Home » Public Forums » GMCnet » Valve Stems / Ballance Beads (Should I replace the valve stems on Alcoas when I get new tires?)
| Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276599] |
Thu, 23 April 2015 22:32  |
jtfred
Messages: 132
Registered: January 2015
Location: Grand Marais, MN
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My first plan of action for the new coach is new tires. It already has Alcoas. Should I replace the valve stems when I get tires? If so, which stems will I need?
I have read a bit about the balance beads and air soft pellets some have used. It sounds like the pellets work but maybe not until you get up to speed. I have also read some posts where they did not work and had to be removed. Should I have the tires spin balanced or use the beads/pellets? The wheels currently have the lead weights crimped onto the rim so they may already have damage from the dissimilar metals.
Thanks,
John Fredrikson
Fayetteville, GA
'78 Eleganza
John Fredrikson
Grand Marais, MN
1978 Eleganza
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276603 is a reply to message #276599] |
Thu, 23 April 2015 22:50  |
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ljdavick
Messages: 3548
Registered: March 2007
Location: Fremont, CA
Karma: -3
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When Tom Hampton took the coach over to the tire dealer in Ohio he instructed them to use Equal balance beads. I don’t know how much. I’ve never had a problem with the balance of the tires.
Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, CA
> On Apr 23, 2015, at 8:32 PM, John Fredrikson wrote:
>
> My first plan of action for the new coach is new tires. It already has Alcoas. Should I replace the valve stems when I get tires? If so, which stems
> will I need?
>
> I have read a bit about the balance beads and air soft pellets some have used. It sounds like the pellets work but maybe not until you get up to
> speed. I have also read some posts where they did not work and had to be removed. Should I have the tires spin balanced or use the beads/pellets? The
> wheels currently have the lead weights crimped onto the rim so they may already have damage from the dissimilar metals.
>
> Thanks,
> John Fredrikson
> Fayetteville, GA
> '78 Eleganza
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Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, Ca
Howell EFI + EBL + Electronic Dizzy
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276607 is a reply to message #276599] |
Thu, 23 April 2015 23:22 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
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John,
I used Counteract (about the same as Equal) for 5-6 years before switching
to air soft beads about 4 years ago. Both have always worked well for me.
The air soft beads may be a tiny bit slower to distribute themselves from
dead stop, but not really noticeably so.
On the other hand, a friend who followed my advice a while back was not
satisfied with the pellets and had his front tires balanced. Today he
reported finding one of those weights laying in his driveway so is going
back to the balancer -- reluctantly because he says their balancer sounds
like its bearings are dying. :-( Just can't win!
It costs very little to try the beads. A big jug from WalMart will do 15+
225-16's with 4 oz each -- a pretty standard recommendation in the industry.
Ken H.
On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 11:32 PM, John Fredrikson wrote:
> My first plan of action for the new coach is new tires. It already has
> Alcoas. Should I replace the valve stems when I get tires? If so, which
> stems
> will I need?
>
> I have read a bit about the balance beads and air soft pellets some have
> used. It sounds like the pellets work but maybe not until you get up to
> speed. I have also read some posts where they did not work and had to be
> removed. Should I have the tires spin balanced or use the beads/pellets?
> The
> wheels currently have the lead weights crimped onto the rim so they may
> already have damage from the dissimilar metals.
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276612 is a reply to message #276607] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 02:09 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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I have "Equal" installed in mine. I've had no problems. I have "airsoft" beads in my dual axle trailer tires. Also no problems with them.
As Colonel Ken says, 4 oz in each tire.
I an going to replace 4 of my tires on the coach in the next few weeks. This time I'm going to try something different. I'm going to have them balance them (it's free) with stick on weights on the inside of the wheels. Then I'm going to hand them four 4 oz. packets of "airsoft" beads and tell them to throw them inside the tire. If I do not like it I can remove the weights without going back to the tire installer.
If you have steel valves on the Alcoas, I would not replace them. Also if you use "Equal" or "Counteract", you should have them install filtered valve cores.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276613 is a reply to message #276599] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 06:02 |
jtfred
Messages: 132
Registered: January 2015
Location: Grand Marais, MN
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Sounds like a trip to Walmart for Airsoft beads.
I like the idea to balance with the stick on weights and add the beads as well. I think I may have them do that. I guess they will have to mount them, balance them and then will have to break the beads again to add the beads, correct? I'm going to Discount Tire. I wonder if they will have heart burn with the added work to add the beads. It would probably be worth an added charge for the belt and suspenders approach.
Thanks for the help guys!
John
John Fredrikson
Grand Marais, MN
1978 Eleganza
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| Re: Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276619 is a reply to message #276599] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 07:57 |
Jeff Marten
Messages: 199
Registered: August 2013
Karma: 1
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Why bother with the stick on weights? When one falls off, the beads probably won't be able to overcome that much imbalance. I used ceramic beads (like Dynabeads) and filtered cores when I replaced the tires on the Gulf Stream. 6oz for each front, 8oz for each rear (for dual configuration); tires are 225/70R19.5's. So far I'm very pleased with their performance.
For the beads to be most effective, you need to ensure the tire installer knows not to use excessive lube on the bead. If he sloshes it all over inside the tire, even ceramic beads can clump up.
1985 Gulf Stream 34' Sun Stream
1964 Falcon 'Vert
1980 Bradley GTE
1999 Chevy Tahoe
2005 Saab 93 Aero
1987 Suzuki Intruder 1400
1978 Glastron/Carlson CV23
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276629 is a reply to message #276613] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 10:44 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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John,
The trick is to weigh the beads yourself and bag them before going to the
tire store. Tell them to empty the beads in since they may be familiar
with the commercial stuff which, like Counteract, comes in self-destroying
bags which they just drop into the tire.
When I had to put new tires on in WI last year, I didn't have my postal
scale with me. I took baggies to the post office and when the clerk wasn't
busy, got her to weigh one without and then with beads, then filled the
others to approximate the volume. She then weighted each of the remaining
5 for me; they were all "close enough".
I personally would NOT use both beads and weights.
Ken H.
On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 7:02 AM, John Fredrikson wrote:
> Sounds like a trip to Walmart for Airsoft beads.
>
> I like the idea to balance with the stick on weights and add the beads as
> well. I think I may have them do that. I guess they will have to mount them,
> balance them and then will have to break the beads again to add the beads,
> correct? I'm going to Discount Tire. I wonder if they will have heart burn
> with the added work to add the beads. It would probably be worth an added
> charge for the belt and suspenders approach.
>
> Thanks for the help guys!
>
> John
> --
> John Fredrikson
> Fayetteville, GA
> 1978 Eleganza
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276631 is a reply to message #276613] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 11:05 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
Karma: 10
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jtfred wrote on Fri, 24 April 2015 06:02Sounds like a trip to Walmart for Airsoft beads.
I like the idea to balance with the stick on weights and add the beads as well. I think I may have them do that. I guess they will have to mount them, balance them and then will have to break the beads again to add the beads, correct? I'm going to Discount Tire. I wonder if they will have heart burn with the added work to add the beads. It would probably be worth an added charge for the belt and suspenders approach.
Thanks for the help guys!
John
It is only going to take an extra minute or two to add the beads and air the tire up again when they are finished with their balancing. I like the "Airsoft" ones because they are larger that the commercial stuff like "Equal" and do not get stuck in the valve cores. I see two types of air soft beads .12 gr and .20 gr. I have only used the .12 one. I do not know if one would be advisable over the other. The .12 are cheaper. I think I might try the .20 ones this time.
I have the guys at Walmart trained. I took in some used trailer tires to be mounted and he asked me where the bag of beads was for each tire. I had forgotten to bring them so I bought another bottle of "Airsoft" beads. He borrowed a new scale off of the shelf and we weighed out what we needed for each tire. My new tires will come from and be installed by Tire Rack. I do not expect them to give me any hassle over them. They are really good people there.
Our size tire in truck and RV applications says to use 4 oz. If 4 oz. can not balance them you have a bad tire. I always clean up the surface of the wheel thoroughly before I take them in for new tires with stick on weights to be installed. I have never had a problem loosing stick on weights if the wheel surface is cleaned before the tires are balanced.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276650 is a reply to message #276638] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 17:54 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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For now, I think I'll stick with the red pellets; I'll get the ones that
glow in the dark when I get a set of those transparent tires.
Ken H.
On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 2:17 PM, John Fredrikson wrote:
> I was thinking that I should go with the glow-in-the-dark airsoft pellets
> to get that cool under glow effect. :)
>
> That will probably draw too much attention.
>
> John
>
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276665 is a reply to message #276599] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 21:12 |
rickmike
Messages: 252
Registered: September 2011
Location: United States
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I recommend getting the tires trued then balanced.
I did this and they run smooth.
Jim Bounds trues tires and I know a shop here in Knoxville, TN that trues tires also.
Rick M.
1974 26' Canyonlands
aka "The General"
Clinton, TN
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276667 is a reply to message #276665] |
Fri, 24 April 2015 22:25 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
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Which reminds me of something I've been meaning to mention: I have a tire
truing machine.
It's a Amermac 400A, on-vehicle truer. As it happens, Amermac is located
in Ellaville, GA, 11 miles from me. The first one was designed by Roy
Peacock, a local garage owner and close friend of my grandfather. In 1958,
he sketched the principle he had in mind in the dirt in front of his shop.
My great uncle Doy, a skilled machinist, built the prototype. Roy
eventually sold the rights to the design to the newly formed Amermac.
But I got it from HER cousin, who had it, unused, for at least 10 years
before he gave it to me 5+ years ago. It sat in Frank Jenkin's garage
until last January when I finally picked it up. Now it's occupying space
in my shop -- still unused.
It appears to be complete and in good condition -- the cutter seems sharp
enough to go to work right now, if I were willing to try it. 15 years or
so ago, I did have the GMC's front tires trued with a machine identical to
this one and was well satisfied with the results. But I feel no need to do
it myself.
It looks just like this one:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TSI-405-W-Amermac-Porta-Tire-Truer-/171057832334?hash=item27d3d7618e&item=171057832334&vxp=mtr
I'm undecided about what to do with the machine. Probably put it on eBay I
guess. If there was a central location where it could be available to the
GMC community at large, I'd put it there, but that's a tall order.
Any ideas?
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 10:12 PM, Richard Michelhaugh <
rick.michelhaugh@frontiernet.net> wrote:
> I recommend getting the tires trued then balanced.
>
> I did this and they run smooth.
>
> Jim Bounds trues tires and I know a shop here in Knoxville, TN that trues
> tires also.
>
> Rick M.
> --
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276678 is a reply to message #276658] |
Sat, 25 April 2015 00:24 |
Ken Burton
Messages: 10030
Registered: January 2004
Location: Hebron, Indiana
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I have no idea where to tell you to put it.
I have trued a few sets of tires for people on Blaine's machine (including mine). It is 150 miles down there so I do not do it very often.
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276686 is a reply to message #276684] |
Sat, 25 April 2015 07:30 |
Ken Henderson
Messages: 8726
Registered: March 2004
Location: Americus, GA
Karma: 9
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Pete,
As I noted earlier, tire truing originated in 1958, here in Americus. It
was very popular back in the days when recapped tires were also popular.
Recaps frequently were not truly round, so would bounce down the road even
if dynamically balanced. And, in fact, even today, even new tires are not
truly round, though they're much improved. Add the out-of-round condition
of the rims the tires are mounted on, and you can wind up with wheels that
are well balanced but won't "stay on the road".
Jim Bounds is an especially ardent supporter of tire truing on GMCs, though
I suspect that ardor is cooling with the demise of most of the old steel
wheels. He trued all of mine, on Alcoas, back in '98, with good results.
I had the front tires trued a few years later, again with results. But I
haven't bothered during the past 10+ years. I attribute the smooth ride I
now enjoy mostly to the use of the dynamically operating balance beads.
Today, the most common use of truing seems to be in racing.
Ken H.
Americus, GA
'76 X-Birchaven w/Cad500/Howell EFI & EBL,
Manny Brakes & 1-Ton, etc., etc.
www.gmcwipersetc.com
On Sat, Apr 25, 2015 at 7:46 AM, Pete Smith wrote:
>
> I had never heard of "Truing" tires until this forum. Was this some
> up_selling
> By tire shops or was it actually necessary? To the best of my knowledge
> if never
> Had it done on tires here or in the UK........and they all ran fine unless
> they were cheap
> $@$@ ones
> --
> Cary, NC
>
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Ken Henderson
Americus, GA
www.gmcwipersetc.com
Large Wiring Diagrams
76 X-Birchaven
76 X-Palm Beach
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| Re: [GMCnet] Valve Stems / Ballance Beads [message #276722 is a reply to message #276684] |
Sat, 25 April 2015 21:24 |
Jim Galbavy
Messages: 1443
Registered: August 2007
Karma: 7
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JimB has trued my last two sets of tires mounted on Alcoas. Truing
works so well that there is very little weight on the wheels. As a
matter of fact I have two wheels with no weights at all. Just make
sure that you don't have any stones lodged in the tread. You do have
to drive the tires on the wheels for a mile or two to seat them to the rims.
jim galbavy
'73 x-CL ANNIE
Lake Mary, FL
[Updated on: Sat, 25 April 2015 21:27] Report message to a moderator |
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