on the stems - having the front hub bearings replaced along with the upper and lower ball joints and KYB - KG5435 shocks. While it is apart will have the brake system drained, disk brake pads and master cylinder checked, 3 dot brake fluid added and rear drums checked as well. Jim Bounds curbed some of my ideas about the upgrade process before a long trip to Phoenix in Feb. Will replace the mirrors with RAMCO, quad bags, and install foam fire extinguishers in the motor and frig areas. Jan & I saw an RV on fire during our Oct trip to Cimarron, NM. The rig did not stand a chance. Was to have driven ALF, but too much was needed in the preparation time.
Safety is the main concern for now.
I am looking for a heater plug for the block. Something like the Zerostart Engine Block Heater - that is installed through the plug hole (were is that located and size?).
Also looking to replace the shag with cork which wears well, is natural, and has sound and insulation capabilities.
I do have 6 GMC hub caps and 9 - 16.5 steel rims (7 with tires that have about 2 years left).
Would appreciate any comments and recommendations - have been reading so much, but maybe my ideas are dangerous.
Certainly thankful for the opportunity to view all the data you all have - what a wealth of experience you are sharing.
Virgil
ALF is viewable within my profile with new wheels _______________________________________________
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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Guy Lopes
76 Birchaven "Orion"
Sacramento, CA
W6TOL
www.GMC-Guy.com
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292124 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 01:12 |
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John Heslinga
Messages: 632
Registered: February 2011
Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Karma: 4
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Virgil.
It is quite a surprize to me that anyone south of the 49th parallel might show any interest in an engine block heater. Many ask why we Northern Canucks have wires peeking out of the grill. (Even Most of the southern Canada can live without block heaters) With Carb type engines we could not get the engines started without plugging them in when it gets cold. FI engines do better but heated engines start better. Here it was a very common practice to boost (jump start) those "dead horses" for our friends and neighbors when they forget to plug in.
The block heaters thinned the oil,loosened the engine and helped in faster engine warm up. (Read that as heater output for most people 😕) It gave the starter and battery a fighting chance to get the engine spinning., and a little heat in the manifold to help vaporize some of the fuel.
While I did put one in my coach i have never seen one in any other. (They do not (generally) get used in the warm weather.) I had a couple in the shop anyway
Nontheless. If I understand your question correctly: We usually install a frost plug type block heater in the engine cooling jacket. There are other kinds such as ones that are inserted into the lower Rad hose and recirculating types in the heater hoses. If one was put in the cooling jacket it was recomended to he put in the front right frost plug hole. A 1 1/2 inch hole.
For both the 455 and 403 a Temro part number 3100039 plug type block heater with the element pointing to 12:00 as you insert it. The frost plug hole needs to be well cleaned so the rubber O-ring seals properly. The fingers on the mounting screws bend back to the engine casting when you tighten the screw like a wall anchor so you only get one chance to do it right, and they do not need reefing to seat them The power cord is plugged into the heater and routed to the grill.
I found that I had a bit of difficulty with my 455 because the Radiator venturi brackets were past that frost plug.
Therefore it needed to be removed to install the heater and cord. Here is a photo of the block heater in my engine. To the left of the knock sensor. The cord actually fits behind the bracket with no pressure but it cannot be installed or removed without loosening the bracket.
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/knock-sensor-install-efi/p46370-knock-sensor-install-3.html
Here is a Link to a Temro catalog and information book.
http://www.phillipsandtemro.com/userfiles/file/2015%2520Zerostart%2520Catalog.pdf
Best Regards
John and Cathie Heslinga
1974 Canyonlands 260
455, Manny tranny and 1 ton, 3:70 LS,
Red Seal Journeyman, DTE, BEd. MEd.
Edmonton, Alberta
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292134 is a reply to message #292124] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 04:29 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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Lots of vehicles around here in Indiana have engine block heaters. They are frequently found on vehicles with large engines and vehicles parked outside. All of our airport vehicles also have them. My Colorado has one and it only has a 3.5 engine. My John Deere and my airplane have one. My Colorado heater only turns on when it is lower than 0 degrees F.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292135 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 06:24 |
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USAussie
Messages: 15912
Registered: July 2007
Location: Sydney, Australia
Karma: 6
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Senior Member |
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Virgil,
If you want to address possible causes of a fire in a GMC here you go:
http://www.gmceast.com/technical/Mueller_GMCer-Fire-Guide.pdf
Regards,
Rob M.
The Pedantic Mechanic
-----Original Message-----
From: Virgil Pearce
What a club to discover for newbies.
We just adopted ALF (Aluminum Falcon) the end of September (TZE336V100703) and moved it to Lake Oswego, OR - so still the same damp
weather.
odometer has about 54K if that can be believed - mmmm -
Anyway, upgraded the steel rims to AL 16" and Michelin LT225/75R16 E load tires with T/P sensors on the stems - having the front
hub bearings replaced along with the upper and lower ball joints and KYB - KG5435 shocks. While it is apart will have the brake
system drained, disk brake pads and master cylinder checked, 3 dot brake fluid added and rear drums checked as well. Jim Bounds
curbed some of my ideas about the upgrade process before a long trip to Phoenix in Feb. Will replace the mirrors with RAMCO, quad
bags, and install foam fire extinguishers in the motor and frig areas. Jan & I saw an RV on fire during our Oct trip to Cimarron,
NM. The rig did not stand a chance. Was to have driven ALF, but too much was needed in the preparation time.
Safety is the main concern for now.
I am looking for a heater plug for the block. Something like the Zerostart Engine Block Heater - that is installed through the plug
hole (were is that located and size?).
Also looking to replace the shag with cork which wears well, is natural, and has sound and insulation capabilities.
I do have 6 GMC hub caps and 9 - 16.5 steel rims (7 with tires that have about 2 years left).
Would appreciate any comments and recommendations - have been reading so much, but maybe my ideas are dangerous.
Certainly thankful for the opportunity to view all the data you all have - what a wealth of experience you are sharing.
Virgil
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Regards,
Rob M. (USAussie)
The Pedantic Mechanic
Sydney, Australia
'75 Avion - AUS - The Blue Streak TZE365V100428
'75 Avion - USA - Double Trouble TZE365V100426
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292143 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 09:04 |
JohnL455
Messages: 4447
Registered: October 2006
Location: Woodstock, IL
Karma: 12
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Senior Member |
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Question on the TP monitors. Are they full steel 80 PSI type? Otherwise you are de rating the tire/ wheel assembly. There was a GM dealer parts counter freeze plug electric heater. Not sure if the were one part number or different part numbers for different GM engine families. Someone may have the GM PN and you may find one on eBay. I still have one in a Buick 350. You knock out a freeze plug and the brass unit has an O ring and butterfly type fasterner.
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292151 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 09:49 |
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Matt Colie
Messages: 8547
Registered: March 2007
Location: S.E. Michigan
Karma: 7
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Senior Member |
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vpearce wrote on Tue, 15 December 2015 00:03What a club to discover for newbies.
You are in the right place!
We just adopted ALF (Aluminum Falcon) the end of September (TZE336V100703) and moved it to Lake Oswego, OR - so still the same damp weather.
Odometer has about 54K if that can be believed - mmmm -
Possible, but not highly likely. Has the engine been opened? If no, maybe. If yes, probably not. There is a section somewhere on inspecting brake pedals to confirm mileage.
By the by, it doesn't make a huge difference. At 40+yo, it will need love and maintenance in any case.
Anyway, upgraded the steel rims to AL 16" and Michelin LT225/75R16 E load tires with T/P sensors on the stems - having the front hub bearings replaced along with the upper and lower ball joints and KYB - KG5435 shocks. While it is apart will have the brake system drained, disk brake pads and master cylinder checked, 3 dot brake fluid added and rear drums checked as well. Jim Bounds curbed some of my ideas about the upgrade process before a long trip to Phoenix in Feb. Will replace the mirrors with RAMCO, quad bags, and install foam fire extinguishers in the motor and frig areas. Jan & I saw an RV on fire during our Oct trip to Cimarron, NM. The rig did not stand a chance. Was to have driven ALF, but too much was needed in the preparation time.
All good ideas. Do your first overnight in the driveway if you have had previous RV experience.
Safety is the main concern for now. Very good plan and a priority.
I am looking for a heater plug for the block. Something like the Zerostart Engine Block Heater - that is installed through the plug hole (were is that located and size?).
Also looking to replace the shag with cork which wears well, is natural, and has sound and insulation capabilities.
I do have 6 GMC hub caps and 9 - 16.5 steel rims (7 with tires that have about 2 years left).
Would appreciate any comments and recommendations - have been reading so much, but maybe my ideas are dangerous.
Try out ideas here first. We can maybe save you a lot of grief.
Certainly thankful for the opportunity to view all the data you all have - what a wealth of experience you are sharing.
And we all love helping.
Virgil
ALF is viewable within my profile with new wheels
Virgil,
Welcome to the group, family, cult, asylum....
It looks like you are running the e-mail list, and that is as good as any, but attaching more information is also good. We like to use sigfiles, but this can be a pain as that if added to you mail client it attaches to everything. I don't have a good answer, but maybe another does. You have no doubt seen other's sigfiles. We like to have a real name so that when we meet (and we will) we will know who you are.
And include a short bit about the coach. From the VIN, we know it is a 23' 76 that left Pontiac as a Transmode (no interior). There are variations with the company that did the inside that can change things so this can be important.
A geographic reference is good for two reasons. First is that someone that might like to help will know if he is in striking range. Second is that there are some climate related issues that we understand very well (like cold).
If you think this place is neat now, wait until you really need help. The thing that will bother us is that either you do say when you need help or if you ignore those that offer advice and assistance. There are many decades and millions of miles of experience available here. Use it to advantage.
You wrote adopted. That is the right word. We often feel that our biggest charge is saving the coach for the next owner. You will soon find that ALF is more than just another toy. She will be a part of your life and a good part at that. Not just for the freedom she will give you, but for the new/old friends you now have. You are now a part of a nearly unique community. The only other like it that I know is the watermen that are my world. For that reason, I have taken to welcoming new owmers much as a new vessel or owner is welcomed there. So,
May the Good Lord bless this coach and all those that set forth within her.
Welcome Virgil
Matt
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292155 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 10:06 |
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John Heslinga
Messages: 632
Registered: February 2011
Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Karma: 4
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Senior Member |
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Re:
Quote: Lots of vehicles around here in Indiana have engine block heaters.
Yup. You guys get so cold too.
John and Cathie Heslinga
1974 Canyonlands 260
455, Manny tranny and 1 ton, 3:70 LS,
Red Seal Journeyman, DTE, BEd. MEd.
Edmonton, Alberta
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292179 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 11:55 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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From MN, and I have alot of experience with Block heaters. I would Highly NOT recommend installing a frost plug/block heater in your GMC. the likely hood of a block heater failure, well outweighs the benefits that block heater might give you. The antifreeze gets pumped out of that engine so quick when the block heater lets loose, the engine is normally toast when one fails, and a GMC engine is usually very expensive to replace.
Unless you consistently plan on firing up your GMC in 15 degrees or colder weather, I see no need for a block heater. I actually have one of these on my oil pan in the winter that I will use if I decide to start the coach up when it is sub zero out, more to help the lubing of the engine because I run SAE 30 all year:
http://www.amazon.com/Kats-1153-Handi-Heat-Magnetic-Heater/dp/B000BOABS6/ref=sr_1_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1450201377&sr=1-2&keyword s=magnetic+heater
cheap, and will not fail causing coolant loss. I have the wire zip tied so it does not drag, and I have not had it fall off yet, it holds very well.
my original carbed 455 with an electric choke, starts almost immediately every time, even when it is sub zero out. I sometimes need a little more choke when it is below zero to keep idle going for a few minutes.
All our work trucks that I have to send out to North Dakota, needs a block heater. (can be -30 to -40 for a week straight). maybe 20-30 different trucks out there in the past 13 years, We have lost two engines. and I think a couple had to be replaced because they were caught leaking before they failed. Granted I would guess the guy driving should have noticed the heat gauge climbing fast, and one of the astro vans was driving back in a rain storm, and did not notice. But not a good track record. I think the key is to install the block heater on a "new" engine, not a old engine, but that is just my opionion. We still need block heaters on those trucks, because we can't afford to have a truck not start. And the one E-250 that always started one winter without being plugged in developed a rod knock that spring. Again- Devils Lake, ND weather!
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292183 is a reply to message #292112] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 12:17 |
jhbridges
Messages: 8412
Registered: May 2011
Location: Braselton ga
Karma: -74
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Senior Member |
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Two other possibilities. Heat tape (We used to call it 'housetrailer tape') wrapped around the lower radiator hose and then insulated and tied down with with aluminum duct tape, or the dipstick heaters we use to see in Ballimer when I was a student there. You'd have to modify the dipstick version for the long tube on the GMC but they worked well. No idea where you'd get one, but J.C. Whitney had them back in The Day. All our gensets used an outboard coolant heater - a big Diesel won't take load cold even if it starts. The engines were plumbed fro them, and they were set so the block was arm to the touch but the upper hose past the thermostat wasn't. We replaced them every four years when we did hoses and belts. Never had trouble with them.
--johnny
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292199 is a reply to message #292183] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 14:42 |
lqqkatjon
Messages: 2324
Registered: October 2010
Location: St. Cloud, MN
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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http://www.amazon.com/Kats-16700-Lower-Radiator-Heater/dp/B00F8KTD8C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1450211832&sr=8-2&keywords=radiator+hose+heate r
People install these as well. Most cars though, may not have the room to install them, and to find the correct one for your size radiator hose seems to be the trick. I am not sure about if there is enough room on the GMC to fit that midway on the lower hose. (do not want to install on upper- might be dry).
Dip stick heaters are nice as well, but I really do not see a really easy way to get them to work with our long dip sticks. the magnetic heaters, come in many sizes, and they really do have a solid magnet. They do get hot, an will burn you if you touch the wrong spot.
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292248 is a reply to message #292199] |
Tue, 15 December 2015 19:35 |
Larry
Messages: 2875
Registered: January 2004
Location: Menomonie, WI
Karma: 10
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Senior Member |
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lqqkatjon wrote on Tue, 15 December 2015 14:42 http://www.amazon.com/Kats-16700-Lower-Radiator-Heater/dp/B00F8KTD8C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1450211832&sr=8-2&keywords=radiator+hose+heate r
People install these as well. Most cars though, may not have the room to install them, and to find the correct one for your size radiator hose seems to be the trick. I am not sure about if there is enough room on the GMC to fit that midway on the lower hose. (do not want to install on upper- might be dry).
Dip stick heaters are nice as well, but I really do not see a really easy way to get them to work with our long dip sticks. the magnetic heaters, come in many sizes, and they really do have a solid magnet. They do get hot, an will burn you if you touch the wrong spot.
Yup, this is what I have used for the last 5 or so years. I need to leave Northern Wisconsin between Christmas and NewYears. I plug it in 24 hrs before we leave. Gets the engine warm enough that the dash heater has warm air almost immediatly. Plenty of room on the lower hose. The only down side is that you have to drain the radiator to install....so, install it the next time you drain and flush the cooling system. JWID
Larry 
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
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| Re: [GMCnet] Engine Heater Plug for '76 Birchaven 455 [message #292291 is a reply to message #292248] |
Wed, 16 December 2015 07:13 |
Bruce Hart
Messages: 1501
Registered: October 2011
Location: La Grange, Wyoming
Karma: 5
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Senior Member |
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About your 16.5" wheels and tires.
Post them on Craigslist, older duelly trucks and trailers use that size.
On Tue, Dec 15, 2015 at 6:35 PM, Larry wrote:
> lqqkatjon wrote on Tue, 15 December 2015 14:42
>>
> http://www.amazon.com/Kats-16700-Lower-Radiator-Heater/dp/B00F8KTD8C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1450211832&sr=8-2&keywords=radiator+hose+heate
> r
>>
>> People install these as well. Most cars though, may not have the room
> to install them, and to find the correct one for your size radiator hose
>> seems to be the trick. I am not sure about if there is enough room on
> the GMC to fit that midway on the lower hose. (do not want to install on
>> upper- might be dry).
>>
>>
>>
>> Dip stick heaters are nice as well, but I really do not see a really
> easy way to get them to work with our long dip sticks. the magnetic
>> heaters, come in many sizes, and they really do have a solid magnet.
> They do get hot, an will burn you if you touch the wrong spot.
>
> Yup, this is what I have used for the last 5 or so years. I need to leave
> Northern Wisconsin between Christmas and NewYears. I plug it in 24 hrs
> before we leave. Gets the engine warm enough that the dash heater has warm
> air almost immediatly. Plenty of room on the lower hose. The only down
> side is that you have to drain the radiator to install....so, install it
> the next time you drain and flush the cooling system. JWID
> --
> Larry
> 78 Royale w/500 Caddy
> Menomonie, WI.
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
--
Bruce Hart
1976 Palm Beach
Milliken, Co
GMC=Got More Class
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Bruce Hart
1976 Palm Beach
1977 28' Kingsley
La Grange, Wyoming
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